It'S Only 10 Baht More

[iainiain101]

If you go into one of the bars where local expats get discounts do you refuse the discount and want to pay the full menu price?

[Beetlejuice]

Good observations and comments. By the way, being able to speak and read Thai--at least to some extent--for better than 15 years now, I would always order in Thai. I will try to find another, maybe even better place to spend my money. All part of the adventure.

if youve been really here 15 years your a slow learner. you liked the food the cook and the price but now you wont go there. thats daft. fact.

I don`t think that is daft.

This has happened to me several times including in some of the well known places.

I never complain or say anything, once I find out that I am being treated like a pratt, I pay up and then I`m done, never to return. Plenty of other places to go and eat.

[Jingthing]

I understand that it might upset you and I probably would have said something. However, I'm sort of the opposite. There are two Thai cafes that I dine at frequently. Very few farangs go there. I always have paid 40 baht for the same meal that the Thais pay 30 baht for. I also know the same meal in town costs 50 to 60 baht. But, I willingly pay more than I need to and more than the menu says. It has had an odd spin off. I get a big bowl of consume soup with my meal when others get a small bowl. And, I get a huge helping that is at least half again as much as others receive. If I order a Thai omellet I get 3 eggs instead of the usual 2.

Don't you realize that are getting the large size portion and price without asking for it? Anybody, foreign or Thai, could get that same thing for the same price. At just about ANY casual Thai restaurant, you can ask for a large portion and they will increase the price and give you more food. That place is being fair to you, treating you exactly as a Thai who paid what you are paying.

[ozzieovaseas]

Like another poster said, you like(d) the place, the food was good and cook was cheerful and friendly..(well..now we know why she was so friendly).

BUT:

What about the cost of her having to print up the farang menu?..thais dont do anything for nothing you know..and she has to recover her costs in serving the farang extra 2 baht worth of soup..

AND what about all that trouble of having to smile and be cheerful when all along she might have supsected you could be a bit of a farang kee-niow

Now that you have opened your mouth and boycotted her fine services for the sake of a lousy 10 baht, you have remooved all doubt (in her mind anyway) that you are indeed the same same kee-niow she expected

....joking

Seriously though, i do know what your talking about..Thai business people do seem to have a VERY simple business model that goes beyond our thinking..there seems to be no rhyme or reason as to the things they do and courses of action they take.

I try to train people (for want of a better word) into my way of thinking but that doesnt work either,so i can only accertain that the average thai intellect is in "non-compus" mode 24-7 and only thinking of where the next meal (or next few baht) is coming from.

My experience: Have eaten the same dish, khuay-thiaow nua touwn,same place, nearly every second day, every time i visit BK....is great stuff, i wouldnt complain and alienate myself from them though, simply because i'd miss the food..But, as is the case in some noodle places, they seem to go a little light on the soup,considering how some thais seem to eat the noodles but leave half the soup to be wasted..so id think its not impolite to ask for a little more soup when ordering if your gonna have it all.

I did this on one particular day and got soup filled nearly to the brim, yet the guy still charged only the same amount of 30 baht..not suprising...so i left 10 baht on the table after paying as a tip..the first time id ever done this,usually i'll leave a few baht coins if handy.

The next day i get served again by the same guy..and low and behold the soup rationing has come into effect again...

note to self: Subtle hints DO NOT work

[Jingthing]

Thais don't tip at street restaurants. Neither should we.

[jayjay0]

I agree with you but................. you like the place, the food and the higher price was still a good deal. By not going "you cut off your nose to spite your face". Although I dont like it I would continue going since you do like it like it is, in spite of her attempt to fleece you. At least now she knows you know.

I have been in this situation before and like you stopped going only to pay more somewhere else that wasnt as good. I went back but was just a little less friendly.

Good point

I hardly call 40 baht for chicken and cashews with rice being fleeced. Seems like a good value to me.

[IanForbes]

I understand that it might upset you and I probably would have said something. However, I'm sort of the opposite. There are two Thai cafes that I dine at frequently. Very few farangs go there. I always have paid 40 baht for the same meal that the Thais pay 30 baht for. I also know the same meal in town costs 50 to 60 baht. But, I willingly pay more than I need to and more than the menu says. It has had an odd spin off. I get a big bowl of consume soup with my meal when others get a small bowl. And, I get a huge helping that is at least half again as much as others receive. If I order a Thai omellet I get 3 eggs instead of the usual 2.

