Remembrance Day

[Tonto21]

@transam

Only one person ever died for me, his name was Jesus.

Please don't suggest differently.

Sarahsbloke! I think this is a gender thing for you, “Boys will be boys” a! Men beating there chests with clubs and stuff. The remembrance day is probably one of the few times each year that many think about the folly of war, not glorify it. I don't think you get it....Do you? As for no one dying for you, well OK, not directly, but you do like to swim against the tide a lot on TV.......How long do you think you would have lasted against the nazis on you own?

[lovelomsak]

To have taken part in WW1, you would need to be over 100 years old.

To have taken part in WW2, you would have to be over 80 years old.

The only living person I know of, who took part is the current Pope, a former member of the Hitler youth who participated by helping shoot down allied aircraft.

Do we need to be reminded each year, how 'evil the Germans' were, how 'cruel the Japanese' were.

How much longer will remembrance day continue?

How relevant is it to a Thailand forum?

Surely time to forgive and forget!

What do German and Japanese members of TV think of this thread?

I had written a longer post on my 1st go around but opted for a 1 liner because I figured most people would understand. Unfortunately, it seems you do not get it, so I am going to give you a response that will perhaps impress upon you why some of us remember.

1. One of my family members served in the trenches in WWI. He was a simple factory worker in civilian life. He did his duty and watched the gas warfare. Another of my relatives was in the German army on the eastern front, drafted out of medical school. He had no idea what he was doing and left Germany right after the war because he couldn't handle what he called the descent into madness.

2. In WWII, I am grateful that my family member survived the Battle of the Gulf of the St Lawrence and North Atlantic because the German U boats had been sinking any and all shipping, including civilian non combatant vessels, in Canadian waters. From the start of the Japanese involvement until early 1943, the RCN and RCAF was the only thing between between the Germans and North America as the US had moved most of its assets to the west coast to defend against the Japanese. The Canadians were the ones running 40% of the convoys that kept Great Britain alive until the US Liberty ship program got into full swing. Thousands of Canadian and British sailors and merchant marine crew drowned or burnt to death during those convoys. Hundreds of Australians, South Africans and New Zelanders were flying out of Canada keeping those convoys going, keeping Great Britain alive and bringing orphans and other children to safety.. Many died when their boats were sunk by U boats. They are deserving of respect.

When I see the sacrifice of the men made in my father's and grandfather's regiment made on the ground in Europe, some of whome were shot in the back after capture, I remember. I remember the kindness and compassion shown by US servicemen when they liberated the Nazi concentration camps.

3. My great uncle had been a young rmedical resident in the US when the Japanese attacked. He volunteered for service in the South Pacific and was on hand when POWS were liberated from the camps. He wouldn't talk about it and I always thought he was such a quiet and kind guy. I only found out after he died that he was screwed up because of all the time spent with those POWs and the Japanese concentration camp survivors. I remember the US POWs and the Commonwealth servicemen that survived the Japanese death camps, all but forgotten by the general public. The Canadian veterans of the Hong Kong catastrophe never received the apology or redress they deserved for the years of torture and suffering they received in the Japanese POW camps. I remember the tens of thousands of Chinese citizens that were sacrificed in cruel sadistic Japanese experiments to see how much pain could be inflicted or to wtach the effect of gangrene or to see if someone could survive with missing parts. etc. etc.

I am grateful for the sacrifice of US and Commonwealth forces that liberated part of my family from the Japanese occupation in China. The Japanese were not very nice to some of my family members.

4. I give thanks because I never had to deal with thousands of communists running at undermanned undergunned positions in Korea or in being so overwhelmed that one was dropping arillery barrages into allied positions. At least that family member came back alive.

5. I remember my classmates that served in the Persian Gulf and in Afghanistan. I give thanks that I never had to go through what they did.

