What Do I Need To Setup A Home Network In My Room?

[naughtybadfurrimunki]

Hey guys,

In my room there's an ethernet socket in the wall. I connect my pc to the building's LAN to connect to the internet.

I'd like to setup a home network in my room. I have 2 desktop PC's, WD live TV and an iPad that I want to network but I'm not sure what I need to build a LAN on an existing LAN. Obviously I don't want a gateway/router with modem built-in, but I'm not sure what to go for.

My initial leanings are toward the Asus RT-N16, will this work? Or do I need a switch, not a router?

Please advise.

Many thanks.

[ballbreaker]

You want a router and your choice is okay.

[garyh]

A switch would allow you to connect the PC's but to connect the Ipad a wireless router like you have chosen is needed.

[joncl]

You want a router and your choice is okay.

Well said, but configured as a bridge so on the LAN side (in your room) you have all your local devices active and on the WAN side you have your 1 connection to the condo network.

[monty]

Yup, a wireless (wifi) router will do.

Connect the condo's internet LAN cable to the WAN port on the router, your desk-top PC and WD live will get plugged into the LAN ports of the router, and obviously your wireless device(s) such as your ipad will automatically hook up to the wifi.

Make sure to run the software included with the router which will prompt you to change the default router password and to activate the wireless security.

[joncl]

The key word here is Bridge, to set the device up as a Bridge or RFC1483 Bridged. Else it will fail.

[innerspace]

What you want is a 4 port wireless router.

Some models will be ADSL, you have no need for that, just 4 ethernet ports.

My personal preference would be a anything that supports "tomato firmware" which can turn a good router into an amazing router.

The router you mentioned supports tomato. Click here.

Depending on your requirements that router may be overkill, but it sure looks good - I want one!

However, if you are unsure about what you are doing be careful upgrading the firmware, it can kill a device!

The key word here is Bridge, to set the device up as a Bridge or RFC1483 Bridged. Else it will fail.

No, the key word is Router, which allows joining networks together.

Bridging and routing perform similar tasks however routers are more efficient and common than bridges.

Saying it must be bridged or will fail is simply not true.

[joncl]

well there you go as on all the old cisco/linksys modem routers that I have here simply will not support Tomato and the other Tomato types of 3rd party upgrades. So I upgraded them with Neptun354 and in this case it uses a RFC 1483 bridge in a similar config as the OP wants complete with its own onboard DHCP server for the LAN.

[naughtybadfurrimunki]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

I'm interested in the RT-N16 because it's 802.11n (same as iPad), supposedly with good wifi range, and features a print server and usb port for network storage. My idea is to connect a high capacity USB drive to the router,to which I can download TV shows etc, and not need to copy or move the files to watch via the WD live TV box.

Also, I want both desktop PC's available on the network, but I only want one of them to have internet access, so is it possible (WinXP) to have a PC on a network which is connected to the internet but have that PC setup so it doesn't have internet access?

Many thanks again!

[naughtybadfurrimunki]

Hi guys,

I've bought the RT-N16, but so far I am unable to connect to the internet with it.

With the RT-N16 disconnected and my PC plugged directly into the condo's LAN I can login to the condo's router (because they didn't change the default password) to get the following info:

The condo router is a Zyxel P-660H-T1 v2, settings as follows:

WAN

DSL Mode: ADSL2+

IP address: 58.8.237.241

Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.255

Default Gateway: N/A

VPI/VCI: 0/100

LAN

IP address: 192.168.1.252

Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.0

DHCP: Server

I have connected the WAN port of the RT-N16 to the Zyxel router, and connected my PC to

the 1st LAN port on the RT-N16.

I have the RT-N16 set up as follows:

Mode: Router (as opposed to gateway or access point)

WAN

Receive IP address automatically

LAN

IP address: 192.168.2.1

Subnet mask: 255.255.255.0

The RT-N16 will not let me allocate a LAN ip in the 192.168.1.xxx range, because the Zyxel is already using that range (the Zyxel DHCP server is allocating ip addresses in that range).

Is it ok to have the RT-N16 LAN subnet mask set to 255.255.255.0? (ie: same subnet as the Zyxel LAN)

ipconfig /all shows my PC is being allocated an IP address by the RT-N16.

