Esol And Citezenship Tests

[the scouser]

Terry,

In order to be able to apply for a settlement visa post-29 November 2010, your wife needs to be able to show that she has an English language ability that is at at least A1 level, but only in the speaking and listening elements.

If it is felt that her English is good enough, she can undertake the test whilst in the UK as a visitor. Simply sitting an assessment does not constitute study. There are various bodies whose certificates are recognised by the UKBA, one of which is EMD.

Scouse.

Edited October 23, 2010 by 7by7
Commercial spam removed; only sponsors may use the forums to solicit for business

[scouseterry]

Terry,

In order to be able to apply for a settlement visa post-29 November 2010, your wife needs to be able to show that she has an English language ability that is at at least A1 level, but only in the speaking and listening elements.

If it is felt that her English is good enough, she can undertake the test whilst in the UK as a visitor. Simply sitting an assessment does not constitute study. There are various bodies whose certificates are recognised by the UKBA, one of which is EMD.

Scouse.

my wife will be applying for her leave to remain initial settlement visa in jan 2011 i believe she does not have to undertake any assesment of her english to take the life in the uk computer test! she just makes an appointment pays the fee and takes the test! this test pass qualifies anybody for indefinate leave to remain so should be qualifie her for a leave to remain visa which is 27mths eg a shorter duration than ilr! im just waiting on the embassy in bangkok to confirm at what level of english the life in the uk test is at and also is it sufficient to include in her ile visa apllication on place of the english language requirement ! if she was to take an english assesment and was found to be at level 3 she would have to take the life in the uk anyway and would not be required to show moving up a grade in her english as grade 3 is the highest in the assesment! i await the ukbas reply!

[mark515]

I think the college has got it mixed up a bit.

My wife started her ESOL course a month ago. She has been here about 6 months on her settlement visa.

I had to pay full price for the course. After 12months she will get a discount of 50%. Government funded discount I think.

[the scouser]

my wife will be applying for her leave to remain initial settlement visa in jan 2011 i believe she does not have to undertake any assesment of her english to take the life in the uk computer test! ....

Whilst I can see your point that the Life in the UK test is more "difficult" so should be accepted above an A1 assessment, the Immigration Rules don't actually allow for this. The law states (or will state as of 29 Nov):-

the applicant provides an original English language test certificate in speaking and listening from an English language test provider approved by the Secretary of State for these purposes, which clearly shows the applicant’s name and the qualification obtained (which must meet or exceed level A1 of the Common European Framework of Reference)

The Life in the UK test is not offered by any of the approved test providers, so cannot conceivably meet the above requirement of the Immigration Rules. Indeed, the Life in the UK test is not a language test, but an assessment of a person's knowledge of life in the UK.

If your wife's English is of a sufficiently high standard, she will not need any formal tuition before sitting the language assessment, and as with the Life in the UK test, she can simply make an appointment, turn up and take the test. If you're intent on proceeding on the basis of a pass in the Life in the UK test, I wish you the best of luck, but there is a distinct probability that her settlement application would not even be accepted for consideration.

Scouse.

[Rayongy]

The life in UK is attenable to anyone with ESOL entry level 3. My Mrs passed it with 2-3 weeks study. Its a test of comprehension as far as that goes, certainly not as Scouse said a test of ones English.

[7by7]

I would disagree with the sentiment that the LitUK test is not a test of one's English; for the simple reason that if one's English was not of a certain level (ESOL entry level 3 or better) then one would not be able to understand the study materials nor the test itself and so would not be able to pass.

That one has passed the test shows that one's English is of a certain standard or better.

As Scouse says: "The law states (or will state as of 29 Nov):-

the applicant provides an original English language test certificate in speaking and listening from an English language test provider approved by the Secretary of State for these purposes, which clearly shows the applicant's name and the qualification obtained (which must meet or exceed level A1 of the Common European Framework of Reference)"

However, it also says that one does not need this certificate if one has "obtained an academic qualification (not a professional or vocational qualification) which is deemed by UK NARIC to meet the recognised standard of a Bachelor's degree in the UK and provides the specified evidence to show:

1) he has the qualification, and

2) that the qualification was taught or researched in English"

I am not, of course, saying that the LitUK test is anwhere close to a bachelor's degree! However, it does show that there is more than one way to satisfy this new requirement.

As said, I've contacted both the Home Office and the UKBA on this point. Hopefully one of them will be able to clarify this matter!

[Rayongy]

The lifeinuk is no more a test of English than an NVQ in Child care, a BTEC in masonry or a CG qual in petrochemicals. Yes, one needs a certain level of English to achieve a pass but it is in no way a measure of one's English.

Aside, an A1 qual on the CEF is absolute rock bottom and any Thai with a M3 education should easily jump through that hoop.

I write that as a past senior examiner and current consultant for Cambridge and also having been instrumental in mapping various quals into the CEF

[Rayongy]

This post has been edited by 7by7: 2010-10-23 14:03

Reason for edit: Commercial spam removed; only sponsors may use the forums to solicit for business

And that's another shame. Whilst we the readers do understand the point 7by7, comments like that will scare of folks like Scouse, Bangcockney who are real experts providing free advice. If there is zero advantage for them and they cant attract a little bit of business, then we lose them on the board and the advice then is simply the layman armchair assumptions pushed around some many a bar stool.

[7by7]

This forum runs on the income received from sponsors and advertisers; no sponsorship or advertiser income = no forum.

If other people are going to be allowed to advertise their business for free, why would anyone pay to advertise theirs?

No sponsorship or advertiser income = no forum.

