WinnieTheKhwai Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Foreigners are not treated differently to locals, in fact they prefer to hold a local (female) in the jail as a hostage. I have to disagree with Millwall, there are only 2 ways to avoid this type of extortion. 1) Don't have a business in Thailand 2) Get yourself a GF/wife with a policeman in the family who works locally I've opted for 2) And what if the policeman brother in-law happens to be a part of the scam? I'm talking from experience. All the better; that would mean solid advance warning. Much better than sorting out the mess afterwards. Who, by the way, as a matter of curiosity, has physical audio or video material around his house, never mind a business? Start your own internet radio station and stream it. Or are we in a time warp back to the 90's and has nobody told me? That would suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 I am amazed no ones written a decent guide to this, as it comes up so often. Yes if you play music it needs to be licensed. No the fines levied do not go to the licensee and they (the enforcers usually with police help) will lie, cheat, obfuscate and pretend to make the fine. They claim artists they dont represent officially if you dont have the artist licensed. Yes if you get the one stop license your covered on 99% of western mainstream music. Yes if you have a Single Thai CD (most not covered by one stop) in the place you can still get busted even with the one stop. Yes theres 10's of different licencing systems and its nearly impossible to cover them all, however legally they cannot enforce a lack of license unless its by one of their artists. Your lawyer demanding to know which artists they represent often makes them turn tail and run. Yes you can have MP3's if you show they are legally sourced and experience shows they dont check how it was purchased, itunes purchasing or other claimed online source (allofMP3 etc) is enough to pass but its hazy here. I always figured if I had to do this I would go this way.. Use a wifi NAS (Network address storage) hard disc hidden in the building.. Use a wifi media player / computer to address this file store. If anyone comes just explain its a web radio feed or playing from an online cloud based locker (love to see their expressions pretending to understand that) and theres no local media. Yes its still illegal to play music but essentially theres no files for them to take and use as evidence. Without evidence they have no charges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transam Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 I know a copper who has or is financially involved with two counterfeit DVD/CD shops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinnieTheKhwai Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Ah, solid advice!! Great post, thank you. When going the wifi way then why not go all the way and actually run an internet stream.. That does make you dependent on a reliable internet connection of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blabla1 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 I am amazed no ones written a decent guide to this, as it comes up so often. Yes if you play music it needs to be licensed. No the fines levied do not go to the licensee and they (the enforcers usually with police help) will lie, cheat, obfuscate and pretend to make the fine. They claim artists they dont represent officially if you dont have the artist licensed. Yes if you get the one stop license your covered on 99% of western mainstream music. Yes if you have a Single Thai CD (most not covered by one stop) in the place you can still get busted even with the one stop. Yes theres 10's of different licencing systems and its nearly impossible to cover them all, however legally they cannot enforce a lack of license unless its by one of their artists. Your lawyer demanding to know which artists they represent often makes them turn tail and run. Yes you can have MP3's if you show they are legally sourced and experience shows they dont check how it was purchased, itunes purchasing or other claimed online source (allofMP3 etc) is enough to pass but its hazy here. I always figured if I had to do this I would go this way.. Use a wifi NAS (Network address storage) hard disc hidden in the building.. Use a wifi media player / computer to address this file store. If anyone comes just explain its a web radio feed or playing from an online cloud based locker (love to see their expressions pretending to understand that) and theres no local media. Yes its still illegal to play music but essentially theres no files for them to take and use as evidence. Without evidence they have no charges. It's not about the music, it's about extortion,not knowing the law and catching you off guard, music loop holes gives them the oportunity to extort money as do many other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Ah, solid advice!! Great post, thank you. When going the wifi way then why not go all the way and actually run an internet stream.. That does make you dependent on a reliable internet connection of course. Exactly why.. If I listen to web radio etc it just reminds me how even what appear stable lines have drop outs.. Thats acceptable at home and less acceptable in a bar. Tho it wouldnt be hard to do some DNS games and make it 'appear' to be online while in the next room or a attic space or etc etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 I am amazed no ones written a decent guide to this, as it comes up so often. Yes if you play music it needs to be licensed. No the fines levied do not go to the licensee and they (the enforcers usually with police help) will lie, cheat, obfuscate and pretend to make the fine. They claim artists they dont represent officially if you dont have the artist licensed. Yes if you get the one stop license your covered on 99% of western mainstream music. Yes if you have a Single Thai CD (most not covered by one stop) in the place you can still get busted even with the one stop. Yes theres 10's of different licencing systems and its nearly impossible to cover them all, however legally they cannot enforce a lack of license unless its by one of their artists. Your lawyer demanding to know which artists they represent often makes them turn tail and run. Yes you can have MP3's if you show they are legally sourced and experience shows they dont check how it was purchased, itunes purchasing or other claimed online source (allofMP3 etc) is enough to pass but its hazy here. I always figured if I had to do this I would go this way.. Use a wifi NAS (Network address storage) hard disc hidden in the