These Bloody Clashes Must Cease Immediately: Thailand

[khunjamespittman]

..........

Abhisit gives no sign of folding.

Nor should he.

from Webfact

"Gen Prayuth, tipped to become army commander-in-chief in October upon the compulsory retirement of the current army chief, said he could not tolerate any longer as the 'Red Shirt' people break the law. He vowed to adopt every measure to bring back peace to the country as soon as possible. (TNA)"

I am afraid the Falcons have the majority above the doves... Peace seems not on the agenda

Keeping a functional civil government is only in the country's best interest. If the government caves immediately then out come the yellows, then the reds, then the yellows. then the reds......

According to a Poll published in a Website we cannot named 92% of Thais people put PEACE as the first priority.

I expect that a Government of National Unity will take over next week in order to clean the deck of this successions of Coups, dismisses of PM (some under the funny pretext cooking in a TV show), all this successions of events are a stain on the credibility of Abhisit and throws a doubt on his legitimacy (wrongly or truly, it is not the question- It is an endless debate). On the other side, you have a Northern population who is over-exploited and needs urgent measures. I do agree with some of you that Thaksin must not come back and I will be on your side if it happens.

Urgently the Thai system needs amendments, those amendments have to be endorsed by the Parliament which can be dissolved only when the amendments to Charter have been implemented. Then, Elections can be set up. How long it will take? We have to be serious, to consider the time to pass the amendments through the parliament and to set up the Elections. To throw figures without reality is meaningless. It has to be discussed by Responsible and experiienced People. I hope -I repeat myself- that the 4 Ex PMs (Anand, Chavalit,Banharm and Chuan Leekpai) will arrive to set a proposal and the roadmap to Elections.

One Personnality above any Parties must manage this period in order to re-establish Peace and confidence between Thais to overpass this current division. Abhisit because he is too much engaged on one side cannot embody this third way. but he can come back in few months through the elections.

This is my hope.

A third way, a Charter corrected of its major flaws, Peace and Harmony in Thailand.

I agree with your suggestions that a group of men of good will and trust need to meet and define an solution for this problem.

I don't restrict the list to any specific names, only men of good will and trust. This elimanted mr. Abhisit and the commanding generals who killed the Thai citizens. Their fate should ultimately be prison after a legitimate investigation and fair trials.

I disagree with you about delaying an election until this faulty government make changes. They could never be trusted to do anything other than feather their bed and how can any one trust someone who changes the agreement made at Thaicom and proposes 9 months to perform a a 1 month job of an election. Thailand is at least as good as the UK.

Stop all these silly excuses andf get on with a legitimate election.

[VegasVic]

I think VegasVic is making a point --- Thaksin is Thai Chinese and his residence was in BKK before he ran away to avoid serving time in jail and the people of Thailand are sick of him!

That was your point right?

BTW --- the PAD committed some crimes, vic, while they stalled the PPP from being able to do a unilateral rewrite of the charter. They never took power. They virtually disappeared after the courts dissolved the PPP (for cause).

Everyone but a few Thaksin die-hards knows that the current government is legit and came into power the way other governments do, through a vote in parliament. People have seen the tapes of the PPP party Executive making payoffs and know the court decision to disband them was valid.

Everyone has seen the reds attacking Thaicom, attacking 1st Regiment, carrying and using weapons and everyone knows that this is NOT the first time (ASEAN summit and Songkran 2009).

The most vital thing to remember in this mess is that PPP could have dissolved parliament and called new elections even 1 day before they were disbanded (and remember that tape of the payoffs --- them being disbanded was a forgone conclusion!)

Give up while you are behind there JD You and your brother jingthing are way out of touch with what is going on in the Thai countryside. Abhisit will step down by the end of next week and there will be new elections by the middle of summer, because that is the only sensible way out of this

[punisher]

The real TEMPORARY solution is for Abhisit to resign. I know it might not help long term, but he is the epicenter of violence now. We need to stop the blood flow now, we need to do something practical.

Abhisit, you must resign.

Giving in to blackmail, extortion, threats and demands never works. It only encourages the criminals to push for more, and increase the level of the threats they will utter, to get what they want.

