747 Engine Failure On Thai Airways Flight Tg116 5:15 Bankok To Chang Mai

[bkkjames]

They fly 747 jumbo jets from BKK to CM ? I thought the Jumbo was a long haul airoplane not a short haul. Do that many people want to go to CM ? A little confused here

You would be surprised. I flew on one to Phuket. In Japan, ANA and JAL fly them domestically as well just for their capacity.

[Ricardo]

They fly 747 jumbo jets from BKK to CM ? I thought the Jumbo was a long haul airoplane not a short haul. Do that many people want to go to CM ? A little confused here

They operate 747s at least a couple of times per-day to CNX, I happened to be on the same flight last month, I guess that they might be 'between' long-haul flights ?

[parryhandy]

The title reminded me of the following incident: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9 I caught a lengthy radio interview with the captain of this flight many years ago, amazingly calm guy!!

LOL what a truly amazing story. Love this bit

Despite the lack of time, Captain Eric Moody made an announcement to the passengers that has been described as "a masterpiece of understatement":[3]

“ Ladies and Gentlemen, this is your Captain speaking. We have a small problem. All four engines have stopped. We are doing our damnedest to get it under control. I trust you are not in too much distress. ”

:D

[theoldgit]

It was also a little unsettling because it makes you think that there may have have been no way to make it another 40 minutes to Chang Mai.

I think you will find that it was an operational decision to return to Bangkok as, I believe, that's where Thai service their aircraft.

Pretty sure it could have made it safely to Chiang Mai though, I don't envy you your experience.

Pretty sure the standard procedure in case of an incident is to land at your nearest possible airport that can handle you.

I agree that would be the responsible thing to do, but do you remember a couple of years ago a BA flight that encountered a problem shortly after taking off from an American airport was criticised for continuing to London because that's where

maintenance is based, though I am sure they wouldn't have done so it if it wasn't safe to do so.

[NearestTheTee]

The title reminded me of the following incident: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9 I caught a lengthy radio interview with the captain of this flight many years ago, amazingly calm guy!!

Yep, you're right an amazinly calm guy.

Captain Eric Moody - the pilot of the above flight has his own website 'ericmoody.com' where you can also read about the Jakarta incident of flight BA9. In his words the Wikipedia version of initial events is not truly accurate (he was not in the toilet when the incident first occured).

[ronz28]

My wife took a Pan American 747 flight from Japan to California in April, 1970 as part of her trip from Thailand. Pan Am was the first airlines to start flying the 747 in January 1970 from New York to Heathrow. That first Pan AM flight also had engine trouble but I am sure they are totally different electronic controlled engines by now.

[MAZ3]

The 747 from BKK to CNX used to change flt number and go on to Japan?.As its only a hour flying time the aircraft would not have had much fuel on board(a 747 can take up to 170,000K of fuel)to protect the Max landing weight and so on landing the plane would not have been overweight on its return to BKK

[theoldgit]

do you remember a couple of years ago a BA flight that encountered a problem shortly after taking off from an American airport was criticised for continuing to London.

This is the incident I was referring to, and whilst this article indicates the view the decision was made to limit compensation claims I seem to recall reading the maintenance of the engine played a part in the decision.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article518637.ece

[skippybangkok]

Landing a 747 overweight is a dangerous decision and one they only do if it is a serious problem. Brakes overheat and the tyres will often go flat. Requires alot of skill to pull it off. Maybe a bird strike.

At TG, the pilots on the 747 tend to be the older experienced and best qualified personnel, so score one for the legacy airline.

1) doubt they would fully fuel the AC for a 1 hour flight, and as such, no issue on landing.

2) know a guy who's 1st AC after graduating flight school was co-pilot 747 - ( well connected family ) - not sure i would want a fresh graduate in that seat.

[hmficc]

You say 15 min after takeoff? Had fasten seat beat sign been turned off yet? Or were you still climbing to flight altitude with fasten seat belt light still on?

Just wondering.

It was off, I am not 100% about what the flight time was. He actually kept sounding the fasten seatbelt sign several times. The shortly after the engine failed, the pilot came on and said that we would immediately turn around and go back to bankok and land within 5 minutes, which I thought was really fast, but maybe he sped up the plane to get us back fast. It was also a little unsettling because it makes you think that there may have have been no way to make it another 40 minutes to Chang Mai.

