Raising Baby In Issan

[cardholder]

1) If they don't have a rice farm they must buy their rice.

2) Large portions of Isaan are bone dry with no vegies available to pick for free for most of the year.

3) Chickens? May one a week for my wife's household in the village. And it is an emaciated little bugger.

4) Free fish are available during the rainy season, but what about the rest of the year?

I think you are romanticizing the stark life that most people in Isaan actually live in. Yes they have a leaking roof over their heads. Yes they have ample leisure time. Some enterprising individuals do very well at 20,000-30,000 bt/month. Can you survive? Of course. But can you buy educational toys, new clothes, books, afford an internet connection, decent transportation, air condition in the summer? No way.

..... and one of the most endearing things about the Isaan Thais (particularly older generations) is that they do not complain about their.

They have bugger all, expect bugger all, get bugger all and get on with their lives. I know several young families raising their children on less than 12,000 Baht p.m.

Only the Falangs seem to complicate it.

[way2muchcoffee]

..... and one of the most endearing things about the Isaan Thais (particularly older generations) is that they do not complain about their.

They have bugger all, expect bugger all, get bugger all and get on with their lives. I know several young families raising their children on less than 12,000 Baht p.m.

Only the Falangs seem to complicate it.

Isn't that the problem? The younger generation just doesn't accept these squalid living conditions. So their anger and frustration gets harnessed by organizations like the UDD and DAAD. Life is harsh. If you think it is so great then I challenge you to live on 3,000 bt/month in an Isaan village. I doubt you would make it through even one month.

The question of this thread isn't what is survivable. The question is what is the appropriate amount to send for an ex-wife and child. If you want your child to live in squalor that is on you. Personally I won't have it.

Edited September 11, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[lovelomsak]

..... and one of the most endearing things about the Isaan Thais (particularly older generations) is that they do not complain about their.

They have bugger all, expect bugger all, get bugger all and get on with their lives. I know several young families raising their children on less than 12,000 Baht p.m.

Only the Falangs seem to complicate it.

Isn't that the problem? The younger generation just doesn't accept these squalid living conditions. So their anger and frustration gets harnessed by organizations like the UDD and DAAD. Life is harsh. If you think it is so great then I challenge you to live on 3,000 bt/month in an Isaan village. I doubt you would make it through even one month.

The question of this thread isn't what is survivable. The question is what is the appropriate amount to send for an ex-wife and child. If you want your child to live in squalor that is on you. Personally I won't have it.

Did anyone say there was a problem?I amnot sure where you came up with the 3000 baht amount figure to live on no one else has used that amount in this thread so far as I know. And life isnot harsh there you have probably never even been there.You appear to be speaking with emotion instead of facts.I have been told by considerable amount of adult Thais the problem with thai youth is they have it too easy their family will bale them out of any trouble they get into and they donot have to go to school or work for the family will continue to support them no matter how bad they get.The youth has no accountability is the problem. Money has nothing to do with it so you are way off track this isnot the slums of London this is rural thailand. And 15000 baht a month is enough to have a respectable life and family in Issan.

Edited September 11, 2010 by lovelomsak

[dumball]

I think by the posts on this thread , that many posters have no idea what they are talking about is because they have never lived in a village and experienced how things work , the phsyce of a villager is completely different than what you find in the towns and cities , I know that because I lived in one for 6 weeks or so and had ACTUAL experience . They live the way they live on what you would call impossible or peanuts because they have not built the desire to change , not knowing what else goes on outside and are not concerned about it , just get your sorry ass out of your comfy chair and go see for yourselves how well they live on so little . Maybe then you will stop talking a load of drivel that they need the same or even more than a city dweller to just exist , what you suggest should be supplied for the child is not even available in the area .

Just like Frank Sinatra sang "I did it my way "and that is what they do .

[gregb]

Assuming this isn't just a newbie trolling for sport,

The Thai courts say 3000 - 5000 baht per month is all that is required, the latter figure only when the child is much older and has significant schooling expenses. Having twins of my own, I can tell you this actually isn't far off the mark if you do not pay a caregiver or worry about the mother's expenses. Spending more than this is really just for unnecessary luxuries.

If you are paying $500 USD, that is more than sufficient, and everyone knows it. I suggest you ask her to provide you with a breakdown of monthly expenses if she is requiring more than this. The results would be illuminating/entertaining to say the least.

