These Bloody Clashes Must Cease Immediately: Thailand

[webfact]

EDITORIAL (REVISED)

These bloody clashes must cease immediately

By The Nation

BANGKOK: -- With the situation now out of control, let us hope Songkran week will usher in a period of reflection and calm

The bloodshed that ripped apart the veneer of civility left in the country's politics yesterday was a tragedy waiting to happen.

A miffed Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva apparently appealed to the conscience of the armed forces on Friday over their lax implementation of the emergency decree.

Abhisit was reportedly so upset after rampaging red-shirt protesters managed to get the blacked-out PTV back on air that he gave the top brass a stinging lecture on "responsibility".

"I'm not asking you to take sides," Abhisit reportedly said, amid rumours of him falling out with military. "I'm just asking you to protect the legal power of the state."

Setting at rest the rumours, the armed forces responded to the premier's upbraid with a renewed resolve yesterday as they attempted to purge key areas in downtown Bangkok seized by the red shirts.

The result has been gory. The country witnessed its bloodiest political conflict since the 1992 unrest, and one that the whole country had been dreading for more than a month. The clashes between the Army and the red-shirt protesters have left 11 killed, including two soldiers. Undoubtedly, this tragedy will result in a series of recriminations and finger-pointing even as the dead on both sides are mourned. But the most critical thing for all sides in the conflict is to end the confrontation, back off and to desist from all acts of provocation. This message must undoubtedly be heard on the red-shirt stage, where emotions have been running high.

For the last few years, a culture of protest has repeatedly challenged governments and the armed forces - be it through the seizure of Government House, the airport or the Rajprasong intersection. Governments have been prevented from discharging their duties and forced to be on the run by mobs that claim to be speaking for the masses. This cultural of provocative recalcitrance and civil disobedience is making a mockery of democracy and threatens a breakdown of the administrative machinery. It is a price the country can ill afford to pay.

To be fair to the armed forces, the red-shirt campaign put many parties, including the military, in a damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-don't situation.

How long could the country have endured the siege of a key economic target with the serious danger of a domino effect tripping the rest of the economy? How much longer could the government have continued to be on the run in the country's capital? Had the red shirts continued to pursue talks with the government on the time frame for the dissolution of the House, which is their key demand, without being intractable on their 15-day deadline, it is possible things would not have come to such a pass. In a democracy, negotiations are the only way to resolve a stand-off, even if that involves using interlocutors.

While yesterday's tragedy cannot be easily forgotten, if the lessons it holds out are learned, it is possible to avoid another confrontation of a similar or greater scale. At the end of the day, reds, yellows or people of any other hue are all still Thai.

The military has offered a ceasefire. The red shirts, however great their grief and however intense their angst, must respond positively. And efforts must immediately be made to get negotiations back on track.

Let this coming week's Songkran usher in a period of calm.

-- The Nation 2010-04-11

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[TallForeigner]

And now what?

15 dead people and nearly 700 people injured.

Troops did retreat.

After the battle started the leaders promised to have Phan Fah area cleared before nightfall. Troops and police also tried to move into the Ratchaprasong rally area.

Red leaders asking for truce and talks - government asking for talks.

And the Reds right now?

They are left even more angry and aggressive. They still occupy the Phan Fah area. Doesn't seem many of them have gone home. Ratchaprasong is still occupied by the red masses. Fact is that they are ready to defend their stance with their blood. Battles leaving 15 dead and 700 injured were not enough to have them removed even from one site.

Are we waiting to see round two with even more blood flowing? Does the government plan to turn also Ratchaprasong into a warzone with even more deaths and casualties? The reds are ready to do just that - but is further bloodshed the only solution here?

Whatever happens I just don't want to see more bloodshed. I am praying that finally some men on all sides involved will display the wisdom needed to find a peaceful compromise.

[MB1]

While yesterday's tragedy cannot be easily forgotten, if the lessons it holds out are learned, it is possible to avoid another confrontation of a similar or greater scale. At the end of the day, reds, yellows or people of any other hue are all still Thai.

