Bangkok Red Shirt Rally To Be Peaceful: Jatuporn

[barryofthailand]

I have a question. How can they hold a political demonstration when their is still a state of Emergency in the province of Bangkok?

Barry

[jdinasia]

I have a question. How can they hold a political demonstration when their is still a state of Emergency in the province of Bangkok?

Barry

The SoE allows for peaceful protests if the people are not "ill intentioned" -- it also allows for the right to protest to be suspended without proof of ill-intent. As long as the reds maintain a semblance of order AND disperse afterwards they will be allowed to protest.

[ianbaggie]

take a look at this if you want to see an unbalanced view

compared to this the thai Visa forum is totally balanced

[rubl]

trying to get a balanced view of the Red philosophy from most of the forum members is like trying to fly a kite on a windless day.... hard work

Not easy to find 'good points' about the Red philosophy as has been displayed earlier this year. With interesting people like k. Jatuporn stating on stage 'we will fight to our last drop of blood' and through actions seem to have meant other's blood, one may wonder. The grenade attacks during March - May with non-reds casualties and the bonfire at the end makes it difficult to see a philosophy I can admire.

What all those (explicit deleted) have done is distract the attention from the real grass-root cause of disaffection. Even k. Somyos with a modified vision transcending k. Thaksin has an image problem as long as 'reds' and 'red-shirts' are associated with 'grenade attacks', 'burning BKK', etc. Maybe he should start looking for a new name for the movement.

[Skywalker69]

There are 4 sentences you can skip in this paper. They start with "Jatuporn says...", "Jatuporn promised..." or "Jatuporn declares...".

100% vacuum.

So very true!!

[Xangsamhua]

"Why do we have the emergency law? It is to limit the people's freedom," Somyot Pruksakasemsuk, a leading protester for Friday's rally, told AFP.

"We have the right to express our feelings."

As in the burning and the looting of buildings the interference with the daily lives of uninvolved citizens along with the prolonged closure of schools due to the protest.

What a wonderful ideal Somyot Pruksakasemsuk has of , ''freedom.''

Freedom is for all, not just a few individuals who were being funded by a criminal to further his, and his family along with their acolytes own ends.

Should also note the threat from Somyot (often transliterated as Somyos) made earlier:

A red-shirt leader warned Thursday certain red-shirt people may turn suicide bombers to avenge the government crackdowns and fight for democracy.

The warning was made by Somyos Prueksakasemsuk

Red Shirt Faction Leader Warns Some Red Shirts May Become Suicide Bombers

http://www.thaivisa....uicide-bombers/

Additionally, Somyot's publication, Red Power,

depicts what a wonderful ideal Somyot Pruksakasemsuk has of , ''freedom'' and "democracy."

Impressive cover for "Red Power". I wonder if he is inspired by Lenin's teaching on hate: "We must hate; hatred is the basis of communism". (V. I. Lenin Defeat of One's Own Government in Imperialist War, 1915.)

Perhaps Khun Somyos doesn't know the saying: "Revolution is a mother who eats her own children".

[Robby nz]

I have a question. How can they hold a political demonstration when their is still a state of Emergency in the province of Bangkok?

Barry

Its called freedom of speech mate.

But hang on dont the reds say this country has none of that?

Must be something wrong somewhere.

[rubl]

From http://www.tannetwork.tv/tan/ViewData.aspx?DataID=1037595

Red-shirts Gather at Ratchaprasong, Traffic at Standstill

UPDATE : 19 November 2010

The red-shirt group has gathered at the Ratchaprasong intersection for activities to commemorate the 6 months of the crackdown on their rally on May 19.

Traffic is at a standstill in the area and motorists are urged to avoid commute there or to use the BTS. Ratchadamri Road is closed off to traffic. Shopping malls there remain have decided to close early but the BTS will be opened as usual until midnight.

The rally is set to end at 8 PM.

[barrybankruad]

Well, 10,000 protesters on a Friday at Ratchaprasong! Maybe I should take a day off rather than get stuck in traffic.

That's described as "snarling" traffic in the American notice.