Or, assuming this is a troll post, I think that if you simply sent the entire $10,000 USD per month to her, that may be sufficient for a short while. Why step up the payments gradually? Just send everything you have and be done with it.

[JPPR2]

..... and one of the most endearing things about the Isaan Thais (particularly older generations) is that they do not complain about their.

They have bugger all, expect bugger all, get bugger all and get on with their lives. I know several young families raising their children on less than 12,000 Baht p.m.

Only the Falangs seem to complicate it.

Isn't that the problem? The younger generation just doesn't accept these squalid living conditions. So their anger and frustration gets harnessed by organizations like the UDD and DAAD. Life is harsh. If you think it is so great then I challenge you to live on 3,000 bt/month in an Isaan village. I doubt you would make it through even one month.

The question of this thread isn't what is survivable. The question is what is the appropriate amount to send for an ex-wife and child. If you want your child to live in squalor that is on you. Personally I won't have it.

I think that is really the truth of the matter. Foreigners come over and complicate it with their personal living expectations basing it on their current/past living life style. The US is in a mess because of this behavior. Excessive, waste, new this, new that, more wants then needs. "Have to have best. If 1 TV is good then 2 is better and 3 is GREAT". "Oh that shirt lost a button, just throw it away and buy a new one". I tend to think as foreigners it is forgotten what Thai people are comfortable and happy with. Foreigners assume far too much....................................

I think it is clear from the posters that KNOW, $15,000 baht a month is more than enough.

[way2muchcoffee]

I think it is clear from the posters that KNOW, $15,000 baht a month is more than enough.

And yet not one of these people posting lives on this amount. And they certainly wouldn't do it while caring for their child. Very interesting.

Edited September 11, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[BlackGrape]

I think it is clear from the posters that KNOW, $15,000 baht a month is more than enough.

And yet not one (with or without kids) lives on this amount. Very interesting.

JPPR2, same same mate:)

[dumball]

'way2muchcoffee' timestamp='1284228804' post='3877563']

'JPPR2' timestamp='1284226637' post='3877546']

I think it is clear from the posters that KNOW, $15,000 baht a month is more than enough.

And yet not one of these people posting lives on this amount. And they certainly wouldn't do it while caring for their child. Very interesting.

I wrote a post to that effect , but you probably skipped over it because it did not agree with your point of view , my wife and I live off slightly more than that for all of our expenses , we live in a nice apartment in the city and want for very little , go back and read the whole post . I forgot to mention that until a few weeks ago her sister had lived with us to attend English classes at an international school for which we also payed .

You have NO idea .

[lovelomsak]

I think it is clear from the posters that KNOW, $15,000 baht a month is more than enough.

And yet not one of these people posting lives on this amount. And they certainly wouldn't do it while caring for their child. Very interesting.

Wrong again why do you keep making up stories. I have on many months lived on 15000 baht it is easy here. I have a friend married with a daughter they have internet true a truck 2 motorcycles built a house all on 15000 bahy a month he aloows for budget . Why do you not go out to the real Thailand and learn. I amnot trying to be mean but really you are so far off base.

For over 10 years I used to come here on holidays for 2 months a year and live in hotels and go out every night and spend 30,000 baht a month. Please until you are better versed read and learn

[JPPR2]

My final post to the thread, If the OP is sending $15k baht as a supplement to her current living then quite honestly I would think she would be extremely comfortable. If she manages the money right I suspect she could even save a little bit each month.

Lastly, as Lovelomsak said, I think there are a lot of posters on TV that are either here as ExPats or on business where the company is covering all expenses( I know thats how I started). With that said they never leave BKK. all bills are covered and because they know you are a foreigner they inflate fees and you never really ever see the REAL cost and living in Thailand. I learned this very fast 3.5 years ago. A shirt bought in BKK is $12- $18 USD. Go to Rangsit, Chachensao, Bang Na and that same shirt can be had $2 -$3. The same goes for everything else. Just go to the daily market and buy your food and see. Stay away from Topps and Value Markets and the Malls.

My 2 baht worth

Edited September 12, 2010 by JPPR2

[way2muchcoffee]

I've lived and worked in Thailand for nearly a decade. My wife is from Isaan. I know very well how much it costs to survive. My wife and are I are also raising a child. I know the costs involved there as well. Personally I think it would be impossible to do so properly for 15,000 bt/month.

