Democrat MPs Angry Over Suthep's Soft Handling Of Red-Shirts

[steveromagnino]

The blocking of the interesection is not shutting down any business.

There are roads around the demonstration.

Nobody is stopping people working or shopping, it is the owners of the places who have shut them down of their own free will.

Bangkok has many roads, nowhere is blocked access. On foot anywhere can be accessed. By car a small diversion is needed.

More and more are supporting the Reds now, at night when its cool and people finish work the Reds numbers swell. Thats good news.

Many people support the Reds and demanded House Dissolution now. They also questioned why, with staggering evidence far in excess of what was used to disband TRT and PPP, that the EC still muddles on and delays for months the case of dissolution against the Democrats that is pending.

Please explain to a shopping center where 80% of their clients drive, how their clients will come to the center when the road is blocked completely, as occurred yesterday.

Please explain how staff who catch the bus can arrive when a bus doesn't stop near where they are going.

Please explain to a shopping center who is advised by their insurance company not to risk opening and when each individual store wishes to not open since they will have no customers and will potentially have to deal with a mob situation their staff are unable to control that they should disregard those stakeholders and open anyway, but not have any sales.

They will get a big push tonight, no doubt, when all the taxi driver/motorcycle/security guard etc staff go after work to support them.

But I suggest only owners of a shopping center have to consider in deciding to open adjacent to what is currently a peaceful protest but could quickly spiral out of control. When you have a TRT family deciding to shut Bangkok's premier luxury mall and the resultant loss of sales....you can assume they are doing so taking into account the safety of all their staff, of their premises, the likelihood of being able to sell in such an environment.

Your comments are similar to me coming to your condo, moving in uninvited, then questioning why you would not come home as I am not stopping you from sleeping or cooking food or having a party, as I am not stopping you from doing any of these things.*

As for your 'staggering evidence'.....I can only hope that there is evidence out there which has not been in the media as yet, that you have and none of us have seen, for you to make such a bold and strong statement relative to the cheating of TRT in rigging an unnecessary election.

* let me know when I should come around, I will bring along 10,000 people; that's more than the number of red shirts in Ratchaprasong as of this morning driving past. Hope your place is big enough. And don't think I won't use your toilet; I will lay a turtle's egg that will bring glory to the late great Bennie Goodman; a reed player of vast skill who also was widely renowned for his toilet blocking skills.

Edited April 5, 2010 by steveromagnino

[whatawonderfulday]

The blocking of the interesection is not shutting down any business.

There are roads around the demonstration.

Nobody is stopping people working or shopping, it is the owners of the places who have shut them down of their own free will.

Bangkok has many roads, nowhere is blocked access. On foot anywhere can be accessed. By car a small diversion is needed.

More and more are supporting the Reds now, at night when its cool and people finish work the Reds numbers swell. Thats good news.

Many people support the Reds and demanded House Dissolution now. They also questioned why, with staggering evidence far in excess of what was used to disband TRT and PPP, that the EC still muddles on and delays for months the case of dissolution against the Democrats that is pending.

Go on own up - you still think the moon is made of Cheese !!

[Insight]

Well - everyone is as miserable as he chooses to be... My Thai wife and all her friends and neighbours in the area have got a similar positive attitude and I don't see any hatred against the Reds. I don't see anyone's life really being made miserable because of the Red Shirts.

Believe it or not, I think your opinion is massively geographically challenged. I bet you all the business owners in the surrounding areas are having kittens right now about their staff from outside the area being prevented from approaching the area. Many staff workers people use public busses or drive their own cars. To think that people's lives are not being made miserable by a rally cutting of access to the heart of a city during the first working day of the week is outright naive.

Suthep's inability to handle the situation is again landing us with another Pattaya ASIAN conference – it's time for him to go and this to end.

According to him, he would be happy in a concentration camp. I just dislike when it appears people make up personal stories to support a cause and avoid simply saying what they are ... in this case a Red Shirt supporter.

Wow, what a guy have we got here? Talking about concentration camp and coming with an attitude influenced by the Bush doctrine "either you are with or you are against us". If you come from an English speaking country you probably cannot understand that there are more view than just yes or no or democrat/republican or conservative/labor or similar. If I'm taking a more neutral approach and not broadly condemning and judging the Red Shirts it doesn't mean that I support them. I'm neither supporting the Red Shirts nor the Yellow Shirts nor the Blue Shirts nor the Pink Shirts. I'm just wondering how some farangs chose to think that life is miserable if some businesses are suffering - life is going on, people here are inventive and most find ways to make the best out of the situation. Some people have got the ability to make the best for themselves out of even a miserable situation and some don't.