I think Abhisit has played this very well, he has given the red shirts enough rope to hang themselves. They have shown themselves to be no more than thugs, paid to support a criminal who is on the run. Their leader has blood on his hands from deaths in the war against drugs, the Tak Bai massacre etc. What does he want? Why destroy Thailand? For greed? For power?

The sooner he is gone for good the better. Thailand can get on with the process of healing the rifts created by this megalomaniac.

Mr.Abi is not the guy who decide what to do,the people who decide sit somewhere else

[jdinasia]

I think VegasVic is making a point --- Thaksin is Thai Chinese and his residence was in BKK before he ran away to avoid serving time in jail and the people of Thailand are sick of him!

That was your point right?

BTW --- the PAD committed some crimes, vic, while they stalled the PPP from being able to do a unilateral rewrite of the charter. They never took power. They virtually disappeared after the courts dissolved the PPP (for cause).

Everyone but a few Thaksin die-hards knows that the current government is legit and came into power the way other governments do, through a vote in parliament. People have seen the tapes of the PPP party Executive making payoffs and know the court decision to disband them was valid.

Everyone has seen the reds attacking Thaicom, attacking 1st Regiment, carrying and using weapons and everyone knows that this is NOT the first time (ASEAN summit and Songkran 2009).

The most vital thing to remember in this mess is that PPP could have dissolved parliament and called new elections even 1 day before they were disbanded (and remember that tape of the payoffs --- them being disbanded was a forgone conclusion!)

Give up while you are behind there JD You and your brother jingthing are way out of touch with what is going on in the Thai countryside. Abhisit will step down by the end of next week and there will be new elections by the middle of summer, because that is the only sensible way out of this

HUH? did someone in the USA just tell me that I am out of touch with Thailand? Please think your post through again and then feel free to respond again after all you didn't respond to anything ... just wrote the red party-line.

[changnaam]

I think VegasVic is making a point --- Thaksin is Thai Chinese and his residence was in BKK before he ran away to avoid serving time in jail and the people of Thailand are sick of him!

That was your point right?

BTW --- the PAD committed some crimes, vic, while they stalled the PPP from being able to do a unilateral rewrite of the charter. They never took power. They virtually disappeared after the courts dissolved the PPP (for cause).

Everyone but a few Thaksin die-hards knows that the current government is legit and came into power the way other governments do, through a vote in parliament. People have seen the tapes of the PPP party Executive making payoffs and know the court decision to disband them was valid.

Everyone has seen the reds attacking Thaicom, attacking 1st Regiment, carrying and using weapons and everyone knows that this is NOT the first time (ASEAN summit and Songkran 2009).

The most vital thing to remember in this mess is that PPP could have dissolved parliament and called new elections even 1 day before they were disbanded (and remember that tape of the payoffs --- them being disbanded was a forgone conclusion!)

Give up while you are behind there JD You and your brother jingthing are way out of touch with what is going on in the Thai countryside. Abhisit will step down by the end of next week and there will be new elections by the middle of summer, because that is the only sensible way out of this

Yes, because the "Thai countryside" is the centre of the universe yes?

Although important to the economy but with all due respect would not exactly be well placed to run a nation, and hopefully keep pace with the rest of Asia which must be rubbing its hands together at this debacle.

I bet Vietnam et al are well looking forward to all the extra investment coming their way.

The "Thai countryside" needs fair and inclusive guidance, rather than looking to take over the world.

[Jerrytheyoung]

Can I ask a stupid question in view of what's been happening? Do you think the Red shirts are likely to give in? My fear is may more people will die and nothing is resolved. I'm no great shakes at politics even my own country's, but, I do feel for the people of Thailand.

nobody can give you an answer, we can give you only opinions.

IMHO, next week after tuesday (festivities of Songkran), there will be an aftermaith of the events. Abhisit (the PM) and his government are under survey by the Big Brasses and what we name "the Invisible Hand". I do not think there will be a military coup, it is a discarded option (The last coup has been a failure and we believe than the Current Militaries have been summoned by their Big brothers from USA), however we cannot eliminate totally this option.

There is a meeting organised "after Songkran" under the patronage of the Human Right Committee. Four ex Prime Ministers, highly respected with different political backgrounds will join this meeting. I (and a lot of people) expect than a solution like a Government of National Unity will come out. It is personally my hope.

