Beware Of Being Shortchanged

[brahmburgers]

It's happened to me twice in the past two months. I'll be checking out of a store, and the woman hands me less than my allotted change. Happened at Sahapaiboon Homecenter (the large hardware store halfway between the old bus station and the Super Hwy, on the south side of the street), and at Boots drug store.

At the hardware store, a fat lady gave me change for Bt.500, when I had handed her 1,000.

At Boots, the pretty sales clerk handed me change which was 100 baht short.

In each case, when I mentioned the discrepancy, the girls immediately gave me the correct amount. That's an additional indication that they knew they were trying to cheat me. If it was an honest mistake, they would have at least hesitated, and/or re-crunched their numbers, or perhaps put forth some doubts.

Those are just two places I noticed. There may have been other instances of being shortchanged at which I was successfully duped. I'm a middle aged farang, so am a prime target for such scams. They girls might assume I just arrived in Thailand, and not acquainted with the currency and/or I'm dazzled/distracted by the cuteness of the girl doing the transaction, or just another dough-headed farang (some veracity to numbers 2 and 3).

Imagine if the average rip-off did that little trick 30 times a day, for Bt.100 each time. That's almost $100/day gravy on top of her small salary.

Next time I catch this happening, I'm going to immediately call it to the attention of the manager - though that may elicit nothing but soggy excuses devolving to 'mai pen rai' as soon as I'm out the door. I almost did it at Boots yesterday, even though the girl said 'so sorry' four quick times while handing me my 100 baht.

Message to farang (or anyone else): complain when you're being ripped off. Don't accept a tepid excuse or a cute smile and 'I'm sorry.' If the worker is ripping you off, chances are he/she is ripping off many other customers. Nip it in the bud. Make some noise.

[sceadugenga]

The same thing happened to me in Big C with a male checkout operator last month. I tendered 1000B on a 250B purchase and received change of 500.

There were two managerial types close by and they came over when they heard me querying the transaction. It was soon sorted out with apologies, the operator insisted I only gave him 500B but the check out slip had 1000 on it, however the same guy was still at a checkout the next week.

Edited March 21, 2010 by sceadugenga

[Briggsy]

Happened to me in my local 7-11 in Bangkok. The girl immediately dived into the till and handed me the missing 100. She lasted 2 days in the job.

[krading]

Had that tried on me at the servo, bought 600bht of diesel, handed over 1000 bht and was given four bundles of 20's each supposedly 4 notes with one folded around to make 100 bht. I sat there, unfolded and counted each one and sure enough each bundle had only 4 notes.

He blamed the girl who makes up the bundles of ready change every day.

Probably going halves.

[Ulysses G.]

As someome who works with cash every day, I can assure you that it is quite easy to make mistakes - no matter how careful you try to be.

Yes, you should be careful, but don't assume that all mistakes were done on purpose. There is a good chance that it was just human error.

[toptuan]

Yeah, you guys are over-analyzing the psychology of the supposed Mafia cashiers behind every counter. A possible other side of the coin: The fact that they immediately give you your correct amount (after you point out the error) could also mean that they make so many mistakes on an hourly basis that they're used to having the customer correct them.

It's a developing country where people in the service industry are no where nearly as well-trained (if at all) and as sophisticated as in your home country. Just try to lighten up a bit. Yes, always check your change, and politely request your correct change with a smile.

[brahmburgers]

I don't think I'll "lighten up" on this concern.

There are thousands of check-out people who do what they're supposed to do. They pay attention, they count out the money twice on their own before handing the change to the customer. Then there are those (a rare few?) who intentionally shortchange. If I were doing that, I'd pick on elderly farang (or elderly anybody) and perhaps people that seem very distracted and/or in a hurry. If the worse that happened was once in awhile someone made a mention (not a fuss), then I'd be ahead of the game. I might rip off fifty people for every one who noticed. And if I had a manager who didn't give a hoot or wasn't paying attention or would always came to my defense when there was a complaint, then that would reinforce my stealing ways.

Even if it was an honest mistake, I think it's incumbent on the customer to make a fuss. That in itself would alert the manager (if there is one) - that something is wrong.

Also, it's not impossible that the customer may be wrong. Reminder to self: be acutely aware of what happens during transactions.