It was interesting to observe the news during the floods in the south and the NE. The people in the south interviewed said they will find their own solutions on their own and take care of themselves. All the ones from Korat all wanted handouts from the government and compensation. Speaks for itself live on channel 3 just what sort of people are being bred up there.

Can't believe they are still going at it over this red shirt silliness, and all the credibility they've all lost. They need a new way of thinking.

They have a way of thinking that will remain. ' I am p1ss poor and do not want my children to go through life the same as me' We all confuse the red shirt leadership with the plight of its followers. The leadership is hel_l bent on wrestling power from the sitting incumbents, then abuse the system the way every other person in power does. The leadership needs the followers and visa versa. The followers have a social issue that will not go away, they want a better life. They want good schools, hospitals and jobs near where they live. These people have been abused as the immigrant workforce of Thailand to fill the big mans factories in places like Rayong ). Family life as a unit is all but destroyed because family members have to go away to work. If you dont agree with red politics thats fine but only a heartless person cannot recognise the plight of these people. Why have successive governments ignored the facts, the area needs massive investments.

Companies wanting to do business in Thailand should be encouraged to set up shop in poorer areas. Have you ever wondered why they build factories in the south then move the workforce from the North and North east to fill the factories.(and dont reply its because of the ports). Which farang on here originates from a country that does not give all sorts of incentives for international companies to set up in deprived areas that has the skills required (minimal). Documented on the net 'State within the State' How Thailand does business. Go google it you may start to understand what most poor people in Thailand already know

You forgot to add that the unscrupulous employers use cheap and often illegal Burmese and Cambodian labour with which the Thai have to compete.

[rubl]

8:07 PM the last twitters have it the red-shirts started dispersing about 7:15PM and traffic was soon back to 'friday evening' normal. Maybe slightly better with many having avoided the area. Rumour has it McDonald's had a field day ( http://twitpic.com/385frx )

Latest from http://twitter.com/tulsathit a few minutes ago 'Well, it was not 100% peaceful. Just as red shirts were dispersing, a big firecracker exploded in front of Grand Hyatt Erawan, injuring 1.'

(Add PS: probably just a fool)

Edited November 19, 2010 by rubl

[webfact]

'Red Shirts' end rally at Ratchaprasong peacefully; mark end of April-May protests

BANGKOK, Nov 19 -- Thailand's anti-government 'Red Shirt' United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) movement peacefully ended their rally to mark the six-onth anniversary of the forced ending by state security forces of the group's protest against the government earlier this year at Ratchaprasong intersection.

Ratchaprasong, a prime Bangkok commercial area, was the central venue of the anti-government protests last April-May.

The UDD started their symbolic gathering at 6.06pm on the streets near the CentralWorld shopping complex -- said to be Asia's largest -- and the numbers of the protesters built up to occupy the entire intersection, blocking traffic. Police tried unsuccessfully to contain the crowd of demonstrators and opened one lane for traffic to pass through.

Key UDD leader Jatuporn Prompan also joined the rally, asserting that the Red Shirts would not protest at the same time that its rival -- the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) planned to protest against the charter amendments.

The PAD Yellow Shirts on Friday announced their intention to rally at Parliament next week, from Tuesday through Thursday, to oppose the charter amendment drafts scheduled for deliberation by the joint session of Parliament during the period, and pledged to continue its protest there until all amendments have been withdrawn or rejected.

Fifteen hundred police were deployed at Ratchaprasong and nearby late in the afternoon to ensure law and order.

Police said protesters vandalising public property around Ratchaprasong intersection would be prosecuted.

The group started their activities Friday morning at Bangkok Remand Prison, demanding that the Red Shirt protesters still being detained on charges of violating the emergency decree be released.

Then they moved to the headquarters of the Department of Special Investigation (DSI) calling for fair treatment and justice for the deaths of 89 people during the April-May unrest.

The UDD supporters protested at DSI for about an hour and a half, they dispersed at noon and proceeded to Ratchaprasong intersection for their evening activities.

The Red Shirt rally in downtown Bangkok ended May 19 after the Red Shirt leaders announced the end of the over ten-week long protest and surrendered to police as heavily-armed soldiers sealed off their protest area. Most key protest leaders remain in detention under terrorism charges and their bail has been rejected, with the court cited their possible flight to avoid prosecution.

