Tourists Warned Not To Feed Bangkok's Street Elephants

[ramsesxix]

People...and tourists...luv elephants. Now we can get a 10000baht fine for helping keep them alive. That sucks!

if you really love elephants u should do your part to protect them and ensure that they can live where they belong to.

There are parks in Thailand where they can live in a naturally perfect environment and not on streets where they suffer from many diseases, often treated badly.

Information is all: elephants back to nature

I 100% agree with you, the elephants belong in their natural habitat. Keeping them in the city is helping to kill them, not helping to keep them alive.

Unless there is a plan to immediately expropriate the elephant there and then, put it on a truck and move it to one of these parks, how does fining a tourist 10k solve anything?

The offence is from the mahout, not the tourist, and I can't wait for someone to challenge this stupid law on the basis of entrapment.

The mahouts are being fined as well, so that would be 20,000 baht per offense(10,000 from the 'tourist' and 10,000 from the mahout), which I think would be enough to offset the transport fees involved in getting an elephant to a park or reserve where they can be treated humanely.

I doubt the BiB will be pocketing much money. This is an offense that you should get a citation for, and settle at a later date. Do you actually think a tourist would just fork over 10,000 baht???? Of course there is likely to be cases of tourists talking their way out of citations by bribing officers with a few hundred baht. If that is the case, then so be it. TIT, as not much has been done to stop corruption at any level of the police farce.

As for entrapment, lest a copper dress up as a mahout, and entices a tourist to feed an elephant and the does the 'gotcha' and demands 10,000, there is no case to be made for entrapment.

At the end of the day, there will be few citations handed out, and probably even fewer mahouts that get nicked, however, there will also be fewer elephants on the streets of Bangkok - and that is a step in the right direction.

For what it is worth, I've lived in Thailand for the past 5 years, and the overwhelming majority of elephants that I have seen being fed are being fed by Thais. The Thai will 'pity' the elephant, and shell out the 40 baht for the sugar cane and go away feeling as if they have done good by feeding the elephant. My overriding concern here is that laws like this will simply cause a shift in where the mahouts and elephants are - as they will go to less densely populated areas (upcountry) where police are even less likely to give a rip.

Edited July 13, 2010 by ramsesxix

[pattayabuggy]

I would like to say this about it.

Some people are quick to comment.. "This is Thailand" when in dismay at some of the problems encountered here.

Some people aren't so ready to notice the steps being taken in Thailand to have some kind of 'normalcy' in 'global' terms.

This is a great win.  One of many.  There will to continue to be more wins great and small while Thailand climbs from the grips of corruption, and political, economic and social growing pains.

Small wins deserve great praise in my view.

Meanwhile, Thailand goes on doing great things in science, sport, government, industry, in schools, at home, in the farms and on the streets.

Shall we look at the clouds, or the sky?

I always look forward to seeing more positive Thai benchmarks, contributing to modern, realistic, successful and culturally proud foundations for this great nation.

They're not hard to find if you look.  Easier still if we digest less of the negative 'media and rant' pie.

Thumbs up on this one.

Cheers.

This is sarcasm, surely, c'mon it must be.

[kuffki]

I would like to say this about it.

Some people are quick to comment.. "This is Thailand" when in dismay at some of the problems encountered here.

Some people aren't so ready to notice the steps being taken in Thailand to have some kind of 'normalcy' in 'global' terms.

This is a great win. One of many. There will to continue to be more wins great and small while Thailand climbs from the grips of corruption, and political, economic and social growing pains.

Small wins deserve great praise in my view.

Meanwhile, Thailand goes on doing great things in science, sport, government, industry, in schools, at home, in the farms and on the streets.

Shall we look at the clouds, or the sky?

I always look forward to seeing more positive Thai benchmarks, contributing to modern, realistic, successful and culturally proud foundations for this great nation.

They're not hard to find if you look. Easier still if we digest less of the negative 'media and rant' pie.