Different scenario, but a reminder to myself not to be dough headed. I somehow (stupidly) left my wallet at a public market. It had something to do with putting it down while motioning/asking the vendor not to use too many plastic bags. I realized the missing wallet an hour later in town, after the market closed. 2 hours later, while driving home on a dark dirt road, I passed a motorbike coming the other way which honked for me to stop. I stopped (though how many people stop for a strange bike coming in the opposite direction on a dark night?). I didn't recognize the man, nor did I understand what he was saying at first. Then he handed me my wallet. Turns out I knew the guy from 9 years ago when he fixed my truck. Somehow, he had gotten my wallet and looked and saw a passport photo of me in it (or my Thai drivers license photo?), and remembered where I lived. He rode all the way up that dark dusty road looking for me - to return the wallet. Thailand has all types, but it certainly has some sterling characters. I gave him a cash reward and almost kissed him in my glee. He's probably glad I didn't go that far.

[neverdie]

Standard life situation, happens everywhere in the world

[sceadugenga]

Yeah, you guys are over-analyzing the psychology of the supposed Mafia cashiers behind every counter. A possible other side of the coin: The fact that they immediately give you your correct amount (after you point out the error) could also mean that they make so many mistakes on an hourly basis that they're used to having the customer correct them.

It's a developing country where people in the service industry are no where nearly as well-trained (if at all) and as sophisticated as in your home country. Just try to lighten up a bit. Yes, always check your change, and politely request your correct change with a smile.

I would suggest that check out operators in Thai shopping malls are required to be better educated than in Western countries where it's generally seen as a dead end job with no skills required. This is the first mistake I've picked up in 6 years of shopping regularly at this particular outlet... there's little alternative to Big C in Chiang Rai so it's hardly the norm.

However... I'm prepared to ignore it in cases where I receive too much change, which proves that I'm not totally intractable on this matter.

[toptuan]

I don't think I'll "lighten up" on this concern.

Then enjoy your stress-induced heart attack down the road. Up to you.

[chiang mai]

I think the OP is correct, short changing is becoming a lot more prevalent, often it's only small amounts, five Baht or so but it's definitely happening on a more regular basis. The odd thing is that the moment I go to query the amount of change I've just been handed, nine times out of ten the girl dives straight into the till and hands me the difference without so much as a thought or a word, that alone tells you much.

[Terminator]

Or the other way round when bar's such as Livingstone's are all of a sudden are charging you ++ to you and try not to give you your chit so that you don't know about.

They all try to get you either way....

[onnut]

I never check my change, maybe time for me to start doing so. People can make mistakes, but the girls in the OP sound like thieving feckers!

Don't take it personal as they also try it on with there own kind!

[sarahsbloke]

I was in CR a few months ago, my friend was in a bar and paid with a 1000bht note.

He received change for 500bht and when challenged the management swore he only gave them 500bht.

I saw the 1000bht note handed over.

I have never seen this scam before, and am wondering if it has become a bit of a Chiang Rai phenomenon

Edited March 21, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[brahmburgers]

I don't think I'll "lighten up" on this concern.

Then enjoy your stress-induced heart attack down the road. Up to you.

How different is it if you're shortchanged, than if a someone put their hand in your pocket and tried to pull out some money. Would you just smile and say, oops, silly me for putting my pocket so close to your hand. a few smiling "I'm sorrys" and you're on your merry way without a second thought.

[skybluestu]

Yes sarahsbloke, it only happens in Chiang Rai, nowhere else in Thailand or the rest of the world.

[kandahar]

In the last week, I saw several instances of shortchanging and over charging me, the customer. I pretty much deal with both cases the same way. I make clear that I want the proper thing to occur and whether or not it does, that is the last baht I spend in the place. One of the recent occurrences was in a Faring owned cafe, the overcharging (100 baht) was done by his Thai wife. That was my first and last visit to that cafe, regardless of the food and service quality. The next instance occurred in a local Thai shop where I made purchases almost every day of the last year. The lady (she is also the owner) short-changed me 120 baht. I just handed back to her the money she had placed in my hand. She didn't even look at it. She just put another 100 baht on the stack and handed it back to me. I handed it back to her. She added the twenty, again, without counting it. That's the end of me being her customer.