The RT-N16 shows 'connection is established' however I can't access the internet.

Many thanks again.

Edited June 26, 2010 by naughtybadfurrimunki

[welo]

You have to setup the RT-N16 to expect a 'standard' LAN on the WAN side, no PPP etc. How to configure this setup depends on the router software. Your RT-N16 should obtain an IP from the Zyxel in the 192.168.1.x subnet and have the gateway set to 192.168.1.252, all automatically via DHCP. This is on the WAN side! Check your RT-N16 if this worked or not. Maybe try the 'gateway' option, the differences between gateway and router is sometimes 'fuzzy'.

Your LAN side seems to be OK. The router should actually 'route' between your home network (192.168.2.x and the 'Zyxel' 192.168.1.x network, which then again should be router by the Zyxel to the WAN for public IPs.

When you setup everything, did you try to ping 192.168.1.252 (the Zyxel)?

Did you try to ping a public IP, e.g. 8.8.8.8 (Google DNS)?

If ping works, but 'no internet', maybe your DNS config is confused. Check whether the RT-N16 obtained a correct DNS, or set your PC to 8.8.8.8 for test purposes.

Btw you will have a cascaded NAT setup then, portforwards will be more difficult to setup in such a scenario.

A standard switch would have avoided this, as well does setting up the router as a 'bridge' (if possible). Your PCs will then work in the same subnet as the Zyxel AFAIK. Both setups have pros and cons.

welo

Edited June 26, 2010 by welo

[astral]

A simple wireless Access Point plugged in to the Internet socket would do the job.

http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=316

or the like.

[welo]

Well, this is a actually a router that you linked to

But you're right. Switching it to AP-only mode would do the trick. It should act like a combined switch/access point then. However, the same should be possible with the RT-N16 as well.

Some bare access points have only one LAN port, not suitable if OP wants to connect one of devices via wired ethernet.

[bram]

Better keep it in the router mode because else other people in the condor have direct access to you pc. Important is that the 2 routers are not in the same range but u got that allready. Try to let the asus get a ip adres from the zyxel by renew it at the intnet settings if this does not work find out from what ip adres the dhcp start from the zyxel. If for sample it starts at 192.168.1.100 till 192.168.1.254 this means your can pick a static ip from 192.168.1.2 till 192.168.1.99 ( 192.168.1.1 will be the gateway i think ) Check in the zyxsel it there are no others using this static ip you like to use .

Than set this staic ip for sample:

IP 192.168.1.3

subnet 255.255.255.0

gateway 192.168.1.1 ( must be the ip your use to get in the zyxel )

dns ( same as gateway )

Let us know if it worked out.

[siamect]

Better keep it in the router mode because else other people in the condor have direct access to you pc. Important is that the 2 routers are not in the same range but u got that allready. Try to let the asus get a ip adres from the zyxel by renew it at the intnet settings if this does not work find out from what ip adres the dhcp start from the zyxel. If for sample it starts at 192.168.1.100 till 192.168.1.254 this means your can pick a static ip from 192.168.1.2 till 192.168.1.99 ( 192.168.1.1 will be the gateway i think ) Check in the zyxsel it there are no others using this static ip you like to use .

Than set this staic ip for sample:

IP 192.168.1.3

subnet 255.255.255.0

gateway 192.168.1.1 ( must be the ip your use to get in the zyxel )

dns ( same as gateway )

Let us know if it worked out.

You can use this static ip to test but if you leave it like that you better make sure the IP is not within the range that the Zyxel is giving out when it gets a DHCP request.

And besides... you are not the admin of the Zyxel so you will never know if they change that range... You should let your router use DHCP to get a proper IP.

If that works when you connect your computer directly w/o router then it should work for the router too provided the router is setup correctly.

Martin

Edited June 27, 2010 by siamect

[naughtybadfurrimunki]

Hi guys,

Thanks for the replies.

Unfortunately I haven't had any success, but I will try your latest suggestions.

