The Longer The Red-Shirts Rally, The Higher The Damage

[grandpops]

Chamlongs slipped the leash again. Must be feeling the cold chill of no publicity recently. Threatening outright violence and mayhem on the streets and setting out to break the SOE with the sole intention of confrontation.

At least the Redshirts have an adjenda. What have PAD got, The usual reference to "saving the monarchy" and that's your lot folks.

What he forgets is that during the PAD seige, the Police gassed and ran them out of the area by themselves and would have routed them for sure if the Army hadn't come to their aid. Something the combined army and police couldn't do the other saturday. Given that the Police will firmly stand against the PAD again, he must be hoping to draw in the Army.

Is this the voice of reason the country is waiting for? He can only be hoping that so many of his PAD flock are slaughtered that the Army have to step in..... or arrest him and his lackey Thaugsabum.

Surely, these are the two most disruptive and divisive characters at the moment. Shouldn't they be obeying their own rules? Probably not, as the rules they set are only for stupid people, which they aren't

[OzMick]

I'm sure Kerry Packer wouldn't take offense, especially as he's dead. After he had a heart attack, he personally paid for every ambulance in NSW (possibly Australia???) to be fitted with a defibrillator. A real oppressor of the masses. His son appear to be as brain dead as Murdochs sprout.

[LevelHead]

Propaganda backlash alert.

Damage to Thailand image might be more soon.

Abhisit and Suthep going into panic mode ?

Being reported now that forensic reports say the Japanese camera man shot dead WAS SHOT BY THE MILITARY SIDE.

Panic for Mark ahead - spin coming ?

[bangkoklight]

Your maths disgust me (amongst other things).

Your example is a thai on $200/m buying a house worth $16,000 or a little more.

How is that different from an Oz worker on $2,000/m buying a $160,000 house - about the going rate for both when I left 10 years ago. Should the workers rise up and slaughter the Packers and Murdochs?

When you earn little money, the amount you can save decreases exponentially - or becomes non-existent. It's not a case of "I earn 2000 UNITS/month, so I can save 200 UNITS/month" or "I earn 200 UNITS/month so I can save 20 UNITS/month". If you’re earning 2,000 UNITS/month, you’re more likely to save more than 200 UNITS/month. If you’re earning 200 UNITS/month, you’re more likely to save less than 20 UNITS/month – regardless of where you live and regardless of the relative cost of living. Why? - Because 180 UNITS is not enough to live on but 1800 UNITS is. Basically, it’s a poverty cycle which stops these folk from rising in society and keeps them in their place. And the system allows this cycle to continue.

[bkkjames]

Propaganda backlash alert.

Damage to Thailand image might be more soon.

Abhisit and Suthep going into panic mode ?

Being reported now that forensic reports say the Japanese camera man shot dead WAS SHOT BY THE MILITARY SIDE.

Panic for Mark ahead - spin coming ?

I don't see any panic except on the soundbites from Jatuporn and crew saying if your mobile phone goes off or a helicopter flies by run for cover.

[grandpops]

Propaganda backlash alert.

Damage to Thailand image might be more soon.

Abhisit and Suthep going into panic mode ?

Being reported now that forensic reports say the Japanese camera man shot dead WAS SHOT BY THE MILITARY SIDE.

Panic for Mark ahead - spin coming ?

You spin me right round baby right round.... Where was the report. Better see it quick before its banned.

On a related issue the good Dr Khunying on the CRES should be a good thing. She does have the confidence of most and if they involve her, I think most will accept what she says.

Edited April 21, 2010 by grandpops

[animatic]

... Every large scale political organization has its fringe elements. I seriously doubt that the reds have significant numbers of followers who agree with arisaman on that point and intend to follow it.

Yes, but most ALL of these large scale organizations don't let their 'fringe elements'

take to the main stages and call for "Burn Bangkok the The Ground".