Thumbs up on this one.

Cheers.

This is sarcasm, surely, c'mon it must be.

Nah, just a wishful positive thinking

[KK-Mike]

10k baht penalty for the tourist? Are elephants banned from the city? I can already hear the upcoming howls of protest from tourists getting clipped.

TheWalkingMan

I wonder if this 10,000 baht fine is only for tourist? What about Thais feeding the

elephants? Probably another way the Thai government has of saying "we do not like tourist"

kk-mike

[OBLEDUT]

People...and tourists...luv elephants. Now we can get a 10000baht fine for helping keep them alive. That sucks!

So you think Bankok city is the right environment for the elephants?

[infernalman7]

It's Thai Visa after all. Any police actions = scams.

Edited July 13, 2010 by infernalman7

[Fishman1967]

I go to Mahachai often in Samut Sakhon. The elephants cause havoc in the evenings as they stroll down the main roads near the food stalls causing traffic to back up and making motor bikes dodge even more throughout traffic. A few months ago I saw a pick-up hit an elephant (bumped actually) and the elephant went into a sort or defensive rage. It could have been a lot worse and I am certain that in the past it has happened. Elephants don't belong on these streets now. It's honestly cruel to walk an animal of this size in places that just don't allow safety or comfort for the animal and people.

[infernalman7]

10k baht penalty for the tourist? Are elephants banned from the city? I can already hear the upcoming howls of protest from tourists getting clipped.

TheWalkingMan

I wonder if this 10,000 baht fine is only for tourist? What about Thais feeding the

elephants? Probably another way the Thai government has of saying "we do not like tourist"

kk-mike

Err.. Thais have always been bounded by this law.

[pattayabuggy]

It's Thai Visa after all. Any police actions = scams.

Sure, the biggest organized crime unit in Thailand, is the police. 

[zappalot]

THis thread is still overlooking the fact that these elephants have NOWHERE TO GO - so fine or no fine they will end up back on a street somewhere.

read all the thread and its links and u will find out that there are some places where they can go.

its not true that they have to beg and suffer on the street!!!!!!!!!!!!

so nothing is being overlocked when it comes to get them out of the city.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!stop spreading the stupid and untrue argument that there is no place where they can be send to!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ramsesxix]

10k baht penalty for the tourist? Are elephants banned from the city? I can already hear the upcoming howls of protest from tourists getting clipped.

TheWalkingMan

I wonder if this 10,000 baht fine is only for tourist? What about Thais feeding the

elephants? Probably another way the Thai government has of saying "we do not like tourist"

kk-mike

ummm... the article says that messages will be broadcast on local Thai tv, and unless there is a large number of Thai speaking foreign tourists, then I would well imagine that the messages are aimed at Thais who feed the elephants.

Only for the tourist? NO ... for the Mahout and anyone (Thai, farang, or otherwise) feeding the animal. Granted the story was very poorly written, but it is obvious that all parties involved are culpable - and this is true with all crimes, not just feeding elephants.

Edited July 13, 2010 by ramsesxix

[Indra]

PPS. Tourists do not walk around looking at the signs

Are you farang?

If yes, then you should know that there are signs in Europe and foreign tourists are supposed to comply.

In Jakarta, I use to walking across the street even if there is no zebra cross nor traffic light, may I argue a London (please change "London" to any capital city of your country) policeman, who catch me walking across the street?

Edited July 13, 2010 by Indra

[ukrules]

<br>Are you farang?<br>If yes, then you should know that there are signs in Europe and foreign tourists are supposed to comply.<br>In Jakarta, I use to walking across the street even if there is no zebra cross nor traffic light, may I argue a London (please change "London" to any capital city of your country) policeman, who catch me walking across the street?<br>

It's not illegal to walk across the street in London, we do it all the time, we are still allowed to think for ouselves for some things.

[jackr]

anybody with half a brain knows that elephants don't belong in cities...and feeding them bananas and sugar cane doesn't really help to keep these mammals alive.