I keep reading about the honest mistakes. I get that. Sure, we all can make mistakes. In my original homeland, mistakes were made in various transactions throughout my life. There were significant differences between there and here, however. Never in my old life did I get the impression that the staff was trying to steal my money. Body language, obvious embarrassment and earnest apologies always accompanied the refund. Also, the mistakes were pretty much equal as to whether it was in my favor or theirs. Regardless of who was set to gain from the mistake, I made a point of getting it corrected. But in Thailand, I have yet to be given too much change or charged too little. EVERY instance so far in my dealings has been in the favor of the business or the staff. So, "honest mistakes"? HA!! Maybe one percent of the time. The over-charging and short-changing are much too common an occurrence to be "mistakes". So, to ANY business owner, I would say if I take the time to spend money in your venture and you don't take the time to make sure you treat me fairly, that is the end of our relationship. And I'll tell my friends about it. The burden of honesty is on you. You and every other business owner ought to be making certain that the burden doesn't fall on the people that provide your livelihood. In your home country, mistakes happen and customers return. Here, it is a way of life, so all the more reason to make sure you DON'T get that label and DO overcompensate when you do make an honest mistake, just to make sure the customer knows the difference. The difference is important.

When I first came to Thailand, I was intrigued to see my Thai friends so diligently going over restaurant and shop bills before paying and so diligently counting their change from transactions. I asked about it. The answer was, "If they aren't stealing from the owner, then they are stealing from you. They steal. That's that". Truly, I think that is pretty harsh. I have found lots of folks that don't try it and I think they don't even THINK about trying it. But if the Thais believe that about one another, then I'll stay cautious. They have more experience in this thing than I do. So far, my caution has saved me several tens of thousands of baht; nearly 5,000 baht in one transaction alone.

And "toptuan", no heart attack yet. It seems that knowing where my money is and where and why it is going is actually better for my health than wondering what happened to it all.

Edited March 21, 2010 by kandahar

[chang35baht]

`At the hardware store, a fat lady gave me change for Bt.500, when I had handed her 1,000. `

Fat girls are the worst.

`At Boots, the pretty sales clerk handed me change which was 100 baht short.`

Can`t trust those pretty one either.

`I'm a middle aged farang, so am a prime target for such scams.`

` If I were doing that, I'd pick on elderly farang (or elderly anybody)`.

Have another look in the mirror Brahms.

`Even if it was an honest mistake, I think it's incumbent on the customer to make a fuss. That in itself would alert the manager (if there is one) - that something is wrong.`

What????

Chiang Rai isn`t safe anymore. Luckily for me, my wife takes all my money to ensure I never get ripped off. Aint I lucky.

Message to self; GIVE WIFE MORE MONEY.

C35B

`

[sceadugenga]

Get the story straight, how can you give wife more money if you're giving her all of it now?

I noted the claim of middle-agedness myself. Never having met the OP I can't comment, but from personal experience I realise that this term changes over the years.

When I was 30 I considered 50 to be old and myself young. Now more than 30 years on I look upon old age as something my father, at 89 is approaching.

[Cuban]

At places I'm not known locally and elsewhere I always make a point of paying the correct money or when tendering a 500/1,000 Baht note hold onto it for a moment longer than normal and say in Thai "500" or "1,000".

As for the reverse situation. I've overpaid at some places to have excess money returned to me.

[473geo]

Each person makes their own call.........I think the reality is that anywhere as a foreigner may be viewed as 'just passing through' so it is worth a try!!!

There are places, where there is no reciept etc ,it is probably best to avoid giving high value notes....so you can only ever be a few baht out.

The op has a point.....if the general feeling is that a certain type of customer will not complain about overcharging......then word will get passed around!!!......I agree with the smile and politely request the correct amount way......this might eventually change the opinion of the shop check out people that some customers are an easy touch.........and hopefully they will be smart enough to carry on overcharging the people who do not mind, as it is the way of the world..... ......perhaps you guys could wear a badge....'I will accept overcharging'.......would make life easier....

[onnut]

Get the story straight, how can you give wife more money if you're giving her all of it now?

I noted the claim of middle-agedness myself. Never having met the OP I can't comment, but from personal experience I realise that this term changes over the years.

When I was 30 I considered 50 to be old and myself young. Now more than 30 years on I look upon old age as something my father, at 89 is approaching.

nah mate, 60 years of age is old, trust me. I just hope I live long enough to reach it.

[kurnell]

I've been short changed twice at a bank. It is part of Thai culture to try it on, regardless of status.

[Garry]

I still can't get over the fact the amount of young people I come across in the small shops, who have to use a calculator to sum up really REALLY simple math. I don't think of them as being dumb or stupid, but hey give it a go, give the grey matter some exercise

Edited March 21, 2010 by Garry

[sarahsbloke]

I noted the claim of middle-agedness myself. Never having met the OP I can't comment, but from personal experience I realise that this term changes over the years.