As I previously mentioned, I'm able to login to the Zyxel admin page because they didn't change the default password, I can see the LAN IP of the Zyxel but there's no information about what range of IP addresses the Zyxel DHCP server is assigning. However if I connect my PC directly to the Zyxel (bypassing the RT-N16) I can see my PC IP is 192.168.1.4 and the Zyxel IP is 192.168.1.1. The default gateway is set to the same as the Zyxel IP.

If I put the RT-N16 in ap mode and leave it's LAN IP to be assigned automatically I can't access it's admin page again because it's IP has changed and I can't repair the network connection in Win XP. Only option is to reset the RT-N16 to factory settings, reboot and start again. Also, still in ap mode, if I assign a static IP, anything other than 192.168.1.1 and 255.255.255.0 causes the same problem, but I can't use 192.168.1.1 as a static IP for the RT-N16 because the Zyxel is already using that address.

I also posted this problem on the Asus forum, and I've been told on there that it'll only work with the RT-N16 in ap mode, however I'm now beginning to think that this just isn't the case.

[siamect]

Hi guys,

Thanks for the replies.

Unfortunately I haven't had any success, but I will try your latest suggestions.

As I previously mentioned, I'm able to login to the Zyxel admin page because they didn't change the default password, I can see the LAN IP of the Zyxel but there's no information about what range of IP addresses the Zyxel DHCP server is assigning. However if I connect my PC directly to the Zyxel (bypassing the RT-N16) I can see my PC IP is 192.168.1.4 and the Zyxel IP is 192.168.1.1. The default gateway is set to the same as the Zyxel IP.

If I put the RT-N16 in ap mode and leave it's LAN IP to be assigned automatically I can't access it's admin page again because it's IP has changed and I can't repair the network connection in Win XP. Only option is to reset the RT-N16 to factory settings, reboot and start again. Also, still in ap mode, if I assign a static IP, anything other than 192.168.1.1 and 255.255.255.0 causes the same problem, but I can't use 192.168.1.1 as a static IP for the RT-N16 because the Zyxel is already using that address.

I also posted this problem on the Asus forum, and I've been told on there that it'll only work with the RT-N16 in ap mode, however I'm now beginning to think that this just isn't the case.

Don't believe in forums too much...

There is no point using AP mode. Use it as router instead.

Most if not all that I write here is just repetition of what others already has given you but I guess the more ways you see it written the closer to the solution you get...

You should setup the LAN side of the RT-N16 to use for example 192.168.2.1 and configure the DHCP server.

The DHCP server of the RT-N16 should be configured to give the following to the clients on your private network:

IP (give the range for example 192.168.2.10 - 192.168.2.20)

mask 255.255.255.0

default gateway 192.168.2.1

DNS server 192.168.2.1 (if RT-N16 is configured to work as a DNS server, if not try with 8.8.8.8 (google))

If any of these are missing, it will cause problems.

Remember the WAN of the RT-N16 is the LAN of the Zyxel.

Set the RT-N16 up to receive the WAN IP using DHCP.

The RT-N16 should get a WAN IP in the range 192.168.1.x

RT-N16 should also get the mask, probably 255.255.255.0 and the default gateway 192.168.1.252 and the DNS should point to 192.168.1.252 (or whatever the Zyxel is configured to give)

ping 192.168.1.252

ping 98.137.149.56

ping yahoo.com

If all works you a fine. If ping yahoo.com is not working you have a DNS problem.

If ping 98.137.149.56 does not work you have a routing problem and you cannot get the massage out to the Internet..

If ping 192.168.1.252 does not work the routing problem is in your router.

Martin

[naughtybadfurrimunki]

Hi guys,

Thanks for the replies.

Unfortunately I haven't had any success, but I will try your latest suggestions.

As I previously mentioned, I'm able to login to the Zyxel admin page because they didn't change the default password, I can see the LAN IP of the Zyxel but there's no information about what range of IP addresses the Zyxel DHCP server is assigning. However if I connect my PC directly to the Zyxel (bypassing the RT-N16) I can see my PC IP is 192.168.1.4 and the Zyxel IP is 192.168.1.1. The default gateway is set to the same as the Zyxel IP.

