Bungfai Rockets, Lanterns Endanger Planes, Says Thai Ministry

[webfact]

Bungfai rockets, lanterns endanger planes, says Ministry

By The Nation

The Transport Ministry will notify provincial governors about the danger to aviation of "bungfai" makeshift rockets and floating lanterns, and will work with the Interior Ministry for stricter control of them, Transport Minister Sopon Zarum said yesterday.

Following a meeting with related agencies, Sopon said regulations to be drawn up would set time limits for bungfai lighting and might include requirements for permission to light and launch bungfai.

"Domestic and international airlines have told the ministry that some bungfai rockets could reach the aviation route height level and could harm planes. They have urged measures to prevent accidents and keep aviation 100 per cent safe," he said.

Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning director Soitip Traisuth said that 3,090 bungfai rockets were launched in Buri Ram in 2009, followed by 590 in Amnat Charoen and 389 in Nakhon Ratchasima.

From October 15 to November 15, 2009 Chiang Mai had the largest number of floating lanterns- 793 - falling in aviation zones, followed by Lampang's 241 lanterns and Phrae's 130.

Soitip said bungfai rockets were now developed to fly faster and last longer in the air. A bungfai-powered rocket with 300-1,200 kilograms of explosive powder could reach the aviation route height level of 20,000-30,000 feet, putting low-flying small planes at risk, she said.

-- The Nation 2010-07-21

[siampolee]

Upon my soul,this gets aired every year. To date if my memory serves me correct there has not been one incident of any aircraft being put into a dangerous situation .

I assure you being on the ground at the ''Bang Fai'' event is a dammed sight more fun and indeed hazardous that actually being up aloft in the sky.

Surprising how a old 64 year old like me can outpace the average teenager at the Bang Fai festival when a projectile declares war on the people on the ground who made it loved abused then launched it

[sungod]

I'm no expert, but;

'A bungfai-powered rocket with 300-1,200 kilograms of explosive powder could reach the aviation route height level of 20,000-30,000 feet, putting low-flying small planes at risk.'

I would have thought 300-1,200 kg of explosive in a rocket seems quite a lot to me, thought it would put it into orbit. Also how many low flying small planes have you seen out the window of an airliner at 30,000 feet.

[siampolee]

Sungod.

I am of the opinion that a Bang Fai projectile filled with some 1200 kilos of propellant i.e. explosives would if it did get off the ground indeed be a wondeful cure for the constipation you never knew you had when said projectile did a U turn to return to launch base.

The aerodynamics of the projectiles I have experienced indeed leave much to be desired along with the strength of said projectile too.

Certainly the Bang Fai event is well worth a look .

[Portlandstone]

I've watched the "bonfai rockets" being lit, all the ones I saw couldn't even get up to a helicopter. What, are they using advanced ones now?

[dom samui]

Also how many low flying small planes have you seen out the window of an airliner at 30,000 feet.

Too many, too many ! You know, the papers ones ! Which thai children at school are wellknown for.

[hyperdimension]

I've watched the "bonfai rockets" being lit, all the ones I saw couldn't even get up to a helicopter. What, are they using advanced ones now?

Ones with "300-1,200 kilograms of explosive powder", I guess... probably developed by UDD militants/activists/protesters for civil war. Edited July 21, 2010 by hyperdimension

[Robby nz]

The big ones at Yasothon go right out of sight.

the festival there is a great show well worth seeing.

[sungod]

I 'm sure the Bung Fai event, rockets with 1,200kg of propellant would be quite a blast!

And that woman quoted is a director of a government department? Shame on the Nation also for printing such crap without checking first.

[geriatrickid]

These objects are a fire hazard in some parts. The stupid lanterns they launch on Phuket are covered in plastic, and usually have metal frames sprayed with leaded paint. They often land in the sea. Think about it. I remember when the lanterrns were bamboo and rice paper. After awhile, they'd fall apart in the ocean.

If any of you have flown into Phuket at night, you can see the lanterns floating out over Patong bay. Usually the wind blows them away from the airport, sometimes it doesn't.

