Bangkok: Assailants Fired M-79 Grenades At Sala Daeng Skytrain Station

[lannarebirth]

MCOT: Red Shirt is ready to hold new round of talks if government agrees to dissolve parliament in 30 days: Veera

LMAO .. we'll talk if you meet are demands before hand.

Send in the tanks.

I think Veera wants to negotiate the terms of his future freedom.

Well, it's a 100% improvement on the original demand for dissolution in 15 days and a 3,000% improvement on their later demand for immediate dissolution.

At least it's some movement and perhaps shows that Red Shirt solidarity on infinite intransigence is breaking down.

Also indicates that Veera has moved away from the demand for Abhisit to leave the country.

A tiny little, infinitely tiny, ray of sunshine?

I agree. Abhisit should reduce his offer on dissolution to 8 1/2 months, reducing the previous offer by 15 days just as the Reds have raised there's by 15 days.

[Neurath]

MCOT: Red Shirt is ready to hold new round of talks if government agrees to dissolve parliament in 30 days: Veera

LMAO .. we'll talk if you meet are demands before hand.

Send in the tanks.

I think Veera wants to negotiate the terms of his future freedom.

Well, it's a 100% improvement on the original demand for dissolution in 15 days and a 3,000% improvement on their later demand for immediate dissolution.

At least it's some movement and perhaps shows that Red Shirt solidarity on infinite intransigence is breaking down.

Also indicates that Veera has moved away from the demand for Abhisit to leave the country.

A tiny little, infinitely tiny, ray of sunshine?

I agree. Abhisit should reduce his offer on dissolution to 8 1/2 months, reducing the previous offer by 15 days just as the Reds have raised there's by 15 days.

I'll raise you 6 on that.

[whiterussian]

tulsathit News&gossips ab red leaders. News: They r apparently ready to negotiate again and accept probably an election timeframe of 60 days from now.

--------------

Question is....

will 'The Nation' go into PR overdrive for 2 months! How will they fill the 'news clippings section'

will the streets be once again filled with pickup trucks blaring country musack with great big posters!!

will they work out which parties are allowed to stand before election day!

will the army promise not to take sides unless directly theatened with obsolescence?

will the judges judge?

will the cops get pay rises so they dont have to fleece everyone!?

Edited April 23, 2010 by whiterussian

[coalminer]

'FULL SCALE WAR'

The violence and deepening political divide has spurred talk of civil war in Southeast Asia's second-biggest economy.

"The government is far from controlling the situation," Thailand's largest broker, Kim Eng Securities, said in a note to clients. "Reds have denied their involvement. But if they are indeed behind the (grenade) attacks, these powerful explosions right in the army-barricaded area demonstrate they are well-prepared to wage a full-scale war."

The central bank said on Wednesday the crisis was hitting confidence, tourism, private consumption and investment, although exports, which are crucial to economic growth, have not been affected so far by the unrest.

Britain, Australia and the United States have warned their citizens to reconsider travel plans to Thailand, where tourism accounts for 6 percent of the economy.

Indonesian Foreign Minister Marty Natalegawa said on Friday he had called his Thai counterpart, Kasit Piromya, to offer "any assistance" for a dialogue between the conflicting parties.

He said Indonesia was alert to the possibility that the Thai troubles could have a contagious impact in the region.

The 1997 Asian financial crisis began in Thailand with a run on the local baht currency and spread to the Philippines, Malaysia, Indonesia and South Korea.

U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon appealed to both protesters and the Thai authorities to avoid further violence. U.S. State Department spokesman Philip Crowley also urged both sides to show restraint.

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/SGE63M00N.htm

[hammered]

Jatuporn has said something about the reds will retreat

[Deeral]

""It is a good thing you weren't there are you might do something - throw something - at a Red Shirt and get deported. Luckily I am here in Phuket because I am so sick of seeing those neanderthals that I could spit. "

this appalling piece of bigotry is so symptomatic of many of the posts here - remember like it or not those grouped around the

Redshirt coalition will almost certainly win any straight election - so it might be an idea to make your peace......or at least get up to speed on the situation.

[coalminer]

The yellows trying to spell "uneducate people".

Can a red shirt help these yellows with their English grammar?

[LevelHead]

""It is a good thing you weren't there are you might do something - throw something - at a Red Shirt and get deported. Luckily I am here in Phuket because I am so sick of seeing those neanderthals that I could spit. "

this appalling piece of bigotry is so symptomatic of many of the posts here - remember like it or not those grouped around the

Redshirt coalition will almost certainly win any straight election - so it might be an idea to make your peace......or at least get up to speed on the situation.