The Red Shirt movement is emancipating and less and less under the influence of Thaksin, however the umbilical cord is not yet cut. they represent more and more the interests of the Northern population particularly the farmers. it is a political consequence of the current events.

Democrats and Abhisit have to make a pause before coming back on the scene. They represent mainly the Bangkokian Middle Class and the Elite and also the Southern Thailand.

Several small parties can make the difference for building a Coalition.

One of the reason of the current conflict is the fact that the PPP (Party of the Red Shirts) has lost the Government Control due to this small parties, (Democrats joined by those small parties making the Coalition currently in power)

I think I have tried to answer to your question honestly, but i know my colleagues will correct me, some with their vitriolic ink...At your service, do not hesitate to ask more question....

[VegasVic]

The result has been gory.

The opinion writer can call it 'gory' if he/she wants, but all the deaths yesterday comprised one third of a daily average for road carnage on any day of the year in Thailand. Oops, sorry, not 'any day of the year' .....road deaths double for New Years and for Songkran. Is the gore any less, when a 5 year old girl and her 2 year old brother have their heads smashed on the pavement by some ignorant drunk driver?

The title of the Editorial is hand-wringing at its best. Sure, no one likes to see people getting injured or killed. However, the Red Shirt leaders have been egging on the authorities for weeks, and the recent fracas is what the Reds have been aiming for. They even stole dead bodies and paraded them on a public stage! After the Red leaders get refreshed from staying at their plush hotels, they'll go back to the Red stages and yell and prance at the manipulated folks who slept on reed mats on dirty sidewalks - to fight for democracy - which any observer knows is a mean ruse. There's no democracy among the Reds. They're a withering minority who are paid to stay in Bkk, and who have leaders who dictate what the y should do (note: democracies shouldn't have dictators), .....all in a thinly disguised objective to bring a power hungry rich man - back to power and back to padding his ill-gained fortune.

Do you have any idea what you are talking about? ---- I understand that people are allowed to express their views but to say there is no democracy among the reds??? Hmm the current government was it elected by the people for the people? They are a withering minority paid to stay in Bangkok--- ???? I do not think that 70 % of the population is withering... And although yes must aggree that Thaksin is close to the Red Shirts this is not about him this is about the process of government.. All seem to forget that he was outsted BY A MILITARY COUP.. lets look at who has been in control since then???? HMMM

By my calculations there is about .001% of the thai population demonstrating in BKK

As for military coup's there have been 18 of them in the last 70 years. That averages to 1 every 3.5 years.

Everybody is screaming for democracy, but with stats like this I am not sure there is a lot of experience with democracy.

You make a big mistake by thinking that the 80,000 protesting in Bangkok is the totality of this movement, there are 10's of millions of Thais who are sympathetic to to the red shirts cause. You are however correct that democracy in Thailand is a little different than democracy elsewhere around the globe. I mean when the minority party can find a few military leaders who are sympathetic to their cause and overthrow a popularly elected leader, then outlaw the opposing party and censure 100+ of that parties leaders from politics, not too mention changing the constitution on there own, it really doesn't look like any form of democracy that I am familiar with BTW your calculations are a little off, not that it matters but the 80,000 in Bangkok arer a little more than .01% of the Thai population

[jdinasia]

I agree with your suggestions that a group of men of good will and trust need to meet and define an solution for this problem.

I don't restrict the list to any specific names, only men of good will and trust. This elimanted mr. Abhisit and the commanding generals who killed the Thai citizens. Their fate should ultimately be prison after a legitimate investigation and fair trials.

I disagree with you about delaying an election until this faulty government make changes. They could never be trusted to do anything other than feather their bed and how can any one trust someone who changes the agreement made at Thaicom and proposes 9 months to perform a a 1 month job of an election. Thailand is at least as good as the UK.

Stop all these silly excuses andf get on with a legitimate election.

KJP ---- you were excusing the violence of Oct 7th 2008 by saying that the government MUST maintain law and order. You stated clearly that deaths were acceptable to maintain law and order! Yet this is your approach now? nothing even close to any logic in that flip flop is there?

editing to add some KJP quotes ------ sorry to keep trotting these out in front of you but you never do answer --- why was it OK for the government to kill and main in the past to enforce the law but not now?

