How To Open A Business And Stay Away From Corruption?

[Hyponeros]

My wife wanted to open a small business (and it is not a bar).Before doing so, she read how to do it, what are the laws, etc… She came acrosssome forum and now she is scared.

What she found out was that if you stick strictly to the lawpolice will find a way to charge you anyway. If you respect the law thebusiness next to yours will not and take away your business. If you payprotection to some policemen they cannot protect you anyway. Some police will finda way to make you to break the law and then fine you. It seems that there is more stress than benefits to open a business in Thailand.

Now she is scared and doesn’t want to open her business. Sheis more the shy kind of person ad would not fight back and since I am aforeigner I will be wrong anyway.

What can we do to be protected from this corrupt police? Cana lawyer help? Is there no other choice than to play the game of corruption?

If an employee brakes the law against our instructions, can we be protected from that?

[angiud]

I live in Koh Phangan since 2000 and I have 2 business open. In all these years I deal with local police just one time, without to pay any money.

Of course in Thailand every place is different so I just talk for my experience.

IMO the situation is not so desperate, usually Police tend to ask money to people doing something illegal (drug, girls, copyright infringements, etc).

If your business is legal and you pay the due taxes and permits you don't have to worry.

[mark45y]

What kind of business do you want to open?

[Hyponeros]

If your business is legal and you pay the due taxes and permits you don't have to worry.

I wish that was true but according to what my wife read in Thai, it is a perfectly legal and harmless business and still it looks to be far from being safe!

However, in case of unfair threats, what can we legally do?

[Hyponeros]

What kind of business do you want to open?

I have my own job, but my wife wants to open an internet shop.

[bkkmick]

My wife has had her own business for 5 years in Bangkok. In all that time she only had one hard up cop come and try to get money out of her. She more or less told him to f. off. He never came back.

[robblok]

Problem is then you probably dont have legal software and that is a crime (so they can ask for money not to prosecute)

[Hyponeros]

Problem is then you probably dont have legal software and that is a crime (so they can ask for money not to prosecute)

I might need to check that out more in details. But we planed to do everything legally!

[robblok]

Problem is then you probably dont have legal software and that is a crime (so they can ask for money not to prosecute)

I might need to check that out more in details. But we planed to do everything legally!

Thing is if all your software is legal its more expensive to run then the neighbor who does not use legal software. Combine that that most computer seller put on an illegal copy that is why most internet cafe's could be shaken down.

[samran]

If your business is legal and you pay the due taxes and permits you don't have to worry.

I wish that was true but according to what my wife read in Thai, it is a perfectly legal and harmless business and still it looks to be far from being safe!

However, in case of unfair threats, what can we legally do?

what do you want to do?

My experience is if you stay within the law, make sure you have the correct permits, pay taxes etc, they can't really do much to get you.

The onus is on you to do it properly. And, there are some silly requirements about...which is why people want to ignore them to begin with.

Too many Thai's and foreigners alike get into the habit of ignoring the law, and then complain about corruption.

[Ulysses G.]

I never had any problem with the police and I have a number of retail outlets. Just make sure that you are not breaking the law and they are not usually a problem and do not try to shake you down.

By the way, it is possible to get cheap copies of legal software and use freeware whenever you can. There is plenty of decent free software available.

[dave111223]

Wife's been running a clothing business for 3 years now. Never had a policeman come asking for money.

However you do get people come in every once in a while asking "funny" questions, such as "do you have any fake stuff", ...not sure if these people are just strange characters that are actually looking to buy some "fake stuff", but wife suspects they are plain clothes cops looking for a shake down opportunity.

But we don't sell counterfeit products so it's not a problem.

If you are not doing anything illegal you won't have a problem with the police.

Edited August 15, 2010 by dave111223

[BigPanda]

If its a small business it should not be a problem.