Fair enough, just your sentence "I don't see anyone's life really being made miserable because of the Red Shirts" sounded like symptoms of Stockholm Syndrome

Hope it doesn't get ugly where you are; many of my former colleagues are at work round there (if they made it in today).

[LevelHead]

Tomorrow is a national holiday. Bangkok residents should hold their own counter protest in the streets surrounding Rajasaprong and see how the Reds enjoy being prevented from having freedom of movement. Keep them from wandering off to restaurants and hotels and bathrooms. Make their lives as miserable as they want make the lives of Bangkok residents. If the police won't enforce the laws that have been implemented the Reds will never leave.

What a load of absolute crap!! I live here in the middle of the Red Shirt protest literally under siege from the masses. Is my life miserable?? - Certainly not!

If I go out now I am in the middle of thousands of generally friendly people, lot's of them singing, dancing - it's generally a happy atmosphere. Apart from the noise it's not an unpleasant experience if you don't go out with an attitude or prejudice. Do I care about the luxury shopping mall being closed? No!

Do the average Bangkok people care about the luxury shopping malls to a degree that their life would be miserable once they are closed? Certainly not!

I can still buy food at thousands of little food stalls in the area. If I want to get out of the area I have a working skytrain just in front of my door.

Am I miserable because I cannot use my car now? Certainly not!

Well - everyone is as miserable as he chooses to be... My Thai wife and all her friends and neighbours in the area have got a similar positive attitude and I don't see any hatred against the Reds. I don't see anyone's life really being made miserable because of the Red Shirts.

I enjoy living in Bangkok and not being a Thai so I have chosen to let the Thais solve their own problems and I take a more neutral position, not condemning anyone.

I just wonder why so many TV farangs seem to have such a destructive attitude and seem to have chosen to make their own life miserable. I have chosen not to be miserable and enjoy life in Bangkok with all its conveniences and inconveniences. And since I am living here at the same place since about 10 years I can say that this is not just a temporary mood.

Well said Sir !!!!!

I too am in Bangkok (unlike many people on here I think).

There are no problems. Reds are in party mode, everyone is happy and lots of cars have Red flags and Red scarf's on them.

The mood of the Bangkok people in the majority is understanding and often at night many Bangkok people put on a red shirt and go down and support, which is why in the evening the numbers swell.

The English language local press appears to be "owned" at high level by the Yellow's (the media moguls) and so its not surprising to see the BP and TH spouting all sorts of nonsense and reports from "un-named sources".

Well done the Reds !!

You have lots of support in Bangkok and Thailand (but not so much in the Democrat loving South)

The government has seen so many deadlines pass they now look so weak its unbeleivable. And each time they issue another deadline and it passes they get even weaker.

The people support you Reds, keep on the fight for Democracy !!

[pimay11]

Well - everyone is as miserable as he chooses to be... My Thai wife and all her friends and neighbours in the area have got a similar positive attitude and I don't see any hatred against the Reds. I don't see anyone's life really being made miserable because of the Red Shirts.

Believe it or not, I think your opinion is massively geographically challenged. I bet you all the business owners in the surrounding areas are having kittens right now about their staff from outside the area being prevented from approaching the area. Many staff workers people use public busses or drive their own cars. To think that people's lives are not being made miserable by a rally cutting of access to the heart of a city during the first working day of the week is outright naive.

Suthep's inability to handle the situation is again landing us with another Pattaya ASIAN conference – it's time for him to go and this to end.

According to him, he would be happy in a concentration camp. I just dislike when it appears people make up personal stories to support a cause and avoid simply saying what they are ... in this case a Red Shirt supporter.

Wow, what a guy have we got here? Talking about concentration camp and coming with an attitude influenced by the Bush doctrine "either you are with or you are against us". If you come from an English speaking country you probably cannot understand that there are more view than just yes or no or democrat/republican or conservative/labor or similar. If I'm taking a more neutral approach and not broadly condemning and judging the Red Shirts it doesn't mean that I support them. I'm neither supporting the Red Shirts nor the Yellow Shirts nor the Blue Shirts nor the Pink Shirts. I'm just wondering how some farangs chose to think that life is miserable if some businesses are suffering - life is going on, people here are inventive and most find ways to make the best out of the situation. Some people have got the ability to make the best for themselves out of even a miserable situation and some don't. The only thing that really counts for me is that the crisis will end without bloodshed.

Can we please leave the Bush hater syndrome out of this string? Totally irrelevant to what this thread is about. The tread is "Democrat MPs Angry Over Suthep's Soft Handling Of Red-Shirts".