It won't ever be forgotten and yes lets hope Thai people learn, they red or yelow can't incite violence towards their own people and it remain unpunished.

[brahmburgers]

The result has been gory.

The opinion writer can call it 'gory' if he/she wants, but all the deaths yesterday comprised one third of a daily average for road carnage on any day of the year in Thailand. Oops, sorry, not 'any day of the year' .....road deaths double for New Years and for Songkran. Is the gore any less, when a 5 year old girl and her 2 year old brother have their heads smashed on the pavement by some ignorant drunk driver?

The title of the Editorial is hand-wringing at its best. Sure, no one likes to see people getting injured or killed. However, the Red Shirt leaders have been egging on the authorities for weeks, and the recent fracas is what the Reds have been aiming for. They even stole dead bodies and paraded them on a public stage! After the Red leaders get refreshed from staying at their plush hotels, they'll go back to the Red stages and yell and prance at the manipulated folks who slept on reed mats on dirty sidewalks - to fight for democracy - which any observer knows is a mean ruse. There's no democracy among the Reds. They're a withering minority who are paid to stay in Bkk, and who have leaders who dictate what they should do (note: democracies shouldn't have dictators), .....all in a thinly disguised objective to bring a power hungry rich man - back to power and back to padding his ill-gained fortune.

[Vaquero]

This cultural of provocative recalcitrance and civil disobedience is making a mockery of democracy and threatens a breakdown of the administrative machinery. It is a price the country can ill afford to pay.

This is a lesson all democratic societies need to learn today. A whole generation has been raised to do nothing more than protest every single decision made by lawmakers. Its affects on a democratic governement are starkly obvious here in Thailand as we are sadly witnessing now, but its a slow poison in the rest of the democratic world that is doing tremendous harm.

[TallForeigner]

Interesting how most people are behaving as if it's all over by now. The government has shown its mighty military power and defended democracy and the lesson should have been that the anarchists cannot get away with their crimes. As if it were as simple as that...

What happened is that the army tried to restore order. The result is that by now already 18 people are dead and more than 800 injured - the army retreated but the Reds Shirts are still occupying Phan Fah and Ratchaprasong - anything but order is restored. The only tangible result of that operation might be that now both parties agreed to talk again.

If the level of pressure and violence was not enough to restore order how many lives will be lost once the army increases pressure to finally clear Phan Fah and Ratchaprasong? Is that the only solution?

Give peace a chance again and let's hope that the talks will finally end in an acceptable compromise.

[Teddy3943]

And now what?

15 dead people and nearly 700 people injured.

Troops did retreat.

After the battle started the leaders promised to have Phan Fah area cleared before nightfall. Troops and police also tried to move into the Ratchaprasong rally area.

Red leaders asking for truce and talks - government asking for talks.

And the Reds right now?

They are left even more angry and aggressive. They still occupy the Phan Fah area. Doesn't seem many of them have gone home. Ratchaprasong is still occupied by the red masses. Fact is that they are ready to defend their stance with their blood. Battles leaving 15 dead and 700 injured were not enough to have them removed even from one site.

Are we waiting to see round two with even more blood flowing? Does the government plan to turn also Ratchaprasong into a warzone with even more deaths and casualties? The reds are ready to do just that - but is further bloodshed the only solution here?

Whatever happens I just don't want to see more bloodshed. I am praying that finally some men on all sides involved will display the wisdom needed to find a peaceful compromise.

Don't forget who started the capture of Bangkok and the Thai state...

Enough demonstrating. Let the reds accept their defeat and go home. They get a chance at the next elections. Only wait a little bit longer than they demand. Democratic demonstrations have to be limited, only try to convince politicians of the parliament, where a government can be supported or not. If not than there will be new elections, not by force through capturing a city centre and many citizens and businesses.

