Bangkok: Red-Shirts Slam Chulalongkorn Hospital For Evacuating Patients

[Insight]

What task would that be sir?

Defending the reds. That is the purpose of your presence?

[hextac]

What task would that be sir?

Defending the reds. That is the purpose of your presence?

Nope, I'm pretty impartial.

[PoorSucker]

I think we have to blame the guy asking for red apologists just now...

All the grenades painted in yellow

Edited May 1, 2010 by PoorSucker

[ding]

Raiding a hospital loses popular support. Period.

And the invoking of cloud beings CAUSES zealotry and violence - how else can leaders get poor people do risk their lives for the rich and powerful?

[elkangorito]

What task would that be sir?

Defending the reds. That is the purpose of your presence?

Nope, I'm pretty impartial.

Nurses are also impartial. My mum was a nurse for about 40 years & her main concern was with patient care. I can pretty much guarantee you that any hospital with any regard for 'patient care', would evacuate under a possible threat of violence. This would particularly apply if the government did/could not provide adequate security against such intrusions.

[Insight]

What task would that be sir?

Defending the reds. That is the purpose of your presence?

Nope, I'm pretty impartial.

I just checked your posting history, then I checked mine, then realised we're as "impartial" as each other.

Edited May 1, 2010 by Insight

[hextac]

I'm asking because I am tired of all those The Italiann, LevelHeaded and RusselHantz types who obviously had other usernames before all this started.

Please explain how it is obvious those users had other usernames before "all this started".

Maybe not all of them, but look at the overly aggressive/propagandist/trollish posts about the political situation and you will see that most of these.. - ahem - posters... have signed up just a few weeks ago and look where their postcount is now... ?

I guess many of them also got bans from mods, but just decided to carry on with another account.

I see such posts from all sides, from seasoned TV veterans and newbies alike. Most trollish behaviour is dealt with by the mods/admins very effectively.

[hextac]

What task would that be sir?

Defending the reds. That is the purpose of your presence?

Nope, I'm pretty impartial.

I just checked your posting history, then I checked mine, then realised we're as "impartial" as each other.

OK, good? Or were you being sarcastic?

[beejoir]

PAD/UDD who really gives a shit/

[way2muchcoffee]

The world understands a government trying to disperse a mob of insurgents. The world does not understand an attack on a hospital, except as pure evil.

so let me get this right,,your calling all those thousands of ppl (some died and hundreds got injured) who "defended" their rally site on april 10th as insurgents????

Yes. When you take up arms against your country's government, police, and military you can properly be labeled an insurgent.

[Jingthing]

Yes, those weren't rallies anymore. They became illegal occupations. The reds don't OWN the streets of Bangkok. Those are for the use of the general public. There isn't a country in the world that wouldn't try to break up an illegal occupation by insurgents such as is happening now. The fact that the Thai government can't manage that is sadly the sign of a potentially failed state.

As far as casualties, if the reds were a legitimate civil disobedience movement, they would still be illegal, but they could be dispersed without force. But the reds are armed and violent.

Edited May 1, 2010 by Jingthing

[BkkMD]

Terrorists rush into a hospital brandishing weapons and howling obscenities, and the hospital staff are expected to NOT try and protect their patients.

Makes perfect sense

[elkangorito]

Yes, those weren't rallies anymore. They became illegal occupations. The reds don't OWN the streets of Bangkok. Those are for the use of the general public. There isn't a country in the world that wouldn't try to break up an illegal occupation by insurgents such as is happening now. The fact that the Thai government can't manage that is sadly the sign of a potentially failed state.

As far as casualties, if the reds were a legitimate civil disobedience movement, they would still be illegal, but they could be dispersed without force. But the reds are armed and violent.

I could not agree more JT.

[Siam Simon]

from the washingtonpost

In the current round of protests, Thaksin has secretly seeded the Red Shirts in Bangkok with former military personnel, said Viengrat Nethipo, a supporter of the Red Shirts who is an assistant professor of political science at Chulalongkorn University in Bangkok. A number of government officials and independent observers share her view.

Thai police and army forces have seized caches of rocket-launched grenades from the Red Shirts. During the army's failed attempt on April 10 to move the protesters out, several fighters in black uniforms sprang into action on the Red Shirt side, according to videotape evidence.

Autopsies after the shootout showed that high-velocity bullets, many of them fired with precision to the head, neck and chest, had killed and wounded several members of the army, including the most senior officer at the scene. The lethal targeting suggested a high level of military command and control among the protesters.

Leaders of the Red Shirts say they do not know who the black-shirted fighters are or where they came from. Government leaders say that is absurd.

