Basements In Thailand?

[floridaguy]

I am debating whether to buy or build next year, and have a question about basements. In most of the United States, most homes have basements. Goes back to storing canned and cured foods during the winters. Now we like to call it a mancave and put our pool tables, home theater systems, dart boards, stocked bars, and such down there and the men like to hang out and we usually put the laundry room there to get that eyesore out of the way of the public areas of the house.

I have yet to see one here. I understand that the raining is a big factor, along with where the house is. But do any of you have a basement? How did you have it built, or did it come that way? Was it hard to find a contractor or supplier to do it? Do you have moisture/flooding/mold/mildew/vermin problems?

[metisdead]

The main reason why there aren't any basements here is that there is a very shallow water table in pretty much most of the country. You don't have to dig very deep to encounter water.

[longball53098]

The history of basement/cellar building in the US is more than just storage of veggies and pool tables. Without doing any research and just talking from my own "local" knowledge from living most of my life in and around the northern climates of the US.

Basements came in to popularity I think yes from the need for root cellars but also because in the more northern climates and the introduction of modern building codes the need for a footing/foundation that was impervious to the heavy ground freeze/thaw cycles and preventing a foundation from "heaving". You will not normally see basements in dwellings in the southern and western parts of the US mainly due to building codes not requiring the footings to be as deep as in the north.

The builders took advantage of this now required hole in the ground and for a few extra bucks back in the old days added a couple more feet in height and created another usable space for furnaces and other needs. The added expense to the house construction was not that big in the days when costs were not too high. Dating myself I can clearly remember back in the late forties and early fifties the houses we lived in had basements but were very low by today's standards. But this area became the playground, laundry, canned goods storage and furnace area and winter time work space for the DIY'r.

I would say you don't see basements here for a couple of reasons. One already said is the high water table and the other is most obvious the cost to build such an area. Generally Thai houses were built on stilts above the ground to protect the furnishings from water damage and the occupants from all the creepy crawlies and other things. Much cheaper & easier to build up.

Just a few observations and as said this is IMHO.

[gotlost]

Also look at the typical traditional Thai house design. It is constructed on supports that raise the house up approximately 2.5 meters off the ground. One of the main reasons for this flooding. This idea has carried over to new western designed house building as most new homes are of the two story design. the thought is you always can go to the 2nd floor because of flooding. If you look at the devastation of the communities around Korat due to flooding at the moment you would understand better why we do not have basements in Thailand.

[floridaguy]

The history of basement/cellar building in the US is more than just storage of veggies and pool tables. Without doing any research and just talking from my own "local" knowledge from living most of my life in and around the northern climates of the US.

Basements came in to popularity I think yes from the need for root cellars but also because in the more northern climates and the introduction of modern building codes the need for a footing/foundation that was impervious to the heavy ground freeze/thaw cycles and preventing a foundation from "heaving". You will not normally see basements in dwellings in the southern and western parts of the US mainly due to building codes not requiring the footings to be as deep as in the north.

The builders took advantage of this now required hole in the ground and for a few extra bucks back in the old days added a couple more feet in height and created another usable space for furnaces and other needs. The added expense to the house construction was not that big in the days when costs were not too high. Dating myself I can clearly remember back in the late forties and early fifties the houses we lived in had basements but were very low by today's standards. But this area became the playground, laundry, canned goods storage and furnace area and winter time work space for the DIY'r.

I would say you don't see basements here for a couple of reasons. One already said is the high water table and the other is most obvious the cost to build such an area. Generally Thai houses were built on stilts above the ground to protect the furnishings from water damage and the occupants from all the creepy crawlies and other things. Much cheaper & easier to build up.

Just a few observations and as said this is IMHO.

I was simplifying the purpose of the basement. I too grew up in the northern part of the US. I lived in Michigan for 35 years, and most houses had basements, with the majority of those finished.

[trogers]

Do not build a basement unless you have access to ready-mixed concrete.

[floridaguy]

Also look at the typical traditional Thai house design. It is constructed on supports that raise the house up approximately 2.5 meters off the ground. One of the main reasons for this flooding. This idea has carried over to new western designed house building as most new homes are of the two story design. the thought is you always can go to the 2nd floor because of flooding. If you look at the devastation of the communities around Korat due to flooding at the moment you would understand better why we do not have basements in Thailand.

There are many regions of Thailand that differ from the others. The mountainous regions around northern Thailand, such as Chiang Mai, and some regions even in Nakon Ratchasima. Those areas are elevated and well above the water table. Those houses that are flooded out in Korat are due to most houses and communities are farming communities which build around water, such as the river. They rely on farming for their survival and livelihood. I believe there are no basements because of several factors, the raining and low ground around farming communities, and also that basements are more a western construct and have not been brought over here.

I like the idea of a basement or split level walkout for the same reason most people like multi-level houses, and that is to maximize your living space in the confines of your house footprint. Basements serve another purpose that would be very useful for Thailand's heat and that is to provide a place of coolness during hot days. The temperature in basements can be 10 degrees cooler than the outside temperature. This amounts to free air-conditional, saving energy and costs.