The ignorant leaders of the red group forget that the majority of the Thai people disaprove with their actions. It is the silent majority who doesn't want to go on the streets, but dislike very much the actions perpetrated by the brainwashed red group. It says enough that the reds want Taksin to come back in power. They want a criminal and a thief of the Thai state to rule the country and that he is also a dictator appears now the last few weeks where he, like a dictator is adressing the reds. What a disgusting stupid stageplay of this Front for "democracy" and against "dictatorship"!

[guyshown]

The result has been gory.

The opinion writer can call it 'gory' if he/she wants, but all the deaths yesterday comprised one third of a daily average for road carnage on any day of the year in Thailand. Oops, sorry, not 'any day of the year' .....road deaths double for New Years and for Songkran. Is the gore any less, when a 5 year old girl and her 2 year old brother have their heads smashed on the pavement by some ignorant drunk driver?

The title of the Editorial is hand-wringing at its best. Sure, no one likes to see people getting injured or killed. However, the Red Shirt leaders have been egging on the authorities for weeks, and the recent fracas is what the Reds have been aiming for. They even stole dead bodies and paraded them on a public stage! After the Red leaders get refreshed from staying at their plush hotels, they'll go back to the Red stages and yell and prance at the manipulated folks who slept on reed mats on dirty sidewalks - to fight for democracy - which any observer knows is a mean ruse. There's no democracy among the Reds. They're a withering minority who are paid to stay in Bkk, and who have leaders who dictate what they should do (note: democracies shouldn't have dictators), .....all in a thinly disguised objective to bring a power hungry rich man - back to power and back to padding his ill-gained fortune.

Do you have any idea what you are talking about? ---- I understand that people are allowed to express their views but to say there is no democracy among the reds??? Hmm the current government was it elected by the people for the people? They are a withering minority paid to stay in Bangkok--- ???? I do not think that 70 % of the population is withering... And although yes must aggree that Thaksin is close to the Red Shirts this is not about him this is about the process of government.. All seem to forget that he was outsted BY A MILITARY COUP.. lets look at who has been in control since then???? HMMM

Edited April 11, 2010 by guyshown

[Jarearn]

I wish for the UDD to show the film "Gandhi" to teach/learn a little about "non-violence", which they claim to believe in. They have been very violent since the start of this mess. If they were to truly go about it in a non-violent way, there might still be death, but they would have much more sympathy from the public at large, and thus would be much more likely to get what they are after.

Guns, grenades, and firebombs are violent period. They have been used and threatened from the beginning of this "non-violent", "peaceful" protest. The world judges more from actions. Ever heard of Karma? Karma simply means action. Every action will bring a reaction based upon the nature of the action.

I have heard nothing yet of arrests, but with all the red shirts wounded, I would think they'd arrest and lock up those who have been bandaged up. Perhaps the repercussions would be worse.

May this all end with peace in the streets very soon.

Negotiation with mandatory training in NVC (Non-Violent Communication) would be a great step forward.

I love you Thailand.

Dylan

สวัสดีครับ

เจริญ

[geovalin]

1997 - 2007, during the reign of this constitution, no such clashes. Chance or good constitution?

With the 2007 constitution, you are obliged to use violence as every thing is locked. Your political party wins the election? He'll be unfairly disbanded by unfair judges.

A supposed modern country like Thailand needs counter powers.

New constitution (or the old 1997 one) = new era of peace.

[Thai at Heart]

Interesting how most people are behaving as if it's all over by now. The government has shown its mighty military power and defended democracy and the lesson should have been that the anarchists cannot get away with their crimes. As if it were as simple as that...

What happened is that the army tried to restore order. The result is that by now already 18 people are dead and more than 800 injured - the army retreated but the Reds Shirts are still occupying Phan Fah and Ratchaprasong - anything but order is restored. The only tangible result of that operation might be that now both parties agreed to talk again.

If the level of pressure and violence was not enough to restore order how many lives will be lost once the army increases pressure to finally clear Phan Fah and Ratchaprasong? Is that the only solution?

Give peace a chance again and let's hope that the talks will finally end in an acceptable compromise.

Absolutely agree.