If I put the RT-N16 in ap mode and leave it's LAN IP to be assigned automatically I can't access it's admin page again because it's IP has changed and I can't repair the network connection in Win XP. Only option is to reset the RT-N16 to factory settings, reboot and start again. Also, still in ap mode, if I assign a static IP, anything other than 192.168.1.1 and 255.255.255.0 causes the same problem, but I can't use 192.168.1.1 as a static IP for the RT-N16 because the Zyxel is already using that address.

I also posted this problem on the Asus forum, and I've been told on there that it'll only work with the RT-N16 in ap mode, however I'm now beginning to think that this just isn't the case.

Don't believe in forums too much...

There is no point using AP mode. Use it as router instead.

Most if not all that I write here is just repetition of what others already has given you but I guess the more ways you see it written the closer to the solution you get...

You should setup the LAN side of the RT-N16 to use for example 192.168.2.1 and configure the DHCP server.

The DHCP server of the RT-N16 should be configured to give the following to the clients on your private network:

IP (give the range for example 192.168.2.10 - 192.168.2.20)

mask 255.255.255.0

default gateway 192.168.2.1

DNS server 192.168.2.1 (if RT-N16 is configured to work as a DNS server, if not try with 8.8.8.8 (google))

If any of these are missing, it will cause problems.

Remember the WAN of the RT-N16 is the LAN of the Zyxel.

Set the RT-N16 up to receive the WAN IP using DHCP.

The RT-N16 should get a WAN IP in the range 192.168.1.x

RT-N16 should also get the mask, probably 255.255.255.0 and the default gateway 192.168.1.252 and the DNS should point to 192.168.1.252 (or whatever the Zyxel is configured to give)

ping 192.168.1.252

ping 98.137.149.56

ping yahoo.com

If all works you a fine. If ping yahoo.com is not working you have a DNS problem.

If ping 98.137.149.56 does not work you have a routing problem and you cannot get the massage out to the Internet..

If ping 192.168.1.252 does not work the routing problem is in your router.

Martin

Hi Martin,

Many thanks for your assistance.

I've done everything as you've outlined. The RT-N16 is getting a dynamic WAN ip address from the Zyxel DHCP server. I can ping the RT-N16 LAN ip and the RT-N16 WAN ip successfully, but I can't ping the Zyxel's WAN ip address.

btw, this is what the RT-N16 says about the different modes of operation, the english is ambiguous to say the least:

In Router mode, we suppose you use RT-N16 to connect to LAN in your company. So, you can set up routing protocol to meet your requirement in office. Explaining with technical terms, router mode is, NAT is disabled, static routing protocol are allowed to set.

In Access Point mode, four LAN ports in the RT-N16 and other wireless devices are set up in the same local area network. The WAN related functions are not supported in this mode. In this mode, NAT is disabled and four LAN ports in the RT-N16 and other wireless devices are bridged together.

Is it worth having another go at getting it working in ap mode?

Edited June 27, 2010 by naughtybadfurrimunki

[welo]

I'm pretty sure that your setup should work either way, with the Asus router in 'standard' mode as well as in AP mode. The result will be different in terms of network topology - I guess for now you are just interested to get it to work any way, but later you should think about the pros and cons and make a decision.

Did some reading on the Asus, here is what I found out:

Gateway mode

The standard mode should be 'Gateway'. This is to connect the router to another network with NAT enabled (that means you will have your 'own' network starting with e.g. 192.168.2.x. Usually this mode is intended to connect to a ADSL modem.

In Home Gateway mode, the RT-N16 connects to the Internet via ADSL or cable modem, and clients in your network share the same IP to ISP.

In this mode, NAT is enabled and WAN connection is allowed using PPPoE, DHCP, or static IP. It also support UPnP and DDNS features that are useful for home users.

Your setup:

* set the Asus to Gateway mode (or Home Gateway?) and enable either DHCP OR static IP (e.g. 192.168.1.150). I recommend DHCP for a start.

* check the LAN configuration page and see which subnet the Asus is configured to 'create'. From your previous post I assume this is 192.168.2.x/255.255.255.0 . The LAN IP for Asus is most likely set to 192.168.2.1.

* Set your PC to static IP, e.g. 192.168.2.2/255.255.255.0, Gateway 192.168.2.1

* Restart your router and try to access the web interface from your PC.