Thailand must enforce the rule of law even if it means imprisoning a significant number of the radical extremists. Anarchy will consume Thailand if the rule of law does not prevail.http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=&showtopic=218054&view=findpost&p=2282096

The government must enforce the rule of law even if some law-breakers are killed or injured. It is the government's responsibiliy and duty to maintain law and order and to prosecute ALL law-breakers.http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?s=&showtopic=216639&view=findpost&p=2265470

So ... Rule of Law --- doesn't really appear to matter to KJP. KJP also appears to think that killing people on Oct 7th 2008 was OK but that killing different people now is not! Why do you think that KJP --- or if that is not how you think can you explain why these things seem so opposite?

Edited April 11, 2010 by jdinasia

[punisher]

I think VegasVic is making a point --- Thaksin is Thai Chinese and his residence was in BKK before he ran away to avoid serving time in jail and the people of Thailand are sick of him!

That was your point right?

BTW --- the PAD committed some crimes, vic, while they stalled the PPP from being able to do a unilateral rewrite of the charter. They never took power. They virtually disappeared after the courts dissolved the PPP (for cause).

Everyone but a few Thaksin die-hards knows that the current government is legit and came into power the way other governments do, through a vote in parliament. People have seen the tapes of the PPP party Executive making payoffs and know the court decision to disband them was valid.

Everyone has seen the reds attacking Thaicom, attacking 1st Regiment, carrying and using weapons and everyone knows that this is NOT the first time (ASEAN summit and Songkran 2009).

The most vital thing to remember in this mess is that PPP could have dissolved parliament and called new elections even 1 day before they were disbanded (and remember that tape of the payoffs --- them being disbanded was a forgone conclusion!)

Give up while you are behind there JD You and your brother jingthing are way out of touch with what is going on in the Thai countryside. Abhisit will step down by the end of next week and there will be new elections by the middle of summer, because that is the only sensible way out of this

Yes, because the "Thai countryside" is the centre of the universe yes?

Although important to the economy but with all due respect would not exactly be well placed to run a nation, and hopefully keep pace with the rest of Asia which must be rubbing its hands together at this debacle.

I bet Vietnam et al are well looking forward to all the extra investment coming their way.

The "Thai countryside" needs fair and inclusive guidance, rather than looking to take over the world.

Thai countryside,they are thais!!!!

[Jerrytheyoung]

In addition to my previous post, general Chavalit is currently the Chairman of the Red Shirts, he is one of the 4 participants to the above mentioned meeting and I do believe that he is very favourable to a Government of National Unity: this is an idea he has promoted several times in the past, in other circumstances. I do believe that at least 2 other ex-PMs are open to this solution....

There are some strong analogies with the 1933 situation in Spain which has leaded to the Civil war three years later. However we are in Asia and the European History cannot be transposed directly in South East Asia. However, we have to be cautious and everybody must be of good will for defusing the situation.

Edited April 11, 2010 by Jerrytheyoung

[hammered]

Can I ask a stupid question in view of what's been happening? Do you think the Red shirts are likely to give in? My fear is may more people will die and nothing is resolved. I'm no great shakes at politics even my own country's, but, I do feel for the people of Thailand.

nobody can give you an answer, we can give you only opinions.

IMHO, next week after tuesday (festivities of Songkran), there will be an aftermaith of the events. Abhisit (the PM) and his government are under survey by the Big Brasses and what we name "the Invisible Hand". I do not think there will be a military coup, it is a discarded option (The last coup has been a failure and we believe than the Current Militaries have been summoned by their Big brothers from USA), however we cannot eliminate totally this option.

There is a meeting organised "after Songkran" under the patronage of the Human Right Committee. Four ex Prime Ministers, highly respected with different political backgrounds will join this meeting. I (and a lot of people) expect than a solution like a Government of National Unity will come out. It is personally my hope.

The Red Shirt movement is emancipating and less and less under the influence of Thaksin, however the umbilical cord is not yet cut. they represent more and more the interests of the Northern population particularly the farmers. it is a political consequence of the current events.

Democrats and Abhisit have to make a pause before coming back on the scene. They represent mainly the Bangkokian Middle Class and the Elite and also the Southern Thailand.