Don't you realize that are getting the large size portion and price without asking for it? Anybody, foreign or Thai, could get that same thing for the same price. At just about ANY casual Thai restaurant, you can ask for a large portion and they will increase the price and give you more food. That place is being fair to you, treating you exactly as a Thai who paid what you are paying.

You and Vagabond are missing my point. When I first started going to the cafes I got the same size portion as the Thai people. I also knew that at even 30 baht I was getting a good deal by Thai standards when I compared it a similar meal within the main city. But, in any case I always left them a 10 bat tip. Some people don't tip but others do. I always tip if I think I get good service or a reasonable meal for the price. It's been my experience that Thais don't tip at simple food cafes. The result of my tips was they started increasing the size of my meal. It was not due to any request by me. Occasionally I had to tell them I wanted a smaller portion. Another result was we've become good friends and they get my repeat business. And, I do other things for them such as taking photos of the woman and her two daughters. What goes around comes around.

[Jingthing]

I get your point but you don't get mine. They gave you what you paid for. Tips are not customary in street stalls.

[bifftastic]

"She had always been friendly and attentive, but she'd been fleecing me all along."

This conclusion could be applied to countless topics on this forum.

My nomination for post of the day!

[Naam]

Thais don't tip at street restaurants. Neither should we.

<snip> deplorable and based on thai-phobia suggestion as the majority of Thais are forced to make ends meet with an income of 200-250 dollars a month. i agree that Farangs having that princely sum available for total living expenses should not tip when eating at street restaurants.

Edited July 22, 2010 by toptuan
Insult deleted. An insult with a strikethrough doesn't really clean up a post, as readers still get your point.

[Gladiator]

I understand that it might upset you and I probably would have said something. However, I'm sort of the opposite. There are two Thai cafes that I dine at frequently. Very few farangs go there. I always have paid 40 baht for the same meal that the Thais pay 30 baht for. I also know the same meal in town costs 50 to 60 baht. But, I willingly pay more than I need to and more than the menu says. It has had an odd spin off. I get a big bowl of consume soup with my meal when others get a small bowl. And, I get a huge helping that is at least half again as much as others receive. If I order a Thai omellet I get 3 eggs instead of the usual 2.

Don't you realize that are getting the large size portion and price without asking for it? Anybody, foreign or Thai, could get that same thing for the same price. At just about ANY casual Thai restaurant, you can ask for a large portion and they will increase the price and give you more food. That place is being fair to you, treating you exactly as a Thai who paid what you are paying.

You and Vagabond are missing my point. When I first started going to the cafes I got the same size portion as the Thai people. I also knew that at even 30 baht I was getting a good deal by Thai standards when I compared it a similar meal within the main city. But, in any case I always left them a 10 bat tip. Some people don't tip but others do. I always tip if I think I get good service or a reasonable meal for the price. It's been my experience that Thais don't tip at simple food cafes. The result of my tips was they started increasing the size of my meal. It was not due to any request by me. Occasionally I had to tell them I wanted a smaller portion. Another result was we've become good friends and they get my repeat business. And, I do other things for them such as taking photos of the woman and her two daughters. What goes around comes around.

'What goes around - comes around' Wonderful expression Ian!

My daughter worked her way thorugh "high school' and later Uni to support herself - as a waitress, working on minimum wage. As is often the case, both in North America, Europe and here in Thailand, (my wife being an example), folk that serve the food depend upon on tips to supplement their meagre wages. Mnay times my daughter would serve a table of ten, with great service only to be left the equiv. of a 10 Bhat tip. For this reason, if the service and the food is good, I always plus up the bill 10%, and hand the tip to the person who has served me..

[Naam]

'What goes around - comes around' Wonderful expression Ian!

