Hate Mobs Thrive In Asia'S Booming Social Media

[Nisa]

Or perhaps people can express themselves effectively, rapidly and honestly.

You can't have your cake and eat it though you would want to. That is, in America and the UK, indeed much of the first world Governments are responding to 'tweets' in order to remain informed of true public opinion. Instant honest public opinion. The same un-inhibted responses that it is implied are 'wrong' to re-act so forcefully to the spoilt brat that caused the death of the innocent.

It would be wise to acknowledge that stregth of feeling - 300k persons - and not particularly worry about her, or the family. The mother of who stated straight off the bat that they hope to avoid prosecution.

That is why people are right to be angry and call for justice.

Uninhibited? I prefer freedom of speech that the interent allows. Honesty.

Whereas it is dis-honesty that this case has written all over it.

Even the articl acknowledges that she come from a 'wealthy Thai family.' Now what does that imply when considering the Thais justice system and its punishment of the Na Ayuthaya clan?

Rarely are good decisions made when emotions are high. And rarely does anything positive come out of an emotionally charged mob of people spreading untruths to keep the anger burning as long as they can because they know it will die out soon as it always does with these types of online lynch mobs except for a few people who are more mentally unstable and unable to regain rational thought as quickly as most or in some cases at all.

I would be curious to know if you have any sort of credible (even semi credible) link at all stating the mother said she hoped to avoid prosecution. As you mention 'honesty" in your post I feel it would be important to show some credibility since this seems to go against every action and words the family has displayed since the accident.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Nisa

[Nisa]

According to: http://asiancorrespo...t-thai-society/

which kind of does a chronology of events regarding the online lynching of this 16-year old girl. The photos (and believe her name) were first published by Daily News Online (Thai Language) and then spread to Twitter and resulted in the fake postings by the 16-year old as well as faked photos. From there it took off.

On December 27, Daily News online, news website of the second-largest circulated Thai-language daily newspaper, published a series of photo from the night of accident. One of the photo featured Miss A here.

However, when the picture was circulated on Twitter many Thai Twitter users not only rushed to judge that she was entirely responsible for the accident, but also believed that she was chatting on her BlackBerry right after the accident and angrily slammed her with rude words.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Nisa

[hanuman1]

If you look the latest news coming out of the other English newspaper you will see the license plate was not in this girls name and it was not even registered to the Honda but another car and they have named that person.

I also believe The Nation ALWAYS stated the girl was 16 until the girl said in a press statement that she was 17. As we found it is normal for younger Thais to give their age as what it will be that year (2011) as opposed to what age they technically are. But all this is really moot when it comes to her name as I am fairly sure The Nation never printed her name but the other paper did from the start .. you can correct me if I am wrong on this but I am fairly sure this is the case.

The photo doesn't show her face. The pictures were taken AFTER rescue crews were already on the scene. She was trapped in the vehicle and freed by them. The police were also already on the scene and statements from her said she was using the phone to get the insurance information, from the friend who lent her the car, and contacting her parents. Both these things were requested by the police before they could let her leave and go to the hospital. So, it would not be unreasonable to believe there was some kind of reporter on the scene as they took numerous pictures.

I always thought it interesting that initially everyone condemned the girl for not helping people dying on the street near her as the purported this was immediately after the accident but never once questioned why the person taking pictures wasn't helping people ... but this is typical of reporters.

Although certainly possibly, I highly doubt the Facebook page got started before news reports of her name were released by some news outlet. She is not identifiable in this picture or any others I have scene from the accident and the car wasn't hers and it is doubtful she was known to drive the car since a friend supposedly lent it to her and this friend actually borrowed it from the owner of a garage who was repairing the friends car ... and as I mentioned, there was no way to trace the 16-year old to the licence plates since they were not in her name but in somebody else's who has now been named in the other English speaking newspaper.

I cannot read Thai but maybe somebody knows what the watermarks on the photos say.

Also note the time stamps on the photos. I believe these were cropped in the originals photos posted on Facebook that also didn't show the emergency workers in the background of the injured man on the ground. (This photo is NOW what appears on that facebook page.)

The watermark says 'Daily News' - the newspaper.