[lovelomsak]

I've lived and worked in Thailand for nearly a decade. My wife is from Isaan. I know very well how much it costs to survive. My wife and are I are also raising a child. I know the costs involved there as well. Personally I think it would be impossible to do so properly for 15,000 bt/month.

If what you say is true about Issan wife and child then and your time spent here, then I feel you have either been sheltered from reality by associates or you just fail to see things as they are. If you know the costs then you should know 15000 baht is a very good income in Isaan. I should also mention the friend I mentioned in my last post doesnot live in Isaan and can do it easily on 15000 a month, so Isaan being Isaan it should be even easier. . Rural Thailand is so inexpensive.

[way2muchcoffee]

I've lived and worked in Thailand for nearly a decade. My wife is from Isaan. I know very well how much it costs to survive. My wife and are I are also raising a child. I know the costs involved there as well. Personally I think it would be impossible to do so properly for 15,000 bt/month.

If what you say is true about Issan wife and child then and your time spent here, then I feel you have either been sheltered from reality by associates or you just fail to see things as they are. If you know the costs then you should know 15000 baht is a very good income in Isaan. I should also mention the friend I mentioned in my last post doesnot live in Isaan and can do it easily on 15000 a month, so Isaan being Isaan it should be even easier. . Rural Thailand is so inexpensive.

I realize that 15,000/month as a large amount for Isaan. That isn't the argument I am making. I would want my child to be raised with more amenities, educational materials, internet with computer, clothes, etc that the typical Isaan family simply cannot afford. The children in Isaan must do without many of the things that I would want for my child in order to maximize his/her opportunities in life. That is the point I am making, even if I'm making that point poorly.

Edited September 12, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[IanForbes]

I realize that 15,000/month as a large amount for Isaan. That isn't the argument I am making. I would want my child to be raised with more amenities, educational materials, internet with computer, clothes, etc that the typical Isaan family simply cannot afford. The children in Isaan must do without many of the things that I would want for my child in order to maximize his/her opportunities in life. That is the point I am making, even if I'm making that point poorly.

Yours is a very good point, But. Very little information was given by the OP. How much time is the OP willing to spend with the family raising his child? Being a part time parent just doesn't cut it. Undertakeing raising a family ANYWHERE is a big step that shouldn't be taken lightly. Getting some poor girl pregnant and then taking off is not being a good parent. There IS such a thing as contreception, and has been for many years.

I believe what most of us are saying is that 15,000 baht is enough money to raise a child "Thai style" providing the money is NOT spent feeding the whole extended family... which is so often the case. There is a new story every few days about some stupid bloke who has gone down that road. None of us know all the facts and most of us are just speculating by using assumptions of what we have seen before.

[MSingh]

I make $10,000 a month, an extra $500 may be a budget buster for me. Said child doesnt even look like me, looks like a thai boy, similiar to the look of my gf's brother.

Surely you jest ??

[MrsExpat2B]

If my parents managed to raise me and my sister on 20,000 baht a month (total household income) in Bangkok, I would have thought 15,000 baht a month in Isaan would suffice. Sure our lifestyle wasn't grand but I didn't feel like anything was missing?

Edited September 12, 2010 by MrsExpat2B

[cardholder]

If you are paying $500 USD, that is more than sufficient, and everyone knows it. I suggest you ask her to provide you with a breakdown of monthly expenses if she is requiring more than this. The results would be illuminating/entertaining to say the least.

Same tack, but I would ask the question slightly differently.

I would say that I am concerned that $500 is not enough in today s economic climate so could she list EVERYTHING she has to spend over the course of a month. That way you can make sure she is getting enough.

(I am sure she is, and from the 'brother' by the sounds of it)

[longballlarry]

I make $10,000 a month, an extra $500 may be a budget buster for me. Said child doesnt even look like me, looks like a thai boy, similiar to the look of my gf's brother.

I am in a very similar situation. Although I don't think you could support my wife in Udon Thani, who demands $10,100 a month , so slightly out of your range.

I earn $20,101 a month, so even when I pay her, I have more money than you.

When I asked her for a picture of our kid she said he was camera shy, so in the 15 years that I've been sending her money ( nearly 2 million dollars ) , I've still not seen him, but Its still great to be an active father.

