PM Abhisit: Officials Compiling Report On Investigation Of Protest Clashes

[truethailand]

The government is just digging a deeper hole for itself. Admit your soldiers did kill some civilians and journalist. The longer they wait to admit the truth the worst it will be on the government.

I think they've already admitted that security forces killed the Japanese journalist and 3 people in the Wat.

They have not admitted to anything.

Tharit Pengdith, director general of the Department of Special Investigation, said the DSI had concluded its preliminary investigation and passed the results to the police but had not publicly disclosed the contents.

"The investigation report is a sensitive issue to talk about or to confirm its authenticity," he said. "It's an official secret. To confirm the authenticity of the report sent to police would affect the rights of the people whose names were in it."

He would neither confirm nor deny the authenticity of the two reports seen by Reuters but said police will now investigate the case of the three people believed to have been killed by troops at the temple, along with three others possibly killed by troops, including Muramoto.

The results of the police investigation will be sent to the DSI and government prosecutors.

If troops are found responsible for civilian deaths, families could sue for compensation. But authorities could also claim shootings were committed in the line of official duty.

OK, they've said that 3 deaths in the Wat and the cameraman were possibly caused by the army, and have passed the cases to police to investigate further. They haven't denied it, but haven't come out with a definitive statement until the investigation has been completed.

If recent judicial decisions are anything to go by, we already no the outcome.. farangs are entitled to an opinion but some on here have an unhealthy interest in certain threads. Is there 6-7 of you using the same ip address

Edited December 12, 2010 by truethailand

[truethailand]

begin removed, begin quote missing, check original post from 26vinny ...

SO it was alright for the government to use armed forces from the very first day, thats ARMED what a pathetic remark, the government used their options and eventually so did the reds

(edit: normal size seems sufficient)

The government, like the previous governments started with using the police. This government didn't give up too easily and started using unarmed army personel. When that still wasn't enough they allowed army pesonel to be armed. The reds used their options and eventually so did the government. Maybe check this out again ?

http://www.boston.co...n_thailand.html

The previous government could not get the army to intervene at swampy. Do you know why that is?

[jdinasia]

begin removed, begin quote missing, check original post from 26vinny ...

SO it was alright for the government to use armed forces from the very first day, thats ARMED what a pathetic remark, the government used their options and eventually so did the reds

(edit: normal size seems sufficient)

The government, like the previous governments started with using the police. This government didn't give up too easily and started using unarmed army personel. When that still wasn't enough they allowed army pesonel to be armed. The reds used their options and eventually so did the government. Maybe check this out again ?

http://www.boston.co...n_thailand.html

The previous government could not get the army to intervene at swampy. Do you know why that is?

The overt reason was that the police screwed up so badly on October 7th. Additional reasons probably included the grenade attacks against the PAD at Gov't House and Suwannapoom. Finally they had only been there a relatively short time.

[rubl]

begin removed, still in original from truethailand ...

If recent judicial decisions are anything to go by, we already no the outcome.. farangs are entitled to an opinion but some on here have an unhealthy interest in certain threads. Is there 6-7 of you using the same ip address

If you think so, do your patriotic duty and report them to the mods !

[whybother]

If recent judicial decisions are anything to go by, we already no the outcome.. farangs are entitled to an opinion but some on here have an unhealthy interest in certain threads. Is there 6-7 of you using the same ip address

Ask the mods. (or are they in on this conspiracy?)

Edited December 12, 2010 by whybother

[jdinasia]

If recent judicial decisions are anything to go by, we already no the outcome.. farangs are entitled to an opinion but some on here have an unhealthy interest in certain threads. Is there 6-7 of you using the same ip address

Judicial decisions at this point are moot. The cases are under investigation.

I had an interesting conversation last night with several members of the forum (only one other ever posted on politics). Their opinions were quite fascinating on the topic of who the farang are that are red shirt supporters.

If you think that there are people using multiple screennames the mods do have the ability to check IP addresses. Mine is a static IP address unless I post from my BB (I never post from my BB). My mac address changes between about 7 computers but all on the same IP address. Can all of this be defeated? certainly it can by anyone that has some IT skills. However, over time the truth will out. (to steal a phrase from the English, i think)

[jayboy]

If recent judicial decisions are anything to go by, we already no the outcome.. farangs are entitled to an opinion but some on here have an unhealthy interest in certain threads. Is there 6-7 of you using the same ip address

Judicial decisions at this point are moot. The cases are under investigation.