Several small parties can make the difference for building a Coalition.

One of the reason of the current conflict is the fact that the PPP (Party of the Red Shirts) has lost the Government Control due to this small parties, (Democrats joined by those small parties making the Coalition currently in power)

I think I have tried to answer to your question honestly, but i know my colleagues will correct me, some with their vitriolic ink...At your service, do not hesitate to ask more question....

Sounds reasonable to me

The main thing is finding a way out that all can agree to

[jdinasia]

In addition to my previous post, general Chavalit is currently the Chairman of the Red Shirts, he is one of the 4 participants to the above mentioned meeting and I do believe that he is very favourable to a Government of National Unity: this is an idea he has promoted several times in the past, in other circumstances. I do believe that at least 2 other ex-PMs are open to this solution....

There are some strong analogies with the 1933 situation in Spain which has leaded to the Civil war three years later. However we are in Asia and the European History cannot be transposed directly in South East Asia. However, we have to be cautious and everybody must be of good will for defusing the situation.

Do you know anything about Chevalit? gads ... he sank the Thai economy and triggered the 1997 asian collapse. But hey, he's a friend of Thaksin!

[Rinrada]

The real TEMPORARY solution is for Abhisit to resign. I know it might not help long term, but he is the epicenter of violence now. We need to stop the blood flow now, we need to do something practical.

Abhisit, you must resign.

Giving in to blackmail, extortion, threats and demands never works. It only encourages the criminals to push for more, and increase the level of the threats they will utter, to get what they want.

I think Abhisit has played this very well, he has given the red shirts enough rope to hang themselves. They have shown themselves to be no more than thugs, paid to support a criminal who is on the run. Their leader has blood on his hands from deaths in the war against drugs, the Tak Bai massacre etc. What does he want? Why destroy Thailand? For greed? For power?

The sooner he is gone for good the better. Thailand can get on with the process of healing the rifts created by this megalomaniac.

"Giving in to blackmail, extortion, threats and demands never works" Really? It seemed to work out pretty well for the yellow shirts

True...however the Pads were in cahoots with the government who control the army (oops) who are controlled by the ones that every Thais knows about...BUT....mai pooooot

[Jerrytheyoung]

In addition to my previous post, general Chavalit is currently the Chairman of the Red Shirts, he is one of the 4 participants to the above mentioned meeting and I do believe that he is very favourable to a Government of National Unity: this is an idea he has promoted several times in the past, in other circumstances. I do believe that at least 2 other ex-PMs are open to this solution....

There are some strong analogies with the 1933 situation in Spain which has leaded to the Civil war three years later. However we are in Asia and the European History cannot be transposed directly in South East Asia. However, we have to be cautious and everybody must be of good will for defusing the situation.

Do you know anything about Chevalit? gads ... he sank the Thai economy and triggered the 1997 asian collapse. But hey, he's a friend of Thaksin!

yes I have gotten the privilege to meet him and to discuss (a little) with him.

If you read in details the 1997 story, you will see that he has "covered" the mistake of his Finances Minister and he has taken the full responsability on himself. Same last year, he covers his team and he resigns taking the full responsability. When he was in Army, he was very appreciated. I know some of his ideas amidst them the decentralisation of some Industries and the creation of Economical hubs. He has been unlucky in 1997, but his behavior is remarkable: he take full responsability of events when in fact the faults are done by a subordinate. He is in good relation with most of Politicians friends and opponents, he was close to Prem and I know he has worked with Thaksin as he has worked with a lot of people.

Personal touch; he listens to you and to others, he takes his decisions after listening... not always the case.

One more thing, his way of life seems comfortable but not luxurious.

Edited April 11, 2010 by Jerrytheyoung

[hammered]

In addition to my previous post, general Chavalit is currently the Chairman of the Red Shirts, he is one of the 4 participants to the above mentioned meeting and I do believe that he is very favourable to a Government of National Unity: this is an idea he has promoted several times in the past, in other circumstances. I do believe that at least 2 other ex-PMs are open to this solution....

There are some strong analogies with the 1933 situation in Spain which has leaded to the Civil war three years later. However we are in Asia and the European History cannot be transposed directly in South East Asia. However, we have to be cautious and everybody must be of good will for defusing the situation.