7. Whenever I look at the images of the WWI and WWII tombstones, I note the ages. 17, 18, 19, 20, 21. All so young. All so many from small towns and villages. All that they could have been or might have been stopped, so that an insensitive prat like you could say, why should they be remembered, and what does their sacrifice matter. They died so that you could sit there and disrespect them. Sorry, but too many members of my family have done their duty for King and Country and all my freedoms and all my rights today I owe them.

Sarahsbloke, if you want to be an arse and play the devil's advocate, take it to another thread please.

Thank you I wasnot capable of saying what you said but am so thankful for what you let sarhabloke know. .And yes i too hope he takes his devils advocate role somewhere else.

[roamer]

Seems like the followers of Mohammad also bear a grudge.....

Millions fall silent to remember war dead

(UKPA) – 50 minutes ago

Millions on Britons fell silent on Thursday led by services in London to remember those who have died in war.

But in the capital the solemn moment was marred by a small group of protesters styling themselves Muslims Against Crusades, who burned a model of a poppy.

As the clock struck 11am, the nation paused to mark the anniversary of Armistice Day, when peace returned to Europe at the end of the First World War. The agreement between Germany and the Allies after four years of fighting took effect at the "eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month" of 1918.

Wearing their poppies with pride, people joined in the two-minute silence as various commemoration services and events were held around the country.

The protest, in Exhibition Road, Kensington, involved about 30 people. About 50 counter demonstrators gathered nearby but the two sides were kept apart by police. Police clashed briefly with members of the Muslims Against Crusades group at one stage and at least one man was dragged to the floor and arrested. But order was quickly restored as officers completely surrounded the small group. Three men were arrested at the scene.

Three men were arrested at the scene in Exhibition Road, Kensington. Two were for public order offences and one for assaulting a police officer. Around 50 counter demonstrators from the English Defence League gathered nearby but officers kept the two sides apart. As the clock struck 11am the Islamic protesters burned a model of a poppy and chanted "British soldiers burn in hel_l".

Asad Ullah, of Muslims Against Crusades, said: "We are demonstrating because this day is a day of remembrance to remember every single fallen soldier, including those killed in Afghanistan and Iraq. We find it disgusting that innocent people, innocent children, have been killed in an illegal and unjust war and we are demonstrating against that.

"We want the Government to pull the troops out from these countries and to stop interfering in our affairs. We would like to have a protest closer to the memorial but it is difficult to get access. We want to break the silence and say: 'what about the silence for others that have died?'"

Defence Secretary Liam Fox and the Archbishop of Canterbury Dr Rowan Williams joined war heroes, service personnel, veterans, military associations and schoolchildren for a service of remembrance at the Cenotaph in Whitehall, central London. The road was closed and crowds lined the street for the poignant ceremony and wreath-laying. Amid grey skies and damp conditions, there was applause as Victoria and George Cross holders took their places around the monument.

Among those attending was Lance Corporal Matt Croucher, of the Royal Marines Reserve, who was awarded the George Cross for bravery after he threw himself on to a bomb to smother the explosion while serving in Afghanistan in February 2008. The 26-year-old, from Birmingham, survived the blast unhurt. He said: "Even without the medals it's great there is so much support. People in the military don't really ask for much but just to have the support of the crowds here, it means a lot more than anything else."

Copyright © 2010 The Press Association. All rights reserved.

[JUDAS]

A excellent, well written and moving post geriatrickid. Emphasizes the meaning and importance of Remembrance Day so much better than I could. Thank you.

[Indo-Siam]

"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself."

- John Stuart Mill (1806 - 1873)

[Tinkelbell]

I'm a strong support of war veterans. Anyone who sacrifies one life for his country or dying for doing a noble cause is a hero in my eyes.

When in Thailand I would go to 'ong gan ta harn paan suek' ( veteran hospital).

After living in the US more than 20+ yr, I've been supporting 'Disabled American Veterans' in all these years by sending them a check annually, and go watching the parade held in my area, so I can see my heroes in person.

On THIS day, I never fail to put up an American flag display in front of my house.

[GrahamF]

To have taken part in WW1, you would need to be over 100 years old.

To have taken part in WW2, you would have to be over 80 years old.