Anyway - back to the OP - the ungoverned internet allows all humanity to express itself. Expressions of hate and profanity are also expressions borne of humanity, whether we like it or not. At some deep level which we may deny but cannot ultimately avoid, those who post such seemingly diabolical BS are like us in some way. Probably better to stop treating them like aliens or animals and spare a thought for how a human being can end up expressing themselves like that. Not your problem? Maybe that's the problem.

You can't be human by yourself.

Edited January 14, 2011 by hanuman1

[MAJIC]

I don't find the internet anonomous whatsoever, I feel now that people are actually going to read this so that I have to be careful with grammar and spelling just for starters, then opinions are even more circumscribed. I am over 65 years old, I wonder if it is an age thing or just different personalities. (pause there to look-up circumscribe) .

What does circumscribe mean? .

c

Limit, Restrict, Draw a line around.

I had to look it up too.

[AZBill]

Two points to make here.

First, it`s not the girl's fault, the blame and responsibility lays with the parents.

I know of 2 farangs that live near in my area who let their under aged children drive cars. One a girl aged 14 and another a girl aged 14. I once asked the Dad, why do you let your 14 year old daughter drive his car. He replied, oh, she is a good driver; I have no problems with that.

These parents are irresponsible and not taking into consideration of other peoples lives. They should be prosecuted regardless if the child has been involved in an accident or not.

Second, anyone who publishes their details and information about they're personal lives on social networking sites are idiots, pure and simple. They have brought on whatever abuse received on the Internet because they become addicted to social networking sites. The solution is simple, don't use them.

Not their fault??? You got to be kidding me? How do you know these parents are irresponsible? Have you ever raised a teenage girl? They can be the most vile little creatures on earth to one another no matter what a parent tries to do. The biggest problem in the US is that no one wants to place responsibility where it belongs - on the stupid girls! Always looking for an excuse for behavior these girls are quite old enough to understand. Having raised a daughter I can attest to this. Serves the little beeatches right. Same crap going on with this nut that just shot my congresswomean in Arizona! It's talk radio's fault iyt's Palin's fault, blah blah blah. It's the nut's fault plain and simple. But no! We are always looking to absolve the perp of responsibility. We have an entire generation of kids that don't feel any responsibility for anything because our society says they shouldn't and it's their parent's fault and not theirs. That is a big reason why we are going down the drain as a country and why I'm learning Chinese. Thai is too freakin hard!

[tgeezer]

I don't find the internet anonomous whatsoever, I feel now that people are actually going to read this so that I have to be careful with grammar and spelling just for starters, then opinions are even more circumscribed. I am over 65 years old, I wonder if it is an age thing or just different personalities. (pause there to look-up circumscribe) .

Should you have looked up anonymous? Just winding you up.

That makes my point, someone does read it here at least. When we look into our own internal dictionary we get some surprises. I posted 'prorport' (profess X purport)on the Thai language once, noone said anything so I drew attention to it still no response, then only yesterday That Palin woman used it!

Anyway 'anonomous' was a mistake, ta.

Edited January 15, 2011 by tgeezer

[jayboy]

According to: http://asiancorrespo...t-thai-society/

which kind of does a chronology of events regarding the online lynching of this 16-year old girl. The photos (and believe her name) were first published by Daily News Online (Thai Language) and then spread to Twitter and resulted in the fake postings by the 16-year old as well as faked photos. From there it took off.

On December 27, Daily News online, news website of the second-largest circulated Thai-language daily newspaper, published a series of photo from the night of accident. One of the photo featured Miss A here.

However, when the picture was circulated on Twitter many Thai Twitter users not only rushed to judge that she was entirely responsible for the accident, but also believed that she was chatting on her BlackBerry right after the accident and angrily slammed her with rude words.

It's not a bad article at all.I was struck by one extract in particular:

"It is undeniable that social class plays a major role in this story. The news about the van has enraged the middle-class on Facebook because those in the van share the same class with them. They extremely ‘regret’ the deaths the PhD and researchers lost by the spoiled reckless rich girl.

They fear that their ‘middle-class friends’ will not receive justice as the elite will escape from a punishment because of their influence and money.