[BKKer2010]

Well - everyone is as miserable as he chooses to be... My Thai wife and all her friends and neighbours in the area have got a similar positive attitude and I don't see any hatred against the Reds. I don't see anyone's life really being made miserable because of the Red Shirts.

Believe it or not, I think your opinion is massively geographically challenged. I bet you all the business owners in the surrounding areas are having kittens right now about their staff from outside the area being prevented from approaching the area. Many staff workers people use public busses or drive their own cars. To think that people's lives are not being made miserable by a rally cutting of access to the heart of a city during the first working day of the week is outright naive.

Suthep's inability to handle the situation is again landing us with another Pattaya ASIAN conference – it's time for him to go and this to end.

According to him, he would be happy in a concentration camp. I just dislike when it appears people make up personal stories to support a cause and avoid simply saying what they are ... in this case a Red Shirt supporter.

Wow, what a guy have we got here? Talking about concentration camp and coming with an attitude influenced by the Bush doctrine "either you are with or you are against us". If you come from an English speaking country you probably cannot understand that there are more view than just yes or no or democrat/republican or conservative/labor or similar. If I'm taking a more neutral approach and not broadly condemning and judging the Red Shirts it doesn't mean that I support them. I'm neither supporting the Red Shirts nor the Yellow Shirts nor the Blue Shirts nor the Pink Shirts. I'm just wondering how some farangs chose to think that life is miserable if some businesses are suffering - life is going on, people here are inventive and most find ways to make the best out of the situation. Some people have got the ability to make the best for themselves out of even a miserable situation and some don't. The only thing that really counts for me is that the crisis will end without bloodshed.

Thank you for confirming my post.

[elcent]

http://www.chiangrai24.tv/ - reasonable quality of live broadcast

[hammered]

The blocking of the interesection is not shutting down any business.

There are roads around the demonstration.

Nobody is stopping people working or shopping, it is the owners of the places who have shut them down of their own free will.

Bangkok has many roads, nowhere is blocked access. On foot anywhere can be accessed. By car a small diversion is needed.

More and more are supporting the Reds now, at night when its cool and people finish work the Reds numbers swell. Thats good news.

Many people support the Reds and demanded House Dissolution now. They also questioned why, with staggering evidence far in excess of what was used to disband TRT and PPP, that the EC still muddles on and delays for months the case of dissolution against the Democrats that is pending.

That is the yellows didnt shut the airport down argument applied to this situation. Im sure you used it back then too

Im sure you are also aware that a PPP exec actually got caught bribing local administrators to ensure PPP votes in the North and that a disbandment of party is mandatory under law if an excutive is caught doing this. It was an open and shut case. The law may not be a good one but that is another matter,. The scase was a slam dunk.

The case against the Dems is a lot more circumstantial and invloves conflicting evidence. As such it is a harder case to conclude. However, if there is enough evidence to bring the case and the court finds an executive guilty they will be disbanded as there is no leeway on this.

[BKKer2010]

Looks like the Reds are going to get their (Thaksin's) wish. They just broke through the barriers at at EC HQ.

Looks like the government has no choice but to restore peace and put an end to this BS.

[LevelHead]

The blocking of the interesection is not shutting down any business.

There are roads around the demonstration.

Nobody is stopping people working or shopping, it is the owners of the places who have shut them down of their own free will.

Bangkok has many roads, nowhere is blocked access. On foot anywhere can be accessed. By car a small diversion is needed.

More and more are supporting the Reds now, at night when its cool and people finish work the Reds numbers swell. Thats good news.

Many people support the Reds and demanded House Dissolution now. They also questioned why, with staggering evidence far in excess of what was used to disband TRT and PPP, that the EC still muddles on and delays for months the case of dissolution against the Democrats that is pending.

Please explain to a shopping center where 80% of their clients drive, how their clients will come to the center when the road is blocked completely, as occurred yesterday.

Please explain how staff who catch the bus can arrive when a bus doesn't stop near where they are going.

Please explain to a shopping center who is advised by their insurance company not to risk opening and when each individual store wishes to not open since they will have no customers and will potentially have to deal with a mob situation their staff are unable to control that they should disregard those stakeholders and open anyway, but not have any sales.

They will get a big push tonight, no doubt, when all the taxi driver/motorcycle/security guard etc staff go after work to support them.

But I suggest only owners of a shopping center have to consider in deciding to open adjacent to what is currently a peaceful protest but could quickly spiral out of control. When you have a TRT family deciding to shut Bangkok's premier luxury mall and the resultant loss of sales....you can assume they are doing so taking into account the safety of all their staff, of their premises, the likelihood of being able to sell in such an environment.