* If this fails:

- make sure your PC has the correct IP assigned, 192.168.2.2 (ipconfig)

- ping the Asus: C:> ping 192.168.2.1

* If you can access the Asus web interface, see if it obtained a correct address from the Zyxel, e.g. 192.168.1.4

* Then try ping the Zyxel: C:> ping 192.168.1.1

What happens?

Router mode

In router mode there is no NAT, but I assume that you still create your own subnet (192.168.2.x). Maybe you could even share the Zyxel subnet.

I guess this mode requires static routes to be configured, not sure if there is any standard routes in this mode, and maybe this is the reason it didn't work for you.

In Router mode, we suppose you use RT-N16 to connect to LAN in your company. So, you can set up routing protocol to meet your requirement in office.

Explaining with technical terms, router mode is, NAT is disabled, static routing protocol are allowed to set.

AP mode

This mode should transparent and straight forward. Your PC, connected to one of the LAN ports, should be able to obtain a IP address from the Zyxel.

NAT and DHCP (server) are of course disabled in this mode!

Try the following: Before switching to AP mode, set the LAN configuration on the ASUS to static, and assign e.g. 192.168.1.150/255.255.255.0. Then switch. Hopefully the router will not reset the LAN configuration in this mode. Any IP clashes with the Zyxel (192.168.1.1) should be solved.

Also set your PC to static IP 192.168.1.151 (e.g.) in case it cannot obtain an IP via DHCP from the Zyxel.

Then try to ping/access 192.168.1.150 (the ASUS) and 192.168.1.1 (the Zyxel).

Reading your post I think you might have tried changing the IP of the ASUS before, but it wouldn't allow you to do that? I find that rather strange. There is no way the Zyxel can hinder you from setting static IPs on the Asus or on your PC, but you might run into IP clashes (same IP assigned to two different devices/PCs) or the Zyxel might not route your device/IP to the internet.

For all setups described here, you better verify that the IP addresses you assign are not assigned to another device. In your default setup (PC connected directly), just ping a view addresses, e.g. 192.168.1.150-155, and make sure there is no reply.

If you make the setup work with static IP addresses, you can later switch to DHCP step by step.

The ONLY reason I can think of why any of this setup will not work is

* a bug in the Asus software (or any weird non-standard behavior)

* The Zyxel (or another device in the setup) filtering by hardware address (MAC address). This is only allowing your PCs MAC address to be routed to the internet. Even then you can easily make the 'gateway' setup work, the Asus most likely supports setting its own MAC address to your PCs MAC address.

But considering that they didn't even change the default password on the Zyxel, I very much doubt that they implemented anything like this.

Running ipconfig and ping from the command line are essential tools in debugging network issues. Make sure you understand how to do this and what it means!

welo

[siamect]

Hi guys,

Thanks for the replies.

Unfortunately I haven't had any success, but I will try your latest suggestions.

As I previously mentioned, I'm able to login to the Zyxel admin page because they didn't change the default password, I can see the LAN IP of the Zyxel but there's no information about what range of IP addresses the Zyxel DHCP server is assigning. However if I connect my PC directly to the Zyxel (bypassing the RT-N16) I can see my PC IP is 192.168.1.4 and the Zyxel IP is 192.168.1.1. The default gateway is set to the same as the Zyxel IP.

If I put the RT-N16 in ap mode and leave it's LAN IP to be assigned automatically I can't access it's admin page again because it's IP has changed and I can't repair the network connection in Win XP. Only option is to reset the RT-N16 to factory settings, reboot and start again. Also, still in ap mode, if I assign a static IP, anything other than 192.168.1.1 and 255.255.255.0 causes the same problem, but I can't use 192.168.1.1 as a static IP for the RT-N16 because the Zyxel is already using that address.

I also posted this problem on the Asus forum, and I've been told on there that it'll only work with the RT-N16 in ap mode, however I'm now beginning to think that this just isn't the case.

Don't believe in forums too much...

There is no point using AP mode. Use it as router instead.

Most if not all that I write here is just repetition of what others already has given you but I guess the more ways you see it written the closer to the solution you get...

You should setup the LAN side of the RT-N16 to use for example 192.168.2.1 and configure the DHCP server.