Interestingly, this may be the first time that the middle-class have realized that they are also affected by the so-called “double standard” of the Thai judicial system that the red shirts have campaigned against."

This "context" is crucial as I have pointed out many times in understanding the unattractive hysteria.You with respect don't seem to have taken it on board, or have airily dismissed it.But it's crucial to fully appreciate the resentment of the culture of impunity to understand what has been going on.

[Nisa]

I think there is also an inherent problem with communicating via email, chat rooms and internet postings in that it is difficult to interpret somebody's tone. If one remembers Archie Bunker from All in the Family you'd recall some very over the top and often racists things he would say that drew huge laughs from the audience. But if you put those same words on a blog without his tone, pauses they would appear hateful instead of ignorant and naive.

Another example is if you are with friends and make some over the top statement such as, "that guy should have his balls cut off and fed to him" it would be laughable but posted online it can be taken seriously, without hearing the tone, and add fuel to the fire of people already looking for outlets for their rage and looking for a focal point to direct this rage.

[Nisa]

This "context" is crucial as I have pointed out many times in understanding the unattractive hysteria.You with respect don't seem to have taken it on board, or have airily dismissed it.But it's crucial to fully appreciate the resentment of the culture of impunity to understand what has been going on.

I have no argument that the rich, powerful, famous and/or elite can get away with a lot here in Thailand as they do elsewhere in the world and that corruption is rampant here. However, if you research more about cyber bullying and online lynch mobs that form you will find they often have no real rhyme or reason to when they will form and who the target will be. You also have to consider that true anger about a legit issue should not require lies and hatred to the degree involved in these cyber mobs.

Here is another good link (mainly because it shows some examples of targets of this online lynch mobs) .. http://www.tampabay.com/features/humaninterest/article991297.ece

When you read the stories about weak kids in school becoming victims to these cyber attacks you should realize this is not something based in logic. These weak kids may face torment at school by one or two bullies but when it spreads online all of a sudden hundreds from the school want to focus their rage on this kid whose only offence maybe that they are shy and red headed or in other cases a girl who is perceived as being too pretty. Clearly these people committing these acts online have issues. Even in Thailand there is a way to get a message out and get positive results without going to the extreme of joining a hate group that generally serves only to make your group not be heard (dismissed) and be seen negatively.

Regardless if we are in public or online we should all find ways to express our emotions appropriately and without the need to spread lies or believe lies that a rational person would find highly suspicious, in order to fuel the venting of built up rage.

[jayboy]

This "context" is crucial as I have pointed out many times in understanding the unattractive hysteria.You with respect don't seem to have taken it on board, or have airily dismissed it.But it's crucial to fully appreciate the resentment of the culture of impunity to understand what has been going on.

I have no argument that the rich, powerful, famous and/or elite can get away with a lot here in Thailand as they do elsewhere in the world and that corruption is rampant here. However, if you research more about cyber bullying and online lynch mobs that form you will find they often have no real rhyme or reason to when they will form and who the target will be. You also have to consider that true anger about a legit issue should not require lies and hatred to the degree involved in these cyber mobs.

Here is another good link (mainly because it shows some examples of targets of this online lynch mobs) .. http://www.tampabay.com/features/humaninterest/article991297.ece

When you read the stories about weak kids in school becoming victims to these cyber attacks you should realize this is not something based in logic. These weak kids may face torment at school by one or two bullies but when it spreads online all of a sudden hundreds from the school want to focus their rage on this kid whose only offence maybe that they are shy and red headed or in other cases a girl who is perceived as being too pretty. Clearly these people committing these acts online have issues. Even in Thailand there is a way to get a message out and get positive results without going to the extreme of joining a hate group that generally serves only to make your group not be heard (dismissed) and be seen negatively.

Regardless if we are in public or online we should all find ways to express our emotions appropriately and without the need to spread lies or believe lies that a rational person would find highly suspicious, in order to fuel the venting of built up rage.

Thanks.I will check the link.As always there's little you say with which I disagree.

But while agreeing there are culture of impunity abuses in many countries (though Thailand is a particularly bad offender) what's interesting to me is that Thais are beginning to resent it very much.I think that's a trend, perhaps overlapping, but nevertheless distinct from the lynch mob mentality you describe and rightly condemn.