My daughter worked her way thorugh "high school' and later Uni to support herself - as a waitress, working on minimum wage. As is often the case, both in North America, Europe and here in Thailand, (my wife being an example), folk that serve the food depend upon on tips to supplement their meagre wages. Mnay times my daughter would serve a table of ten, with great service only to be left the equiv. of a 10 Bhat tip. For this reason, if the service and the food is good, I always plus up the bill 10%, and hand the tip to the person who has served me..

a 10% tip is not necessarily appropriate. there are a couple of restaurants in Pattaya where i paid for a dinner with a bottle (or two) of wine (4 persons) 8, 10 or even 12,000 Baht. tipping 10% in these cases would be sheer nonsense although 15% would be appropriate (and demanded!) in the United States no matter what fancy amount the bill shows.

p.s. bitching about 10 Baht makes me...

[rishi]

I get your point but you don't get mine. They gave you what you paid for. Tips are not customary in street stalls.

Once in a while I see Thais dressed, trimmed and in every way appearing as having a hasty meal in between business meetings, rather than someone eating at that street stall due to poverty - you know what? - They ALWAYS tip by the plenty.

Actually, among Thais, it's very customary to tip, if you can afford it. (Wonder why this isn't common knowledge among seasoned TV-posters?)

Edited July 22, 2010 by rishi

[MrBrad]

Good observations and comments. By the way, being able to speak and read Thai--at least to some extent--for better than 15 years now, I would always order in Thai. I will try to find another, maybe even better place to spend my money. All part of the adventure.

if youve been really here 15 years your a slow learner. you liked the food the cook and the price but now you wont go there. thats daft. fact.

No, you pegged me wrong I think. I didn't say I'd been here for some 15 years if you read carefully what I wrote. It is possible that I studied Thai outside of Thailand, which is true. As for living here, I'm a relatively new-comer.

And in regards to not wanting to pay any more than Thai customers, well, I guess I'm just a bit unhinged.

[Gladiator]

'What goes around - comes around' Wonderful expression Ian!

My daughter worked her way thorugh "high school' and later Uni to support herself - as a waitress, working on minimum wage. As is often the case, both in North America, Europe and here in Thailand, (my wife being an example), folk that serve the food depend upon on tips to supplement their meagre wages. Mnay times my daughter would serve a table of ten, with great service only to be left the equiv. of a 10 Bhat tip. For this reason, if the service and the food is good, I always plus up the bill 10%, and hand the tip to the person who has served me..

a 10% tip is not necessarily appropriate. there are a couple of restaurants in Pattaya where i paid for a dinner with a bottle (or two) of wine (4 persons) 8, 10 or even 12,000 Baht. tipping 10% in these cases would be sheer nonsense although 15% would be appropriate (and demanded!) in the United States no matter what fancy amount the bill shows.

p.s. bitching about 10 Baht makes me...

Maybe Naam,

But do you tip on top the cost of the food or the total bill? Despite my comments -n I always object to tipping to include the tax!

[flying]

I always tip what seems to be a large amount on the total bill....20-30% even at food stalls

But then I do not live here 100% of the time only a few months per year & the food seems crazy cheap so even with a tip I feel like I am getting a great deal. It makes the workers happy & they always give great service.

I sometimes go with an old Thai business gent from BK & he always comments ...You still tip like an American & laughs. But he also went to school in the US so knows the relative price comparisons & why I feel as I do.

Side note....

In the US I tip 15-20% depending.... on service of course. There I know the govt automatically assumes the food worker got 8% min & taxes them on that.Also in the US only food workers are actually allowed to be paid sub minimum wage because of tips. Because of it they can actually end up with a zero paycheck....Odd that because others like bus drivers, taxi drivers, hotel bell hops etc are taxed nothing automatically.

Edited July 22, 2010 by flying

[nikster]

I get your point but you don't get mine. They gave you what you paid for. Tips are not customary in street stalls.

Once in a while I see Thais dressed, trimmed and in every way appearing as having a hasty meal in between business meetings, rather than someone eating at that street stall due to poverty - you know what? - They ALWAYS tip by the plenty.

Actually, among Thais, it's very customary to tip, if you can afford it. (Wonder why this isn't common knowledge among seasoned TV-posters?)

I was just about to post the same thing. Rich or even middle income Thais tip. Generously, too. And so should you.

It seems to me that the Farangs who don't tip kind of pick and choose on the cultural traits to pick up. You do most things like a foreigner. But when it comes to tipping, you do it like a poor villager. After haggling the street meal down 10 baht and not tipping, you go to that burger place and pay 180 baht for a burger.