Nothing has been concluded, and simply writing headlines like this is not going to change public opinion pro or anti-red one iota.

People have tragically died on both sides.

If anything, I would imagine the red resolve has been strengthened, Abhisit has an even bigger headache than he did this time yesterday and the army is feeling quite sheepish.

Someone had better get these guys around a table, lock the door, keep the bloody media away, and not let them out until there is a hard and binding reconciliation agreement. If that doesn't happen, we will revisit this mess again in the next few days.

[brahmburgers]

The result has been gory.

The opinion writer can call it 'gory' if he/she wants, but all the deaths yesterday comprised one third of a daily average for road carnage on any day of the year in Thailand. Oops, sorry, not 'any day of the year' .....road deaths double for New Years and for Songkran. Is the gore any less, when a 5 year old girl and her 2 year old brother have their heads smashed on the pavement by some ignorant drunk driver?

The title of the Editorial is hand-wringing at its best. Sure, no one likes to see people getting injured or killed. However, the Red Shirt leaders have been egging on the authorities for weeks, and the recent fracas is what the Reds have been aiming for. They even stole dead bodies and paraded them on a public stage! After the Red leaders get refreshed from staying at their plush hotels, they'll go back to the Red stages and yell and prance at the manipulated folks who slept on reed mats on dirty sidewalks - to fight for democracy - which any observer knows is a mean ruse. There's no democracy among the Reds. They're a withering minority who are paid to stay in Bkk, and who have leaders who dictate what they should do (note: democracies shouldn't have dictators), .....all in a thinly disguised objective to bring a power hungry rich man - back to power and back to padding his ill-gained fortune.

Do you have any idea what you are talking about? ---- I understand that people are allowed to express their views but to say there is no democracy among the reds???

Where was Red democracy when one man decided to not accept the v. reasonable offer by the sitting government to call elections a year earlier than need be? One Red rep decided right away that the offer was no good. He didn't even consult with the two other Red leaders sitting next to him. Reds can talk about democracy 'til they're red in the face, but they don't really know what democracy is. The closest the Reds came to democracy was when their leader in absentia paid village headmen (pu yai ban) to spread the payments to his minions (villagers lower down the social ladder) to vote for "the man who was so rich he couldn't be corrupted."

Edited April 11, 2010 by brahmburgers

[powderpuff]

Bring your bulletproof vest made of bamboo.

[IMA_FARANG]

I think everyone wants the violence to stop.

Unfortunately I'm not sure it will.

The wounds are pretty deep now.

We need someone respected by both sides that can step in and defuse the situation. Give both sides a "cool down" period.

Who can do that?

[webfact]

All caps post and 3 innocent replies to it deleted

ALL CAPS posts are considered rude, shouting and bad netiquette.

Next time a suspension will be given

[sunnythai]

Yes I agrre with you..........Big and Bold type the are probally one of the few falang that attended the rally..........step with to the front line and show them what you worth.

[elcent]

Bring your bulletproof vest made of bamboo.

Recently redesigned bullet proof vests are made from various layer of linen mixed with a glue. Not only light and breathing material, but very effective. Alexander the Great used it in the battles against sword attacks.

[robblok]

1997 - 2007, during the reign of this constitution, no such clashes. Chance or good constitution?

With the 2007 constitution, you are obliged to use violence as every thing is locked. Your political party wins the election? He'll be unfairly disbanded by unfair judges.

A supposed modern country like Thailand needs counter powers.

New constitution (or the old 1997 one) = new era of peace.

Sure unfair judges.. the main man was caught on camera buying votes.. seems real unfair to me.

The reds just have to go back and try to win without buying votes, they know this is hard to do so they opt for violence.

I think what happened was bad but it shows the government means business and will help to resolve this situation. Protesting is ok, crippling an entire city is not.

[siampolee]

Thai Prime Minister Secretariat Korbsak Sabhavasuk says future negotiations between the Thai Government and the Red Shirt Movements are only possible when the anti-government protesters obey the law.