[sparedolphin]

"..........To date if my memory serves me correct there has not been one incident of any aircraft being put into a dangerous situation .

I assure you being on the ground at the ''Bang Fai'' event is a dammed sight more fun and indeed hazardous that actually being up aloft in the sky................"

It may well be very dangerous on the ground, as many people who have had to go to hospital can verify.

Maybe the first incident of a Bungfai rocket hitting an aeroplane is waiting for your flight.

"...............Also how many low flying small planes have you seen out the window of an airliner at 30,000 feet..........."

The concern is not for those aircraft flying at 30,000 feet that the rockets would hopefully just glance off anyway if they didn't get sucked into an engine, but for those small aircraft below at 5,000 or 10,000 feet flying at a level at which the rocket being able to reach thirty thousand feet, would potentially be able to do a lot of damage to.

But then, although regulations are needed, what law here is enforced anyway in a uniform manner ?

And if it is, who investigates the instances where local government officials and police have not enforced the law but have given the 'go-ahead' nod in return for some gratuity ?

[markinoc]

<br>Upon my soul,this gets aired every year. To date if my memory serves me correct there has not been one incident of any aircraft being put into a dangerous situation .<br><br>I assure you being on the ground at the ''Bang Fai'' event is a dammed sight more fun and indeed hazardous that actually being up aloft in the sky.<br><br>Surprising how a old 64 year old like me can outpace the average teenager at the Bang Fai festival when a projectile declares war on the people on the ground who made it loved abused then launched it <br>

<br><br><div>Gosh, that is so true!   But, we lovem!  Can't live with them, can't live with out them.  <img src="http://static.thaivisa.com/forum/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" alt="" class="bbc_emoticon"><br><br>

</div>

[Igor]

I was a private pilot. It's a simple matter for the aviation administration to restrict certain areas during festival times. And it's not uncommon for commercial traffic to rerouted around certain areas at times. You can land at either end of the runway, you know.

I am a bit surprised the rockets have that much fuel, though. I wonder if that's a misprint. Still, I'm with the posters who believe the ground is likely more dangerous than the airspace 10,000 meters up.

[TheBarbarian]

How ironic. ever seen Thai Airways commercials?

[Garry]

I've watched the "bonfai rockets" being lit, all the ones I saw couldn't even get up to a helicopter. What, are they using advanced ones now?

Come up to Chiang Rai, I've seen them and have video of Bungfai rockets (still made out of bamboo) with shaped nose cones (using rural mans' aerodynamics skills), reaching dizzying heights on clear and overcast days and go for miles.

Yes I have also seen them go up 50' then drop and chase the crowd as well.

I've never been around when they are packing the charge or close to when they are lighting the rockets. I never ever what to be that close for that matter, as I have this self-preservation thing installed in me :jap:

[siampolee]

[/url]

sparedolphin

And if it is, who investigates the instances where local government officials and police have not enforced the law but have given the 'go-ahead' nod in return for some gratuity ?

Well after some twenty years here I still don't know or really care who, what ,when , why , how.

[Garry]

I was a private pilot. It's a simple matter for the aviation administration to restrict certain areas during festival times. And it's not uncommon for commercial traffic to rerouted around certain areas at times. You can land at either end of the runway, you know.

I am a bit surprised the rockets have that much fuel, though. I wonder if that's a misprint. Still, I'm with the posters who believe the ground is likely more dangerous than the airspace 10,000 meters up.

I have heard of the big charge rockets, but all the ones I have ever witnessed probably hold no more than 2-3 kilograms of charge powder. imagine a bamboo tube about 2 feet long, 3-4 inches wide (no idea what the inside looks like) attached to a 6 foot pole (some poles are aluminum, some bamboo). They are still powerfull enough for farm-boy altitude records. I've been told that the big rockets are over in Issan but like I said I have never witnessed one being launched. :jap:

Edited July 21, 2010 by Garry

[tig28]

Dont know about 1,200 Kg --- but they do get pretty big. They can get much larger than these.

[sungod]

"...............Also how many low flying small planes have you seen out the window of an airliner at 30,000 feet..........."