[retiredusn]

Since dirt/rock is a norm for fill why not encase a area in concret first then fill in around it, this should take care of the water table in any area.........

[Pib]

As wet as Thai soil is year round a person would almost need to build a swimming pool first and then build the house on top of the swimming pool to have any hopes of keeping the water out. Here in my Bangkok mooban they are still building western style homes and they seem to put in the foundations only during the dry season which is coming up.

But before they lay the concrete foundation they press many concrete poles approx 15 feet in length into the gound...then they lay the concrete foundation on top of the poles which have been pressed in to ground level. They use a large/long metal spike (pretty much looks like a 15 foot long railroad spike to create the hole which is just a little smaller than the concrete poles....the backhoe just presses the spike into the ground like a toothpick going into jello....then they pull out the spike with the backhoe and press in the concrete poles. When I say how easily the metal spike and concrete poles were pressed into the ground by a medium size backhoe it quickly painted a picture for me of just how wet the ground is even during dry season....and this wetness goes way down.

As mentioned, the ground is just too wet...water tabe too low to have a basement unless you do some serious, serious waterproofing and special foundation work. Seems it would almost be like laying the foundation for underground level of a highrise building...thick concrete walls and waterproofing...and just hope you don't get cracks in the concrete wall.

[johnnyk]

Heaving and cracking from the freeze-thaw cycle is the main reason for basements (I grew up in Quebec, we know about this sh!t). Root cellars and man caves are by-products.

Not a lot of basements in southern Florida either, for the same reason as Thailand - water.

[Pib]

Not a lot of basements in the northern Florida area, specifically the panhandle area of Pensocola and Ft Walton Beach. In fact I don't remember any of the houses of my friends/family in that area having basements...being at sealevel the water table was only a few feet down. Heck, some people couldn't even have sewer drain fields because the water level was too high.

I asked the head constructuion engineer in charge of building houses here in my Bangkok moobaan if any of the moobaan's 200 hundred or so houses have basements and he said no because the ground stays too wet.

[lopburi3]

From a recent view of old CSI Miami there were only six residences in the Miami area with basements (elevated 27 feet above sea level). Having lived there can confirm slab is normal.

[quiksilva]

As mentioned, water is the principal reason, I know of some high rises that do have basements (or say subterranean water tanks.. yes its a stupid design). The walls constantly suffer from ground water seepage and need frequent resealing.

So it is possible but it is not in any way practical.

[frankie52]

My house was finished last year (2010) with a basement, or as I call it a semi-cellar. So called because the house is built on 1m 20 columns above ground and the basement floor is 1m 20 below ground so it's strictly speaking not a true basement but as it's on the North facing side of the house is noticeably cooler that the above-ground rooms.

Building it was fairly straight forward. I extended the footings a further 30cms, from 1m 20 to 1m 50, around where I wanted the basement and just built it in poured concrete, which had a suitable water-proofing agent added, below ground and concrete slabs, rendered, above ground. The dimensions are 4m x 7m with a height of 2m 40 except where the floor beams of the house extend into it.

The house is on a slope so is well drained although it took a while for me to fully divert the surface drainging water to allow me to have a basement rather than an underground swimming pool. Since solving the flooding problem I have not noticed any water seepage although the rainy season this year will be the true test.

Hope this information is of some use.

[sezze]

Water like said b4 is the main reason . 2nd is the cost of build and 3th is how it is build and nr 4 is general size .

nr 1 you know the rain , but 2nd , any water in cannot get out easy and might host some unwelcome guests ( snakes, scorpions etc ) .

nr2 building is near same the nr3 , buildings in Thailand , if normal are not build on the same foundation as in the Western world . Foundation normal in Thailand consists of a hole in the ground where a concrete pole put in . If you build a basement then it needs to be deeper , so even more chance af having water . Also , the deeper the lowest level , it needs to be dug out , in most cases by human labour . Meaning very high workcosts .

nr4 is part of the design of the houses . Most houses are not that big ( why need it ) it is easier and cheaper to build ground level alone and if necessary go up 1 lvl rather then go down 1 lvl .

[bbradsby]

The previous postings about freeze heave and the need to dig deep to get the foundation below this line are correct. It can be eight feet below grade in the Northern US! Even with an elevated building site - no water table issues - building out or up will be cheaper by far than building the [hopefully] waterproof concrete bunker that is a basement. If you seek the coolness of the mancave, just spend a little on insulation {on the warm side of your wall] and keep the sun off your walls.

[wolf5370]

I suppose a man made hill covering a lower room or even turf over (like those eco houses) would be OK - with suitable soakaways - still above the water table- the groand level could even be raised (again with good soaks) on one side (fornt projection?) perhaps for cosmetics. This would allow for a nice cool room, but would basically be a 2 story bungalow or 3 story house with the lowest level buried. Could look attractive if done right - could even have a drop away drive and have a "below ground" garage/workroom to keep the car cool.