A sensible and workable request that would show to the Thai people that sanity can be found in these times.

However I doubt that the rabid Red Shirt Brigade leaders and their puppet master are willing to comply with the request as it isn't their ''we want it now, we want our way or else policy.''

[guyshown]

The result has been gory.

The opinion writer can call it 'gory' if he/she wants, but all the deaths yesterday comprised one third of a daily average for road carnage on any day of the year in Thailand. Oops, sorry, not 'any day of the year' .....road deaths double for New Years and for Songkran. Is the gore any less, when a 5 year old girl and her 2 year old brother have their heads smashed on the pavement by some ignorant drunk driver?

The title of the Editorial is hand-wringing at its best. Sure, no one likes to see people getting injured or killed. However, the Red Shirt leaders have been egging on the authorities for weeks, and the recent fracas is what the Reds have been aiming for. They even stole dead bodies and paraded them on a public stage! After the Red leaders get refreshed from staying at their plush hotels, they'll go back to the Red stages and yell and prance at the manipulated folks who slept on reed mats on dirty sidewalks - to fight for democracy - which any observer knows is a mean ruse. There's no democracy among the Reds. They're a withering minority who are paid to stay in Bkk, and who have leaders who dictate what they should do (note: democracies shouldn't have dictators), .....all in a thinly disguised objective to bring a power hungry rich man - back to power and back to padding his ill-gained fortune.

Do you have any idea what you are talking about? ---- I understand that people are allowed to express their views but to say there is no democracy among the reds???

Where was Red democracy when one man decided to not accept the v. reasonable offer by the sitting government to call elections a year earlier than need be? One Red rep decided right away that the offer was no good. He didn't even consult with the two other Red leaders sitting next to him. Reds can talk about democracy 'til they're red in the face, but they don't really know what democracy is. The closest the Reds came to democracy was when their leader in absentia paid village headmen (pu yai ban) to spread the payments to his minions (villagers lower down the social ladder) to vote for "the man who was so rich he couldn't be corrupted."

OK -- too wait for any length of time to afford the people the right vote and elect a government of the peoples choice not a Government that was put in place by the actions of a Coup is obserd! It is obvious that the current Goverment is worried that it will not be elected by the people. Question were they ever elected by the people? Again this as much as everyone keeps trying to make it is not about Thaksin this is about the process of the current government...

Edited April 11, 2010 by Lite Beer

[MellowYellow]

The opinion writer can call it 'gory' if he/she wants, but all the deaths yesterday comprised one third of a daily average for road carnage on any day of the year in Thailand. Oops, sorry, not 'any day of the year' .....road deaths double for New Years and for Songkran. Is the gore any less, when a 5 year old girl and her 2 year old brother have their heads smashed on the pavement by some ignorant drunk driver?

Are you actually trying to belittle those who died last night by saying their deaths are no more consequential than accidental deaths?

Is your bloodlust not yet sated with 15+ dead and 100s wounded?

How many dead do you want/need before you will care that Thais are purposefully killing other Thais for their respective rich meglomaniacs?

The title of the Editorial is hand-wringing at its best. Sure, no one likes to see people getting injured or killed. However, the Red Shirt leaders have been egging on the authorities for weeks, and the recent fracas is what the Reds have been aiming for. They even stole dead bodies and paraded them on a public stage! After the Red leaders get refreshed from staying at their plush hotels, they'll go back to the Red stages and yell and prance at the manipulated folks who slept on reed mats on dirty sidewalks - to fight for democracy - which any observer knows is a mean ruse. There's no democracy among the Reds. They're a withering minority who are paid to stay in Bkk, and who have leaders who dictate what they should do (note: democracies shouldn't have dictators), .....all in a thinly disguised objective to bring a power hungry rich man - back to power and back to padding his ill-gained fortune.

So the Nation finally puts out a calming nearly unbiased call to peace and you want to bash them for not encouraging more violence?

Seriously...What will satisfy your bloodlust?

