Thailand

[llso]

Having lived in Thailand for 7 years,worked ,traveled to nearly every part. Speak Thai somewhat fluently and married to an Issan girl I have a pretty good understanding of Thai culture. Thailand came from the stone age directly into the modern age. In my wifes village they did not have electricity until she was about 10 years old, she is 30 now. In these villages without electricity ,nothing had really changed for about a thousand years, it was truly Neolithic. Therefore the majority of Thai culture had moved fast forward right into the modern age.

Whereas in the West the transition was more gradual, we went from an agrarian society ,to the Industrial revolution which ultimately gave way to the modern age which we live in today. I have often thought for many years the modern Thailand that you see today is but a thin veneer over the real Thailand which is what we are seeing now. It may not be apparent to the casual foreign observer ,but there is a very rigid class structure in Thailand that Westerners will never fully comprehend. Altough Thaksin and his populist policies were the catalyst for the current situation, there is certainly a larger dynamic at play here.

LL

[FarangBuddha]

So we just need to get these Issan Reds to go back to their caves

[Soutpeel]

and your point is...???

+/- 800 years ago one of the worlds biggest cities Ankor and "Thailand" and part of the Khmer kingdom, so hardly neolithic...

Go to the UK and see the rigid class structure they have there....not go to Eton or Cambridge...oh dear, sorry old chap...

We could also suggest, Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong etc come from the same pedigree as Thailand. ie "had moved fast forward right into the modern age".....they have appeared to cope...so thats your theroy shot to sh*t...lets move on...

Thai Apologist BS

Current issues IMHO are because of a singles man's ego, who would be prepared to destroy a country because of a "loss of face"...

[Garry9999]

OP, what you say about rapid change in quite true, but these quotes from earlier, sum it up better.

Buddhism is a very convenient philosophy which is the majority of Thai's use to hide behind and disguise their real motives, which as we all know is the accumulation of wealth, basically Thai values and morals are rotten to the core.

Recent events have only highlighted to the rest of the world the true Thailand, corruption and abuse of civil rights are abused daily, there is a tripple standard which exists here, rich/elite Thai against poor Thai, and rich/elite and poor Thai against foreigners.

Forget "loss of face" which is used as a crap excuse for everything from bad driving to insurrection.

Thailand's failings have a lot more to do with the lack of a work ethic, a weak education system, massive inequalities, financial, geographical and racial, and ill-discipline in virtually every field running the gamut from law enforcement to personal development.

Edited May 20, 2010 by Garry9999

[dumball]

='Garry9999' date='2010-05-20 13:14:38' post='3623403']

OP, what you say about rapid change in quite true, but these quotes from earlier, sum it up betteThailandTommy' post='3618827' date='2010-05-19 18:13:55']Buddhism is a very convenient philosophy which is the majority of Thai's use to hide behind and disguise their real motives, which as we all know is the accumulation of wealth, basically Thai values and morals are rotten to the core.

Recent events have only highlighted to the rest of the world the true Thailand, corruption and abuse of civil rights are abused daily, there is a tripple standard which exists here, rich/elite Thai against poor Thai, and rich/elite and poor Thai against foreigners.

'Briggsy' post='3620767' date='2010-05-19 23:13:58']Forget "loss of face" which is used as a crap excuse for everything from bad driving to insurrection.

Thailand's failings have a lot more to do with the lack of a work ethic, a weak education system, massive inequalities, financial, geographical and racial, and ill-discipline in virtually every field running the gamut from law enforcement to personal development.

I think you have hit all of Thai problems in a nutshell with these collective quotes ,cunning , lazy , conniving populace with a seething anger for all things foreign just under the top layer of skin . With these attributes , it is a tall order to configure any logical methods of true growth into this modern world , flawed as it may be , first you need to open eyes and ears with the mouth kept tightly closed , now there is a truly gigantic hurdle to overcome .

[kevozman1]

Not that I know too much about Thailand's history but I think

if you are talking about somewhere like BKK then the change

in time and developments would have been more gradual and

noticable.

I think you may have a point with Isaan and rural places. I bet

if you went back 30 years into Isaan it was probably the same

for a thousand years or so without too much change.

I could be totaly wrong though.

[hawthorne]

So we just need to get these Issan Reds to go back to their caves

and take away their electricity they have abused their new found entitlements.

[StreetCowboy]

and your point is...???

+/- 800 years ago one of the worlds biggest cities Ankor and "Thailand" and part of the Khmer kingdom, so hardly neolithic...

Go to the UK and see the rigid class structure they have there....not go to Eton or Cambridge...oh dear, sorry old chap...

We could also suggest, Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong etc come from the same pedigree as Thailand. ie "had moved fast forward right into the modern age".....they have appeared to cope...so thats your theroy shot to sh*t...lets move on...