The concern is not for those aircraft flying at 30,000 feet that the rockets would hopefully just glance off anyway if they didn't get sucked into an engine, but for those small aircraft below at 5,000 or 10,000 feet flying at a level at which the rocket being able to reach thirty thousand feet, would potentially be able to do a lot of damage to.

Not disputing that mate,I was more into emphasizing how many light aircraft you see at 30,000 feet due to the context it is wrote in.

[sunanta]

I'm no expert, but;

'A bungfai-powered rocket with 300-1,200 kilograms of explosive powder could reach the aviation route height level of 20,000-30,000 feet, putting low-flying small planes at risk.'

I would have thought 300-1,200 kg of explosive in a rocket seems quite a lot to me, thought it would put it into orbit. Also how many low flying small planes have you seen out the window of an airliner at 30,000 feet.

yes this must be a typo....had to laugh out loud when i read this....this much powder in america will get you a free ride on the water board, and a new address forever at a hotel called GITMO.........................LOL

[sunanta]

I'm no expert, but;

'A bungfai-powered rocket with 300-1,200 kilograms of explosive powder could reach the aviation route height level of 20,000-30,000 feet, putting low-flying small planes at risk.'

I would have thought 300-1,200 kg of explosive in a rocket seems quite a lot to me, thought it would put it into orbit. Also how many low flying small planes have you seen out the window of an airliner at 30,000 feet.

yes this must be a typo....had to laugh out loud when i read this....this much powder in america will get you a free ride on the water board, and a new address forever at a hotel called GITMO.........................LOL

oh yea, 10 years here an ive not seen 1 piper cub or cesna... but i do see the odd f-16

[tig28]

I've watched the "bonfai rockets" being lit, all the ones I saw couldn't even get up to a helicopter. What, are they using advanced ones now?

Come up to Chiang Rai, I've seen them and have video of Bungfai rockets (still made out of bamboo) with shaped nose cones (using rural mans' aerodynamics skills), reaching dizzying heights on clear and overcast days and go for miles.

Yes I have also seen them go up 50' then drop and chase the crowd as well.

I've never been around when they are packing the charge or close to when they are lighting the rockets. I never ever what to be that close for that matter, as I have this self-preservation thing installed in me :jap:

Well... this is one of the smaller rockets --- its going up a long way (pic 1)

Now in pic 2 they are packing the final fuse stage (to suit climatic conditions) to one of these small rockets. I took 2 shots --then noticed what was in the hand of the guy with the hat-- he was the chief designer and launch controller who sniffed the stuff being packed in the fuse - to control quality. I decamped swiftly.

[souvenirdeparis]

my first time in T , I looked at the nightly sky bewildered by the giant constellations of orange stars that could be seen in this part of the world ; then I saw lots of lanterns and love them ( worry about setting fire to roofs though) . But I had never heard of the rockets before this article ! I want to see them someday !

I am dubious about this " 1,200 kg" bit ; in my country this just means " one kg and 200 grams" , we never know how to translate "1,200" and "1.200" from English and I don't even know whether Brits and Americans use the same system. 1thousand and 200kg of powder sounds like a scud to me .

Edited July 21, 2010 by souvenirdeparis

[Garry]

my first time in T , I looked at the nightly sky bewildered by the giant constellations of orange stars that could be seen in this part of the world ; then I saw lots of lanterns and love them ( worry about setting fire to roofs though) . But I had never heard of the rockets before this article ! I want to see them someday !

I am dubious about this " 1,200 kg" bit ; in my country this just means " one kg and 200 grams" , we never know how to translate "1,200" and "1.200" from English and I don't even know whether Brits and Americans use the same system. 1thousand and 200kg of powder sounds like a scud to me .

Read the previous posts and take heed mate. There are big rockets. There is a photo above showing one of the bigger ones on its launch platform. They are heavy and have big loads, fact.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Garry

[tig28]

my first time in T , I looked at the nightly sky bewildered by the giant constellations of orange stars that could be seen in this part of the world ; then I saw lots of lanterns and love them ( worry about setting fire to roofs though) . But I had never heard of the rockets before this article ! I want to see them someday !