When I was 30 I considered 50 to be old and myself young. Now more than 30 years on I look upon old age as something my father, at 89 is approaching.

A mans life is three score year and ten

From that information one can deduce

Young age 0-23

Middle age 24-46

Old age 46+

It's in the bible so it must be correct (deny it and go to hel_l)!

[Garry]

The same thing happened to me in Big C with a male checkout operator last month. I tendered 1000B on a 250B purchase and received change of 500.

There were two managerial types close by and they came over when they heard me querying the transaction. It was soon sorted out with apologies, the operator insisted I only gave him 500B but the check out slip had 1000 on it, however the same guy was still at a checkout the next week.

I've actually had the opposite happen at Big C, where a cashier gave me back too much money by 500. i was about to chuck the change & receipt in my wallet when I noticed I had too many 500 baht notes. I let her know and she was very greatful and apologetic. I woud imagine that if their float and end of day takings don't match up, they get nailed for it.

[brahmburgers]

`At the hardware store, a fat lady gave me change for Bt.500, when I had handed her 1,000. `

Fat girls are the worst.

`At Boots, the pretty sales clerk handed me change which was 100 baht short.`

Can`t trust those pretty one either.

`I'm a middle aged farang, so am a prime target for such scams.`

` If I were doing that, I'd pick on elderly farang (or elderly anybody)`.

Have another look in the mirror Brahms.

I honestly don't know what you're alluding to.

`Even if it was an honest mistake, I think it's incumbent on the customer to make a fuss. That in itself would alert the manager (if there is one) - that something is wrong.` What????

Chiang Rai isn`t safe anymore. Luckily for me, my wife takes all my money to ensure I never get ripped off. Aint I lucky. Message to self; GIVE WIFE MORE MONEY. C35B

Your wit underwhelms me. If you want to crank up your wit and find fault with anything a particular person says, it's not hard to do. Try it with me. Tell me anything about yourself, and if I so chose, I could tear it down with pseudo wit. Let me guess, you're one of those people who think in black and white / all right and all wrong. There are some people in your life who can do no wrong, ......and there are other people who you preclude can do nothing right. Am I wrong?

I've been short changed twice at a bank. It is part of Thai culture to try it on, regardless of status.

Next question, did you make make a fuss and/or call it to the attention of that person's superior?

I admit, I rarely do that, but the more I think about shortchanged, the more it looks like petty thievery. Not much different than pickpockets or purse snatchers. If you had just bought a book for 600 baht, and the employee of the bookshop snatched it out of your hand and ran off down the street, how different is that than if they shortchanged you 600 baht on a transaction?

The difference is, in the case of the book snatcher, you'd likely make a heated mention to the book shop manager. In the case of being shortchanged, you'd likely just smile and say 'mai pen rai' when the pretty sales or bank clerk belatedly (but quickly) handed you the correct amount - taking in to account the clerk was apologetic. The fact remains, the shortchanging clerk is as much as of a thief as the book/purse snatcher - regardless of whether you know you've been ripped off or not - and regardless of whether the thief appears to be apologetic.

Similarly, as long as it's lucrative, the purse-snatching thief or the shortchanging thief will keep doing it. But reporting the shortchanger, may get that person kicked off the job and preclude her/him from ripping off a string of others - at least until that person finds another job at another shop.

If you catch someone lifting your wallet in a crowded bus, if the thief hands back your wallet, are you just going to smile and say, "oh, no bother, that's ok, thanks."

I've decided to report any shortchanging from now on - right when it happens, regardless of how quick the correct change is given, and regardless of how charming and/or apologetic the thief is.

[Ulysses G.]

I still can't get over the fact the amount of young people I come across in the small shops, who have to use a calculator to sum up really REALLY simple math. I don't think of them as being dumb or stupid, but hey give it a go, give the grey matter some exercise

Try doing it all day, every day and you might just change your mind. On top of that, if you do happen to make a mistake doing it without a calculator, someone might accuse you of cheating them and put it all over the internet.

[sceadugenga]

In my experience the calculator is there to show dumb farangs who can't count in Thai the price of something.

[kandahar]

In my experience the calculator is there to show dumb farangs who can't count in Thai the price of something.

I guess I'm dumb. That's what they always use it for with me. But it is fun to take it away from them and type in a lower price and see what they say.