Your comments are similar to me coming to your condo, moving in uninvited, then questioning why you would not come home as I am not stopping you from sleeping or cooking food or having a party, as I am not stopping you from doing any of these things.*

As for your 'staggering evidence'.....I can only hope that there is evidence out there which has not been in the media as yet, that you have and none of us have seen, for you to make such a bold and strong statement relative to the cheating of TRT in rigging an unnecessary election.

* let me know when I should come around, I will bring along 10,000 people; that's more than the number of red shirts in Ratchaprasong as of this morning driving past. Hope your place is big enough. And don't think I won't use your toilet; I will lay a turtle's egg that will bring glory to the late great Bennie Goodman; a reed player of vast skill who also was widely renowned for his toilet blocking skills.

The BTS is open, many reds are going by BTS. The BTS joins by walkway to the shopping places.

Whats the problem ? Too elite to get the BTS ? Too elite to walk ? Just because you cannot get your Merc to stop at the door does not mean you have to close the place.

The donations scandal of the Democrats is well known, but there appears to be influence holding up the vedict, rather than simply find them guilty as charged or not the "agencies" are passing it around each taking a month or two to view the evidence before passing to the next, and the next....... in effect to delay any verdict - perhaps for 9 months or 1 year and 9 months. The evidence is clear, sadly the verdict is being relentlessly delayed.

Are you in Bangkok ? Or just another "outsider" who feels the need to post on here for arguments sake ?

The Reds have very very strong support, as can be seen on the streets with your eyes open (not reading some internet site).

[moresomekl]

No hate in the street??? I seem to recall another view when the Pinks scooped up the Red Shirt at their rally.

Yes, the Yellow shirt PAD see themselves as above the law, they answer to nobody. This is why when the very same people put on Pink shirts they were violent again beating up innocent single red shirts who were just watching.

Sadly the rule of law and the judiciary appears to be under the control of an "elite" who allow their "friends" to get away with anything they do, whilst coming down hard on their "enemies". Surely it is not good for the judiciary to be seen to be under the control of, an influenced by, the elite.

However, it is said that following the coup many top judges and judiciary positons were replaced by the CNS leaders and coup government, and so this is only to be expected until Democracy returns and the coup appointed people are replaced by a democratically elected government.

New elections are needed. Whilst the present coalition can claim to be "legal" and "legitmate" everybody know they only came to power after the judiciary dissolved the PPP and then "elite" influence behind the scenes made up this new "coalition". The government whilst claiming to be "legitimate" cannot claim to be elected by the people, as the people did not vote for these. The people voted PTP.

Therefore, this is the crux of the issue, the elite have got control by "legitimate" methods under the law, the same way Thaksin did many things "within the law".

However, both were immoral and until this immoral government coaliation ends and the power is returned to the people to vote, then the problems remain.

Just dissolve the house Abhisit, be a man for once and show you have the "all" the Thai peoples concerns on your mind, not just the ruling elite.

Yes but what would happen if they called for elections now .

Result A: The dems and their coalition partners would be reelected (or elected , no partisan view here) . Then what for spend so much money on election ? They here already

Result B : a) The PTP would find itself in power in which case

Stock market would likely crash , investors are banking on Abhisit staying in power , and they would withdraw if not . Chavalit and his friends is hardly a star in economic matters , my 5 years old daughter does better . And the class war thing has made investors rather nervous

c) Thaksin would be asked to return to " Save" the thai economy and granted immunity as a special adviser

d) The rest is a replay of a movie that has been played before

But then perhaps its what you want after all

Edited April 5, 2010 by moresomekl

[hammered]

If they storm the EC this whole game will change and be nasty.

[elcent]

Looks like the Reds are going to get their (Thaksin's) wish. They just broke through the barriers at at EC HQ.

Looks like the government has no choice but to restore peace and put an end to this BS.

It seems a little to late for this. Justice and the gov failed to indict the yellow in time.

aside, the reds distanced themselves from Rambo Arisman on live TV

[LevelHead]

That is the yellows didnt shut the airport down argument applied to this situation. Im sure you used it back then too

Im sure you are also aware that a PPP exec actually got caught bribing local administrators to ensure PPP votes in the North and that a disbandment of party is mandatory under law if an excutive is caught doing this. It was an open and shut case. The law may not be a good one but that is another matter,. The scase was a slam dunk.

The case against the Dems is a lot more circumstantial and invloves conflicting evidence. As such it is a harder case to conclude. However, if there is enough evidence to bring the case and the court finds an executive guilty they will be disbanded as there is no leeway on this.