[Redsunset]

It is 10:30am... what is the status of the red shirt occupations? I read yesterday that the government was going to re-occupy Phan Fa Bridge? Where ae the protesters now? Are their numbers growing?

[Redsunset]

Honestly... I've read several editorials and articles pleading for the red-shirts and government to stop fighting because "We are all Thais".

Is that really necessary? Is that the real solution, or merely a cry for help?

The real TEMPORARY solution is for Abhisit to resign. I know it might not help long term, but he is the epicenter of violence now. We need to stop the blood flow now, we need to do something practical.

Asking Thaksin to stop is like asking a wild boar to think..... that route is useless....telling Thais to stop killing each other because "we are all Thais" works as well as a water pistol at the Chicago Fire.

Abhisit, you must resign.

[Redsunset]

The opinion writer can call it 'gory' if he/she wants, but all the deaths yesterday comprised one third of a daily average for road carnage on any day of the year in Thailand. Oops, sorry, not 'any day of the year' .....road deaths double for New Years and for Songkran. Is the gore any less, when a 5 year old girl and her 2 year old brother have their heads smashed on the pavement by some ignorant drunk driver?

Are you actually trying to belittle those who died last night by saying their deaths are no more consequential than accidental deaths?

Is your bloodlust not yet sated with 15+ dead and 100s wounded?

How many dead do you want/need before you will care that Thais are purposefully killing other Thais for their respective rich meglomaniacs?

The title of the Editorial is hand-wringing at its best. Sure, no one likes to see people getting injured or killed. However, the Red Shirt leaders have been egging on the authorities for weeks, and the recent fracas is what the Reds have been aiming for. They even stole dead bodies and paraded them on a public stage! After the Red leaders get refreshed from staying at their plush hotels, they'll go back to the Red stages and yell and prance at the manipulated folks who slept on reed mats on dirty sidewalks - to fight for democracy - which any observer knows is a mean ruse. There's no democracy among the Reds. They're a withering minority who are paid to stay in Bkk, and who have leaders who dictate what they should do (note: democracies shouldn't have dictators), .....all in a thinly disguised objective to bring a power hungry rich man - back to power and back to padding his ill-gained fortune.

So the Nation finally puts out a calming nearly unbiased call to peace and you want to bash them for not encouraging more violence?

Seriously...What will satisfy your bloodlust?

To the original poster.... so what? So what would you do to solve the problem?

[10027586]

To those saying Abhisit must resign. Think about it for a moment. If he resigns, any group of thugs can make any government, elected or not, resign. If he resigns, Thailand is truly screwed.

[MellowYellow]

Honestly... I've read several editorials and articles pleading for the red-shirts and government to stop fighting because "We are all Thais".

Is that really necessary? Is that the real solution, or merely a cry for help?

The real TEMPORARY solution is for Abhisit to resign. I know it might not help long term, but he is the epicenter of violence now. We need to stop the blood flow now, we need to do something practical.

Asking Thaksin to stop is like asking a wild boar to think..... that route is useless....telling Thais to stop killing each other because "we are all Thais" works as well as a water pistol at the Chicago Fire.

Abhisit, you must resign.

Here is where I am going to diverge from my previous thought.

Now is probably the exact WORST time of any for Abhisit to resign.

My impression is that he let the violent genie out, under extreme pressure and against his actual desires.

Should he snap resign before this is somewhat settled peacibly, I really fear the lengths a replacement hard-line PM would go to.

Despite my questioning the legitimacy of his government, I think he is quite essential now in holding, against heavy pressure, the door shut to more and far worse violence.

If he were to step down later after it is all calmed, fine, but not now.

If he were to carry on as PM, well it's going to be difficult but we shall see how he handles the next few days.

[rreddin]

Honestly... I've read several editorials and articles pleading for the red-shirts and government to stop fighting because "We are all Thais".

Is that really necessary? Is that the real solution, or merely a cry for help?

The real TEMPORARY solution is for Abhisit to resign. I know it might not help long term, but he is the epicenter of violence now. We need to stop the blood flow now, we need to do something practical.