[OzMick]

Chamlongs slipped the leash again. Must be feeling the cold chill of no publicity recently. Threatening outright violence and mayhem on the streets and setting out to break the SOE with the sole intention of confrontation.

At least the Redshirts have an adjenda. What have PAD got, The usual reference to "saving the monarchy" and that's your lot folks.

What he forgets is that during the PAD seige, the Police gassed and ran them out of the area by themselves and would have routed them for sure if the Army hadn't come to their aid. Something the combined army and police couldn't do the other saturday. Given that the Police will firmly stand against the PAD again, he must be hoping to draw in the Army.

Is this the voice of reason the country is waiting for? He can only be hoping that so many of his PAD flock are slaughtered that the Army have to step in..... or arrest him and his lackey Thaugsabum.

Surely, these are the two most disruptive and divisive characters at the moment. Shouldn't they be obeying their own rules? Probably not, as the rules they set are only for stupid people, which they aren't

The yellow AGENDA is simple - "Let us get on with our life."

You continually make idiotic statements - the highlighted one is a gem.

[danc]

I'm sure Kerry Packer wouldn't take offense, especially as he's dead. After he had a heart attack, he personally paid for every ambulance in NSW (possibly Australia???) to be fitted with a defibrillator. A real oppressor of the masses. His son appear to be as brain dead as Murdochs sprout.

Yes, death tends to have an effect, whereby those it afflicts don't take themselves too seriously!

[LevelHead]

Propaganda backlash alert.

Damage to Thailand image might be more soon.

Abhisit and Suthep going into panic mode ?

Being reported now that forensic reports say the Japanese camera man shot dead WAS SHOT BY THE MILITARY SIDE.

Panic for Mark ahead - spin coming ?

You spin me right round baby right round.... Where was the report. Better see it quick before its banned.

In Khao Sod (Thai paper), now on Breaking News of the other English language news paper of Bangkok (that cannot be mentioned on here).

Marky mark, spin it baby.........

[Chaimai]

Being reported now that forensic reports say the Japanese camera man shot dead WAS SHOT BY THE MILITARY SIDE.

Ah levelhead, care to share the full autopsy report with us ?

[grandpops]

Chamlongs slipped the leash again. Must be feeling the cold chill of no publicity recently. Threatening outright violence and mayhem on the streets and setting out to break the SOE with the sole intention of confrontation.

At least the Redshirts have an adjenda. What have PAD got, The usual reference to "saving the monarchy" and that's your lot folks.

What he forgets is that during the PAD seige, the Police gassed and ran them out of the area by themselves and would have routed them for sure if the Army hadn't come to their aid. Something the combined army and police couldn't do the other saturday. Given that the Police will firmly stand against the PAD again, he must be hoping to draw in the Army.

Is this the voice of reason the country is waiting for? He can only be hoping that so many of his PAD flock are slaughtered that the Army have to step in..... or arrest him and his lackey Thaugsabum.

Surely, these are the two most disruptive and divisive characters at the moment. Shouldn't they be obeying their own rules? Probably not, as the rules they set are only for stupid people, which they aren't

The yellow AGENDA is simple - "Let us get on with our life."

You continually make idiotic statements - the highlighted one is a gem.

Your knee jerk trumped it. Let us get on with our lifes so long as we are never able to be voted out. Is getting on with their lifes involves organising a legal mob, thats up to them, but don't expect the media or intelligent commentators to miss that.

What I do MATE, is continually get your collective goats by pointing out many simple things that you and other PAD followers on here have never read up on, imagined or tried to understand. The more you post, the less we know that you understand.

Why not try a considered post instead of regurgitating your masters voice.

Military shot the Japanese as well. Why not get some background on it.

Very interesting reading on a website that is probably monopolising news gathering in Bangkok at this time. An army train also appears to have been held up as well.

Edited April 21, 2010 by grandpops

[bkkjames]

Being reported now that forensic reports say the Japanese camera man shot dead WAS SHOT BY THE MILITARY SIDE.