You have to remember many posters on here are likely in Phuket, Pattaya, Samui and other places that need tourism for income and also cheap prostitutes for their bars.

The status quo was excellent for them, cheap labour, cheap prostitutes and lots of tourists.

The Reds have created problems with tourism and might also effect future generations of cheap prostitutes if life improves for the poor.

Therefore you can expect many to be "pro Yellow" and "anti-red" as it effects their cash flow. And they do not generally care about Thailand, all they care about is money. They want everything the same as they are happy with the system.

Its like the middle class in Bangkok, they do not want change as they are ok with the way things are, they get cheap cleaners, cheap nannies, cheap employees, cheap girls in the massage parlors and life is good, so the last thing they want is an upset to their way of life, I mean, how does a vibrant Isaan region with lots of factories and jobs and new hotels and roads and schools help Bangkok people ?

[LevelHead]

http://www.facebook.com/notes/prachatai/fo...ia/385692413892

Former Thai senators call on government to stop blocking and manipulating media

Statement from Former Thai Senators (2000-2006)*, “Demanding the government to stop blocking media channels and using the state-run media to present one-sided information on the crackdown of the demonstration on April 10, 2010”

The crackdown of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) demonstration by the government security forces under the Emergency Decree on April 10, 2010 has resulted in 24 deaths of demonstrators and soldiers, more than 800 injured and many went missing. Not only have we yet to hear a straightforward and credible explanation of this tragic event from the Government, we have also seen unreasonable blockade of voices from the UDD side. Hundreds of community radios, TV stations, websites and SMS, which the government branded as “Red-shirted media” including the satellite-based People Channel television station (PTV) and Thairednews have been shut down by the Government.

Worse, the Government has used state-owned televisions as well as private channels (such as TNN) to provide one-sided information to deny its responsibility for the tragic violence and pass the blame onto the demonstrators who simply exercise their constitutional rights to demand a fresh election by Parliament dissolution.

Such media control by the Government and concerned agencies (especially the Centre for the Resolution of Emergency Situations (CRES), the Royal Thai Army, the Public Relations Department, TV channel 11 (NBT), TV channel 3, 5, 7, 9 and Thai PBS), is a serious violation of people’s basic rights under the Constitution, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and the International Covenant of Civil and Political Rights.

In the name of members of the Senate 2000-2006 undersigned, we urge Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva, the Democrat Party, the rest coalition parties as well as media professionals who appeared to have acceded and cooperated with the Government in providing biased information about the April 10, 2010 crackdown, to show responsibilities for the acts that led to the great loss of Thai people as follows;

1. To immediately cancel the State of Emergency and related legal instruments in the name of national security as the said declaration and the enforcement is an unlawful act under the Constitution and laws.

2. Stop all the obstruction of public information flows and news reports presented in print media, radio and TV stations, telecommunications, the Internet and all other kind of media, in order to return the constitutional rights to information and expression to the people.

3. We urge media institutions and media professionals to uphold highest professional ethics by providing fact and giving equal opportunities for all concerned parties to present their information and evidence. It should stop allowing one-sided information and evidence from the government.

Last but not least we, members of the Senate 2000-2006, express our political stance here that we consider the demonstrators demanding for the House Dissolution as an exercise of rights to demonstration in order to express their political views according to laws and democratic system under the constitutional monarchy as guaranteed in sections 3, 7, 26, 28-30,37, 39-41, 44 and 65 of the 1997 Constitution of the Kingdom of Thailand (Please note here that we do not recognize the present Constitution (2007) which is the legacy of coup d’etat). A deprivation and violation of these rights to freedom by unlawfully using the State of Emergency Decree, therefore, is a humiliation of human dignity. This violation against people’s rights to freedom is an abuse of the state power and hence justifies the people’s invocation of natural rights to uprise against the rulers who use injustice power to govern the country as President Abraham Lincoln states:

"Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up, and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable - a most sacred right - a right, which we hope and believe, is to liberate the world.” By Abraham Lincoln

* Former Senators 2000-2006

Panat Tasneeyanond (Tak)

Napinthon Srisanpang (Ratchaburi)

Wiboon Shamsheun (Kalasin)

Montri Sinthawichai (Samut-songkram)

Sawai Phramanee (Nakhon Ratchasima)

Boontan Dokthaisong (NakhonRatchasima)

Prakiat Nasimma (Roi Et)

Surachai Danaitangtrakul (Roi Et)

Boonya Leelead (Songkhla)

Sompong Sakawee (Songkhla)

Khampan Pongpan (Udon Thani)

Somkiat Soralam (Nakhon Sawan)