Yes yes, but why take it out on your average tourist?

Why cant they just arrest the people that are bringing out the BIG FAT HUGE ELEPHANT, which cant be missed, instead of targeting uninformed tourists.

--

zappalot; get your head straight and think a bit. No-one wants to see elephants on the street being treated like this, but why should the buck stop at the tourist, It's akin to banging up the curb-crawler because he's perceived responsible for the lady being on the street in the first place.

[wcoast]

I was in Chiang Mai during Songkran and saw a young elephant being paraded around with the mahout and helper selling bags of nuts, it was really sad.

The young pachyderm was bleating a sad cry and it was heart wrenching to hear and watch. Many tourists with a conscience were upset at the exploitation and knowing the social family life of an elephant made it even more heartbreaking.

[moe666]

Why are you guys getting so worked up over a Thai problem let the Thais take care of it. Thailand for Thais.

Elephants are wild animals no matter how long in captivity if you are dumb enough to get close enough to one to feed it you deserve a 10,000baht fine.

[jackr]

Are you farang?

If yes, then you should know that there are signs in Europe and foreign tourists are supposed to comply.

In Jakarta, I use to walking across the street even if there is no zebra cross nor traffic light, may I argue a London (please change "London" to any capital city of your country) policeman, who catch me walking across the street?

... and what are you?

&lt;deleted&gt; have signs depicting where one should walk elsewhere in the world got to do with being shaken down for feeding a freaking elephant on the streets of Muang Thai?

[Indra]

<br>Are you farang?<br>If yes, then you should know that there are signs in Europe and foreign tourists are supposed to comply.<br>In Jakarta, I use to walking across the street even if there is no zebra cross nor traffic light, may I argue a London (please change "London" to any capital city of your country) policeman, who catch me walking across the street?<br>

It's not illegal to walk across the street in London, we do it all the time, we are still allowed to think for ouselves for some things.

Well, then let's change to something else LOL

My point is "Some countries have restrictions, like or not we have to comply if we want to visit/stay that country"

[DickFarang]

“Activists warn that car fumes and narrow streets often leave the elephants with eye calluses and tuberculosis and make them vulnerable to leg injuries.”

Unhealthy for elephants but OK for people ?!

[witold]

Love elephants or not, anybody with half a brain knows that elephants don't belong in cities...and feeding them bananas and sugar cane doesn't really help to keep these mammals alive. Anybody who really wants to help should donate money to one of the various funds for elephants or directly to the elephant farms/villages (or whatever they're called). 

There's one youngish elephant that is paraded around Hua Hin every evening. It disgusts me to see these idiots (tourists and locals alike) feeding them.

Elephants are a relic of the past.  They no longer serve a purpose other than entertainment for people.  If people didn't visit the camps and pay to feed them on the street, you can be pretty sure they would all die out or be killed for meat or something.  

While walking from bar to bar each evening is probably not the perfect lazy life for elephants, it's couldn't possibly be that horrible.  

And ultimately, this is one of the things that makes BKK/LOS unique.  It's kinda cool.  I don't want BKK to become the sanitized perfect city like Singapore.

[chantorn]

Farangs are rich enough to pay 10K.

That's just small change to them.

Edited July 13, 2010 by chantorn

[JetsetBkk]

Elephants are a relic of the past. <snip>

Nonsense. Get out of the tourists areas and you will discover that in many parts of Thailand there are working elephants that are well fed and cared for by their mahout.

[JetsetBkk]

<snip>

Meanwhile, Thailand goes on doing great things in science, sport, government, industry, in schools, at home, in the farms and on the streets.

<snip>

I always look forward to seeing more positive Thai benchmarks, contributing to modern, realistic, successful and culturally proud foundations for this great nation.

<snip>

Well, you certainly chose the right username didn't you?

So, come on, who put you up to it?

[JetsetBkk]

So can I bring food from home and feed to the elephants?