No shop to change an engine in CM and it is safer to land at nearest major airport after a major mechanical.

[hmficc]

747 can fly no problem on 2 engines, in fact 1 engine, and like anything mechanical there is sometimes a problem. Pilots are trained for this rare occurrence. If it were a 777 l would be more concerned.

It can fly on one engine but can it maintain altitude?

[mca]

I"m sure that the Bangkok - London banger (747) was in the Battle of Britain.

Yeah I'm not saying the one I flew home in once was old but they put me in next to the tail gunner.

Boom Boom!

[davee58]

Although this incident is not mentioned (because of time zones it will probably go in tomorrow) there were 5 Aircraft engine problems reported world wide YESTERDAY, no big deal ALL planes landed safely. Incidence Reports

Yes, details of the incident are shown on that site now.

That is an interesting link you provided...

[goldfinger]

1) doubt they would fully fuel the AC for a 1 hour flight, and as such, no issue on landing.

2) know a guy who's 1st AC after graduating flight school was co-pilot 747 - ( well connected family ) - not sure i would want a fresh graduate in that seat.

Even if well connected, this would be against all rules.

[manarak]

but then I thought about the chances of being in an "incident" two times in one night. I think that it is like 30,000,000 to one?! since it would be like 15,000,000 to one to go down from a bird strike in mid air in a 747.

Probabilities are multiplicative, not additive.

So, the probability that it occurs twice in the same day is 1/15.000.000*1/15.000.000 = 4.44 10^-15

But after the first problem occurred, the probability that the second takes place doesn't change and is still 1/15000000.

So, there's no rationale behind the reasoning.

It's a little like the theory saying that artillery shells never fall into previous craters... doesn't work.

[apetley]

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2010/02/05...al_30121952.php

Another engine problem BKK to Chiang Mai, reported tonight.

Or is it usual shoddy Nation reporting of the same incident?

[goldfinger]

TG 116 on 5.February

Departure Status Details

Airport: (BKK) Suvarnabhumi Airport

City: Bangkok, TH

Scheduled: 5:15 PM - Fri Feb 05, 2010

Actual: 5:30 PM - Fri Feb 05, 2010

Departed gate 15 min later than scheduled

Arrival Status Details

Airport: (CNX) Chiang Mai International Airport

City: Chiang Mai, TH

Scheduled: 6:25 PM - Fri Feb 05, 2010

Actual: 6:38 PM - Fri Feb 05, 2010

Arrived at gate 13 min later than scheduled

Wednesday or Friday---mai pen Rai

Edited February 5, 2010 by goldfinger

[aussieron]

http://avherald.com/h?article=426d5dbd&opt=0

here it is.

[rakman]

You say 15 min after takeoff? Had fasten seat beat sign been turned off yet? Or were you still climbing to flight altitude with fasten seat belt light still on?

Just wondering.

It was off, I am not 100% about what the flight time was. He actually kept sounding the fasten seatbelt sign several times. The shortly after the engine failed, the pilot came on and said that we would immediately turn around and go back to bankok and land within 5 minutes, which I thought was really fast, but maybe he sped up the plane to get us back fast. It was also a little unsettling because it makes you think that there may have have been no way to make it another 40 minutes to Chang Mai.

Maintenance base is most likely BKK. Once a failure occurs and the aircraft went to CM, it would have to either dead head back to BKK or an engine and change crew sent up to Chang Mai. It's a bit of economics and safety, you were closer to BKK.

[featography]

Last Year I was on a 747 Thai Flight to Phuket which turned around and returned to Bangkok after 20 minutes in the sir. Had an oil leak. Again Thai had us sorted and on our way with only about an hour's delay on the ground. The crew were great there was no panic from them but there were a few rather hysterical ladies when we disembarked in Bangkok.

My hat is off to Thai pilots and the airlines. 2 incidents where passengers on their way again in an hour?? That's unheard of in the US.(ie) 2 yrs ago the wife and I boarded NWA in Portland Or. USA to come home, only to discover while still at the loading gate, the plane had a computer problem. We were left sitting for 2 hours onboard, until we were finally offloaded, and told that we were on our own to find over night accomadations. NWA was unable to get a computer part until the next morning.