The Democrats were also accussed with evidence however what appears to be the coup appointed judiciary seemed to think only the PPP were guilty, the same way prior that with TRT and the Democrats again it was only the TRT who got disbanded.

Those Democrats sure are lucky to never be disbanded eh.... LOL

Again this time with plenty of evidence the case against the Democrats, as is the case against the Yellow PAD, is simply washed around the system and will never he heard, simply delay and delay and delay, pass it around, study some more, another meeting, pass it on....my, how quickly a year or two can pass by.

Sad isn't it that it appears even the judiciary and regulatory bodies now might be defunct, worse so than at the time of Thaksin ?

[Old Man River]

If they storm the EC this whole game will change and be nasty.

Imagine if this was happening in New York or London? It would be game over quickly.

[anotherpeter]

The blocking of the interesection is not shutting down any business.

There are roads around the demonstration.

Nobody is stopping people working or shopping, it is the owners of the places who have shut them down of their own free will.

Bangkok has many roads, nowhere is blocked access. On foot anywhere can be accessed. By car a small diversion is needed.

More and more are supporting the Reds now, at night when its cool and people finish work the Reds numbers swell. Thats good news.

Many people support the Reds and demanded House Dissolution now. They also questioned why, with staggering evidence far in excess of what was used to disband TRT and PPP, that the EC still muddles on and delays for months the case of dissolution against the Democrats that is pending.

Are you kidding? If you shut down any major intersection in Bangkok then you basically shut down the road network for kms in every direction. If the roads are shut down you can't get any supplies in. Your customers also can nor get in. Not everyone in Bangkok uses the BTS. Very few people walk. Most people stay away from the protest areas because of the constant threat of violence. The protests have been peaceful, but every day the leaders are threatening to burn buildings. If there are no customers, why open.

[rreddin]

Playing with words again. I will make it easier for you. Please tell me what programs have received the funding and how there has been an increase, i.e. this budget compared to last year and the previous year.

Or are you just going to backpedal and say the recent increase will deliver these benefit?

You say most hospitals have not opted out. Try and access a good hospital under the free medical scheme. You live in Chiang mai. Please give me the name of the 3 best hospitals and tell me how many of them encourage patients under the government paid healthcare program.

Please give me an indication of what all these great services are and tell me when they were rolled out.

Here's a relaity check. Thailand does not have the funds to pay for the social programs because the money is gobbled up by the military budget and the skimming.

Here is a reality check for you then... How many Issan farmers pay taxes? How many rural reds pay any taxes (even the leaders avoid paying their taxes - right?) and the few who do actually pay taxes are quite probably so low on the tax-thresholds that they only contribute a few thousand baht a month to the tax coffers. They demand social welfare, cheap hospitals, free schooling, public roads etc etc but don't pay taxes the same as the 'Bangkok elite' (aka Office workers, Shop workers etc) Where do you think the money comes from to pay for these types of things? Oh that's right, the very people the reds are holding to ransom right now! White collar workers who are paying tax each month from their salaries.

I wont refute the Military budget claim although maybe you would prefer to see the military not funded (nice avatar by the way, which military force is that?) The Skimming isn't any better or worse than it was during the Thaksin regime (altho its my personal opinion it was probably a lot worse during his time but that's just my opinion) or maybe you are of the viewpoint that all of the TTT/PPP/PTP (whatever they are called this week) politicians were all squeaky clean, never corrupt, and all had such high moral and ethical standards.

Thailand does not have the funds to pay for the social programs because the money is gobbled up by corrupt politicians and greedy non-tax payers who want social programs but aint prepared to pay for them You know Abhisit has a strong stance against corruption... he appears to be one of the first politicians who is publically against it... maybe that is why he is so disliked amongst the red politicians, hes closing down their cash-cow... interesting viewpoint, no?

Are you saying that because the rural poor do not pay taxes "the same as the 'Bangkok elite' (aka Office workers, Shop workers etc)" do" that they should not be entitled to the benefits a civilized country offers to all of its citizens? A simple yes or no answe will do.

[LevelHead]

No hate in the street??? I seem to recall another view when the Pinks scooped up the Red Shirt at their rally.

Yes, the Yellow shirt PAD see themselves as above the law, they answer to nobody. This is why when the very same people put on Pink shirts they were violent again beating up innocent single red shirts who were just watching.

Sadly the rule of law and the judiciary appears to be under the control of an "elite" who allow their "friends" to get away with anything they do, whilst coming down hard on their "enemies". Surely it is not good for the judiciary to be seen to be under the control of, an influenced by, the elite.