Only Mr Jatuporn, who is an MP for the Puea Thai Party, was granted bail as he has parliamentary immunity.

Eighty-nine persons, both security personnel and protesters, were killed and more than 1,900 were injured in several clashes between the troops and the UDD members during April and May. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2010-11-19

[tominbkk]

http://twitpic.com/383mz3 Red shirts at Klong Prem prison today. /RT @tulsathit /RT @naelkung

wow there must be at least 20 of them!

[tominbkk]

The lame UDD supporters protested at DSI for about an hour and a half, they dispersed at noon and proceeded to Ratchaprasong intersection for their evening activities of som tum and ya dong.

-- TNA 2010-11-19

Great! Glad they had fun, and see them next year for another commemoration!

[phiphidon]

The lame UDD supporters protested at DSI for about an hour and a half, they dispersed at noon and proceeded to Ratchaprasong intersection for their evening activities of som tum and ya dong.

-- TNA 2010-11-19

Great! Glad they had fun, and see them next year for another commemoration!

Are there not rules against modifying quotes? I refer of course to your amusing addition "evening activities of som tum and ya dong." ROFL.

By the way the 20 odd joined the rest at Ratchaprasong as this link shows; http://www.daylife.c...ovember+19+2010

[SoftWater]

I have several questions:

Do they have charismatic leaders that can forge a coalition of support from a broad cross-section of society?

Do they have nationwide support among any given class of people (let's say 'the low-paid', for example)?

Do they have any constructive policies for how to change the many and varied ills that they complain about?

If the answer to all the above is NO, is it possible that they could be just a bunch of economically-disadvantaged people from one part of Thailand being manipulated by a bunch of other economically-privileged people who'd like to get even more privileges than they currently enjoy?

I mean, I don't know. I'm just asking.

Edited November 19, 2010 by SoftWater

[rubl]

One thing that really puzzles me is that over the last week I've seen casualty numbers vary from 91 to 'more than 90', to 89 and back to 91. I guess just commemorating the fallen will be easier than to let the press agree on a absolute number

[Xangsamhua]

By the way the 20 odd joined the rest at Ratchaprasong as this link shows; http://www.daylife.c...ovember+19+2010

Don't know how far the crowd in the picture goes back beyond the intersection, but I can see about 1000 - 1500 people there. The crowd is quite loosely packed. How many do the media and police say there were?

[KunMatt]

Not easy to find 'good points' about the Red philosophy as has been displayed earlier this year. With interesting people like k. Jatuporn stating on stage 'we will fight to our last drop of blood' and through actions seem to have meant other's blood, one may wonder. The grenade attacks during March - May with non-reds casualties and the bonfire at the end makes it difficult to see a philosophy I can admire.

Totally agree. One thing that stands out in my memory about the riots earlier this year were the Red Shirts protesting under banners saying "We are not terrorists, we are peaceful protestors" while the same day launching grenades into the BTS and killing innocent commuters, setting off bombs, shooting pedestrians and tourching a large part of the city.

That and them rejecting the offer of elections in September and changing their demands, only proving that their original goals were all lies.

[DP25]

I have several questions:

Do they have charismatic leaders that can forge a coalition of support from a broad cross-section of society?

Do they have nationwide support among any given class of people (let's say 'the low-paid', for example)?

Do they have any constructive policies for how to change the many and varied ills that they complain about?

No, no, and no

[ianbaggie]

trying to get a balanced view of the Red philosophy from most of the forum members is like trying to fly a kite on a windless day.... hard work

Not easy to find 'good points' about the Red philosophy as has been displayed earlier this year. With interesting people like k. Jatuporn stating on stage 'we will fight to our last drop of blood' and through actions seem to have meant other's blood, one may wonder. The grenade attacks during March - May with non-reds casualties and the bonfire at the end makes it difficult to see a philosophy I can admire.

What all those (explicit deleted) have done is distract the attention from the real grass-root cause of disaffection. Even k. Somyos with a modified vision transcending k. Thaksin has an image problem as long as 'reds' and 'red-shirts' are associated with 'grenade attacks', 'burning BKK', etc. Maybe he should start looking for a new name for the movement.