Gen. Manas Aramsri (Suphanburi)

Prateep Ungsongtham Hata (Bangkok)

Sb-Lt. Amnuay Thaiyanont (Prachuapkhirikhan)

Porn Penpas (Buriram)

Pol.Gen. Wirun Fuensaeng. (Chiang Rai)

Adul Wanchaitanawong (Mae Hong Son)

Thaworn Kiatchaiyakorn (Chiang Mai)

Kamnuan Chalopathump (Sing Buri)

Pha Aksornsua (Khon Kaen)

Amorn Nilprem (Ubon Ratchathani)

Manu Vanitchanont (Surat Thani)

Nanthana Songpracha (Chainat)

Anuchart Banchongsupamitr (Uttaradit)

Paiboon Upatising (Phuket)

Sutat Chansaengsri (Petchabun)

Niwet Pancharoenvorakul (Ayutthaya)

Srimuang Charoensiri (Mahasarakham)

Given the above and the pressure of keeping up the PR against the reds I am shocked that the alleged "BTS video camera's" footage is not all over the news and the internet if it really shows anything that can be linked to Reds.

Any delays, like now, in releasing it will have a very detrimental effect on whether to believe its not doctored when it comes out.

It should have been released direct into the public domain, not be talked about in the media but "no signs" of it. Delays mean generally it either shows nothing, or it shows something they do not want which needs deleting, or it needs doctoring to make it show what they want it to show.

[jdinasia]

MCOT: Red Shirt is ready to hold new round of talks if government agrees to dissolve parliament in 30 days: Veera

LMAO .. we'll talk if you meet are demands before hand.

Send in the tanks.

I think Veera wants to negotiate the terms of his future freedom.

Veera's not afraid of jail (unlike his fearless leader Thaksin) -- Veera spent time in jail for supporting a failed coup in the past.

[hammered]

Something is happening down the red stage. They are talking like it is over. Maybe some splits in the reds between stopping and going on. Confusing now Guess we will find out soon

Sounds like reds are asking government for talks

Edited April 23, 2010 by hammered

[Neurath]

""It is a good thing you weren't there are you might do something - throw something - at a Red Shirt and get deported. Luckily I am here in Phuket because I am so sick of seeing those neanderthals that I could spit. "

this appalling piece of bigotry is so symptomatic of many of the posts here - remember like it or not those grouped around the

Redshirt coalition will almost certainly win any straight election - so it might be an idea to make your peace......or at least get up to speed on the situation.

You have to remember many posters on here are likely in Phuket, Pattaya, Samui and other places that need tourism for income and also cheap prostitutes for their bars.

The status quo was excellent for them, cheap labour, cheap prostitutes and lots of tourists.

The Reds have created problems with tourism and might also effect future generations of cheap prostitutes if life improves for the poor.

Therefore you can expect many to be "pro Yellow" and "anti-red" as it effects their cash flow. And they do not generally care about Thailand, all they care about is money. They want everything the same as they are happy with the system.

Its like the middle class in Bangkok, they do not want change as they are ok with the way things are, they get cheap cleaners, cheap nannies, cheap employees, cheap girls in the massage parlors and life is good, so the last thing they want is an upset to their way of life, I mean, how does a vibrant Isaan region with lots of factories and jobs and new hotels and roads and schools help Bangkok people ?

That's just silly LevelHead. Why would anyone need cheap prostitutes when they can simply read what you write?

[way2muchcoffee]

Something is happening down the red stage. They are talking like it is over. Maybe some splits in the reds between stopping and going on. Confusing now Guess we will find out soon

Sounds like reds are asking government for talks

Yes. Following the tweets on The Nation. One can only hope that this thing will end peacefully after all.

[LevelHead]

Something is happening down the red stage. They are talking like it is over. Maybe some splits in the reds between stopping and going on. Confusing now Guess we will find out soon

Sounds like reds are asking government for talks

They have made an offer after foreign Diplomats visited the Reds rally site.

The offer is Dissolve the House in 30 days.

60 days of election campaign.

Then elections.

So 90 days from now elections.

Great offer, lets hope Abhisit and his ilk will see sense and stop their war against these people.

Accept it Abhisit, lets return Thailand to normal and lets have an election !!

[TheOldWolf]

Something is happening down the red stage. They are talking like it is over. Maybe some splits in the reds between stopping and going on. Confusing now Guess we will find out soon

Sounds like reds are asking government for talks

They have made an offer after foreign Diplomats visited the Reds rally site.

The offer is Dissolve the House in 30 days.

60 days of election campaign.

Then elections.

So 90 days from now elections.