Kraisak Choonhavan, a member of parliament and a deputy leader in the government, said Thaksin's policies benefited rural people. But now, he said, "he employs killer-hunters who come from the military."

Although the stalemate continues in the streets of Bangkok, both Kraisak and Jaran said negotiations between the Red Shirts and the government are quietly underway.

Pretty Damning article from the Washington Post --- gotta link ----?

So, you didn't notice the glaring factual error in this article or you're just conveniently ignoring it?

Do you mean that Sae Daeng's ronin fighters were not a secret? That Sae Daeng had talked about them many times?

If the journalist couldn't even get something as basic as how the Commanding Officer died correct, it's hard to consider the article "pretty damning" or even take it seriously. But, hey, lets not let facts get in the way of the relentless roll of pointless propaganda on here.

[warfie]

It was VERY stupid to attack a hospital... let's be honest - but to evacuate is pure 'theater' and politically motivated - no doubt - but who's brainwave was it to attck n the first place? here's a gun - now's where's my foot?

correct me if I'm wrong, this was the second or third attack on Chula?

Theatre?

You are right, very stupid...

[warfie]

It was VERY stupid to attack a hospital... let's be honest - but to evacuate is pure 'theater' and politically motivated - no doubt - but who's brainwave was it to attck n the first place? here's a gun - now's where's my foot?

correct me if I'm wrong, this was the second or third attack on Chula?

Theatre?

You are right, very stupid...

[hyperlemon]

Its time these red shirts went home, attacking a hospital is about as low as it possible to go!

Injure people with bombs, guns etc and then povent those wounded from receving medical care, even in wars this is uncommon i belive

Im not Thai, so my opinion may not matter, but the red's are creating too much damage for thailand as we all know!

the government can not accept any of the demands from the red shirts, that will cause many more problems!

What is Thaksin doing? He a Citizen of Montinegro, has at least us$300million. Why not just live life and forget about trying to destroy thailand and hireing from what the washington post sugests, assasins!

[wintermute]

Its time these red shirts went home, attacking a hospital is about as low as it possible to go!

Injure people with bombs, guns etc and then povent those wounded from receving medical care, even in wars this is uncommon i belive

Im not Thai, so my opinion may not matter, but the red's are creating too much damage for thailand as we all know!

the government can not accept any of the demands from the red shirts, that will cause many more problems!

What is Thaksin doing? He a Citizen of Montinegro, has at least us$300million. Why not just live life and forget about trying to destroy thailand and hireing from what the washington post sugests, assasins!

If you really want to learn how to do propaganda correctly go study some Joseph Stalin or Leni Riefenstahl.

[ronz28]

No, it can get worse. Say they follow the Greek Reds as seen here or worse http://www.businessinsider.com/greek-prote...b-police-2010-5

The Reds probably intend to torch those tire and bamboo barricades with some of their Molotov cocktails when they leave to set Bangkok on fire. Is everyone ready to whip out your Songkran water pistols and hoses when that happens? Have you been stockpiling water to help out or just counting on the rain and the local fire department? A tire fire is hard to put out. Why were they allowed to bring in so many tires in the first place?

[Siam Simon]

Its time these red shirts went home, attacking a hospital is about as low as it possible to go!

Injure people with bombs, guns etc and then povent those wounded from receving medical care, even in wars this is uncommon i belive

Im not Thai, so my opinion may not matter, but the red's are creating too much damage for thailand as we all know!

the government can not accept any of the demands from the red shirts, that will cause many more problems!

What is Thaksin doing? He a Citizen of Montinegro, has at least us$300million. Why not just live life and forget about trying to destroy thailand and hireing from what the washington post sugests, assasins!

Except it wasn't an attack. It was an intrusion (an appalling and misguided one, I agree). But lets not allow fact to get in the way of hysterical propaganda, eh?

[kurtgruen]

Yes, those weren't rallies anymore. They became illegal occupations. The reds don't OWN the streets of Bangkok. Those are for the use of the general public. There isn't a country in the world that wouldn't try to break up an illegal occupation by insurgents such as is happening now. The fact that the Thai government can't manage that is sadly the sign of a potentially failed state.

As far as casualties, if the reds were a legitimate civil disobedience movement, they would still be illegal, but they could be dispersed without force. But the reds are armed and violent.

I could not agree more JT.

I don't see it as a "failed state". The Government managed to wear the protesters down, to much smaller numbers. They also waited long enough, to expose Thaksin's protesters, for the violent thugs, they really are.

Speaking of numbers, this is what happened for the annual May Day celebrations in France...