As he is both an ex moderator and an ex sponsor I am sure that Scouse is aware of this.

Rayongy, I have once before reminded you of the rules regarding questioning moderation, i.e. do so by PM to the moderator concerned or by contacting admin but not in the open forum.

Take this as a public warning; do so again and you will earn yourself a suspension.

[Thongkorn]

The life in the UK test , proves nothing , i know of Thai people who live in the UK, along with other foreign nationals , they just remember the questions, then go sit the test , Also there are people on my wifes course who have been in the UK for years, some cannot even speak English , let alone read or write , My question is how do you take the test if you cannot read or write in English. and what does it prove after learning the questions parrot fashion.

[bobrussell]

I would disagree with the sentiment that the LitUK test is not a test of one's English; for the simple reason that if one's English was not of a certain level (ESOL entry level 3 or better) then one would not be able to understand the study materials nor the test itself and so would not be able to pass.

That one has passed the test shows that one's English is of a certain standard or better.

As Scouse says: "The law states (or will state as of 29 Nov):-

the applicant provides an original English language test certificate in speaking and listening from an English language test provider approved by the Secretary of State for these purposes, which clearly shows the applicant's name and the qualification obtained (which must meet or exceed level A1 of the Common European Framework of Reference)"

However, it also says that one does not need this certificate if one has "obtained an academic qualification (not a professional or vocational qualification) which is deemed by UK NARIC to meet the recognised standard of a Bachelor's degree in the UK and provides the specified evidence to show:

1) he has the qualification, and

2) that the qualification was taught or researched in English"

I am not, of course, saying that the LitUK test is anwhere close to a bachelor's degree! However, it does show that there is more than one way to satisfy this new requirement.

As said, I've contacted both the Home Office and the UKBA on this point. Hopefully one of them will be able to clarify this matter!

I would agree that the LitUK test is a test of English - much of the test is straight forward 'learn it for the exam' stuff. You do need a reasonable level of English comprehension to understand sufficiently to learn the facts (sorry not the best English). How, for example do you explain about the Episcopal Church without a fair knowledge of the language?

Not the most useful exam in the world. I failed it twice even using google. Much of it is a matter of learning facts and figures.

[MAJIC]

If she was on a settlement visa there would be no problem , although you would have to pay until your lady /wife had been in the UK for a year , then she would be entitled to education ,My wife was only here for 3 months and enrolled on an ESOL course , But that was on a settlement visa, Now she is on her second ESOL course , because after she has done level 2 she does not have to do the Life in the UK test , As far as i am aware,

Agreed Thongkorn:

That is exactly my understanding as well,having read the UKBA information.

Obtaining a step up to level 2 entitles the applicant to apply for ILR,once the probationary 2 years is up,without having to sit the Life in the UK Test.

[the scouser]

This forum runs on the income received from sponsors and advertisers; no sponsorship or advertiser income = no forum.

There's also an argument that says that no contributions from informed posters = no forum - irrespective of how many sponsors there may be.

Scouse.

[visa2gorayong]

As an advertiser on the Thaivisa Pattaya Forum, we would like to inform members that we are offering the A1 English Test for Settlement visas in Pattaya. For further details, please see our website:

www.visa-2go.com

[7by7]

This forum runs on the income received from sponsors and advertisers; no sponsorship or advertiser income = no forum.

There's also an argument that says that no contributions from informed posters = no forum - irrespective of how many sponsors there may be.

Scouse.

I have this feeling that your opinion on allowing free advertising was somewhat different when you were a sponsor, Scouse!

The rules are clear, only sponsors may promote their business in the forums. End of story.

[Skypist]

It seems as though the ESOL Skills For Life (level 1) course costs approx. £500 at UK colleges. Do any TV members have experience on what government funding is available to partially help with this?

After reading the thread it seems that completing a stage is the best way to obtain KOL for ILR visa with the added benefit of improving English too instead of just memorising facts.

[steve187]

The life in UK is attenable to anyone with ESOL entry level 3. My Mrs passed it with 2-3 weeks study. Its a test of comprehension as far as that goes, certainly not as Scouse said a test of ones English.

Could you pass it first attempt?

[Desertexile]

The life in UK is attenable to anyone with ESOL entry level 3. My Mrs passed it with 2-3 weeks study. Its a test of comprehension as far as that goes, certainly not as Scouse said a test of ones English.

Could you pass it first attempt?

No, hence why I said its attainable. All it requires is a little study. I read the book ahead of time to help the Mrs with translation and I passed it after I had read the materials. My Mrs passed it first time after she had read and studied the materials, she has the required English level.

It really isn't that difficult if the learner is of that standard of English and is reasonable trainable. Ive seen Thais with a M3 and even a P6 education pass it first time.

I really dont know what the fuss is about. Either way, even if the English level is very low, just study entry level 1 to 2 to illustrate some progress but how a couple can communicate with just A1 standard English is beyond me!!!

[scouseterry]

Terry,

In order to be able to apply for a settlement visa post-29 November 2010, your wife needs to be able to show that she has an English language ability that is at at least A1 level, but only in the speaking and listening elements.

If it is felt that her English is good enough, she can undertake the test whilst in the UK as a visitor. Simply sitting an assessment does not constitute study. There are various bodies whose certificates are recognised by the UKBA, one of which is EMD.

Scouse.

hi so she cab just sit a test with a college or buisness that is acredited by emd eg english a1 level ! and if she passes and supplies the certificate with her leave to enter initial 27month

settlement visa ! she will not have to show herself monving up a level in her english, and does not have to give any further proof of her english standard! thanks for your reply!