Do you know anything about Chevalit? gads ... he sank the Thai economy and triggered the 1997 asian collapse. But hey, he's a friend of Thaksin!

Lets be honest if we want this thing resolved, having a friend of Thaksin in the group isnt a bad idea. The others are Chuan, Banharn and Anand. That isnt a bad group for representing the contries interests. Or lets put it another way, they are probably the best hope right now to avoid more death.

[Livinginexile]

"Revolution is born from the barell of a gun" now who said that?

Viva le revolution! long live the people!

Democracy rules!

[jdinasia]

In addition to my previous post, general Chavalit is currently the Chairman of the Red Shirts, he is one of the 4 participants to the above mentioned meeting and I do believe that he is very favourable to a Government of National Unity: this is an idea he has promoted several times in the past, in other circumstances. I do believe that at least 2 other ex-PMs are open to this solution....

There are some strong analogies with the 1933 situation in Spain which has leaded to the Civil war three years later. However we are in Asia and the European History cannot be transposed directly in South East Asia. However, we have to be cautious and everybody must be of good will for defusing the situation.

Do you know anything about Chevalit? gads ... he sank the Thai economy and triggered the 1997 asian collapse. But hey, he's a friend of Thaksin!

Lets be honest if we want this thing resolved, having a friend of Thaksin in the group isnt a bad idea. The others are Chuan, Banharn and Anand. That isnt a bad group for representing the contries interests. Or lets put it another way, they are probably the best hope right now to avoid more death.

I think more bloodshed is sadly inevitable. I really am convinced that we will be stuck with another coup OR the military will back this government's legitimacy 100% and that after Abhisit sets up the referendum on the constitution and sets the stage for a new government that he takes the hit for this and steps down. Next PM sees the budget taken care of and the army reshuffle and then calls elections.

The street protests have to be stopped as an acceptable way to change a government you don't like and the stand must be made now.

[way2muchcoffee]

In addition to my previous post, general Chavalit is currently the Chairman of the Red Shirts, he is one of the 4 participants to the above mentioned meeting and I do believe that he is very favourable to a Government of National Unity: this is an idea he has promoted several times in the past, in other circumstances. I do believe that at least 2 other ex-PMs are open to this solution....

There are some strong analogies with the 1933 situation in Spain which has leaded to the Civil war three years later. However we are in Asia and the European History cannot be transposed directly in South East Asia. However, we have to be cautious and everybody must be of good will for defusing the situation.

Do you know anything about Chevalit? gads ... he sank the Thai economy and triggered the 1997 asian collapse. But hey, he's a friend of Thaksin!

yes I have gotten the privilege to meet him and to discuss (a little) with him.

If you read in details the 1997 story, you will see that he has "covered" the mistake of his Finances Minister and he has taken the full responsability on himself. Same last year, he covers his team and he resigns taking the full responsability. When he was in Army, he was very appreciated. I know some of his ideas amidst them the decentralisation of some Industries and the creation of Economical hubs. He has been unlucky in 1997, but his behavior is remarkable: he take full responsability of events when in fact the faults are done by a subordinate. He is in good relation with most of Politicians friends and opponents, he was close to Prem and I know he has worked with Thaksin as he has worked with a lot of people.

Personal touch; he listens to you and to others, he takes his decisions after listening... not always the case.

If a Unity Government were to form the question of the leader is interesting. It would be a temporary government with specific tasks to complete before holding an election. Therefore it is important to pick the right person for that job.

It should not be Chavalit precisely because of his role in the PTP.

It cannot be Abbhisit, for obvious reasons.

It cannot be any of the red shirt leaders.

It probably would be difficult to come to agreement over anyone from either PTP or Dem.

So that leaves the military - no way.

Barnharn - hmm.

Chuan - hmm.

Anand?

Others?

[sjaak327]

In addition to my previous post, general Chavalit is currently the Chairman of the Red Shirts, he is one of the 4 participants to the above mentioned meeting and I do believe that he is very favourable to a Government of National Unity: this is an idea he has promoted several times in the past, in other circumstances. I do believe that at least 2 other ex-PMs are open to this solution....