But everyone has their own experience. Myself as a foreigner i never had problems with the 3 business i have concerning the police or government. I had many problems with my ex and her mother stealing the money from my business, even fired some staff thinking it was them. But thats an other story.

So to answer your questions, to have business here you must be ready to fight. It may never happen that you must fight the police or government, but now my current girlfriend is having tons of problems with the tax people... Just because one of the big lady inside the government was trying to get some money from her company. We talking around 1 million bath. They went to court 3 years ago and the girlfriend won the case...

But that woman is much older and has high position and she felt she lost face in front of everyone. So she is trying by every way to get some more tax money out of her company. Sometimes its insane the things they think about, but if you dont have a good lawyer, you end up depressed and scared and you settle for a smaller fee and just pay. That is what so many business do.

If ever her business run well, she could have problems with police, tax officers and probably others that I have not experienced yet. The best is to know a good lawyer who can help in any situation.

Best of luck.

[Hyponeros]

Thank you for your answers.

If I summarize everything we:

1- Have to do everything perfectly legal (which I intended),

2- Don't give in on corruption,

3- Have a good lawyer,

4- Don't be shy and accept to go into a legal fight.

Anything else I forgot?

Edited August 16, 2010 by Hyponeros

[Chunky1]

Just pay 3,000 baht for a real copy of windows for each computer. assuming you want games like most other internet cafes have, instead of buying a copy game for 100 baht and putting it on each computer simply purchase original games for each computer, shouldn't run you more than 10-15,000 baht per computer. also, make sure that nobody is downloading music or videos, visiting pornographic sites or using proxies. also, make sure you aren't violating any other laws like allowing children to use your business during school hours, allowing children to use your computers to view inappropriate materials or allowing children in your business at inappropriate hours. that is all i can think of at the moment. just follow the law and you should be OK.

[carmine]

If you do things legit you won't have a problem.

They are well aware there are plenty of others who do cut corners, do not do things legitimitly. They are the one's that will get shaken down.

Thats my experience for what it's worth.

[Chunky1]

Very obvious that internet cafe is a terrible choice of business if your wife's #1 priority is to not have to speak to a police officer. I would recommend something in retail, since there are less gray areas. Plus, you can always sell your stock or change locations. Internet cafe in general strikes me as a terrible business to get into.

[dogleg]

Very obvious that internet cafe is a terrible choice of business if your wife's #1 priority is to not have to speak to a police officer. I would recommend something in retail, since there are less gray areas. Plus, you can always sell your stock or change locations. Internet cafe in general strikes me as a terrible business to get into.

I agree. I was put off adding an internet cafe as a sideline to something else I was doing a while back. Too many interested (regulating) parties want to look over your shoulder!

[Hyponeros]

Very obvious that internet cafe is a terrible choice of business if your wife's #1 priority is to not have to speak to a police officer. I would recommend something in retail, since there are less gray areas. Plus, you can always sell your stock or change locations. Internet cafe in general strikes me as a terrible business to get into.

The reason is that her sister owns several internet cafe... in Malaysia! So she can benefit from her experience!

[marinediscoking]

I don't think opening an Internet Cafe is a bad idea. I have seen some local thai's here in pattaya become very successful doing that. I have had a business here for the last 7 years and the only time the police have come in was to use my service or check my work permit. The later only happened twice, which I have.

What is import is that you have an "Internet license" which is easy to get according to one of my friends. Like everyone says...pay tax and if she is worried talk to a repeatable lawyer who can help if there are any problems.

In my opinion the biggest problem could come from disgruntled staff. She should try to obey the thai labor laws, one cannot just sack someone without just cause without paying 3 months salary. Otherwise she could be asking for problems. Having said that I have employed over 200 staff over the years and never had a problem, big problems have happened to some of my friends who did not take this advice.

Don't believe all the bar talk you hear about doing business here!!!

You are lucky you have a girlfriend who actually wants to work.

Edited August 16, 2010 by marinediscoking

[IanForbes]

Why stay away from corruption? That is how most successful businesses work. You can start with the leaders of the western world and work your way downward from there.