Ah levelhead, care to share the full autopsy report with us ?

Yea alot of quotes from quotes from who, the Bangkok Police? Unnamed source. Spin it round round like a broken record baby.

Next.

[TheOldWolf]

"He also denied press reports that the Japanese cameraman was killed by a bullet from soldiers, saying the investigation has yet finished and no conclusion has yet come out from the Scientific Crime Detection Division.

It is not true that bullets coming from the front of the protesters were fired by soldiers. Terrorists can fire from any direction to hurt innocent people and create misunderstanding. Video clips revealed earlier can prove that, Col Sansern said."

Nation

[OzMick]

Your maths disgust me (amongst other things).

Your example is a thai on $200/m buying a house worth $16,000 or a little more.

How is that different from an Oz worker on $2,000/m buying a $160,000 house - about the going rate for both when I left 10 years ago. Should the workers rise up and slaughter the Packers and Murdochs?

When you earn little money, the amount you can save decreases exponentially - or becomes non-existent. It's not a case of "I earn 2000 UNITS/month, so I can save 200 UNITS/month" or "I earn 200 UNITS/month so I can save 20 UNITS/month". If you're earning 2,000 UNITS/month, you're more likely to save more than 200 UNITS/month. If you're earning 200 UNITS/month, you're more likely to save less than 20 UNITS/month – regardless of where you live and regardless of the relative cost of living. Why? - Because 180 UNITS is not enough to live on but 1800 UNITS is. Basically, it's a poverty cycle which stops these folk from rising in society and keeps them in their place. And the system allows this cycle to continue.

And the cost of living is markedly cheaper here. Remember, "these people can live on a cup of rice a day" BS sprouted earlier. When I bought my first house it was a struggle, as it is for most working class people. So you start with something cheap and work your way up.

My wife worked initially to get us started, where is your example thais wife?

You are only disgusted because you feel you should be.

[davethesailor]

Your maths disgust me (amongst other things).

Your example is a thai on $200/m buying a house worth $16,000 or a little more.

How is that different from an Oz worker on $2,000/m buying a $160,000 house - about the going rate for both when I left 10 years ago. Should the workers rise up and slaughter the Packers and Murdochs?

When you earn little money, the amount you can save decreases exponentially - or becomes non-existent. It's not a case of "I earn 2000 UNITS/month, so I can save 200 UNITS/month" or "I earn 200 UNITS/month so I can save 20 UNITS/month". If you’re earning 2,000 UNITS/month, you’re more likely to save more than 200 UNITS/month. If you’re earning 200 UNITS/month, you’re more likely to save less than 20 UNITS/month – regardless of where you live and regardless of the relative cost of living. Why? - Because 180 UNITS is not enough to live on but 1800 UNITS is. Basically, it’s a poverty cycle which stops these folk from rising in society and keeps them in their place. And the system allows this cycle to continue.

What nonsense.

If the cost of living is low, a low salary will suffice. If the cost is high, a higher salary is needed.

My wife earned less than $200 selling bits n bobs, (admittedly a while back) she saved enough to buy a brand new pickup and progressed from there to owning a restaurant from savings she squirreled away.

Is your high horse in Orbit or just a few hands bigger than the average?

Edited April 21, 2010 by davethesailor

[Neurath]

Propaganda backlash alert.

Damage to Thailand image might be more soon.

Abhisit and Suthep going into panic mode ?

Being reported now that forensic reports say the Japanese camera man shot dead WAS SHOT BY THE MILITARY SIDE.

Panic for Mark ahead - spin coming ?

You spin me right round baby right round.... Where was the report. Better see it quick before its banned.

On a related issue the good Dr Khunying on the CRES should be a good thing. She does have the confidence of most and if they involve her, I think most will accept what she says.

I won't. Not after her comments on the bomb detectors (yeah, I know that's not 'most' but it should be.)

[pontius]

Is grandpops a troll? I can't believe the guy's for real.