The only living person I know of, who took part is the current Pope, a former member of the Hitler youth who participated by helping shoot down allied aircraft.

Do we need to be reminded each year, how 'evil the Germans' were, how 'cruel the Japanese' were.

How much longer will remembrance day continue?

How relevant is it to a Thailand forum?

Surely time to forgive and forget!

What do German and Japanese members of TV think of this thread?

I had written a longer post on my 1st go around but opted for a 1 liner because I figured most people would understand. Unfortunately, it seems you do not get it, so I am going to give you a response that will perhaps impress upon you why some of us remember.

1. One of my family members served in the trenches in WWI. He was a simple factory worker in civilian life. He did his duty and watched the gas warfare. He wasn't a soldier. Another of my relatives was in the German army on the eastern front, drafted out of medical school. He had no idea what he was doing and left Germany right after the war because he couldn't handle what he called the descent into madness. He was an idealistic socialist. He wasn't a soldier.

2. In WWII, I am grateful that my family member survived the Battle of the Gulf of the St Lawrence and North Atlantic because the German U boats had been sinking any and all shipping, including civilian non combatant vessels, in Canadian waters. From the start of the Japanese involvement until early 1943, the RCN and RCAF was the only thing between between the Germans and North America as the US had moved most of its assets to the west coast to defend against the Japanese. The Canadians were the ones running 40% of the convoys that kept Great Britain alive until the US Liberty ship program got into full swing. Thousands of Canadian and British sailors and merchant marine crew drowned or burnt to death during those convoys. Hundreds of Australians, South Africans and New Zelanders were flying out of Canada keeping those convoys going, keeping Great Britain alive and bringing orphans and other children to safety.. Many died when their boats were sunk by U boats. They are deserving of respect.

When I see the sacrifice of the men in my father's and grandfather's regiment made on the ground in Europe, some of whom were shot in the back after capture, I remember

. I remember the kindness and compassion shown by US servicemen when they liberated the Nazi concentration camps.

3. My great uncle had been a young rmedical resident in the US when the Japanese attacked. He volunteered for service in the South Pacific and was on hand when POWS were liberated from the camps. He wouldn't talk about it and I always thought he was such a quiet and kind guy. I only found out after he died that he was screwed up because of all the time spent with those POWs and the Japanese concentration camp survivors. I remember the US POWs and the Commonwealth servicemen that survived the Japanese death camps, all but forgotten by the general public. The Canadian veterans of the Hong Kong catastrophe never received the apology or redress they deserved for the years of torture and suffering they received in the Japanese POW camps. I remember the tens of thousands of Chinese citizens that were sacrificed in cruel sadistic Japanese experiments to see how much pain could be inflicted or to wtach the effect of gangrene or to see if someone could survive with missing parts. etc. etc.

I am grateful for the sacrifice of US and Commonwealth forces that liberated part of my family from the Japanese occupation in China. The Japanese were not very nice to some of my family members.

4. I give thanks because I never had to deal with thousands of communists running at undermanned undergunned positions in Korea or in being so overwhelmed that one was dropping arillery barrages into allied positions. At least that family member came back alive.

5. I remember my classmates that served in the Persian Gulf and in Afghanistan. I give thanks that I never had to go through what they did.

6. Whenever I look at the images of the WWI and WWII tombstones, I note the ages. 17, 18, 19, 20, 21. All so young. All so many from small towns and villages. All that they could have been or might have been stopped, so that an insensitive prat like you could say, why should they be remembered, and what does their sacrifice matter. They died so that you could sit there and disrespect them. Sorry, but too many members of my family have done their duty for King and Country and all my freedoms and all my rights today I owe them.

Sarahsbloke, if you want to be an arse and play the devil's advocate, take it to another thread please.

Excellent post GK, thank you.

I can only add that my mother was liberated from the Nazi camps by the Russians and she was overwhelmed by the kindness and generosity of the Russians as well. Please understand that I am not talking about the Russian government here, just the regular soldiers that we honor today. According to my Mom, these battle hardened veterans of the Eastern Front "broke down in tears" when they first encountered the concentration camps, out of pity and anger.