[neilf]

I"m sure that the Bangkok - London banger (747) was in the Battle of Britain.

not sure ---------------i noticed in a wc on the wall it said " alcock and brown was ere 1919 "

[Thanh-BKK]

Hi.

I believe a 747 with three operational engines is perfectly safe for long-haul. After all, my one and only long-haul flight from Frankfurt/Germany to Bangkok in December 2000 started with 19 (!) hours delay due to the fact that the aircraft, a 747 of Qantas, developed an engine problem while en route from Bangkok to Frankfurt, returned to Bangkok, could not be fixed there and then took off and flew all the way to Frankfurt on three engines. It was then fixed in Frankfurt.

Quantas, as opposed to Thai Airways, apparently only had that one aircraft available so everyone was offered a night in a hotel in Frankfurt by Qantas (i didn't take the offer but stayed at the airport, stupid me) while the aircraft was on the way/being repaired. They even did a one-hour test flight after repairing it, this was announced via intercom to the then-waiting passengers and we could actually watch the aircraft take off and return about an hour later before we could board it.

Kind regards......

Thanh

[Bagwan]

But not when they are actually climbing. The first 35 seconds after take-off are critical. If any of the engines fail during this period the chances of a crash are very high. After 15 minutes it is a minor problem if one engine fails. If two go then the pilot has a big problem and needs a lot of skill and maneuverings to land the plane safely, but they normally do.

Events occurring during the 35 seconds before landing are no picnic either. All aircraft landings are controlled crashes. Just a thought.

[cdnvic]

All aircraft landings are controlled crashes. Just a thought.

And an incorrect one at that

[Colabamumbai]

Please stop flying Thai Airways they do not deserve the business their company and the attitude has constantly gone down hill over the years. They used to be the No. 1 Airlines in the world and look at them now.

[Bagwan]

All aircraft landings are controlled crashes. Just a thought.

And an incorrect one at that

Not according to the senior Captain who lectured our class of novice Cabin Attendants 45 years ago, in the age before airlines became flying bus companies.

[cdnvic]

I've heard the "controlled crash" thing about carrier landings, which isn't far off, but it's a bit overkill to say that about most airline landings.

[pinoyflyer]

Amazing Thailand, to organize a other airplane within 1 hour.

Did all the passengers took the second plane or where there some passengers in a shock and would fly.

Also i would like to know it there was any explanation about this incident by Thai Airways after you arrived at the terminal?

Actually, I think everyone got on the second plane, and there was no explanation as to why the engine failed, but it was too soon to tell. It takes some time for the experts to go over the engine. I asked one of the reps and he said "maybe it was a bird".

Also, I don't think anyone was outwardly panicked during or after the incident, but that was due to the way it was handled by the flight crew. However there was a VERY tense few minutes right after the bang. People were starting to look out of their windows in a sort of "pre panic". After we got in at first I was like..there is no way Im flying again tonight, but then I thought about the chances of being in an "incident" two times in one night. I think that it is like 30,000,000 to one?! since it would be like 15,000,000 to one to go down from a bird strike in mid air in a 747.

i was on the same flight. the airplane crew and the pilot did their job and led the plane to a safe landing. but i had to disagree on how we were treated. we were brought back to the airport and made to wait on a holding area. there was no one from the thai airways to try and see to it that everyone was okay. i'm a medical doctor traveling with a pregnant wife and there was no one who asked if anyone needed any medical assistance given the situation that just a few minutes ago everyone's life was put in danger. bangkok post (newspaper) put it as a "serious incident." there was not even water to drink in that area. no one said what will happen to us next. after a few minutes i just followed the crowd as they stood up to board another plane as someone from thai airways appeared out of nowhere. no apologies offered while we were all waiting. no words of comfort and assurance. no one asked if it's okay to just board another plane or if anyone needed to take a breather after a near death experience. a thai safety officer said it was the first time that such an incident occurred to a 747 according to the Bangkok Post feb 6 issue. once on board the next plane, the pilot apologized for the delay like a casual bus driver who had a flat tire and inconvenienced his passengers. they served a small sandwich when everyone missed dinner because of the delay.

i felt that they were trying to downplay what happened by their treatment as if these things happen all the time.

[neverdie]

Amazing Thailand, to organize a other airplane within 1 hour.

Did all the passengers took the second plane or where there some passengers in a shock and would fly.

Also i would like to know it there was any explanation about this incident by Thai Airways after you arrived at the terminal?