As for "the higher the damage..." - all Thais I know (except for the 2-3 redshirt motorcy-drivers in front of my entrance) are seriously pissed off and want a massive and rapid kick-in-the-ass solution.

[Neurath]

Is grandpops a troll? I can't believe the guy's for real.

As for "the higher the damage..." - all Thais I know (except for the 2-3 redshirt motorcy-drivers in front of my entrance) are seriously pissed off and want a massive and rapid kick-in-the-ass solution.

Grandpops is just a very sloppy thinker with an opinion - well, lots of them it seems. For example he says above:

"Your knee jerk trumped it. Let us get on with our lifes so long as we are never able to be voted out."

I assume he's talking about the Democrat led coalition and I suppose he knows how many times Democrat led coalitions HAVE been voted out, so where he gets the "never able to be voted out" is presumably the same place he gets his hemroids.

[britmaveric]

As far as the Jap lad goes - let's face it when you put yourself in the middle of the sh*ite as media - there is a chance you might end up losing your life. I don't think his death makes little difference one way or another unless he was knowingly targeted.

[bangkoklight]

Again bangkoklight I agree with your statement about the thugs repressing the poor people of this country. But this is not what the red rally is about. Surely you can see this right?

When you say that this rally is not about the oppressed rising against the oppressors, you must mean that it’s about Mr. T wanting to reclaim his wealth, and that he’s paying these folk to be there on the streets in their thousands. I can accept this, but read on...

To these folk, Mr. T is the only person who has given them any hope. The system, the current system, fails them, miserably. The government fails them. I’m not even going to say whether I like Mr. T or not because the issue (to me and to them) is oppressed vs. oppressors and opportunity. Mr. T is the distraction that all pro Government supporters love to hate or hate to love.

If you are saying that this rally is only about these people receiving 500-1,000 baht/day to be there, then you are saying that they don’t have minds of their own, which is wrong. If an oppressive system brings about a situation whereby a wealthy man (whose money is frozen by the way) or a group of wealthy men are willing to pay people in their thousands to protest, wouldn't you say that the system is at fault? Shouldn’t the system have stopped this from happening in the first place? Of course, but past governments haven't cared. They've been getting on with making money and living the highlife.

These people have, for the first time, been given the opportunity to stand up for themselves and fight against this failing system. If Mr. T wants to finance this, let him. Let these people take the opportunity. They’ve had no opportunity to fight before. The oppressors have never given or done anything to help these people - only token gestures to appease them in order to allow the system to continue and benefit the few.

So, who's ultimately to blame? The farmer who can't make a living or the government and elite oppressing him? Think of the whole and what’s happened in the past decades, not just four or five years back. Think holistically. You can only blame the system, the government, and the ones pulling the strings.

Oppress the weak and one day, they will fight back no matter what/who the catalyst is.

[anotherpeter]

Again bangkoklight I agree with your statement about the thugs repressing the poor people of this country. But this is not what the red rally is about. Surely you can see this right?

When you say that this rally is not about the oppressed rising against the oppressors, you must mean that it's about Mr. T wanting to reclaim his wealth, and that he's paying these folk to be there on the streets in their thousands. I can accept this, but read on...

To these folk, Mr. T is the only person who has given them any hope. The system, the current system, fails them, miserably. The government fails them. I'm not even going to say whether I like Mr. T or not because the issue (to me and to them) is oppressed vs. oppressors and opportunity. Mr. T is the distraction that all pro Government supporters love to hate or hate to love.

If you are saying that this rally is only about these people receiving 500-1,000 baht/day to be there, then you are saying that they don't have minds of their own, which is wrong. If an oppressive system brings about a situation whereby a wealthy man (whose money is frozen by the way) or a group of wealthy men are willing to pay people in their thousands to protest, wouldn't you say that the system is at fault? Shouldn't the system have stopped this from happening in the first place? Of course, but past governments haven't cared. They've been getting on with making money and living the highlife.