[waza]

Hate mobs, mob rule, mob dynamics, herd dynamics are a natural psycological aspect of social animals. It is an evolutionary adaptation that provides the mechanism for collective intelligence, but also explains how morally reprehensible consensus can form. Its well konw and well studied by psychologists and sosciologistsl. Individuals act in unison on an issue because they want to remain accepted in that goup, dissidents are quicky shouted down and belittled til they comply, Mob members compete with each other to be the most outspoken or radical. Its a spiral that feed itself increasing the level of panic, outrage or hysteria(also called "crowd hysteria") isnt circumscribed, (thanks tgeezer) and member become less aware of their actions . This can be manifested in behaviors ranging from vilolent aggression at a shoe sale, gang rapes and beatings to the extermination of an entire people group. The mob members are disinhibited and empowered because their individual responsabilites for what the say and do is diluted by the group, thats is the responsabilities is shared by the group, leading to individual acting beyond their normal moral code. One would assume that the anonymity of the internet would highten this disinhibition but would also negate the physical reponses.

Edited January 15, 2011 by waza

[Nisa]

Hate mobs, mob rule, mob dynamics, herd dynamics are a natural psycological aspect of social animals. It is an evolutionary adaptation that provides the mechanism for collective intelligence, but also explains how morally reprehensible consensus can form. Its well konw and well studied by psychologists and sosciologistsl. Individuals act in unison on an issue because they want to remain accepted in that goup, dissidents are quicky shouted down and belittled til they comply, Mob members compete with each other to be the most outspoken or radical. Its a spiral that feed itself increasing the level of panic, outrage or hysteria(also called "crowd hysteria") isnt circumscribed, (thanks tgeezer) and member become less aware of their actions . This can be manifested in behaviors ranging from vilolent aggression at a shoe sale, gang rapes and beatings to the extermination of an entire people group. The mob members are disinhibited and empowered because their individual responsabilites for what the say and do is diluted by the group, thats is the responsabilities is shared by the group, leading to individual acting beyond their normal moral code. One would assume that the anonymity of the internet would highten this disinhibition but would also negate the physical reponses.

[Thai at Heart]

"Common people learn to use internet to express extreme feelings and anger in comparison with previous times, when minions in Asia were expected to put up and shut up."

I can just see the Thai government using articles like this to justify censoring the internet more and more, for the sake of the public good. Better still, just supress stories about rich people doing bad things.

I wouldn't worry too much about social media in Asia, when in comparison in the West potential presidential candidates tell the people "don't Re-treat, Instead Re-load"

[inmysights]

On a lighter tone, fortunately here at TV we have a nice bunch of mods who (try to) keep our cyberworld clean. Not an easy job. I couldn't do it, my boiling point is a bit too low.

For those who don't like moderation, sorry it has become really necessary. Also other forums / blogs have found out:

"Dear Readers,

Due to an increase in offensive and profane comments, Khmerization has decided to moderate all comments. Comments containing offensive language, profanities and racist connotations will not be published."

Bearing in mind that a 'Christian' forum was deemed inappropriate, given that this is a Bhuddist (supposedly) country, and that there are many other followers of many other religions based here, what comprises a 'profanity'? I was once rapped over the knuckles for my use of the name 'Jesus' as in 'Oh Jesus' (not really his real name by the way), would I have similarly been castigated, given a severe telling off, if I'd used the names Allah, Vishnu, Shiva,? Or is this use of so called 'profanity' limited only to those 'Christians' on this forum? The numbers of which must surely be given a tiny proportion? Alpha Centorians included?

[animatic]

Whoever feels satisfaction from this sort of cyber attack needs help or might be hopelessly lost already...

The sheer numbers tell us something about the way part of the society is going to, from which part of society the "virtual Blueberry, iPhone and Facebook Socialites" come from...?

Mobbying and Bullying shows immaturity, insecurity, infantility, naivety and a deep rooted profile neurosis accompanied by fear, very low self-esteem and a remarkable low in creativity.

Agreed my friend.