I don't think it's about the money, either - it's just a huge ego trip. Attempting to be more Thai than the tourists, or even other expats (congratulations!!) and a mortal fear of getting ripped off because you're a foreigner.

I mean really unless you're dirt poor, tip, for chrissake. Don't be kee-new.

As for the food stall - yeah I don't think I would come back either if there's dual pricing. It pisses me off, so I'd just not go there anymore. I wouldn't argue the bill though. If I get a bigger farang portion, then sure, OK, as long as I can also order the Thai size...

[sarahsbloke]

It seems to me that the Farangs who don't tip kind of pick and choose on the cultural traits to pick up. You do most things like a foreigner. But when it comes to tipping, you do it like a poor villager. After haggling the street meal down 10 baht and not tipping, you go to that burger place and pay 180 baht for a burger.

I don't think it's about the money, either - it's just a huge ego trip. Attempting to be more Thai than the tourists, or even other expats (congratulations!!) and a mortal fear of getting ripped off because you're a foreigner.

Attempting to be more Thai than the tourists ....... does that include white foreigners who refer to other white people as falang/farang?

What about black foreigners in Thailand, do you refer to them as Nigos?

Edited July 22, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[iainiain101]

It seems to me that the Farangs who don't tip kind of pick and choose on the cultural traits to pick up. You do most things like a foreigner. But when it comes to tipping, you do it like a poor villager. After haggling the street meal down 10 baht and not tipping, you go to that burger place and pay 180 baht for a burger.

I don't think it's about the money, either - it's just a huge ego trip. Attempting to be more Thai than the tourists, or even other expats (congratulations!!) and a mortal fear of getting ripped off because you're a foreigner.

Attempting to be more Thai than the tourists ....... does that include white foreigners who refer to other white people as falang/farang?

What about black foreigners in Thailand, do you refer to them as Nigos?

I think you would still refer to black foreigners as Farang. Thais, especially up North do not have much exposure to coloured foreigners. You should warn any Thais never to address coloured foreigners as 'Khun'. saw this cause a terrible fight once.

[Lost in LOS]

It seems to me that the Farangs who don't tip kind of pick and choose on the cultural traits to pick up. You do most things like a foreigner. But when it comes to tipping, you do it like a poor villager. After haggling the street meal down 10 baht and not tipping, you go to that burger place and pay 180 baht for a burger.

I don't think it's about the money, either - it's just a huge ego trip. Attempting to be more Thai than the tourists, or even other expats (congratulations!!) and a mortal fear of getting ripped off because you're a foreigner.

Attempting to be more Thai than the tourists ....... does that include white foreigners who refer to other white people as falang/farang?

What about black foreigners in Thailand, do you refer to them as Nigos?

yep, I refer to westerners as farang........ Khao mueng tar-lew, tong lew-tar tarm [When in Rome, do as the Romans do]

black foreigners are referred to as "chocolate men" I like chocolate so that's not so bad

Most of these small stands barely make a living. If you don't have much money, then okay, don't tip or really watch the bill. If you are comfortable, help someone who is working hard to make a living........its 10 BAHT not much money to most

Edited July 22, 2010 by Lost in LOS

[MrBrad]

I guess we're straying a bit from my original post, but that's fine.

As for tipping, whether in our home country or here in Thailand, should one feel obligated to tip the owner of the restaurant, or barber shop, or laundry? If the owner feels he's not able to subsist without a tip, shouldn't he charge an appropriate amount to begin with? Service people are usually not the owners. Where do you draw the line as for whom to tip?

And, as I understand it, many establishments here have a pooled tip box where all tips are to be deposited, and then the contents is later split in some way between the kitchen help and the servers on the floor and maybe a few others who get in on the taking. Your exemplary and deserving waiter gets the same portion of the tip box as the slackers.

[flying]

Your exemplary and deserving waiter gets the same portion of the tip box as the slackers.

Sadly that is the norm & not the exception.

( does not change my tipping habits as I know a fraction is still better than none )

Same hold true in may places the world over.

Also in the states where unions rule many jobs the same can be said for employees who have raises negotiated by time served & not performance.

[sarahsbloke]

I think you would still refer to black foreigners as Farang. Thais, especially up North do not have much exposure to coloured foreigners. You should warn any Thais never to address coloured foreigners as 'Khun'. saw this cause a terrible fight once.