There are some strong analogies with the 1933 situation in Spain which has leaded to the Civil war three years later. However we are in Asia and the European History cannot be transposed directly in South East Asia. However, we have to be cautious and everybody must be of good will for defusing the situation.

Do you know anything about Chevalit? gads ... he sank the Thai economy and triggered the 1997 asian collapse. But hey, he's a friend of Thaksin!

Lets be honest if we want this thing resolved, having a friend of Thaksin in the group isnt a bad idea. The others are Chuan, Banharn and Anand. That isnt a bad group for representing the contries interests. Or lets put it another way, they are probably the best hope right now to avoid more death.

I think more bloodshed is sadly inevitable. I really am convinced that we will be stuck with another coup OR the military will back this government's legitimacy 100% and that after Abhisit sets up the referendum on the constitution and sets the stage for a new government that he takes the hit for this and steps down. Next PM sees the budget taken care of and the army reshuffle and then calls elections.

The street protests have to be stopped as an acceptable way to change a government you don't like and the stand must be made now.

I wonder why that stand couldn't be made in 2008. I do agree that street protests are not an acceptable way to force a government change, fair elections are. After yesterday's violence, I sense that such elections are going to be called rather sooner then later.

[Jerrytheyoung]

I do think that Thailand has some leaders in reserve. Same as Anand who has been suddenly introduced on the scene... We have to wait the Highest level is brain storming on this issue.

[way2muchcoffee]

I do think that Thailand has some leaders in reserve. Same as Anand who has been suddenly introduced on the scene... We have to wait the Highest level is brain storming on this issue.

I'm sure there are very heavy discussions going on. This is a very difficult situation. A significant segment of the country is in open revolt. The protesters here represent millions of people throughout Thailand. And there are certainly many other Thais who understand and can sympathize with the feelings of being exploited and abused by the wealthy class.

This was once mostly about Thaksin, but now it is much more complicated. The whole nation needs to come together, throw down their swords, and work this thing out. Despite their rhetoric, I think even the red shirt leaders don't want this to escalate to some kind of civil war. Eventually they will calm down and agree to talks. It is the only way forward.

Edited April 11, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[jdinasia]

Do you know anything about Chevalit? gads ... he sank the Thai economy and triggered the 1997 asian collapse. But hey, he's a friend of Thaksin!

Lets be honest if we want this thing resolved, having a friend of Thaksin in the group isnt a bad idea. The others are Chuan, Banharn and Anand. That isnt a bad group for representing the contries interests. Or lets put it another way, they are probably the best hope right now to avoid more death.

I think more bloodshed is sadly inevitable. I really am convinced that we will be stuck with another coup OR the military will back this government's legitimacy 100% and that after Abhisit sets up the referendum on the constitution and sets the stage for a new government that he takes the hit for this and steps down. Next PM sees the budget taken care of and the army reshuffle and then calls elections.

The street protests have to be stopped as an acceptable way to change a government you don't like and the stand must be made now.

I wonder why that stand couldn't be made in 2008. I do agree that street protests are not an acceptable way to force a government change, fair elections are. After yesterday's violence, I sense that such elections are going to be called rather sooner then later.

No way for "free and fair" elections to be held in all areas at this time.

The PAD did make some very radical choices in 2008 but much of that was to eliminate the efectiveness of the PPP government from changing the charter unilaterally to whitewash Thaksin (over Temasek) and prevent the charter from being changed to prevent TRT execs from being whitewashed after they were dissolved. The decision by the court was pretty clearcut way in advance, they had a PPP exec on video making payoffs. They weren't staging an insurrection or sedition.

I would have objected to the use of any force to remove them from government house (just being honest) as they had an injunction but I wouldn't have had much of a leg to stand on if they had been repelled from Parliament on Oct 7th in a more responsible way! (using old chinese military ordinance laced with RDX was just wrong and doing it when the police had sealed all avenues of retreat was wrong on so many levels!) But hey .... Chavalit (Chevalit) that some people are proposing as an acceptable leader for a unity government was one of the PPP people that fell on his sword and took partial responsibility for how badly that police action went. Probably not an acceptable leader in the eyes of many for that reason (and his connection to the profiteering over the devaluation of the Baht doesn't add any credibility for him either!)