In France, an estimated 300,000 people had taken to the streets in various cities by midday as part of the traditional May Day demonstrations held by trade unions in many countries.

If the Reds were truly for the people, yesterday, would have been the perfect day to make a stand.

I have no idea, what their numbers were yesterday, at the Pro-Thaksin demonstrations, but I would guess, less than 30,000 (probably a lot less, most likely only a few thousand)

So, failed state, I don't think so. I think, things are going the Government's way. Thaksin's Protesters, will get more and more negative publicity, while they illegally occupy an importand part of Bangkok. There will be a lot of negative fallout, for Thaksin and his cronies, once this is all over. For the Reds, it's do or die or go home now and they don't have the numbers to do (overthrow the Government), so they either die or go home. I would strongly suggest they go home. Then, they can spin some more rhetoric at home, about how they tried to save Thailand from the other side. They can claim to be heroes, keep feeding the uneducated their bulls*it and maybe get elected again next year. Stranger things have happened

Of course, Thaksin will not allow that to happen, because, after spending all these millions, attempting to overthrow the Government, he wants to be the Ruler of Thailand, not the pathetic criminal, he is right now. If his Reds don't overthrow the Government for him, his political fantasies, about Thailand, will most likely come to an end. The Government has enough political ammo, to defeat any attempt of the TRT, PPP, Phea Thai, or whatever they want to reinvent themselves as, during the next election.

So, without Thaksin's buddies in power, he will remain a criminal on the run. His dreams of becoming Prime Minister (or more), will be shattered. Question is, how much blood, are his followers willing to spill for him? What about his little Mafia of Red leaders? Are they willing to die for their cause, or will they hide at McDonalds and enjoy a happy meal, while the their red pawns get shot?

[pontius]

THE NATION: Arisman told redshirts: "We'll again have a chance to flex our muscles."

I do not condone violence, but I wish somebody would bitchslap this guy in public, with a hundred people watching and laughing.

[waza]

I dont think the Red shirt going home will be the end, not even the begining of the end. Thaskins has been chasing his agends for the last 4 years and hes like a dog with a bone. But I think the movement has grown beyond his control and this movements still have a few aces up their sleeve, and theres a joker in the pack

[Siam Simon]

Yes, those weren't rallies anymore. They became illegal occupations. The reds don't OWN the streets of Bangkok. Those are for the use of the general public. There isn't a country in the world that wouldn't try to break up an illegal occupation by insurgents such as is happening now. The fact that the Thai government can't manage that is sadly the sign of a potentially failed state.

As far as casualties, if the reds were a legitimate civil disobedience movement, they would still be illegal, but they could be dispersed without force. But the reds are armed and violent.

I could not agree more JT.

I don't see it as a "failed state". The Government managed to wear the protesters down, to much smaller numbers. They also waited long enough, to expose Thaksin's protesters, for the violent thugs, they really are.

Speaking of numbers, this is what happened for the annual May Day celebrations in France...

In France, an estimated 300,000 people had taken to the streets in various cities by midday as part of the traditional May Day demonstrations held by trade unions in many countries.

If the Reds were truly for the people, yesterday, would have been the perfect day to make a stand.

I have no idea, what their numbers were yesterday, at the Pro-Thaksin demonstrations, but I would guess, less than 30,000 (probably a lot less, most likely only a few thousand)

So, failed state, I don't think so. I think, things are going the Government's way. Thaksin's Protesters, will get more and more negative publicity, while they illegally occupy an importand part of Bangkok. There will be a lot of negative fallout, for Thaksin and his cronies, once this is all over. For the Reds, it's do or die or go home now and they don't have the numbers to do (overthrow the Government), so they either die or go home. I would strongly suggest they go home. Then, they can spin some more rhetoric at home, about how they tried to save Thailand from the other side. They can claim to be heroes, keep feeding the uneducated their bulls*it and maybe get elected again next year. Stranger things have happened

Of course, Thaksin will not allow that to happen, because, after spending all these millions, attempting to overthrow the Government, he wants to be the Ruler of Thailand, not the pathetic criminal, he is right now. If his Reds don't overthrow the Government for him, his political fantasies, about Thailand, will most likely come to an end. The Government has enough political ammo, to defeat any attempt of the TRT, PPP, Phea Thai, or whatever they want to reinvent themselves as, during the next election.

So, without Thaksin's buddies in power, he will remain a criminal on the run. His dreams of becoming Prime Minister (or more), will be shattered. Question is, how much blood, are his followers willing to spill for him? What about his little Mafia of Red leaders? Are they willing to die for their cause, or will they hide at McDonalds and enjoy a happy meal, while the their red pawns get shot?