Well I'm in ChiangMai, which is fairly up north, and can assure you that in town the correct derogatory racist insult directed at black skinned foreigners (by Thai nationals) is 'Nigo',

Edited July 22, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[iainiain101]

I think you would still refer to black foreigners as Farang. Thais, especially up North do not have much exposure to coloured foreigners. You should warn any Thais never to address coloured foreigners as 'Khun'. saw this cause a terrible fight once.

Well I'm in ChiangMai, which is fairly up north, and can assure you that in town the correct derogatory racist insult directed at black skinned foreigners (by Thai nationals) is 'Nigo',

You missed my point. The Thai was trying to be polite!

[Ulysses G.]

Don't you realize that are getting the large size portion and price without asking for it? Anybody, foreign or Thai, could get that same thing for the same price. At just about ANY casual Thai restaurant, you can ask for a large portion and they will increase the price and give you more food. That place is being fair to you, treating you exactly as a Thai who paid what you are paying.

This is a good point and the kind of thing that many foreigners get upset without realizing that they are actually getting and paying for a bigger portion while Thais automatically get the smaller portion if they do not ask for the larger one (which is fair in my book).

[toptuan]

'What goes around - comes around' Wonderful expression Ian!

My daughter worked her way thorugh "high school' and later Uni to support herself - as a waitress, working on minimum wage. As is often the case, both in North America, Europe and here in Thailand, (my wife being an example), folk that serve the food depend upon on tips to supplement their meagre wages. Mnay times my daughter would serve a table of ten, with great service only to be left the equiv. of a 10 Bhat tip. For this reason, if the service and the food is good, I always plus up the bill 10%, and hand the tip to the person who has served me..

a 10% tip is not necessarily appropriate. there are a couple of restaurants in Pattaya where i paid for a dinner with a bottle (or two) of wine (4 persons) 8, 10 or even 12,000 Baht. tipping 10% in these cases would be sheer nonsense although 15% would be appropriate (and demanded!) in the United States no matter what fancy amount the bill shows.

p.s. bitching about 10 Baht makes me...

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For the Moderating Team

[ChiangMaiIB]

I think you would still refer to black foreigners as Farang. Thais, especially up North do not have much exposure to coloured foreigners. You should warn any Thais never to address coloured foreigners as 'Khun'. saw this cause a terrible fight once.

I had to laugh

[KRS1]

Believe me, this double tier pricing happens to Thais also.

[Lizard2010]

Very interesting posts.

I will ask my Thai friends next time i see them.

Maybe i have lucky so far, but maybe not.

[IanForbes]

_{Nothing in this world is really fair or balanced. No matter what line you draw there are always people have more than they need and people who don't have enough. And, it's not because they aren't trying or working hard enough. As a customer, all we've got to accept is if we are getting value for our money. Nobody can convince me that a Thai meal in a Thai cafe is over priced... even at double what they charge. It's one of the reasons why I seldom eat in Thai restaurants in Canada. I hate paying $12.95 plus taxes, plus tip for the same meal that I pay $1.25 for in Chiang Mai.}

_{I don't buy what I can't afford and I don't tip when the occasion is not needed. But, I do try to help out people I think need it more than me. I'm just an old pensioner, but I have enough to keep me happy if I don't get too extravagant. What other people do is entirely up to themselves.}

_{In Asian and African countries everything is pretty much run by a bartering system where the prices fluctuate. In some African markets the staff are disappointed if you don't haggle over the price of the object for sale... whether it's a meal or a blanket. I don't like people trying to cheat me, but I don't call bartering, cheating. I guess it is like the prostitution thread on the general forum... you get polarized viewpoints depending on each person's situation. As far as my own situation is concerned, I actually get pleasure out of giving away what little I have. It puts a smile on my face making others happy. And, I'll even smile when I know someone is trying to con me. I just laugh and tell them I'm not an ATM machine. And, I do it in a way that they are not insulted or lose face. It leaves me in an enlightened frame of mind like I own the world. So far, in the 14 years I've been coming to Thailand it seems to have worked for me and I haven't really had an unpleasant experience. Maybe I'm just lucky or maybe it's Karma. But, I'll still say don't invest more than you can't afford to walk away from.}