The DHCP server of the RT-N16 should be configured to give the following to the clients on your private network:

IP (give the range for example 192.168.2.10 - 192.168.2.20)

mask 255.255.255.0

default gateway 192.168.2.1

DNS server 192.168.2.1 (if RT-N16 is configured to work as a DNS server, if not try with 8.8.8.8 (google))

If any of these are missing, it will cause problems.

Remember the WAN of the RT-N16 is the LAN of the Zyxel.

Set the RT-N16 up to receive the WAN IP using DHCP.

The RT-N16 should get a WAN IP in the range 192.168.1.x

RT-N16 should also get the mask, probably 255.255.255.0 and the default gateway 192.168.1.252 and the DNS should point to 192.168.1.252 (or whatever the Zyxel is configured to give)

ping 192.168.1.252

ping 98.137.149.56

ping yahoo.com

If all works you a fine. If ping yahoo.com is not working you have a DNS problem.

If ping 98.137.149.56 does not work you have a routing problem and you cannot get the massage out to the Internet..

If ping 192.168.1.252 does not work the routing problem is in your router.

Martin

Hi Martin,

Many thanks for your assistance.

I've done everything as you've outlined. The RT-N16 is getting a dynamic WAN ip address from the Zyxel DHCP server. I can ping the RT-N16 LAN ip and the RT-N16 WAN ip successfully, but I can't ping the Zyxel's WAN ip address.

btw, this is what the RT-N16 says about the different modes of operation, the english is ambiguous to say the least:

In Router mode, we suppose you use RT-N16 to connect to LAN in your company. So, you can set up routing protocol to meet your requirement in office. Explaining with technical terms, router mode is, NAT is disabled, static routing protocol are allowed to set.

In Access Point mode, four LAN ports in the RT-N16 and other wireless devices are set up in the same local area network. The WAN related functions are not supported in this mode. In this mode, NAT is disabled and four LAN ports in the RT-N16 and other wireless devices are bridged together.

Is it worth having another go at getting it working in ap mode?

No...

But you should enable NAT!

(I guess I confused router mode and gateway mode earlier, sorry, and thanks Welo for clarifying this)

It is quite common that you cannot ping the routers WAN address. It is like sending a message out and receiving it on the same port... Some routers support it and some don't...

Martin

Edited June 27, 2010 by siamect

[welo]

well, Martin,

you know, one reason for keeping the discussion in the forum instead of starting a private conversation is that

* others can benefit from the discussion as well (now or later, thanks to google and the forum search feature)

* no time wasted with work being duplicated because one doesn't know what another person has already written. It's not that writing a lengthy post and cross-checking facts on the internet, adding links and quotes etc is a matter of 5 minutes.

* others can cross-check what you write and correct your mistakes - I personally don't have any problem with others correcting me, on the contrary, I appreciate and encourage it.

Of course there are downsides of message boards as well, but I believe the pros outweigh them in most cases.

Thanks for the OP to keep me updated what's going on.

Don't believe in forums too much...

There is no point using AP mode. Use it as router instead.

Both are valid setups. There are pros and cons. In most home-user scenarios double NAT has no benefit at all, and only complicates things. I'm sure you know that.

I agree that in the OPs situation a proper NAT setup has advantages, and I actually advocate that solution as well. The major disadvantage will be port forwarding issues with P2P software.

welo

[naughtybadfurrimunki]

Your setup:

* set the Asus to Gateway mode (or Home Gateway?) and enable either DHCP OR static IP (e.g. 192.168.1.150). I recommend DHCP for a start.

* check the LAN configuration page and see which subnet the Asus is configured to 'create'. From your previous post I assume this is 192.168.2.x/255.255.255.0 . The LAN IP for Asus is most likely set to 192.168.2.1.

* Set your PC to static IP, e.g. 192.168.2.2/255.255.255.0, Gateway 192.168.2.1

* Restart your router and try to access the web interface from your PC.

* If this fails:

- make sure your PC has the correct IP assigned, 192.168.2.2 (ipconfig)

- ping the Asus: C:> ping 192.168.2.1

* If you can access the Asus web interface, see if it obtained a correct address from the Zyxel, e.g. 192.168.1.4

* Then try ping the Zyxel: C:> ping 192.168.1.1

What happens?