However, it is said that following the coup many top judges and judiciary positons were replaced by the CNS leaders and coup government, and so this is only to be expected until Democracy returns and the coup appointed people are replaced by a democratically elected government.

New elections are needed. Whilst the present coalition can claim to be "legal" and "legitmate" everybody know they only came to power after the judiciary dissolved the PPP and then "elite" influence behind the scenes made up this new "coalition". The government whilst claiming to be "legitimate" cannot claim to be elected by the people, as the people did not vote for these. The people voted PTP.

Therefore, this is the crux of the issue, the elite have got control by "legitimate" methods under the law, the same way Thaksin did many things "within the law".

However, both were immoral and until this immoral government coaliation ends and the power is returned to the people to vote, then the problems remain.

Just dissolve the house Abhisit, be a man for once and show you have the "all" the Thai peoples concerns on your mind, not just the ruling elite.

Yes but what would happen if they called for elections now .

Result A: The dems and their coalition partners would be reelected (or elected , no partisan view here) . Then what for spend so much money on election ? They here already

Result B : a) The PTP would find itself in power in which case

Stock market would likely crash , investors are banking on Abhisit staying in power , and they would withdraw if not . Chavalit and his friends is hardly a star in economic matters , my 5 years old daughter does better . And the class war thing has made investors rather nervous

c) Thaksin would be asked to return to " Save" the thai economy and granted immunity as a special adviser

d) THe rest is a replay of a movie that has ben played before

But then perhaps its what you want after all

Open your eyes.

There is Result C,D,E,F,G,H,J and so on.

You are limiting yourself to what the Yellow want you to think. What their newspapers put into your mind.

There is no A or B as there are many possible results and differences.

This is not about Thaksin now, its about the Elite and how they have, do and will try to continue to control everything in Thailand.

Thaksin is a side issue, his supporters are just ONE PART of the Reds.

Its more than that now, open your eyes.

Come to Bangkok, speak to the people.

[elcent]

If they storm the EC this whole game will change and be nasty.

Imagine if this was happening in New York or London? It would be game over quickly.

it's a different thing to fight a seven headed snake

[tomyummer]

This issue of protesting and demonstrating is really for one reason. To party and avoid really working. Back and forth, back and forth. All 'colors' are to blame, reds, yellows, blues, pinks, etc. It's too bad that the major population cannot see through the smoke and realize that what they (both sides) are really 'rallying' for is the personal wealth of its leaders. Contracts, rights to budgets, etc. Thailand just needs to get their head on straight and clean out ALL of the government offices. Get the top two positions at each accredited university to form the new government. Keep the permanent secretaries of each ministry to continue to run. Take elements of governments from the UK, US, Germany, Singapore, and others to modify and model the new government on.

At this stage, Thailand will continue to run itself into the ground while the surrounding economies and countries will eventually eat up Thailand and their share of the global economic benefits (especially in agricultural trade). Good bye state owned communications and energy!

The Thailand 'brand' is non-existent anymore. It's only made up of bloody walls, corrupt politics, stupid drama series, and mice eating election ballots (remember that one?). The only time Thailand gets coverage on international news is when something out of the ordinary happens. It's taken as a joke.

Get rid of all colors and get to work!

[hammered]

If they storm the EC this whole game will change and be nasty.

Imagine if this was happening in New York or London? It would be game over quickly.

Very true. In fact you wouldnt even be allowed to assemble without a police agreed assembly place or marching route.

[anotherpeter]

Were the judiciary appointed by the junta?

[hammered]

That is the yellows didnt shut the airport down argument applied to this situation. Im sure you used it back then too

Im sure you are also aware that a PPP exec actually got caught bribing local administrators to ensure PPP votes in the North and that a disbandment of party is mandatory under law if an excutive is caught doing this. It was an open and shut case. The law may not be a good one but that is another matter,. The scase was a slam dunk.

The case against the Dems is a lot more circumstantial and invloves conflicting evidence. As such it is a harder case to conclude. However, if there is enough evidence to bring the case and the court finds an executive guilty they will be disbanded as there is no leeway on this.

The Democrats were also accussed with evidence however what appears to be the coup appointed judiciary seemed to think only the PPP were guilty, the same way prior that with TRT and the Democrats again it was only the TRT who got disbanded.

Those Democrats sure are lucky to never be disbanded eh.... LOL

Again this time with plenty of evidence the case against the Democrats, as is the case against the Yellow PAD, is simply washed around the system and will never he heard, simply delay and delay and delay, pass it around, study some more, another meeting, pass it on....my, how quickly a year or two can pass by.