I am dubious about this " 1,200 kg" bit ; in my country this just means " one kg and 200 grams" , we never know how to translate "1,200" and "1.200" from English and I don't even know whether Brits and Americans use the same system. 1thousand and 200kg of powder sounds like a scud to me .

I know how you feel-- years ago working in Bkk I heard about these rocket events -- & having little else to do at the time I flew up to Ubon to see them in action. I was amazed.

I attach one more pic of these mid sized rockets. Vast amounts of money are wagered throughout the day. And i do mean vast. There are official regulations re size etc. This rocket is 30 cm in diameter

.

The really large ones are 60 cm. ---- and almost double that length. I really doubt 1,200 Kg. but they certainly contain many hundreds of Kg. of explosive powder...who knows??

[blakegeee]

my first time in T , I looked at the nightly sky bewildered by the giant constellations of orange stars that could be seen in this part of the world ; then I saw lots of lanterns and love them ( worry about setting fire to roofs though) . But I had never heard of the rockets before this article ! I want to see them someday !

I am dubious about this " 1,200 kg" bit ; in my country this just means " one kg and 200 grams" , we never know how to translate "1,200" and "1.200" from English and I don't even know whether Brits and Americans use the same system. 1thousand and 200kg of powder sounds like a scud to me .

That is a good point, BUT the article wasn't written in french. In any case, obviously it is not 1200kg, but is a mistake that is so typical in these papers.

[Igor]

I am dubious about this " 1,200 kg" bit ; in my country this just means " one kg and 200 grams" , we never know how to translate "1,200" and "1.200" from English and I don't even know whether Brits and Americans use the same system. 1thousand and 200kg of powder sounds like a scud to me .

I wondered about that, too. But reread the article and it's pretty clear they were using 1,200 as one thousand two hundred.

In one place they say: "3,090 bungfai rockets were launched..." I doubt that means 3 and 9/100ths rockets went aloft.

Then they sepcify the amount as, "...300-1,200 kilograms of explosive powder..." Assuming they don't change numbering systems in the middle of an article then they are talking about large amounts of fuel.

Again, I wonder if they got the amounts right. If correct, I can't believe they are sending very many of this size into the sky. Or it could be the Thailand Space program. Any of these rockets manned?

[rreddin]

my first time in T , I looked at the nightly sky bewildered by the giant constellations of orange stars that could be seen in this part of the world ; then I saw lots of lanterns and love them ( worry about setting fire to roofs though) . But I had never heard of the rockets before this article ! I want to see them someday !

I am dubious about this " 1,200 kg" bit ; in my country this just means " one kg and 200 grams" , we never know how to translate "1,200" and "1.200" from English and I don't even know whether Brits and Americans use the same system. 1thousand and 200kg of powder sounds like a scud to me .

Read the previous posts and take heed mate. There are big rockets. There is a photo above showing one of the bigger ones on its launch platform. They are heavy and have big loads, fact.

Spot on! I have seen a few of these big beasts being launched. They are 18 to 20 metres tall and pack 1000kg of powder. Surprisingly, these monsters do not go as high as the smaller 2kg rockets - probably due to the weight of the tree trunk the propellant container is fastened to. They also come down faster than the small rockets.

[Sel]

This is a 120kg rocket

Its 8inch diameter pipe and about 12ft long.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Sel

[ballpoint]

Regular bung fai festivals are held along the Moon River, where it forms the border between Surin and Yasothon. You usually get a few 500 kg rockets at these, but the 1000+ kg ones are fairly rare. They do exist though, and it's quite an experience seeing, and hearing, one launched.

That is a good point, BUT the article wasn't written in french. In any case, obviously it is not 1200kg, but is a mistake that is so typical in these papers.

It is quite interesting to see all the posts doubting these numbers, even going to the lengths of ridiculing the newspaper because it has printed them. Makes you wonder about many of the other claims made on TV that people swear are true or false depending on their personal opinion and not actual knowledge.

Edited July 21, 2010 by ballpoint