Asking Thaksin to stop is like asking a wild boar to think..... that route is useless....telling Thais to stop killing each other because "we are all Thais" works as well as a water pistol at the Chicago Fire.

Abhisit, you must resign.

Here is where I am going to diverge from my previous thought.

Now is probably the exact WORST time of any for Abhisit to resign.

My impression is that he let the violent genie out, under extreme pressure and against his actual desires.

Should he snap resign before this is somewhat settled peacibly, I really fear the lengths a replacement hard-line PM would go to.

Despite my questioning the legitimacy of his government, I think he is quite essential now in holding, against heavy pressure, the door shut to more and far worse violence.

If he were to step down later after it is all calmed, fine, but not now.

If he were to carry on as PM, well it's going to be difficult but we shall see how he handles the next few days.

Agreed, now is not the time for Abhist to resign, it is the time for him to show statesmanship. The military option has failed. Now is the time for meaningful negotiations with no pre-conditions from either side.

edited to correct typo

Edited April 11, 2010 by rreddin

[JetsetBkk]

To those saying Abhisit must resign. Think about it for a moment. If he resigns, any group of thugs can make any government, elected or not, resign.

<snip>

They already did.

[jonnyscot]

Thai Prime Minister Secretariat Korbsak Sabhavasuk says future negotiations between the Thai Government and the Red Shirt Movements are only possible when the anti-government protesters obey the law.

A sensible and workable request that would show to the Thai people that sanity can be found in these times.

However I doubt that the rabid Red Shirt Brigade leaders and their puppet master are willing to comply with the request as it isn't their ''we want it now, we want our way or else policy.''

I agree that negotiation is the only way to achieve results,,,,,,,,, give everyone a cooling off period,,,, and have the red leaders that were issued with the arrest warrants sent to the courts to explain their instigation of illegal deeds.... that should give the red party some time to have restored some sensibility, negotiation skills and understanding of democracy and the laws of the country to make a legitimate challenge to government

.............. oops,,, maybe the reds will not be happy about their current leaders going to court,,, but they did break the law....

[animatic]

The result has been gory.

The opinion writer can call it 'gory' if he/she wants, but all the deaths yesterday comprised one third of a daily average for road carnage on any day of the year in Thailand. Oops, sorry, not 'any day of the year' .....road deaths double for New Years and for Songkran. Is the gore any less, when a 5 year old girl and her 2 year old brother have their heads smashed on the pavement by some ignorant drunk driver?

The title of the Editorial is hand-wringing at its best. Sure, no one likes to see people getting injured or killed. However, the Red Shirt leaders have been egging on the authorities for weeks, and the recent fracas is what the Reds have been aiming for. They even stole dead bodies and paraded them on a public stage! After the Red leaders get refreshed from staying at their plush hotels, they'll go back to the Red stages and yell and prance at the manipulated folks who slept on reed mats on dirty sidewalks - to fight for democracy - which any observer knows is a mean ruse. There's no democracy among the Reds. They're a withering minority who are paid to stay in Bkk, and who have leaders who dictate what they should do (note: democracies shouldn't have dictators), .....all in a thinly disguised objective to bring a power hungry rich man - back to power and back to padding his ill-gained fortune.

Do you have any idea what you are talking about? ---- I understand that people are allowed to express their views but to say there is no democracy among the reds??? Hmm the current government was it elected by the people for the people? They are a withering minority paid to stay in Bangkok--- ???? I do not think that 70 % of the population is withering... And although yes must aggree that Thaksin is close to the Red Shirts this is not about him this is about the process of government.. All seem to forget that he was outsted BY A MILITARY COUP.. lets look at who has been in control since then???? HMMM

Thaksin's minions on their best day never got close to 70% of the country.

Typically 65% of the nation has opposed them.

Last election they managed 36% nothing more.

The red shirt bunch barely could possibly represent 20% IF all agreed with their tactics.

No doubt many up country agree with some of their aims but few of their tactics.