Great offer, lets hope Abhisit and his ilk will see sense and stop their war against these people.

Accept it Abhisit, lets return Thailand to normal and lets have an election !!

It was not an offer, it was a new demand

[Neurath]

Something is happening down the red stage. They are talking like it is over. Maybe some splits in the reds between stopping and going on. Confusing now Guess we will find out soon

That's the way I'm reading it.

Number of things:

Veera has gone feral and decided, against the sage advice of Jatuporn, Nattawut et.al., that it's necessary to negotiate.

The wonderful and sublime actor seems to have been caught with illicit weaponry and far, far too much information on the constitution, activities and connections of certain black robed freedom fighters.

The 'calling in' for questioning of a multitude of Red Shirt fund raisers is cutting off significant mullah.

The bad press from the explosions on Silom are depressing and deflating otherwise moderate support.

Overall, looks like negotiate now or find that the position from which negotiation can be had will have deteriorated further.

The real difference between negotiating now and having negotiated a few weeks ago? 25-30 dead people and many more maimed and traumatized.

Intransigent rhetoric is needed to fire the mob, talk of political negotiation and compromise will bore them. Bad luck for Jatuporn but even worse luck for the other 27 who don't have immunity.

[jcbangkok]

deleted

Edited April 23, 2010 by jcbangkok

[Chaimai]

""It is a good thing you weren't there are you might do something - throw something - at a Red Shirt and get deported. Luckily I am here in Phuket because I am so sick of seeing those neanderthals that I could spit. "

this appalling piece of bigotry is so symptomatic of many of the posts here - remember like it or not those grouped around the

Redshirt coalition will almost certainly win any straight election - so it might be an idea to make your peace......or at least get up to speed on the situation.

You have to remember many posters on here are likely in Phuket, Pattaya, Samui and other places that need tourism for income and also cheap prostitutes for their bars.

The status quo was excellent for them, cheap labour, cheap prostitutes and lots of tourists.

The Reds have created problems with tourism and might also effect future generations of cheap prostitutes if life improves for the poor.

Therefore you can expect many to be "pro Yellow" and "anti-red" as it effects their cash flow. And they do not generally care about Thailand, all they care about is money. They want everything the same as they are happy with the system.

Its like the middle class in Bangkok, they do not want change as they are ok with the way things are, they get cheap cleaners, cheap nannies, cheap employees, cheap girls in the massage parlors and life is good, so the last thing they want is an upset to their way of life, I mean, how does a vibrant Isaan region with lots of factories and jobs and new hotels and roads and schools help Bangkok people ?

That's just silly LevelHead. Why would anyone need cheap prostitutes when they can simply read what you write?

I just want to be clear; are we saying that I will soon no longer be able to avail mayself of cheap prostitutes in Thailand ?

(not that there are any because prostitution is not legal).

[Neurath]

Something is happening down the red stage. They are talking like it is over. Maybe some splits in the reds between stopping and going on. Confusing now Guess we will find out soon

Sounds like reds are asking government for talks

They have made an offer after foreign Diplomats visited the Reds rally site.

The offer is Dissolve the House in 30 days.

60 days of election campaign.

Then elections.

So 90 days from now elections.

Great offer, lets hope Abhisit and his ilk will see sense and stop their war against these people.

Accept it Abhisit, lets return Thailand to normal and lets have an election !!

It was not an offer, it was a new demand

Yes, but when you demand LESS than you previously demanded it's actually a negotiation. I do it all the time over salary

[hammered]

Something is happening down the red stage. They are talking like it is over. Maybe some splits in the reds between stopping and going on. Confusing now Guess we will find out soon

That's the way I'm reading it.

Number of things:

Veera has gone feral and decided, against the sage advice of Jatuporn, Nattawut et.al., that it's necessary to negotiate.

The wonderful and sublime actor seems to have been caught with illicit weaponry and far, far too much information on the constitution, activities and connections of certain black robed freedom fighters.

The 'calling in' for questioning of a multitude of Red Shirt fund raisers is cutting off significant mullah.

The bad press from the explosions on Silom are depressing and deflating otherwise moderate support.

Overall, looks like negotiate now or find that the position from which negotiation can be had will have deteriorated further.

The real difference between negotiating now and having negotiated a few weeks ago? 25-30 dead people and many more maimed and traumatized.

Intransigent rhetoric is needed to fire the mob, talk of political negotiation and compromise will bore them. Bad luck for Jatuporn but even worse luck for the other 27 who don't have immunity.

There is a lot of pressure on the big ones behind some of the incidents too. Listen to what Anupong said today. Thee are going to be some things that dont get negotiated away.