Kurt, what are you and others going on about with these accusations about political leaders hiding? The red shirt leaders are no more hiding at MaccyD's (apparently not an option now, anyway) than the Demo-led government are hiding at that army barracks on the outskirts of town. Leaders of all types usually keep themselves out of direct line of fire. It makes sense to do so. The ones who don't do this either cover themselves in glory or end up dead. The Army CO of this and last year's Red Shirt uprisings got to experience both the former and the latter, brave guy that he was. It would be better for all genuine posters on here if we had more cold analysis and less histrionics.

[elkangorito]

I don't see it as a "failed state".

The quote was "potentially failed state" & not "failed state" as you indicate.

[kurtgruen]

The Government managed to wear the protesters down, to much smaller numbers. They also waited long enough, to expose Thaksin's protesters, for the violent thugs, they really are.

Speaking of numbers, this is what happened for the annual May Day celebrations in France...

In France, an estimated 300,000 people had taken to the streets in various cities by midday as part of the traditional May Day demonstrations held by trade unions in many countries.

If the Reds were truly for the people, yesterday, would have been the perfect day to make a stand.

I have no idea, what their numbers were yesterday, at the Pro-Thaksin demonstrations, but I would guess, less than 30,000 (probably a lot less, most likely only a few thousand)

So, failed state, I don't think so. I think, things are going the Government's way. Thaksin's Protesters, will get more and more negative publicity, while they illegally occupy an importand part of Bangkok. There will be a lot of negative fallout, for Thaksin and his cronies, once this is all over. For the Reds, it's do or die or go home now and they don't have the numbers to do (overthrow the Government), so they either die or go home. I would strongly suggest they go home. Then, they can spin some more rhetoric at home, about how they tried to save Thailand from the other side. They can claim to be heroes, keep feeding the uneducated their bulls*it and maybe get elected again next year. Stranger things have happened

Of course, Thaksin will not allow that to happen, because, after spending all these millions, attempting to overthrow the Government, he wants to be the Ruler of Thailand, not the pathetic criminal, he is right now. If his Reds don't overthrow the Government for him, his political fantasies, about Thailand, will most likely come to an end. The Government has enough political ammo, to defeat any attempt of the TRT, PPP, Phea Thai, or whatever they want to reinvent themselves as, during the next election.

So, without Thaksin's buddies in power, he will remain a criminal on the run. His dreams of becoming Prime Minister (or more), will be shattered. Question is, how much blood, are his followers willing to spill for him? What about his little Mafia of Red leaders? Are they willing to die for their cause, or will they hide at McDonalds and enjoy a happy meal, while the their red pawns get shot?

Kurt, what are you and others going on about with these accusations about political leaders hiding? The red shirt leaders are no more hiding at MaccyD's (apparently not an option now, anyway) than the Demo-led government are hiding at that army barracks on the outskirts of town. Leaders of all types usually keep themselves out of direct line of fire. It makes sense to do so. The ones who don't do this either cover themselves in glory or end up dead. The Army CO of this and last year's Red Shirt uprisings got to experience both the former and the latter, brave guy that he was. It would be better for all genuine posters on here if we had more cold analysis and less histrionics.

Hmmm..for one, you have Thaksin, their main leader and puppet master, hiding in foreign countries, to avoid persecution. My reference to McDonald's, was....

THE NATION: Reds on Vibhavadi r also calling for leaders. Kwanchai, earlier reported to hav been arrested, is heading back to Rajprasong, Jatuporn said

THE NATION: Face-off continues btw troops & reds at National Memorial. Gunfire has stopped.

THE NATION: Reds at National Memorial, though apparently still not demoralized, are virtually leaderless.

Kwanchai's escape to McDonalds: http://twitpic.com/1j2pkd (Photo by photo_journ)

[kurtgruen]

I don't see it as a "failed state".

The quote was "potentially failed state" & not "failed state" as you indicate.

My apologies, forgot the word "potentially".

[mintyfresh]

THE NATION: Arisman told redshirts: "We'll again have a chance to flex our muscles."

I do not condone violence, but I wish somebody would bitchslap this guy in public, with a hundred people watching and laughing.

A good pistol whipping would be even better.

[viking75]

i have idea for government win. everybody falang on this site wish for win and only post against reds.

come on you can do it

[whybother]

i have idea for government win. everybody falang on this site wish for win and only post against reds.

come on you can do it

So you're saying (as you have in several threads) that because pro-reds have nothing to say, that only anti-red posts are allowed.

How about trying to come up with some pro-red discussion points?