Sad isn't it that it appears even the judiciary and regulatory bodies now might be defunct, worse so than at the time of Thaksin ?

No the evidence in the democrat case is a lot weaker than that against PPP. Yuth "dooyen" was caught red handed. There was no defence. There was no doubt. You should talk to a lawyer about this and not a red or yellow one. The cases are both quite interesting from a legal standpoint.

[BKKer2010]

If they storm the EC this whole game will change and be nasty.

Imagine if this was happening in New York or London? It would be game over quickly.

It would have been game over long before.

[BKKer2010]

No hate in the street??? I seem to recall another view when the Pinks scooped up the Red Shirt at their rally.

Yes, the Yellow shirt PAD see themselves as above the law, they answer to nobody. This is why when the very same people put on Pink shirts they were violent again beating up innocent single red shirts who were just watching.

Sadly the rule of law and the judiciary appears to be under the control of an "elite" who allow their "friends" to get away with anything they do, whilst coming down hard on their "enemies". Surely it is not good for the judiciary to be seen to be under the control of, an influenced by, the elite.

However, it is said that following the coup many top judges and judiciary positons were replaced by the CNS leaders and coup government, and so this is only to be expected until Democracy returns and the coup appointed people are replaced by a democratically elected government.

New elections are needed. Whilst the present coalition can claim to be "legal" and "legitmate" everybody know they only came to power after the judiciary dissolved the PPP and then "elite" influence behind the scenes made up this new "coalition". The government whilst claiming to be "legitimate" cannot claim to be elected by the people, as the people did not vote for these. The people voted PTP.

Therefore, this is the crux of the issue, the elite have got control by "legitimate" methods under the law, the same way Thaksin did many things "within the law".

However, both were immoral and until this immoral government coaliation ends and the power is returned to the people to vote, then the problems remain.

Just dissolve the house Abhisit, be a man for once and show you have the "all" the Thai peoples concerns on your mind, not just the ruling elite.

Yes but what would happen if they called for elections now .

Result A: The dems and their coalition partners would be reelected (or elected , no partisan view here) . Then what for spend so much money on election ? They here already

Result B : a) The PTP would find itself in power in which case

Stock market would likely crash , investors are banking on Abhisit staying in power , and they would withdraw if not . Chavalit and his friends is hardly a star in economic matters , my 5 years old daughter does better . And the class war thing has made investors rather nervous

c) Thaksin would be asked to return to " Save" the thai economy and granted immunity as a special adviser

d) THe rest is a replay of a movie that has ben played before

But then perhaps its what you want after all

Open your eyes.

There is Result C,D,E,F,G,H,J and so on.

You are limiting yourself to what the Yellow want you to think. What their newspapers put into your mind.

There is no A or B as there are many possible results and differences.

This is not about Thaksin now, its about the Elite and how they have, do and will try to continue to control everything in Thailand.

Thaksin is a side issue, his supporters are just ONE PART of the Reds.

Its more than that now, open your eyes.

Come to Bangkok, speak to the people.

Sounds like you should take your own advice ... you sounds like the same broken record we continue to hear from the reds. No substance.

[hammered]

It looks like the head of the EC is now having his life threatened by Arisaman. This is going way too far

[RegularReader]

The blocking of the interesection is not shutting down any business.

There are roads around the demonstration.

Nobody is stopping people working or shopping, it is the owners of the places who have shut them down of their own free will.

Bangkok has many roads, nowhere is blocked access. On foot anywhere can be accessed. By car a small diversion is needed.

More and more are supporting the Reds now, at night when its cool and people finish work the Reds numbers swell. Thats good news.

Many people support the Reds and demanded House Dissolution now. They also questioned why, with staggering evidence far in excess of what was used to disband TRT and PPP, that the EC still muddles on and delays for months the case of dissolution against the Democrats that is pending.

Please explain to a shopping center where 80% of their clients drive, how their clients will come to the center when the road is blocked completely, as occurred yesterday.

Please explain how staff who catch the bus can arrive when a bus doesn't stop near where they are going.

Please explain to a shopping center who is advised by their insurance company not to risk opening and when each individual store wishes to not open since they will have no customers and will potentially have to deal with a mob situation their staff are unable to control that they should disregard those stakeholders and open anyway, but not have any sales.

They will get a big push tonight, no doubt, when all the taxi driver/motorcycle/security guard etc staff go after work to support them.

But I suggest only owners of a shopping center have to consider in deciding to open adjacent to what is currently a peaceful protest but could quickly spiral out of control. When you have a TRT family deciding to shut Bangkok's premier luxury mall and the resultant loss of sales....you can assume they are doing so taking into account the safety of all their staff, of their premises, the likelihood of being able to sell in such an environment.