building.. Use a wifi media player / computer to address this file store. If anyone comes just explain its a web radio feed or playing from an online cloud based locker (love to see their expressions pretending to understand that) and theres no local media. Yes its still illegal to play music but essentially theres no files for them to take and use as evidence. Without evidence they have no charges. It's not about the music, it's about extortion,not knowing the law and catching you off guard, music loop holes gives them the oportunity to extort money as do many other things. I dont dispute that they play dirty.. But at the same timne so many farang bar owners come on here shouting scam and complaining yet dont have a legal license, if you break the law, at least dont come crying when you get stung for it. If you have a 1stop license.. And no Thai artists.. And your lawyer (or police buddy) on speed dial.. They will turn tail and go for an easier target. They just throw a wide net and see who gets caught in the shakedown. The object of the exercise is to be more work than worth catching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinky1876 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Thought I'd share what I know about this topic. It's based on 4 different occasions when I have incurred these scammers and on each occasion they left with nothing. These guys hold the rights to some very small Thai karaoke songs which were mainly set up for the scam that we are talking about. That is why they come into bars with official looking paper work. They never let you read it fully and only show you the intimidating parts. That is why the police have their hands tied, because the law states that they have every right to look for their licensed products that have been download or copied illegally. They will never find any of these products because they were set up for the purpose of the scam. They always come in about a group of six, and start shouting the odds. They always state that you have to go to the police station, normally the female head of the business(Thai), because this adds added pressure on the farang. They normally have a friend at the station that they can contact, who then in turns out be on your side and helps you settle the issue, i.e. you pay the scammers something. You can have every license under the sun, but due to the intimidation of six guys, who tend to be displaying big chunks of gold, you get scared and play right into their hands. It's a scam and I have to take my hats off to them. Most Thai scammers spend all of two minutes creating a scam to rip off farangs, but this one is clever and it works. Best of all, they are covered by the law. Perfect. Call your lawyer and the police to your bar or restaurant straight away. Never give them money and never go to the police station. Once they know you know the scam, they never come back again. I have to thank a good friend of mine for filling me in, because if it weren't for him, I would have paid them out of fear. He came to my bar at the time, and as soon as they saw him, the knew that the game was up and they left without a word. There are scam artists all over the world, good ones and bad ones. Be careful and keep your wits about you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses G. Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 There are scam artists all over the world, good ones and bad ones. Be careful and keep your wits about you. Yes, but the fact that the police are helping them is not all that common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinnieTheKhwai Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 There are scam artists all over the world, good ones and bad ones. Be careful and keep your wits about you. Yes, but the fact that the police are helping them is not all that common. So.. one of the reasons for moving here was the excellent and reliable police force? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotlost Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 There are scam artists all over the world, good ones and bad ones. Be careful and keep your wits about you. Yes, but the fact that the police are helping them is not all that common. A "GOOD SCAM ARTIST". You need to by a bar or if you own one buy another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkles Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I hope Pim from City Life considers picking up on this thread. She knows how things operate here in CM and has the connections. The Mayor might also be interested in what going on in his patch and on his watch. Investigative reporting is mostly confined to Bangkok but these thugs need exposing ,name and shame and hope some decent Chiang mai people who want to see CM prosper put an end to this scam. Doing nothing will ensure it continues or am I dreaming ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivinLOS Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I hope Pim from City Life considers picking up on this thread. She knows how things operate here in CM and has the connections. The Mayor might also be interested in what going on in his patch and on his watch. Investigative reporting is mostly confined to Bangkok but these thugs need exposing ,name and shame and hope some decent Chiang mai people who want to see CM prosper put an end to this scam. Doing nothing will ensure it continues or am I dreaming ? The police are complicit and make money from it.. So doubt you will see high level outrage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blabla1 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I hope Pim from City Life considers picking up on this thread. She knows how things operate here in CM and has the connections. The Mayor might also be interested in what going on in his patch and on his watch. Investigative reporting is mostly confined to Bangkok but these thugs need exposing ,name and shame and hope some decent Chiang mai people who want to see CM prosper put an end to this scam. Doing nothing will ensure it continues or am I dreaming ? people like Pim although loving and caring, will turn a blind eye to things like this,or her peace may be disturbed! i've just added it to expences of garbage,rent,utility and gst, spread over 1 year it doesn't hurt,their land ,their rules,play along,right or wrong.