My payments stop when he is 16, next yr, and she has just contacted me and said she is pregnant again. She insists the child is mine, even though we have not seen each other since 1995. She said it is still possible, and once i send a money transfer for her medical care, and hospital fees in Udon, ( 9 million dollars ), she will send me a picture of the ultra sound, which shows without all doubts, that the fetus does in fact, have my nose.

I never thought I'd be a father again. Its all so exciting.

[WAYNEandAEI]

I make $10,000 a month, an extra $500 may be a budget buster for me. Said child doesnt even look like me, looks like a thai boy, similiar to the look of my gf's brother.

I am in a very similar situation. Although I don't think you could support my wife in Udon Thani, who demands $10,100 a month , so slightly out of your range.

I earn $20,101 a month, so even when I pay her, I have more money than you.

When I asked her for a picture of our kid she said he was camera shy, so in the 15 years that I've been sending her money ( nearly 2 million dollars ) , I've still not seen him, but Its still great to be an active father.

My payments stop when he is 16, next yr, and she has just contacted me and said she is pregnant again. She insists the child is mine, even though we have not seen each other since 1995. She said it is still possible, and once i send a money transfer for her medical care, and hospital fees in Udon, ( 9 million dollars ), she will send me a picture of the ultra sound, which shows without all doubts, that the fetus does in fact, have my nose.

I never thought I'd be a father again. Its all so exciting.

Good response to the op

[MikeyIdea]

I make $10,000 a month, an extra $500 may be a budget buster for me. Said child doesnt even look like me, looks like a thai boy, similiar to the look of my gf's brother.

10,000 dollars a month? What do you do for a living, rob banks or run illegal drugs? I live quite comfortably on 2,500 dollars a month. There is already a topic on how much people earn in Thailand. Most rural salaries are between 6,000 and 10,000 baht per month... NOT DOLLARS. Rural Thai families seem to exist quite nicely on that amount.

If you need money for the child's clothing and school then I suggest that YOU buy the items needed on your return visit. Understand of course, that no matter HOW much money you send, it will never be enough. The reason being that you would be paying for the entire village to suck off the rich farang. You would be supplying funds for the mother in law's gambling habit and the Thai boyfriend's drinking problem. You can never buy enough beer to supply the whole village.

Very good post Ian

Some perspective - I support my family including having one daughter going to a good and expensive tri-lingual school in Bangkok for $2,500 per month. That includes helping 4 people of my extended family, my wifes parents and their parents, to a good (but not lazy) life too

"In Issan" is too wide to say for sure, cost of living differ very much depending on city, rural etc, but anything over $400 per month in a rural setting and you are supporting the expanded family of the mother more than what you should. Anything over $600 in an Issan city and you are doing the same.

Care for your child and pay education bills yourself - Time to step up in the father-role

Good Luck

[MikeyIdea]

..... and one of the most endearing things about the Isaan Thais (particularly older generations) is that they do not complain about their.

They have bugger all, expect bugger all, get bugger all and get on with their lives. I know several young families raising their children on less than 12,000 Baht p.m.

Only the Falangs seem to complicate it.

Isn't that the problem? The younger generation just doesn't accept these squalid living conditions. So their anger and frustration gets harnessed by organizations like the UDD and DAAD. Life is harsh. If you think it is so great then I challenge you to live on 3,000 bt/month in an Isaan village. I doubt you would make it through even one month.

The question of this thread isn't what is survivable. The question is what is the appropriate amount to send for an ex-wife and child. If you want your child to live in squalor that is on you. Personally I won't have it.

I don't want to end up on an argument, I just want to share my opinion. No one take offence please.

Survivable is not the question, very true. Paying for the parents of the mother to not work is not part of the deal either, very true? I think yes unless they are over 60 something, then we can help them more. It also depends on if father / mother have separated or not. A Thai man is expected to help the parents of the mother a bit if they are still together but if they are separated then he is only expected to help paying for the mother and the child. A Thai father who earns decent money is expected to support more than a poor father who has problems doing so. It's nice if the father helps the mothers parents a bit also if they are separated but it is not expected actually.

How to define this? I like to do it this way - Everything comes down to respect. Healthy 50 year old parents of the mother not working are not showing the OP respect, a 60 year old father still working carrying 50 kilo cement bags at a construction site probably deserves that we treat him with more respect. Better use the word respect to describe what is "right and wrong", makes it easier to picture what actually is right and wrong...