[Neurath]

""It is a good thing you weren't there are you might do something - throw something - at a Red Shirt and get deported. Luckily I am here in Phuket because I am so sick of seeing those neanderthals that I could spit. "

this appalling piece of bigotry is so symptomatic of many of the posts here - remember like it or not those grouped around the

Redshirt coalition will almost certainly win any straight election - so it might be an idea to make your peace......or at least get up to speed on the situation.

You have to remember many posters on here are likely in Phuket, Pattaya, Samui and other places that need tourism for income and also cheap prostitutes for their bars.

The status quo was excellent for them, cheap labour, cheap prostitutes and lots of tourists.

The Reds have created problems with tourism and might also effect future generations of cheap prostitutes if life improves for the poor.

Therefore you can expect many to be "pro Yellow" and "anti-red" as it effects their cash flow. And they do not generally care about Thailand, all they care about is money. They want everything the same as they are happy with the system.

Its like the middle class in Bangkok, they do not want change as they are ok with the way things are, they get cheap cleaners, cheap nannies, cheap employees, cheap girls in the massage parlors and life is good, so the last thing they want is an upset to their way of life, I mean, how does a vibrant Isaan region with lots of factories and jobs and new hotels and roads and schools help Bangkok people ?

That's just silly LevelHead. Why would anyone need cheap prostitutes when they can simply read what you write?

I just want to be clear; are we saying that I will soon no longer be able to avail mayself of cheap prostitutes in Thailand ?

(not that there are any because prostitution is not legal).

Certainly not. We are saying that you won't need to since you can obtain a similarly tawdry after-effect, a feeling of wasted time and effort, by simply reading LevelHead.

[Chaimai]

The real difference between negotiating now and having negotiated a few weeks ago? 25-30 dead people and many more maimed and traumatized.

.

This is probably the saddest single statement on this thread.

[hammered]

The real difference between negotiating now and having negotiated a few weeks ago? 25-30 dead people and many more maimed and traumatized.

.

This is probably the saddest single statement on this thread.

Agreed

[hammered]

Bear in mind the red leaders are all wanted for a variety of offences right now. Does negotiation mean they have all charges dropped against them?

[Thai at Heart]

But if a negotiated "truce" is agreed, and the reds go home, is there any guarantee that the other side will go home, or does the clock start ticking on the next protest the minute the reds finish theirs?

[jdinasia]

Bear in mind the red leaders are all wanted for a variety of offences right now. Does negotiation mean they have all charges dropped against them?

Double Standards? since the PAD leadership still has ongoing court cases ....

But basically, no , there are things that have happened and things that have been said that won't be overlooked.

[Neurath]

Bear in mind the red leaders are all wanted for a variety of offences right now. Does negotiation mean they have all charges dropped against them?

No, but it certainly can be one of the issues to negotiate.

Real problem for the Red Shirts is that Chaturon is now involved. The dispute and conflict is being shifted to the realm of political compromise (where it should have been all along) and as that tide goes out it will leave exposed the violent radicals.

There might be some very nasty spasmotic shocks shocks to come, but it seems (seems) to be moving in the right direction.

[TheOldWolf]

Isn´t most of the red leaders on bail already from Black Songkran?

[hammered]

But if a negotiated "truce" is agreed, and the reds go home, is there any guarantee that the other side will go home, or does the clock start ticking on the next protest the minute the reds finish theirs?

Any negotiated settlement must be acceptable to all not just the government and reds or it will come to what you say. An election this year but when. I dsont think it will be in 3 months. It must also be clear for all to campaign freely. Maybe a few government visits to the ISaan and North should be arranged first and a couple of PTP ones down south. 6 months is the logical deal or the best deal to getr as many as possible to agree to. What will also happen about all the crimes committed? An amnesty will likely be proposed but that just invites it all again

Lots of bumps along the way

[way2muchcoffee]

But if a negotiated "truce" is agreed, and the reds go home, is there any guarantee that the other side will go home, or does the clock start ticking on the next protest the minute the reds finish theirs?

Any negotiated settlement must be acceptable to all not just the government and reds or it will come to what you say. An election this year but when. I dsont think it will be in 3 months. It must also be clear for all to campaign freely. Maybe a few government visits to the ISaan and North should be arranged first and a couple of PTP ones down south. 6 months is the logical deal or the best deal to getr as many as possible to agree to. What will also happen about all the crimes committed? An amnesty will likely be proposed but that just invites it all again

Lots of bumps along the way

I reckon if there is any amnesty involved for red shirt leaders there will have to be amnesty for the PAD leaders as well. That might help cool them down a bit.