These people have, for the first time, been given the opportunity to stand up for themselves and fight against this failing system. If Mr. T wants to finance this, let him. Let these people take the opportunity. They've had no opportunity to fight before. The oppressors have never given or done anything to help these people - only token gestures to appease them in order to allow the system to continue and benefit the few.

So, who's ultimately to blame? The farmer who can't make a living or the government and elite oppressing him? Think of the whole and what's happened in the past decades, not just four or five years back. Think holistically. You can only blame the system, the government, and the ones pulling the strings.

Oppress the weak and one day, they will fight back no matter what/who the catalyst is.

The problem is that most red supporters *think* Thaksin was good for them.

Edited April 21, 2010 by anotherpeter

[Neurath]

Again bangkoklight I agree with your statement about the thugs repressing the poor people of this country. But this is not what the red rally is about. Surely you can see this right?

When you say that this rally is not about the oppressed rising against the oppressors, you must mean that it's about Mr. T wanting to reclaim his wealth, and that he's paying these folk to be there on the streets in their thousands. I can accept this, but read on...

To these folk, Mr. T is the only person who has given them any hope. The system, the current system, fails them, miserably. The government fails them. I'm not even going to say whether I like Mr. T or not because the issue (to me and to them) is oppressed vs. oppressors and opportunity. Mr. T is the distraction that all pro Government supporters love to hate or hate to love.

If you are saying that this rally is only about these people receiving 500-1,000 baht/day to be there, then you are saying that they don't have minds of their own, which is wrong. If an oppressive system brings about a situation whereby a wealthy man (whose money is frozen by the way) or a group of wealthy men are willing to pay people in their thousands to protest, wouldn't you say that the system is at fault? Shouldn't the system have stopped this from happening in the first place? Of course, but past governments haven't cared. They've been getting on with making money and living the highlife.

These people have, for the first time, been given the opportunity to stand up for themselves and fight against this failing system. If Mr. T wants to finance this, let him. Let these people take the opportunity. They've had no opportunity to fight before. The oppressors have never given or done anything to help these people - only token gestures to appease them in order to allow the system to continue and benefit the few.

So, who's ultimately to blame? The farmer who can't make a living or the government and elite oppressing him? Think of the whole and what's happened in the past decades, not just four or five years back. Think holistically. You can only blame the system, the government, and the ones pulling the strings.

Oppress the weak and one day, they will fight back no matter what/who the catalyst is.

This particular government is no more and no less the "system" than was the TRT government.

Edited April 21, 2010 by Neurath

[OzMick]

Pontius, please read grandpops post on another thread.

"Sure is.

If the elite (you must be elite to own Bank, shopping center or hotel in That area, can just lay off workers on the spot, it show something terribly disturbing about how they regard their staff.

They can just stop paying them? Can I just stop paying my staff? Course I can't, they would take me to the cleaners... and rightly so.

So, they are either untouchable when it comes to poor treatment of staff, or they are trying to promote unrest and trying to set their staff against the redshirts.

Not only is reading fundamental, digesting and thinking is also.... but nice try. Why not try a couple of lines of smart alecism next time?"

The initial article contained this line

the labour ministry ordered employers to keep paying wages to workers or encourage them to take annual vacation or other leave.

[anotherpeter]

Now that the reds finally shup up, the yellows come to stir the s**t.

The government has no choice but to rein in the red shirts in a speedy and effective manner via law enforcement, otherwise the situation will degenerate into a civil war, People's Alliance for Democracy leader Chamlong Srimuang said on Wednesday.

"I have to reprimand the government for failing to act in a decisive manner as if it is waiting for civil war to erupt," he said.

The PAD should get back in it's box. There is enough trouble out there without them stirring more up.

[anotherpeter]

Now that the reds finally shup up, the yellows come to stir the s**t.