What about changing the name to "The Democratic Party" now theres an organisation thats behaved with respect and dignity all through the red terrorism!!

Edited November 20, 2010 by ianbaggie

[ianbaggie]

I have a question. How can they hold a political demonstration when their is still a state of Emergency in the province of Bangkok?

Barry

Its called freedom of speech mate.

But hang on dont the reds say this country has none of that?

Must be something wrong somewhere.

Robby - do they not take freedom of speech away from criminals and terrorists who burn and murder? Maybe New Zealand has different laws to the rest of the world!!

[james24]

C

[Buchholz]

By the way the 20 odd joined the rest at Ratchaprasong as this link shows; http://www.daylife.c...ovember+19+2010

Don't know how far the crowd in the picture goes back beyond the intersection, but I can see about 1000 - 1500 people there. The crowd is quite loosely packed. How many do the media and police say there were?

More than 1,000 police turned out to provide security for the demonstration, which drew around 5,000 people.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5gRJHcsUgH-5LrIXToAHBlqc6I3rg?docId=N0170781290186353865A

[phiphidon]

From the OP:

After meeting with police, Jatuporn travelled on to the Army Auditorium to pay a visit to Colonel Sansern Kaewkamnerd, the spokesman of the Centre for the Resolution of the Emergency Situation.

Jatuporn said he wanted to report himself to Sansern after the CRES said it planned to summon rally organisers to ensure peace and social order.

But he was turned back at the auditorium gate due to a lack of appointment.

things really get lost in translation. 'to pay a visit' and 'wanted to report himself' is not really the same, but here refers to the same statement of k. Jatuporn. I'm sure he only wanted to drop by and say hello.

PS Some seem not to believe k. Jatuporn for whatever reason. Just got an SMS from the Netherlands Embassy: 'On 19/11 there will be red-shirt demonstrations in Bangkok (Ratchaprasong) en ChiangMai. Avoid gatherings and follow news on local media'

The funny thing is he actually turned up at the "Army Club". There was a great photo in yesterdays other paper showing a perplexed looking army "supervisor" explaining to Jatuporn that the club was not the HQ of the CRES. Methinks some mischief making here, like turning up at the Lords members enclosure wearing the wrong tie...........

[Robby nz]

I have a question. How can they hold a political demonstration when their is still a state of Emergency in the province of Bangkok?

Barry

Its called freedom of speech mate.

But hang on dont the reds say this country has none of that?

Must be something wrong somewhere.

Robby - do they not take freedom of speech away from criminals and terrorists who burn and murder? Maybe New Zealand has different laws to the rest of the world!!

Well Ian its like this:

Most of the leaders, the terrorists who burn and murder, are locked up or have run away and their freedom of speech has indeed been at least curtailed.

However there are others, lets say 'silly buggers' for want of a better term, who still believe that Thaksin would be the best leader of this country.

They for the most part ane not the ones who committed the acts you mention.

They in fact are ordinary citizens (however misguided) and as such still retain the right of free speech.

The odd one out of course is K Jataporn who through some annomily of law is still out of jail.

Indeed he should be inside with the other leaders or have such restrictive bail conditions set upon him that he is unable to cause the trouble that he does.

In order to be even handed and in spite of the SOE the Govt also lets the yellow lot do their thing in holding rallys.

As I see it allowing these rallys makes it difficult for either side to claim that there is no freedom of speech.

But they still do with great regularity.

They dont know how lucky they are, they could live next door in Burma.

[SoftWater]

I have several questions:

Do they have charismatic leaders that can forge a coalition of support from a broad cross-section of society?

Do they have nationwide support among any given class of people (let's say 'the low-paid', for example)?

Do they have any constructive policies for how to change the many and varied ills that they complain about?

No, no, and no

That's what I thought. Which would tend to give the lie to the oft-repeated claim (particularly in the Nation and Bangkok Post) that this is a 'divided country' in need of some 'reconciliation'.

My Thai-in-laws I think are more typical of most Thais than those that gather at Rachaprasong. They don't like the red shirts, they don't like the yellow shirts, they think the King beyond reproach and the current government should be left to focus on the economy rather than all this 'rabble-rousing'.

Edited November 20, 2010 by SoftWater