[mark131v]

In answer to your posts

War is wrong, there is no justification for killing another human being for any reason.

Thou shalt not kill

Make love, not war.

SB

you are very, very naive I would love the world to be that way but human nature will not let that happen. The only reason people like you are free to be naive is because other people give their lives to allow you that freedom.

Mark

[cdnvic]

In answer to your posts

War is wrong, there is no justification for killing another human being for any reason.

Thou shalt not kill

Make love, not war.

Almost childlike in it`s naivety.

Nobody here is glorifying war. The unfortunate part of life is that there will always be evil, and thanks to people like our fathers, grandfathers, and others who were brave enough to give their lives standing against it, you can lead a comfortable, free existence, free to view the world as a place full of simple, easy answers.

That there are people who willingly stand up to protect that freedom is what we honour. Not war.

[cdnvic]

I removed some inflammatory stuff that doesn`t belong here. Take it to another topic.

[slapout]

The vast majority of families where I grew up had lost relatives or acquaintances in various conflicts, thus a day to remember that freedom as enjoyed today, has extracted a terrible price in fallen, disabled, and even those who returned with no physical scars, to ensure and maintain that freedom.

As seen via some of the posts on this topic, some people seem to have forgotten/ignored/dismissed the sacrifice that so many have made.

[carmine]

To have taken part in WW1, you would need to be over 100 years old.

To have taken part in WW2, you would have to be over 80 years old.

The only living person I know of, who took part is the current Pope, a former member of the Hitler youth who participated by helping shoot down allied aircraft.

Do we need to be reminded each year, how 'evil the Germans' were, how 'cruel the Japanese' were.

How much longer will remembrance day continue?

How relevant is it to a Thailand forum?

Surely time to forgive and forget!

What do German and Japanese members of TV think of this thread?

There are times when it is better to keep one's thoughts to oneself. You really need to learn this.

I would add that your grammar is extremely good for a twelve year old.

Edited November 12, 2010 by carmine

[Kwasaki]

Nice one, cheers.

[sillyman99]

Some people who choose to live in Britain actually burnt a large poppy.

They're lucky the backlash in Britain wouldn't be the same if a similar protest was made by foreigners in their home country.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1328703/The-boy-brimming-pride-fanatics-burning-hate--faces-Armistice-Day.html

[sillyman99]

These people can't or don't want a life in their native land, they want the trappings of real free life, but they must show hate for what they want, if that makes sense.

.

Is that the same for Farangs who chose to live in Thailand and do nothing but pour scorn on Thai people and Thailand yet continue to live here ?

[Kwasaki]

enough said.:jap:

This was great thanks for posting.

When things about war come up l automatically remember mum and dad and the things they would say.

My dad never spoke much about the war but when he did it was always interesting and l listen intently there were so many great stories he would tell.

Remember my mum always saying about diving under the big oak table with my brother we had when the bombing started, when with friends or family lighting a cigarette from a match mum would say, " No never offer anyone the third Light ".

My mum was one of 10 when war started, after they were only 5.

My dad was one of 9 and became one of 5.

If you haven't watch the video above it's well worth the watch.

[waza]

To give a Thai flavour to rememberance day, it is conducted in Ubon, at a memorial erected by Aussie service men that were based there. It is attended by both Thai and expats.

Lest we forget

Edited November 12, 2010 by waza

[slapout]

These people can't or don't want a life in their native land, they want the trappings of real free life, but they must show hate for what they want, if that makes sense.

.

Is that the same for Farangs who chose to live in Thailand and do nothing but pour scorn on Thai people and Thailand yet continue to live here ?

The mindset of the individuals may have similarities, but the object of their scorn appear to have nothing in common.In fact scorn may be a bit harsh as far as their feelings. Possibly, frustration would be a better description.

[cdnvic]

Let`s leave it at that for this year.