The government has no choice but to rein in the red shirts in a speedy and effective manner via law enforcement, otherwise the situation will degenerate into a civil war, People's Alliance for Democracy leader Chamlong Srimuang said on Wednesday.

"I have to reprimand the government for failing to act in a decisive manner as if it is waiting for civil war to erupt," he said.

The PAD should get back in it's box. There is enough trouble out there without them stirring more up.

As if crap from UDD isn't enough, PAD does this:

THE NATION: The Friday anti-red rally is called not at Silom but Amporn Garden near the Royal Plaza. They aim to mobilized 100,000.

All this does is allow the reds to some more "But the yellows ..."

[Pakboong]

When you earn little money, the amount you can save decreases exponentially - or becomes non-existent. It's not a case of "I earn 2000 UNITS/month, so I can save 200 UNITS/month" or "I earn 200 UNITS/month so I can save 20 UNITS/month". If you’re earning 2,000 UNITS/month, you’re more likely to save more than 200 UNITS/month. If you’re earning 200 UNITS/month, you’re more likely to save less than 20 UNITS/month – regardless of where you live and regardless of the relative cost of living. Why? - Because 180 UNITS is not enough to live on but 1800 UNITS is. Basically, it’s a poverty cycle which stops these folk from rising in society and keeps them in their place. And the system allows this cycle to continue.

[/quo

After a 37 year history with this country and these people, I have a hard time getting past the often told story of the Thai and the Chinaman who were each given 100 baht at the beginning of the day. At the end of the day, the Chinaman returned with 110 baht and the Thai returned broke and owing another Chinaman 10 baht. This has been repeated a billion or so times and will continue to be repeated. This problem did not start last week, and it will not end next week.

[Neurath]

Now that the reds finally shup up, the yellows come to stir the s**t.

The government has no choice but to rein in the red shirts in a speedy and effective manner via law enforcement, otherwise the situation will degenerate into a civil war, People's Alliance for Democracy leader Chamlong Srimuang said on Wednesday.

"I have to reprimand the government for failing to act in a decisive manner as if it is waiting for civil war to erupt," he said.

The PAD should get back in it's box. There is enough trouble out there without them stirring more up.

Absolutely. Back in the box and get someone to lock it.

Hard to believe that Chamlong and Thaksin used to each from the same rice bowl.

[Redsunset]

Chamlongs slipped the leash again. Must be feeling the cold chill of no publicity recently. Threatening outright violence and mayhem on the streets and setting out to break the SOE with the sole intention of confrontation.

At least the Redshirts have an adjenda. What have PAD got, The usual reference to "saving the monarchy" and that's your lot folks.

What he forgets is that during the PAD seige, the Police gassed and ran them out of the area by themselves and would have routed them for sure if the Army hadn't come to their aid. Something the combined army and police couldn't do the other saturday. Given that the Police will firmly stand against the PAD again, he must be hoping to draw in the Army.

Is this the voice of reason the country is waiting for? He can only be hoping that so many of his PAD flock are slaughtered that the Army have to step in..... or arrest him and his lackey Thaugsabum.

Surely, these are the two most disruptive and divisive characters at the moment. Shouldn't they be obeying their own rules? Probably not, as the rules they set are only for stupid people, which they aren't

The yellow AGENDA is simple - "Let us get on with our life."

You continually make idiotic statements - the highlighted one is a gem.

Chamlong is a trouble maker whose time has passed... everytime there is a controversy, he get involved and tries to stir up trouble. He never bridges; he threatens. His need for attention is somewhat pathetic. He is so 1970s. He probably does not even know what a laptop computer is. Now I see he is getting involved again. This time he is threatening to launch a counter attack and do something about the red shirts in 7 days. I'm getting sick of his act. He needs to go to the beach, soak up some sun and let the younger politicians play.

[britmaveric]

Pitch street battle between Reds/Yellows - oh that will be nice. (so I guess there will be quite a few yellows arrested too since no more than 5 people can congregate in one area at once)

Edited April 21, 2010 by britmaveric