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotlost Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I hope Pim from City Life considers picking up on this thread. She knows how things operate here in CM and has the connections. The Mayor might also be interested in what going on in his patch and on his watch. Investigative reporting is mostly confined to Bangkok but these thugs need exposing ,name and shame and hope some decent Chiang mai people who want to see CM prosper put an end to this scam. Doing nothing will ensure it continues or am I dreaming ? people like Pim although loving and caring, will turn a blind eye to things like this,or her peace may be disturbed! i've just added it to expences of garbage,rent,utility and gst, spread over 1 year it doesn't hurt,their land ,their rules,play along,right or wrong.. You learn fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywais Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 people like Pim although loving and caring, will turn a blind eye to things like this,or her peace may be disturbed! i've just added it to expences of garbage,rent,utility and gst, spread over 1 year it doesn't hurt,their land ,their rules,play along,right or wrong.. You do realize that doing investigative reporting of this type (police) could put her and/or her small business in harms way? The big guns media have large buffers to protect them to some degree and perhaps they should be the ones to have it brought to the attention of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luminox Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Millwall you have pm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest siamjourney Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Spectrum in the BKP recently went after the Pattaya porn sellers successfully. Or at least put their sales underground. Do you think they would take this on? I'm sure a lot of people would like it exposed and publicized as much as possible. Perhaps it would finally go away (personally I doubt it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkles Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 people like Pim although loving and caring, will turn a blind eye to things like this,or her peace may be disturbed! i've just added it to expences of garbage,rent,utility and gst, spread over 1 year it doesn't hurt,their land ,their rules,play along,right or wrong.. You do realize that doing investigative reporting of this type (police) could put her and/or her small business in harms way? The big guns media have large buffers to protect them to some degree and perhaps they should be the ones to have it brought to the attention of. You might like to remember the article Pim did,in City life, on the red shirt radio lady ? DJ Aom, Chiang Mai Rak 51, (Sept 2009 issue).I thought at the time that took some courage.Not that Pim wrote anything malicious she gave the interviewee enough rope to let the lady answers condemn her,and her cohorts, own actions.That approach worked perfectly which proves she is very capable,knows the boundareies, and the system far better than any of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonzo the Face Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Our Pim is quite the lady. Me duz think that most or many on this forum do not know the background of this lady. I wouldn't be selling her or her desires and/or abilities short G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest siamjourney Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Can anyone who's dealt with this problem recommend a good lawyer who understands the situation? Ideally, they would be Thai and also be able to assist you at a late hour when these guys usually seem to arrive. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paagai Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Can anyone who's dealt with this problem recommend a good lawyer who understands the situation? Ideally, they would be Thai and also be able to assist you at a late hour when these guys usually seem to arrive. Thanks. Form what I've seen "good" lawyers don't want to get too involved other than making sure you have the right licences. What you actually need is a "BAD" lawyer who has better mafia connections than these out of town gangsters... Whilst this thread sure represents the depressing side of Thailand, sometimes there is something to smile about. I believe these thugs recently tried to raid a certain late night karaoke, without realising who was behind it. It did not go well for them Ouch! But it was nice of them to make such a large "donation" from their ill gotten gains to the local Wat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest siamjourney Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Okay, Can anyone recommend a "bad" lawyer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svtbg Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 (edited) The restaurant owner had to tell those <deleted> to start first with Panthip Plaza, then go to Pat Pong, etc. etc. and AFTER THAT go to him! Thailand is a hypocritical country! Most of the Thais know only to extort money from foreigners, they don't know anything else. And even with so much money made out of tourists, ripp offs and scams, the Thais are still poor! Hahahaha.. Edited January 31, 2011 by svtbg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mystwoodcol Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Foreigners are not treated differently to locals, in fact they prefer to hold a local (female) in the jail as a hostage. I have to disagree with Millwall, there are only 2 ways to avoid this type of extortion. 1) Don't have a business in Thailand 2) Get yourself a GF/wife with a policeman in the family who works locally I've opted for 2) That's hit the nail on the head. How about Gf/wife who is a police person and where can I find one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotlost Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Foreigners are not treated differently to locals, in fact they prefer to hold a local (female) in the jail as a hostage. I have to disagree with Millwall, there are only 2 ways to avoid this type of extortion. 1) Don't have a business in Thailand 2) Get yourself a GF/wife with a policeman in the family who works locally I've opted for 2) That's hit the nail on the head. How about Gf/wife who is a police person and where can I find one? Police station. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbap Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Interesting post ! i suppose 'star movies' has now stopped using dodgy copies for their channel? And Thai Tv is still 'stealing' the football from Malaysia? great Thailand always double standards or just plan old no standards! So if i play my music with a proper licence do i get fined also? can i get fined for listening my Blackberry music ? ermmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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