Everything is up to where the mother lives, if it is rural, city, poor farmer or middle class neghbour hood etc. I'll take the sample with a girl living with her parents in a farmer village in Issan, common scenario. $400 is paying for the mother and the child easily, there is money enough to help the mothers parents life a bit easier too. Father should pay education of the child separately outside this. If he pays this, then the mother and the parents of the mother should all be happy that he is taking his responsibility and is a good man. Some extra money and/or perhaps paying to fix the leaking roof of the house when he comes to visit his child is normal. This sum easily goes up if the environment is less rural, the neighbourhood nicer, it goes up quickly too

On the other hand, someone else wrote something about 15,000 bath per month and being the envy of the whole village and that is certainly also true. It's all depending on environment

My wifes parents live in a farmers village outside Loei, they own some rice land so they do not need to buy rice. I pay them 4,000 bath per month and that helps not only them but also their parents (total 4 people), their lives become easier, they are happy to get some extra help and I am happy to help. On top of this, I do the odd extras (I bought them a new motor cycle several years ago now, paid to tile the floor in the house and fix it up - we are talking about over a 10 year period so it's not much). I pay some extra in the rice season and I always bring or we go out and buy "stuff" when I go there, stocking up on washing powder, meat, whatever. 2,000 bath of things is not much but it goes a long way for them. It makes me happy to see them happy.

I respect them and they respect me and how much do I pay? Average 5,000 bath per month or a bit less probably. This is unthinkable but - Had my wife been living there with her parents with my daughter while I lived somewhere else... then 12,000 bath per month would have made my wife's life easy, wouldn't quite have made her the envy of the village but they would have thought that she is lucky. That would have been enough also for education in the village school and costs associated with that. If I want private school in Loei for my daughter, then I must pay for that and and any additional costs and I would be up to closer to 20,000 bath per month totally or more even (tuition fees separate). The mother and her parents would be happy that I take my responsibility and help and provide well for them and the neighbours (in the environment I talk about) would also think that I provide well. I could have gone there head high, the figures I give will get respect. More money in the environment I describe would not necessarily give more respect because it is not necessary. Then, nicer environment and cost goes up quickly, very quickly, 20,000 could be, 30,000 could be living/renting apartment in a bigger city in Issan, 40,000 would reduce respect getting in return. As a contrast, remember that the law only supports approx 100 bath per day in child alimony and mother and father share education and hospital costs for the child and that wife alimony in Thailand is zero bath, does not exist even. Then, a father loving his child would never pay that little of course

God help that this scenario never happen, I get goose pimples all over only thinking about it...

Edit: added Then, a father loving his child would never pay that little of course

Edited September 22, 2010 by MikeyIdea

[leon1503]

How could you be so mean???

At least 1,000 dollars a month is the right amount.

are you serious with this statement or what. what baby needs 1000 dollors a month in thailand . 500 by right is enought

[leon1503]

Yes. 15,000 bt/month is sufficient for a mother and child to live relatively comfortably in Issan so long as they lived the native lifestyle, but there wouldn't be a much left over for extras. Personally I would want my child to have a bit more in the way of clothes, toys, proper nutrition, games, bicycle, books, be able to go to a movie, a show, an event, a trip, have a computer etc. These things are not really possible on 15,000 bt/month.

We all agree.

I thought 1,000 dollars a month was enough -you've pointed out the error of my way. It should be at least 2.000 dollars a month.

All her friends and family are living on far more and would be horrified if the OP offered less.

what happens if the guy only makes 2000 dollors a month himself in america , how much should he sent to her and the baby then .

[leon1503]

Nice to leave the topic open though, for this important discussion.

heres a question for someone to answer . if i,m a student and work part time how much should i send to my baby and mother in issan .

[MikeyIdea]

Nice to leave the topic open though, for this important discussion.

heres a question for someone to answer . if i,m a student and work part time how much should i send to my baby and mother in issan .

Good question and the answer already lies in the long post I did above, embedded in the respect thing

Both sides should respect each other, if you are a responsible father then you could even take out a loan if you don't have money to provide a living for the child and the mother. If you do not care too much about the chid, then you pay close to legal minimum, I'd say 4,000 bath per month, that is certainly not nice to do in the long run though. A Thai woman coming from a farmers village and who go back there to live with her parents and raise her child would think that a Thai man who paid 6,000 bath per month was decent. I am not saying that these amounts would provide a good living and good future for your child though