Hey Welo, many thanks for your help.

In gateway mode I can successfully ping the Asus on 192.168.2.1 and access the web interface. I can also ping the Zyxel on 192.168.1.1. I also tried pinging 8.8.8.8 and this worked too. However I can't ping yahoo.com.

Unfortunately I've got to go and get a haircut now... back later!

Edited June 27, 2010 by naughtybadfurrimunki

[siamect]

Both are valid setups. There are pros and cons. In most home-user scenarios double NAT has no benefit at all, and only complicates things. I'm sure you know that.

I agree that in the OPs situation a proper NAT setup has advantages, and I actually advocate that solution as well. The major disadvantage will be port forwarding issues with P2P software.

welo

True, both are valid setups but in this case he has one single IP that is given to him by the Zyxel.

If he doesn't use NAT he will need to have a reserved range (as a subnet within the 192.168.1.0/24 ) reserved for him.

Using NAT is beneficial because everything is closed if you take a look at it from the WAN side.

It allows you to be sloppy with the security of your client hosts.

This is causing the problems with port forwarding, but how often? I never had this problem, and you will have to deal with that problem anyway because of the Zyxel and that is outside the range of the authorization of the OP. (except in this case there seems to be no protection at all as the default password worked. the admin page is most likely open from the WAN as well, default setting in the Zyxel I guess)

Maybe we can help the him remotely... if he just give us the wan IP of the Zyxel. I have done it that way many times...

Martin

Edited June 27, 2010 by siamect

[welo]

Sounds great!

Just fix your DNS setting!

For a quick check set the DNS settings on your PC to 8.8.8.8. Then ping any domain name (yahoo.com, google.com, etc).

If it doesn't work, please post the output of the ping here.

If this works, you will have to fix your DNS server settings on the Asus router. If its WAN interface is set to DHCP this should have worked. If you have assigned a static IP on the WAN side then try switching to DHCP (recommended anyway).

Otherwise report back here to get instructions.

Siamect and me, we're both eager to help you

peace,

welo

[siamect]

Sounds great!

Just fix your DNS setting!

For a quick check set the DNS settings on your PC to 8.8.8.8. Then ping any domain name (yahoo.com, google.com, etc).

If it doesn't work, please post the output of the ping here.

If this works, you will have to fix your DNS server settings on the Asus router. If its WAN interface is set to DHCP this should have worked. If you have assigned a static IP on the WAN side then try switching to DHCP (recommended anyway).

Otherwise report back here to get instructions.

Siamect and me, we're both eager to help you

peace,

welo

Excellent!

[naughtybadfurrimunki]

Sounds great!

Just fix your DNS setting!

For a quick check set the DNS settings on your PC to 8.8.8.8. Then ping any domain name (yahoo.com, google.com, etc).

If it doesn't work, please post the output of the ping here.

If this works, you will have to fix your DNS server settings on the Asus router. If its WAN interface is set to DHCP this should have worked. If you have assigned a static IP on the WAN side then try switching to DHCP (recommended anyway).

Otherwise report back here to get instructions.

Siamect and me, we're both eager to help you

peace,

welo

Excellent!

Guys, many thanks. I've finally managed to get on the internet with it.

As per your instructions: RT-N16 in gateway mode, WAN set to auto ip, Zyxel DHCP server allocating WAN ip address.

RT-N16 LAN ip set manually 192.168.2.1 with same subnet as WAN, ie: 255.255.255.0.

PC getting ip of 192.168.2.2 by DHCP from RT-N16 DHCP server. PC DNS server set to 8.8.8.8.

Should I set the DNS server settings in the RT-N16 LAN DHCP settings to 8.8.8.8? Or should I set it to 192.168.1.1 so the Zyxel is the DNS server?

[welo]

True, both are valid setups but in this case he has one single IP that is given to him by the Zyxel.

If he doesn't use NAT he will need to have a reserved range (as a subnet within the 192.168.1.0/24 ) reserved for him.

