Depression, Bi-polar Disorder - Thai Language Info

[JuniorExPat]

I would be very grateful for any links to documents in Thai which describe clinical depression, bi-polar disorder and mood disorders in general.

Many thanks in advance,

JxP

[simon43]

JuniorExpat, some years ago, I tried to locate Thai language documents on bipolar disorder without success, because my ex-wife has this illness.

Is the document required to try to 'educate' a non-medical person about the illness, (perhaps a family member?). Otherwise, the causes/treatment of these illnesses should be well understood by specialist doctors in the major hospitals - and they will be able to explain details in English and/or Thai

Simon

[JuniorExPat]

Hi Simon,

I'm looking for materials to explain to a Thai family member that depression can be a genuine medical condition and to show what the symptoms, causes, triggers and treatments can be.

It looks like I've hit the same brick wall that you came up against.

Thanks,

JxP

[MikeyIdea]

OP, I have spent close to 200,000 bath the last couple of years on psychiatrists for my wife. The adult psychiatrist tried but the only success he ever had was to was to get me to follow his advice; Don't put pressure on her, I can't treat her then. The child psychiatrist was good, she managed to wake up my wife's love for our daughter, whether that is good or not I am not sure though. It would have been much easier for both of us to break up before that, while mummy didn't love our daughter and our daughter didn't want to come to mummy and screamed Go away, Don't come in when mummy fetched her after school… Another problem is that my wife is a good person with a medical problem (that has gotten smaller)

My experience is that sorry; it is no use. A person with bi-polar disorder does not want to know

Another hard earned experience; I finally solved most of the extreme problems like throwing things, hitting, kicking, spitting (me) and screaming in front of our daughter by pointing to the door, fetching her bag and telling her to pack her things and leave often enough. She can finally control herself much better now so bipolar disorder seems to be a medical condition that a person given enough reason can control somewhat. How the concept of empathy and egocentrism works for her is still difficult to understand, but even that is somewhat improved

One more hard earned experience: It was childish of me to think that a psychiatrist would care about our daughter first of all even though I told him that so many times. He will of course care about his patient anyway

I don't have any documentation in Thai either… It can get better, I have mixed success failure so all hope is not lost

Edited February 18, 2010 by MikeyIdea

[simon43]

MikeyIdea, your situation sounds very similar to that which I found myself in a year or so ago. The bipolar illness of my ex eventually led to my marriage breakdown and separation from my son, not mentioned the rather large financial loss due to medical bills, her thieving and payment for the damage caused to property and vehicles of others by her excesses.

Initially, I tried hard to explain to family members about bipolar illness. I speak reasonable Thai, but it seems that mental illness is a taboo subject for many Thais, and rather than trying to face the problems, they preferred to 'dope' their daughter up to render her zombie-like so that she made no trouble for them.

There are good doctors who have had western training, but I think decent treatment always comes down to both money and willingness of the patient to confront their illness. Sadly, for those who have severe mental illness, they may not be lucid enough to recognize that they are ill, or may not be able to comprehend the details and treatment of their illness.

So, from my own experiences, I have to admit that her illness defeated me, even though I (and my friends) did a lot to try to help her.

I would not wish the task of caring for a severely bipolar person on my worst enemy!

Simon

[katana]

Thai Wikipedia has a couple of small entries for major depressive order and depression (mood).

[JuniorExPat]

Thanks very much for the replies.

MikeyIdea - it sounds as though you have had an extremely rough journey. I would agree with ". . . so bipolar disorder seems to be a medical condition that a person given enough reason can control somewhat . . . " up to a point, it really depends on so many external factors/triggers. I wish you the best of luck.

simon43 - what can I say except, so sorry for the outcome of your scenario.

katana - thank you very, very much for those links. Those are the first Thai language articles I have seen on the subject and I will be watching closely to see what reaction they get.

JxP

[mrtoad]

I have to apologise for my lack of translation skills, but this website may well be useful - and there ae contact details on it as well

http://www.rcpsycht.org/contact.php

If the set up is similar to the one in the UK, they may well have leaflets that explain Bi-Polar Daisorder clearly and in laymens terms. I'd suggest maybe sending an e-mail to them.

I wish you all the best.

[JuniorExPat]

Thanks for the response mrtoad, unfortunately I cannot get the link to work, is it correct? I tried clicking through, copying and pasting and then also cutting it down to http://www.rcpsycht.org/ but no success.

JxP

[mrtoad]

Thanks for the response mrtoad, unfortunately I cannot get the link to work, is it correct? I tried clicking through, copying and pasting and then also cutting it down to http://www.rcpsycht.org/ but no success.

JxP

Hmm, well I had it up and working earlier, so it should be working. You could maybe just google Royal College od Psychiatrists Thailand, and use the link that way.

[orlov]

Hi JxP. May seem a little too simple but find some really good articles on the subject on the internet , print them off and get them translated by a reputable local translation service. As for treatment, my own Thai wife had severe depression with an element of psychosis, and she also showed classic symptoms of bi-polar disorder as well. We had a huge problem sorting her out. Won't name names but the first Thai hospital we went to (big international in north Pattaya) gave her no less than 5 assorted anti-psychotic/anti-depressants which, taken together as instructed, dam_n near killed her. She was so confused and disorientated than she took an overdose and ended up in intensive care. The hospital learned absolutely nothing and released her 4 days later with a different assortment of 5 AP/AD's. Result was so horrendous that I refused to give her any more or go back to the same hospital. Now she's on one anti-psychotic and one anti-depressant and she's not doing too bad.