I had an interesting conversation last night with several members of the forum (only one other ever posted on politics). Their opinions were quite fascinating on the topic of who the farang are that are red shirt supporters.

If you think that there are people using multiple screennames the mods do have the ability to check IP addresses. Mine is a static IP address unless I post from my BB (I never post from my BB). My mac address changes between about 7 computers but all on the same IP address. Can all of this be defeated? certainly it can by anyone that has some IT skills. However, over time the truth will out. (to steal a phrase from the English, i think)

Lighten up.It's just a chat forum for expatriates.Getting together to discuss who is Red and who is not is just sad (as Alan Partridge might say).Who gives a toss?

And anyone who posts with multiple identities, regardless of political views, really needs to find something more interesting to do with his life.It's not really possible to win an argument on Thai Visa nor should one want to.The best that one can hope for is to gain some insight (and I often get this from members with whom I profoundly disagree).

[rubl]

Lighten up.It's just a chat forum for expatriates.Getting together to discuss who is Red and who is not is just sad (as Alan Partridge might say).Who gives a toss?

And anyone who posts with multiple identities, regardless of political views, really needs to find something more interesting to do with his life.It's not really possible to win an argument on Thai Visa nor should one want to.The best that one can hope for is to gain some insight (and I often get this from members with whom I profoundly disagree).

It was suggested by (un)truethailand that some members with same interest may be using the same IP address. Probably tried before and maybe (should be?) part of standard procedure of things to check regularly by mods on this forum.

I agree with the last sentence, but have some suspicion as to what is actually meant

[whybother]

If recent judicial decisions are anything to go by, we already no the outcome.. farangs are entitled to an opinion but some on here have an unhealthy interest in certain threads. Is there 6-7 of you using the same ip address

Ask the mods. (or are they in on this conspiracy?)

Or, rather than worrying about the posters, why don't you just worry about what they post.

[SamritT]

Lie lie lie, all lie by the RED. DSI & CRES has repeatedly confirm that they only shoot at leg. Also DSI & CRES has repeatedly confirm that no army on BTS line above the temple. The film shot by the Red-shirt from the Police Hospital showing army on BTS line is a fake, and doctored. I will find the news clip of this CRES denine for you to proof it. The murder of the Japanese is done by the men in black capture in video by army already. Why people are so stupid and refuse to believe in CRES fact, I don't konw. Maybe it just show how stupid most Thai people are.

[SamritT]

Here is the proof . . . http://www.bangkokpost.com/opinion/opinion/38495/let-the-truth-be-known-what-happened-at-the-temple . . . . During the censure debate, Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva and Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban ... insisting that the army did not operate in the temple area as the order was for them to stand by at Siam BTS station. The army commander, Gen Anupong Paojinda . . . "Soldiers will never hurt fellow Thai citizens."

[SamritT]

http://asiancorrespondent.com/bangkok-pundit-blog/what-happened-at-wat-pathum-wanaram We all know that Prachatai is super red and always lie.

[jdinasia]

If recent judicial decisions are anything to go by, we already no the outcome.. farangs are entitled to an opinion but some on here have an unhealthy interest in certain threads. Is there 6-7 of you using the same ip address

Judicial decisions at this point are moot. The cases are under investigation.

I had an interesting conversation last night with several members of the forum (only one other ever posted on politics). Their opinions were quite fascinating on the topic of who the farang are that are red shirt supporters.

If you think that there are people using multiple screennames the mods do have the ability to check IP addresses. Mine is a static IP address unless I post from my BB (I never post from my BB). My mac address changes between about 7 computers but all on the same IP address. Can all of this be defeated? certainly it can by anyone that has some IT skills. However, over time the truth will out. (to steal a phrase from the English, i think)

Lighten up.It's just a chat forum for expatriates.Getting together to discuss who is Red and who is not is just sad (as Alan Partridge might say).Who gives a toss?

And anyone who posts with multiple identities, regardless of political views, really needs to find something more interesting to do with his life.It's not really possible to win an argument on Thai Visa nor should one want to.The best that one can hope for is to gain some insight (and I often get this from members with whom I profoundly disagree).

Sorry, ... my post wasn't clear. By "who" I meant their character, who they are as people etc ... not who as in identity. Perhaps what I should have said is that the people I talked to throughout the evening had opinions about "why" some posters are "red".

I chose not to participate in that line of discussion but I did tend to agree with the people.

Edited December 12, 2010 by jdinasia

[SamritT]

If UK can wait >20 years to admite to the innocent Irish death, how long will thailand take to admit? My guess > 200 years.