Why? Each device can request its own IP from the Zyxel. I don't see any reason why the Zyxel should not assign IPs to other devices on the same subnet. Any Ethernet switch added is transparent (Asus in AP mode is basically acting as a switch), any device connected to the switch does not appear different to the Zyxel compared to any other device connected 'directly' e.g. PCs in other apartments. Possibly the outlet in the apartment is not directly connected to the Zyxel anyway, but to another switch - the point is, it doesn't matter.

Using NAT is beneficial because everything is closed if you take a look at it from the WAN side.

It allows you to be sloppy with the security of your client hosts.

I fully agree. This is the main benefit of using a NAT setup in this scenario IMHO.

This is causing the problems with port forwarding, but how often? I never had this problem, and you will have to deal with that problem anyway because of the Zyxel and that is outside the range of the authorization of the OP.

Well, there is not many scenarios where you'd need to setup a port forward (torrents anyone?) - not sure it will work if setting up a cascaded port forward, might or might not, I'd have to think about the inner workings of NAT, especially how the original IP is encoded into the packet. Too lazy...

If uPnp is enabled on the Zyxel then port forwarding will work with any uPnp-enabled P2P software (that is all popular torrent clients) ONLY IF NOT introducing a cascaded NAT. I'd be very surprised if uPnp will cascade from one router to the next.

(except in this case there seems to be no protection at all as the default password worked. the admin page is most likely open from the WAN as well, default setting in the Zyxel I guess)

My experience is the opposite. Yes, routers ship with default passwords, but for the very same reason access from the WAN side is disabled by default. Everything else would be a security nightmare.

But I don't setup routers on a daily basis, so my experience is limited.

Maybe we can help the him remotely... if he just give us the wan IP of the Zyxel. I have done it that way many times...
Martin

Hehe, just make sure you don't do any mistakes. Did you ever shut yourself out during a remote maintenance session? Strike!

Speedtouch modem/routers have a remote assistance feature that can easily be enabled and disabled by a standard user. Maybe the Zyxel has a similar feature.

welo

[naughtybadfurrimunki]

Guys,

I've been reading your comments about the merits of the various topographies. I stopped using p2p a long time ago because of not being able to set up port forwarding on the condo router.

Also it seems somebody's got wise, I tried logging in to the condo router again and now I'm unable to. I wonder how they know? Maybe someone's been trying to get in from the WAN side because yours truly was stupid enough to post the WAN ip further back in this thread!

[siamect]

Why? Each device can request its own IP from the Zyxel. I don't see any reason why the Zyxel should not assign IPs to other devices on the same subnet. Any Ethernet switch added is transparent (Asus in AP mode is basically acting as a switch), any device connected to the switch does not appear different to the Zyxel compared to any other device connected 'directly' e.g. PCs in other apartments. Possibly the outlet in the apartment is not directly connected to the Zyxel anyway, but to another switch - the point is, it doesn't matter.

you are right about that but that means the money on a router is wasted... if it wasn't for the Wifi you would do it with a 400 baht hub instead...

It's more like getting the most value for the already spent money that rules...

My experience is the opposite. Yes, routers ship with default passwords, but for the very same reason access from the WAN side is disabled by default. Everything else would be a security nightmare.

But I don't setup routers on a daily basis, so my experience is limited.

Hehe, just make sure you don't do any mistakes. Did you ever shut yourself out during a remote maintenance session? Strike!

I'm using dynamic DNS to get into my server from outside. When my ip changes, usually someone else get the same ip. It takes about 15-20 minutes before the new DNS records are updated. During this time I end up on other peoples routers when I try to reach http://home.siamect.com. In the majority of cases I have been able to get in from the WAN side with the default password. It is usually Zyxel that are configured this way. True is the company doing it like this on a regular basis.

And have I locked myself out?.... yes it has happened...

Martin

Edited June 27, 2010 by siamect

[siamect]

Also it seems somebody's got wise, I tried logging in to the condo router again and now I'm unable to. I wonder how they know? Maybe someone's been trying to get in from the WAN side because yours truly was stupid enough to post the WAN ip further back in this thread!

Maybe an old session of yours or someone else is still there stopping you from logging in again.

Should I set the DNS server settings in the RT-N16 LAN DHCP settings to 8.8.8.8? Or should I set it to 192.168.1.1 so the Zyxel is the DNS server?

This is a matter of religion... test and see what is the fastest for you.

Martin