There is rational commentary and valid horror at an occurrence,

and then there is hang 'm' high blind hate at on individual,

with an assumption that malice was involved, and blind assumption that

escape from justice will happen because of class.

As opposed to a grave error in judgment that will be regretted for a lifetime,

regardless of official punishment, which will happen because of the high profile

and horrific nature of the incident,.

In the case of this sad girl, she no doubt is kicking herself inside

more than any cyber-hater can possibly inflict. And will for her lifetime.

But what is scary is the pig-pile moves toward reciprocal violence

as some sort of social catharsis for the mobs horror.

A true wild west lynch mob mentality. Pathetic.

Edited January 16, 2011 by animatic

[animatic]

Mobbying and Bullying shows immaturity, insecurity, infantility, naivity and a deep rooted profile neurosis accompied by fear, very low selfesteem and a remarkable low in creativity.

When using such words at least try to spell correctly.

naivety

self esteem or self-esteem

Gosh I feel so inhibited away from the net.

English is not his first language.

Respond to the point, not the spelling.

[waza]

Mobbying and Bullying shows immaturity, insecurity, infantility, naivity and a deep rooted profile neurosis accompied by fear, very low selfesteem and a remarkable low in creativity.

When using such words at least try to spell correctly.

naivety

self esteem or self-esteem

Gosh I feel so inhibited away from the net.

English is not his first language.

Respond to the point, not the spelling.

Ditto

[animatic]

If you look the latest news coming out of the other English newspaper you will see the license plate was not in this girls name and it was not even registered to the Honda but another car and they have named that person.

I also believe The Nation ALWAYS stated the girl was 16 until the girl said in a press statement that she was 17. As we found it is normal for younger Thais to give their age as what it will be that year (2011) as opposed to what age they technically are. But all this is really moot when it comes to her name as I am fairly sure The Nation never printed her name but the other paper did from the start .. you can correct me if I am wrong on this but I am fairly sure this is the case.

The photo doesn't show her face. The pictures were taken AFTER rescue crews were already on the scene. She was trapped in the vehicle and freed by them. The police were also already on the scene and statements from her said she was using the phone to get the insurance information, from the friend who lent her the car, and contacting her parents. Both these things were requested by the police before they could let her leave and go to the hospital. So, it would not be unreasonable to believe there was some kind of reporter on the scene as they took numerous pictures.

I always thought it interesting that initially everyone condemned the girl for not helping people dying on the street near her as the purported this was immediately after the accident but never once questioned why the person taking pictures wasn't helping people ... but this is typical of reporters.

Although certainly possibly, I highly doubt the Facebook page got started before news reports of her name were released by some news outlet. She is not identifiable in this picture or any others I have scene from the accident and the car wasn't hers and it is doubtful she was known to drive the car since a friend supposedly lent it to her and this friend actually borrowed it from the owner of a garage who was repairing the friends car ... and as I mentioned, there was no way to trace the 16-year old to the licence plates since they were not in her name but in somebody else's who has now been named in the other English speaking newspaper.

I cannot read Thai but maybe somebody knows what the watermarks on the photos say.

Also note the time stamps on the photos. I believe these were cropped in the originals photos posted on Facebook that also didn't show the emergency workers in the background of the injured man on the ground. (This photo is NOW what appears on that facebook page.)

The watermark says 'Daily News' - the newspaper.

Anyway - back to the OP - the ungoverned internet allows all humanity to express itself. Expressions of hate and profanity are also expressions borne of humanity, whether we like it or not. At some deep level which we may deny but cannot ultimately avoid, those who post such seemingly diabolical BS are like us in some way. Probably better to stop treating them like aliens or animals and spare a thought for how a human being can end up expressing themselves like that. Not your problem? Maybe that's the problem.

You can't be human by yourself.

If you are not qualified as a first aide giver, then 'helping the injured'

can cause more harm than good. Stopping a bleeding out artery is one thing,

apply steady pressure, but moving someone around, and checking them out

can kill or paralyze them etc.

If she, as is likely, didn't have a clue what to do, it's appropriate she did nothing.

If you were in a a bad accident, would you NOT contact other concerned parties?

Like parents, parents of friends involved, insurance, car's owner, etc.