Actually, I think everyone got on the second plane, and there was no explanation as to why the engine failed, but it was too soon to tell. It takes some time for the experts to go over the engine. I asked one of the reps and he said "maybe it was a bird".

Also, I don't think anyone was outwardly panicked during or after the incident, but that was due to the way it was handled by the flight crew. However there was a VERY tense few minutes right after the bang. People were starting to look out of their windows in a sort of "pre panic". After we got in at first I was like..there is no way Im flying again tonight, but then I thought about the chances of being in an "incident" two times in one night. I think that it is like 30,000,000 to one?! since it would be like 15,000,000 to one to go down from a bird strike in mid air in a 747.

i was on the same flight. the airplane crew and the pilot did their job and led the plane to a safe landing. but i had to disagree on how we were treated. we were brought back to the airport and made to wait on a holding area. there was no one from the thai airways to try and see to it that everyone was okay. i'm a medical doctor traveling with a pregnant wife and there was no one who asked if anyone needed any medical assistance given the situation that just a few minutes ago everyone's life was put in danger. bangkok post (newspaper) put it as a "serious incident." there was not even water to drink in that area. no one said what will happen to us next. after a few minutes i just followed the crowd as they stood up to board another plane as someone from thai airways appeared out of nowhere. no apologies offered while we were all waiting. no words of comfort and assurance. no one asked if it's okay to just board another plane or if anyone needed to take a breather after a near death experience. a thai safety officer said it was the first time that such an incident occurred to a 747 according to the Bangkok Post feb 6 issue. once on board the next plane, the pilot apologized for the delay like a casual bus driver who had a flat tire and inconvenienced his passengers. they served a small sandwich when everyone missed dinner because of the delay.

i felt that they were trying to downplay what happened by their treatment as if these things happen all the time.

.....meanwhile, Business class passengers enjoyed a different lounge, with a 5 course meal & a complimentry lap dance .

Ohh and things like this do happen all the time & of course theres always people that will complain just about anything

[pinoyflyer]

Amazing Thailand, to organize a other airplane within 1 hour.

Did all the passengers took the second plane or where there some passengers in a shock and would fly.

Also i would like to know it there was any explanation about this incident by Thai Airways after you arrived at the terminal?

Actually, I think everyone got on the second plane, and there was no explanation as to why the engine failed, but it was too soon to tell. It takes some time for the experts to go over the engine. I asked one of the reps and he said "maybe it was a bird".

Also, I don't think anyone was outwardly panicked during or after the incident, but that was due to the way it was handled by the flight crew. However there was a VERY tense few minutes right after the bang. People were starting to look out of their windows in a sort of "pre panic". After we got in at first I was like..there is no way Im flying again tonight, but then I thought about the chances of being in an "incident" two times in one night. I think that it is like 30,000,000 to one?! since it would be like 15,000,000 to one to go down from a bird strike in mid air in a 747.

i was on the same flight. the airplane crew and the pilot did their job and led the plane to a safe landing. but i had to disagree on how we were treated. we were brought back to the airport and made to wait on a holding area. there was no one from the thai airways to try and see to it that everyone was okay. i'm a medical doctor traveling with a pregnant wife and there was no one who asked if anyone needed any medical assistance given the situation that just a few minutes ago everyone's life was put in danger. bangkok post (newspaper) put it as a "serious incident." there was not even water to drink in that area. no one said what will happen to us next. after a few minutes i just followed the crowd as they stood up to board another plane as someone from thai airways appeared out of nowhere. no apologies offered while we were all waiting. no words of comfort and assurance. no one asked if it's okay to just board another plane or if anyone needed to take a breather after a near death experience. a thai safety officer said it was the first time that such an incident occurred to a 747 according to the Bangkok Post feb 6 issue. once on board the next plane, the pilot apologized for the delay like a casual bus driver who had a flat tire and inconvenienced his passengers. they served a small sandwich when everyone missed dinner because of the delay.

i felt that they were trying to downplay what happened by their treatment as if these things happen all the time.

.....meanwhile, Business class passengers enjoyed a different lounge, with a 5 course meal & a complimentry lap dance .

Ohh and things like this do happen all the time & of course theres always people that will complain just about anything

spoken like someone who works for the thai airways.

either that or someone who does not understand what customer care means.