[oddziees]

Thank-you for helping me to understand a little better about what's going on in my beloved Thailand. I don't pretend to know what's happening over there at the minute but I do feel for the people of Thailand no matter what colour shirt they wear. I've only ever visited as a tourist but it really hurts to see such great sorrow on the faces of people I'm used to seeing smile so readily. Call me an old softee but I'm watching every bit of news I can just to keep close to you ALL. Please everyone stay safe, my thoughts and prayers are with you in Thailand tonight.

[chantorn]

Honestly... I've read several editorials and articles pleading for the red-shirts and government to stop fighting because "We are all Thais".

Is that really necessary? Is that the real solution, or merely a cry for help?

The real TEMPORARY solution is for Abhisit to resign. I know it might not help long term, but he is the epicenter of violence now. We need to stop the blood flow now, we need to do something practical.

Asking Thaksin to stop is like asking a wild boar to think..... that route is useless....telling Thais to stop killing each other because "we are all Thais" works as well as a water pistol at the Chicago Fire.

Abhisit, you must resign.

This is not Abhisits' fault so why should he resign? As far as I can see, he is the only one (or at least one of the few people) who is still thinking clearly. No other government in the world would have tolerated protests for such a long period of time. I think he is doing a good job under the circumstances.

Please kindly check your fact.

Samak / Somchai have tolerated protests for HALF A YEAR (contineous) + the seizure of BOTH Bangkok airports, and also the government house. Now, is this a different order of magnitute? Please kindly ask your heart.

ASTV is no better than PTV. Sondhi is no better than Jatupon. Airports is suffering no more than Central World/Gayson Plaza/Siam Paragon/Hyatt/Swisshotel/etc.

Also, Abhisit should NOT resign. Because if he does, Suthep will take over as PM. Who is worst, maybe you should ask your heart this question too.

Edited April 11, 2010 by chantorn

[CLOD]

Didn't see any of the OP logic when the yellows were illegally in government house, and the airport.

Didn't see abisit spouting the same logic either.

2 faced hypocrite, and now a civilian murderer.

[yoshiwara]

Didn't see any of the OP logic when the yellows were illegally in government house, and the airport.

Didn't see abisit spouting the same logic either.

2 faced hypocrite, and now a civilian murderer.

Some people do not see any logic whatsoever.

Its not in the Thaksin script.

The red advance promise of petrol bomb attacks and setting Bangkok ablaze...

....was er issued by fake reds?

Not a 2-faced hypocrite.

Just 1.

[yoshiwara]

Didn't see any of the OP logic when the yellows were illegally in government house, and the airport.

Didn't see abisit spouting the same logic either.

2 faced hypocrite, and now a civilian murderer.

Some people do not see any logic whatsoever.

Its not in the Thaksin script.

The red advance promise of petrol bomb attacks and setting Bangkok ablaze...

....was er issued by fake reds?

Not a 2-faced hypocrite.

Just 1.

And thats the civilian murderer abisits apologist

I suppose it might be possible that someone slinging a petrol bomb or two could be described as a 'civilian'.

Maybe petrol bombs and AK47 rifles are this Spring's must-have accessory.

It could be a fashion trend imported from Montenegro.

You never know.

[yoshiwara]

Some people do not see any logic whatsoever.

Its not in the Thaksin script.

The red advance promise of petrol bomb attacks and setting Bangkok ablaze...

....was er issued by fake reds?

Not a 2-faced hypocrite.

Just 1.

And thats the civilian murderer abisits apologist

I suppose it might be possible that someone slinging a petrol bomb or two could be described as a 'civilian'.

Maybe petrol bombs and AK47 rifles are this Spring's must-have accessory.

It could be a fashion trend imported from Montenegro.

You never know.

Once civilian murderer abisits apologist, always civilian murderer abisits apologist

So is that a yes or a no to seeing the petrol bombs and the red armed AK47s?

Maybe you wear glasses with only rear-view reflection.

Or your fingers are stuck in the keyboard.

[tiuri]

Sir, these repetitions are just plain silly. Are we in kindergarten here?

[anotherpeter]

Do you really think Thaksin will accept a unity government that will delay any elections?

No. Thaksin will keep using the mob until he gets what he wants - the overthrow of an elected government.