[jayboy]

Sorry, ... my post wasn't clear. By "who" I meant their character, who they are as people etc ... not who as in identity. Perhaps what I should have said is that the people I talked to throughout the evening had opinions about "why" some posters are "red".

I chose not to participate in that line of discussion but I did tend to agree with the people.

It still seems an extraordinarily dull way to spend an evening.let me guess..posters sympathetic to the Reds dont understand the network system and mostly have Isaan ex bargirls as companions etc? Surprise me that the discussion was on a more intelligent level.

A more interesting discussion would be why millions Thais are sympathetic to the Red movement despite the huge black propaganda effort.Truth is it's a very broad church with a corresponding political complexion - from left to right.To me the fascinating aspect is that it is much more socially representative than often suggested, though I agree with a base of working and lower middle class.

[jdinasia]

Sorry, ... my post wasn't clear. By "who" I meant their character, who they are as people etc ... not who as in identity. Perhaps what I should have said is that the people I talked to throughout the evening had opinions about "why" some posters are "red".

I chose not to participate in that line of discussion but I did tend to agree with the people.

It still seems an extraordinarily dull way to spend an evening.let me guess..posters sympathetic to the Reds dont understand the network system and mostly have Isaan ex bargirls as companions etc? Surprise me that the discussion was on a more intelligent level.

A more interesting discussion would be why millions Thais are sympathetic to the Red movement despite the huge black propaganda effort.Truth is it's a very broad church with a corresponding political complexion - from left to right.To me the fascinating aspect is that it is much more socially representative than often suggested, though I agree with a base of working and lower middle class.

Actually the conversations covered many topics, but you find talking about politics amazingly dull? Hmmmm

The next part I find rather funny. "It's a very broad church with a corresponding..." The rallies certainly never show that and to steal a line you used lately, your pavlovian response to the yellow shirts and casting them all as Sino-Thai and disregarding everyone else is amazing! Yes I certainly see a couple of more middle class folks at red gatherings, usually driving a truck loaded with the less fortunate and never sitting in the mix agreeing with what is being said from the stages. Or are you implying that this very broad church are just the unseen millions? I mean, really, there are the PTP folks (relying on the continuation of the patronage system) and some folks aligned with the more draconian of the red leaders ... but a broad base in anything but the rural farmers? Notta chance unless they see something in it for themselves.

In fact, the BJT people holding their seats in the recent by-elections tell us more than anything else, that upcountry it is still about the regional power bosses and the kanman system

As for how people see those posters that support the reds and their violence/threats of violence etc ... Maybe someday you can actually meet some other posters from TVF and see what they tell you.

[SamritT]

"the confrontation would never have taken place without the red thugs. So blame the deaths on the originators and not who finally pulled the trigger" - VERY VERY TRUE.

[jayboy]

Actually the conversations covered many topics, but you find talking about politics amazingly dull? Hmmmm

Politics isn't boring but that's not the point I understand why you might want to deflect the subject which was your view (and those who think like you) on why some posters are supportive of the red cause.

I wondered whether there was some intelligent underpinning.Clearly there wasn't, just some odd comment about violence - as though any sane person supports it whether from the red or yellow thugs, or the military.

All very weird.

[jayboy]

The next part I find rather funny. "It's a very broad church with a corresponding..." The rallies certainly never show that and to steal a line you used lately, your pavlovian response to the yellow shirts and casting them all as Sino-Thai and disregarding everyone else is amazing! Yes I certainly see a couple of more middle class folks at red gatherings, usually driving a truck loaded with the less fortunate and never sitting in the mix agreeing with what is being said from the stages. Or are you implying that this very broad church are just the unseen millions? I mean, really, there are the PTP folks (relying on the continuation of the patronage system) and some folks aligned with the more draconian of the red leaders ... but a broad base in anything but the rural farmers? Notta chance unless they see something in it for themselves.

I actually agree that the red rallies are largely rural working class and lower middle class events, though the urban element is surprisingly high and increasing over time.However whether you like it or not there is much support from many who wouldn't dream of attending rallies and who have no time for or are completely disillusioned by Thaksin.Before the May events descended into violence no Bangkok resident could not be struck by the support from ordinary people on the streets for the Reds.The internet is alive with Red support from professionals, students, middle class and educated people.

I assume your reference to a couple of middle class folks driving trucks is facetious, but anyway the reality is the Red supporters are almost everywhere.