[Garry9999]

Just pay 3,000 baht for a real copy of windows for each computer. assuming you want games like most other internet cafes have, instead of buying a copy game for 100 baht and putting it on each computer simply purchase original games for each computer, shouldn't run you more than 10-15,000 baht per computer. also, make sure that nobody is downloading music or videos, visiting pornographic sites or using proxies. also, make sure you aren't violating any other laws like allowing children to use your business during school hours, allowing children to use your computers to view inappropriate materials or allowing children in your business at inappropriate hours. that is all i can think of at the moment. just follow the law and you should be OK.

Yes,and for this service you will be able to charge 20 baht per hour per machine, you do the maths.

[Hyponeros]

Thank you for all your advises. Unfortunately my wife kept reading in forums about opening an internet cafe and now she is too scared. She read that even if people were doing every thing legally police / government officials would find a way to charge you. Police would pay someone to do something illegal and then come right after him to fine the owner. They would take someone away in handcuffs even if they tried to do everything legally.

My wife is a shy kind of person and she doesn't have the courage to fight the police. She doesn't want to work for the police or a lawyer to get all the money.

So we will not open a shop in Thailand but invest the money in a neighbor country. We planed to hire 2 full time and one part time and we won't.

[Eazy-Going]

My business is all above board and doing very well. From day one we have paid the BiB on a monthly basis 300Bht to keep a lookout for our business and just basically ensure all is ok whenever they are passing on their regular patrols. They even have a little book that we keep and they sign it off every month they collect. I'm under the impression that this is the norm here as the book goes back quite some years and details all payments from past 2 Thai renters of the land we are now renting.

[Chunky1]

what do you get for 3000 baht a month?

[Eazy-Going]

what do you get for 3000 baht a month?

You have misread my post, it is 300Bht a month, and I'm at a loss to know what I get for this although as it is such a low amount I don't query it because if I did I no doubt would have many mishaps/thefts/vandalism etc...not saying instigated by whom but you can imagine my inclinations. best to just go with the flow in this situation methinks!

[JurgenG]

Thank you for all your advises. Unfortunately my wife kept reading in forums about opening an internet cafe and now she is too scared. She read that even if people were doing every thing legally police / government officials would find a way to charge you. Police would pay someone to do something illegal and then come right after him to fine the owner. They would take someone away in handcuffs even if they tried to do everything legally.

My wife is a shy kind of person and she doesn't have the courage to fight the police. She doesn't want to work for the police or a lawyer to get all the money.

So we will not open a shop in Thailand but invest the money in a neighbor country. We planed to hire 2 full time and one part time and we won't.

As other people said, it depends the kind of internet cafe

Upscale one where students or young executives drink expensive coffees when checking the news or the stock exchange ? I don't think you will have any trouble.

Or the cheap one where lots of kids who should better be at school spend days and night playing games ? These places are usually managed by mafia because beside the internet business lots of other businesses, usually not very legal, are taking place. Then your wife is right to be scare and to look for some other business to invest.

[leininger]

Wife has small business in Chiang Mai and never had problem with police or govt. officials. I think one thing which is most helpful to avoid problems is to have good relations with other businesses and residents in community where business is located. Otherwise you can get problems from police who are related to or friendly with whoever you have the problem with. Generally I think if you are friendly and honest you have few problems in business here.

[BillR]

Thank you for your answers.

If I summarize everything we:

1- Have to do everything perfectly legal (which I intended),

2- Don't give in on corruption,

3- Have a good lawyer,

4- Don't be shy and accept to go into a legal fight.

Anything else I forgot?

Yes. Have cctv cameras and point to them when mr. policeman shows up.

[oldgent]

Hi. Hypongros. Interesting subject. was thinking of doing the same myself in the near future. this is a bit cheeky of me but would you mind telling me how much were you going to invest in the business. oldgent