Thai Apologist BS

Current issues IMHO are because of a singles man's ego, who would be prepared to destroy a country because of a "loss of face"...

But remember that HK, Singapore and Malaysia were fortunate to grow up British, like the rest of us.

I think you overplay the importance of class and public school education in the UK, though of course it does help; otherwise Abhisit would have been sent to a secondary modern, wouldn't he?

SC

[husskydog]

Well put...2 words really sum it up.....uncompromising greed

[NBD]

I wouldn't say lacking mains electricity makes them neolithic.

[billaaa777]

That was a very well thought out, interesting and educational post. I really appreciate it. I have lived here 6 years and learned a little about Thailand from your comments.

Don't worry about the haters, they never stop with their BS, they are just jealous they can not write as good as you.

[GuestHouse]

I know there are some pretty deprived areas in Isaan, but describing life there 20 years ago as 'Stone Age' is a tad harsh.

Thailand is moving from an Agrarian society to a modern mixed Agrarian/Industrial/Service society. As an agrarian society it has until recently been extremely successful, competing with and bettering many of its SE Asian Neighbours.

But the OP is correct, the transition from Agrarian, to modern mixed Agrarian/Industrial/Service society is happening in a very short space of time.

However direct comparisons to what happened in the West are fraught with a few problems.

Thailand, unlike Europe, was handed a blue print of how to make the change. If not the very specifics at least the principals and framework for modernizing a nation were in place to be copied. The nut had been cracked on the part played and benefits of educational reform. transport provisions, commercial law, governance, financial support, welfare, health and safety, the voluntary sector, utilities provisions, waste management, environmental protection and a host of other hard lessons learned by others.

And it's not like Thailand needs to look West for these lessons, there are enough examples East and in the rest of the non Western world to turn to.

There is no better example than Thailand's appalling educational system - Broken, not fit for purpose and known to be so for decades. Off the shelf solutions available from around the world but nothing done. Worse still, private education is promoted, a government and industry push for excellence in education for those who can afford to pay - while the masses rot on rote learning.

For three or four decades Thailand has been at the forefront of SE Asia's development - Recently every indicator is turning out the same result - Thailand is slipping behind its competitors.

Denial sets in and anyone who points out the failings is non patriotic or, here on TV, a 'Thai Hater'.

Mortgage the farm.... while you can.

[Garry9999]

There is no better example than Thailand's appalling educational system - Broken, not fit for purpose and known to be so for decades. Off the shelf solutions available from around the world but nothing done. Worse still, private education is promoted, a government and industry push for excellence in education for those who can afford to pay - while the masses rot on rote learning.

Agreed, the appalling education system in Thailand is the cause of many of it's problems.

[Kimera]

I wouldn't say lacking mains electricity makes them neolithic.

That maybe true, but it did give them the TV which changes all society.

[lingnoi1977]

Most Thai people I know who have experienced other countries for a year or more never want to move back to LOS for valid reasons, most of which have been discussed.

Interesting...where I come from red tape and heavy multiple layers of taxation (you guessed it - Australia) are unavoidable facts of life. I am no sure which is better to live by - organised democracy with 'hidden' corruption or unashamed greed and disorganised corruption at all levels in LOS.

[zydeco]

and your point is...???

+/- 800 years ago one of the worlds biggest cities Ankor and "Thailand" and part of the Khmer kingdom, so hardly neolithic...

Go to the UK and see the rigid class structure they have there....not go to Eton or Cambridge...oh dear, sorry old chap...

We could also suggest, Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong etc come from the same pedigree as Thailand. ie "had moved fast forward right into the modern age".....they have appeared to cope...so thats your theroy shot to sh*t...lets move on...

Thai Apologist BS

Current issues IMHO are because of a singles man's ego, who would be prepared to destroy a country because of a "loss of face"...

But remember that HK, Singapore and Malaysia were fortunate to grow up British, like the rest of us.

Funny, I always thought going to the UK was like going back in time. Exposed electrical wiring commonplace, too small radiators, streets and sidewalks with more potholes than a lunar crater, ill fiting doors and windows in hotels, bumpy (and slow) trains. It was like somebody stopped the clock somewhere in 1938.

[StreetCowboy]

8>< NESTED QUOTES DELETED ><8

Funny, I always thought going to the UK was like going back in time. Exposed electrical wiring commonplace, too small radiators, streets and sidewalks with more potholes than a lunar crater, ill fiting doors and windows in hotels, bumpy (and slow) trains. It was like somebody stopped the clock somewhere in 1938.

My grandmother was like that, too, before she passed on...

SC

[JohanV]

So we just need to get these Issan Reds to go back to their caves

and take away their electricity they have abused their new found entitlements.

And that would mean they would have to return to making fires ?

As far as I know, they're already there