Whatever your local hospital gives you make sure it's not too much/too strong and find out what it is on the internet. The doctors here are used to treating Thai's who treat them like magicians and don't ask questions. Obviously we're not doctors but just be very careful what your wife is given and use a common sense approach when analysing what effects the medication is having on her. Only relaying my own experience for what it's worth.

[harrry]

There are psychiatrists here that are reasonable in treating bipolar though they have a tendancy to overmedicate but this may be needed because of the fairly poor compliance of many patients. PM me if you want a little more info.

Edited February 21, 2010 by harrry

[JuniorExPat]

Thanks for the response mrtoad, unfortunately I cannot get the link to work, is it correct? I tried clicking through, copying and pasting and then also cutting it down to http://www.rcpsycht.org/ but no success.

JxP

Hmm, well I had it up and working earlier, so it should be working. You could maybe just google Royal College od Psychiatrists Thailand, and use the link that way.

Thanks mrtoad, Google worked (as does your link for me now!) - I have sent a note as suggested.

JxP

[JuniorExPat]

Hi JxP. May seem a little too simple but find some really good articles on the subject on the internet , print them off and get them translated by a reputable local translation service. As for treatment, my own Thai wife had severe depression with an element of psychosis, and she also showed classic symptoms of bi-polar disorder as well. We had a huge problem sorting her out. Won't name names but the first Thai hospital we went to (big international in north Pattaya) gave her no less than 5 assorted anti-psychotic/anti-depressants which, taken together as instructed, dam_n near killed her. She was so confused and disorientated than she took an overdose and ended up in intensive care. The hospital learned absolutely nothing and released her 4 days later with a different assortment of 5 AP/AD's. Result was so horrendous that I refused to give her any more or go back to the same hospital. Now she's on one anti-psychotic and one anti-depressant and she's not doing too bad.

Whatever your local hospital gives you make sure it's not too much/too strong and find out what it is on the internet. The doctors here are used to treating Thai's who treat them like magicians and don't ask questions. Obviously we're not doctors but just be very careful what your wife is given and use a common sense approach when analysing what effects the medication is having on her. Only relaying my own experience for what it's worth.

Thanks for the suggestion orlov, good idea, simple is often best.

Sorry to read about your experiences and I hope your wife continues to improve.

JxP

[JuniorExPat]

Just to be clear (somebody reading may know me and therefore know my wife): I am not seeking help for my wife, she shows no indication of a mood disorder other than the usual unintelligible (to a man) but yet somehow endearing (to this man) behaviours of a woman.

The situation is quite the reverse I am trying to find material to help a Thai understand their western partner's mental state.

JxP

[MikeyIdea]

No difference… We can replace 'her' with 'him' then

I didn't mean to moan about my own experience. Now is As Good As It Gets. October November last year was not and May June will probably be bad again. I would like to share my experience so that others maybe don't do the same mistakes I did.

Looking back at my own experience, there are several things I would do differently. One thing is not to spend money on psychiatrists without first making her interested in listening and improving her situation. That is – I would throw her out for a shorter period before. It sounds horrible I know but fact is that it's no use otherwise. It doesn't have to be long, a week can be a wake-up call just as well as a month can be. It is no use paying anything to make a person who doesn't want to listen listen… That's common sense. Perhaps throwing her out and give her documentation to read at the same time would work.

I would be harder. I was way too soft in the beginning because I didn't have the skill to be hard enough and I had to learn that. For what? not to be beaten, to not be walked on, to not be abused by someone who I found out later when I had learnt to be hard could have controlled herself (a bit anyway) if only I had pushed her to show at least basic respect. My experience: You're not going to get respect until you show you have what they respect; It may not be real respect even if you do, still better than being beaten and psychologically terrorised though

I am a cool-tempered Swede born on ice. But it is not as easy as it once was to be that any longer. One piece of very important experience I would like to pass on: Taking too much unacceptable behaviour for too long does affect you. It is going to make you change. Look at yourself and assess how much you are changing. IMO, the trigger point to terminate a relationship with a person affected by a mental illness is not only taking her illness and situation into consideration. It is equally much how much the situation is affecting you (and of course your children)

Don't wait for the children to reach school age (grade 1) if you don't see considerable improvement; It is so difficult when you see undesirable behaviours in your child and you so clearly see that they come from the mother and she sees nothing wrong… It's so difficult when you try to get your child to get enough sleep and decent food and the mother happily does next to nothing to make the child like her; and it's not good for the child. Those problems doesn't get smaller when the child reaches school age

Realisation that there is actually something strange / not normal is the key to progress I think, I don't think there can be more than temporary progress without it actually. I clearly see the up-and down periods coming about 3 – 4 times per year, the mother can't. I ask her to be aware and remember and sooner or later she may be able to see the periods herself. I have no progress yet but I still do this, maybe it can give the realisation / breakthrough I hope for

My experience: When a person with bipolar disorder is down in a depression then the only thing the psychiatrist tries to do is to get her up and telling you to not put pressure on her. Once she is up, and she thinks that she has no problems and no reason to listen again, then they try to get through to her. I don't understand the logic in that

Mental illness is a taboo subject sure. But I think it is a bit the same in Europe too, who would want to listen to a son-in-law who says that your daughter has bipolar disorder.

I do agree that psychiatrists tend to overmedicate a bit but it was never a big problem with my daughters mother. I think that medication is not a long-term solution anyway. My daughters mother has stopped taking medication, just as well, it's only temporary help anyway, the dose has to be increased to get the same effect and it doesn't work in the long run. Instead of having the medicine taking the tops off, she now does it herself by forcing herself to control herself because she knows that I will throw her out if she doesn't. I think that is very sad, but still, it is improvement and it is progress

Don't ask me in the end of May…

Edited February 22, 2010 by MikeyIdea