Sorry, 10,020 baht as you didn't pay for the bread or bananas.

[JetsetBkk]

Yes, i agree 100%. The cop who dont take action is to be fined as well. at least in serious cases.

<snip>

Can you please define what is a serious case (of not spotting an elephant) and what is a less than serious case.

If it was just a baby elephant, would that be less serious than if it was, say, 8 feet tall? Because, you know, policemen can't spot every little baby elephant that rushes past them.

Come on, zappalot, time to go to bed and let your dad have a go on his computer.

But congratulations on discovering how to say "pineapple" in Thai. More school tomorrow, eh?

[-jr-]

This sign is in Florence, "In Italy purchases of counterfeited goods are punished by law with sanctions up to 10,000 euro." Note that at that time I was there (2006), I haven't seen this sign in any other cities in Italy.

Using excuses from some people here, it would go:

- How dare them to fine a tourist who bought counterfeit goods up to 10000 euro.

- Don't they know that most tourist doesn't read sign, or read about the local law in the place they're going

- Bi<?> (I forgot color of Italian police uniform) must be desperate for money. They just used it to extort more money from tourist

- Tourists love counterfeit products, this will damage tourism

- Police should ban those sellers from bringing counterfeit products to the city, not fining the people who buy them

- Lawmakers who approved this law are morons

How could being ignorant is acceptable when you're a tourist?

One of the reason why police didn't do anything about it before was because moving elephant is not an trivial job. Most just pretended they didn't see it. Now they'll have to be active about it because it's their job to fine and catch the mahout and discourage people from supporting the mahout this way. There is also an organization that provides truck and specialist to transport elephants out of the city if needed, e.g. mahout is jailed or ran away and the elephant is left on the street.

The police may have a problem at night anyway. I don't think the elephant transporter would work at night. So, if they caught the mahout, what could they do? They couldn't jail the mahout because nobody else would be able to take care of the elephant. I don't think that they will waste their time following the mahout just to see where the mahout will stay during the daytime for later arrest.

Let's hope that they'll put enough sign to inform tourists not to feed the elephant in the city and to call the 1555. They already put enough info in Thai media, so Thais are quite well-informed about this.

If there is no sign warning incoming tourists about this new regulation in Bangkok airport, you can inform tourist information center next time you land. Or write to airport authority. It's better take action by yourself rather than just complaining. They should put English signs in the tourist area in the city as well, but I don't think they'll. Sorry about that.

Edited July 13, 2010 by -jr-

[debbiev]

People...and tourists...luv elephants. Now we can get a 10000baht fine for helping keep them alive. That sucks!

Yes, people love elephants, but do you really believe that bananas and sugar cane keep them alive? Seriously? I think that if people love elephants, they shouldn't want to see them in the city and living in conditions that are inhumane.

[alstaxi]

<BR>Yeah... a very very VERY serious problem for the whole Thailand these days....Nothing better to do, BiBs???<BR>

<BR><BR>You took the words right out of my mouth, I guess it is easier for the bib to find a tourist with 10k than it is for them to find an ELEPHANT?????? &lt;deleted&gt;.<BR>

[OldgitTom]

In nature, elephants roam long distances. Putting them in 'reserves' is no substitute. The poor creatures we see in Thai towns are the last remnants of these magnificent, intelligent creatures. Give them food, & don't grudge the poor people who also eke out a living by them. They are both doomed species. Compassion is the Lord Buddha's message. F---k the 'authorities', & 'the law'. OGT

[thebrock]

My first time posting on this so I hope it works? I just wanted to say that when reading the statement about feeding the elephants, I read that it is the mahouts that get fined the 10000 Baht not the tourist, that would be a nonsence and not like Thailand at all????????

quote name='BSJ' date='2010-07-13 16:55' timestamp='1279011317' post='3746577']

People...and tourists...luv elephants. Now we can get a 10000baht fine for helping keep them alive. That sucks!