Your comments are similar to me coming to your condo, moving in uninvited, then questioning why you would not come home as I am not stopping you from sleeping or cooking food or having a party, as I am not stopping you from doing any of these things.*

As for your 'staggering evidence'.....I can only hope that there is evidence out there which has not been in the media as yet, that you have and none of us have seen, for you to make such a bold and strong statement relative to the cheating of TRT in rigging an unnecessary election.

* let me know when I should come around, I will bring along 10,000 people; that's more than the number of red shirts in Ratchaprasong as of this morning driving past. Hope your place is big enough. And don't think I won't use your toilet; I will lay a turtle's egg that will bring glory to the late great Bennie Goodman; a reed player of vast skill who also was widely renowned for his toilet blocking skills.

The BTS is open, many reds are going by BTS. The BTS joins by walkway to the shopping places.

Whats the problem ? Too elite to get the BTS ? Too elite to walk ? Just because you cannot get your Merc to stop at the door does not mean you have to close the place.

The donations scandal of the Democrats is well known, but there appears to be influence holding up the vedict, rather than simply find them guilty as charged or not the "agencies" are passing it around each taking a month or two to view the evidence before passing to the next, and the next....... in effect to delay any verdict - perhaps for 9 months or 1 year and 9 months. The evidence is clear, sadly the verdict is being relentlessly delayed.

Are you in Bangkok ? Or just another "outsider" who feels the need to post on here for arguments sake ?

The Reds have very very strong support, as can be seen on the streets with your eyes open (not reading some internet site).

Great response Steve !

Like you I am sick of these people who make stupid and ignorant statements and can only back it up "it's well known" , "everybody knows" etc., and then igonres all your very correct comments as to why these stores do nt open ,by questioning your credentials and calling you "too elite to catch the BTS".

Would Thaksin, Jatuporn, Weng & co every catch the BTS, eh ?

Is it relevant ?

[BKKer2010]

TAN Network: Red-shirts to seize EC headquarters if EC commissioners failed to meet & answer questions abt Bt258 donation made to Democrats

TAN Network: Kwanchai announced reds will seize EC HQ on Changwattana if EC commissioners failed to answer questions abt Democrats case by 2pm

THE NATION: Recap at EC Hq Chaengwattana: Thousands of reds waiting to meet commissioners, vowing not to leave and giving 2 pm deadline.

THE NATION: Officials/other personnel working at govt agencies located at the Chaengwattana govt centre have been instructed to go home.

[BKKer2010]

It has gone beyond any chance for peaceful resolution. For the sake of all Thailand and its future, the gov't needs to do whatever is needed to enforce the laws and rid the streets of BKK of this unruly mob causing chaos.

Edited April 5, 2010 by BKKer2010

[toybits]

This is stereotyping... from a moderator no less. I am not a farmer from Isaan, but I come from one of those provinces located far from Bangkok. Many of the people here have been branded as not being too smart by people the yellow shirts. It really looks like this is become a struggle between the rural area and Bangkok.

Don't challenge status quo. Let Bangkok take advantage of you. You rural folks are worthless folks anyway - not like "Us" bangkok people.

Amazing...

Here is a reality check for you then... How many Issan farmers pay taxes? How many rural reds pay any taxes (even the leaders avoid paying their taxes - right?) and the few who do actually pay taxes are quite probably so low on the tax-thresholds that they only contribute a few thousand baht a month to the tax coffers. They demand social welfare, cheap hospitals, free schooling, public roads etc etc but don't pay taxes the same as the 'Bangkok elite' (aka Office workers, Shop workers etc) Where do you think the money comes from to pay for these types of things? Oh that's right, the very people the reds are holding to ransom right now! White collar workers who are paying tax each month from their salaries.

I wont refute the Military budget claim although maybe you would prefer to see the military not funded (nice avatar by the way, which military force is that?) The Skimming isn't any better or worse than it was during the Thaksin regime (altho its my personal opinion it was probably a lot worse during his time but that's just my opinion) or maybe you are of the viewpoint that all of the TTT/PPP/PTP (whatever they are called this week) politicians were all squeaky clean, never corrupt, and all had such high moral and ethical standards.

Thailand does not have the funds to pay for the social programs because the money is gobbled up by corrupt politicians and greedy non-tax payers who want social programs but aint prepared to pay for them You know Abhisit has a strong stance against corruption... he appears to be one of the first politicians who is publically against it... maybe that is why he is so disliked amongst the red politicians, hes closing down their cash-cow... interesting viewpoint, no?