Slaughter Of Farm Animals

[oldsailor35]

Is it easy to find healthy slaughter houses in Thailand. And then a butcher, other than those filthy fly blown set ups we see in the markets.

[WatersEdge]

If you are worried about a few flies,

then perhaps Thailand isn't for you.

We do have flies

just like your home country has in warm weather months.

We just have no Winter, so you can see them 365 days.

Case by case basis of course.

No one could make one call for the many slaughterhouses of the whole nation.

Mae Sot now has a brand new sparkling slaughterhouse

while the old one it replaced was a sight to behold from the street

I kill my own livestock on the farm,

so I know the potential problems.

I have to instruct the men,

and then enforce what I told them,

because if I turned my back it would be done any sloppy way they please.

If I want the cuts to be recognizable I do the butchering myself.

because they will just whack the carcase in random pieces.

Their logic is, It's food,

you are going to cut it in tiny pieces eventually,

so how could the exact appearance matter in between?

I found it funny,

after I recovered from first being furious,

that an animal could be cut in such unusual ways,

because proper butchering is done according to the logical divisions of the body.

A carcase just wants to fall apart in an orderly fashion

It's not me doing it in the difficult outlandish way.

Never mind cutting neatly at bone joints...they have a machete to break right through bones.

My farm process is not fancy, it definitely does not look pristine,

but when the meat goes onto the ice,

it's been tidy every step in spite of the farm surroundings.

If someone was to see it all from the front gate,

they might be completely put off.

I'll eat from my own sooner than from someone else's.

So it is with a slaughterhouse.

It doesn't necessarily need a shiny roof with sparkling paint on the outside

Open air works about as well.

It's the attention to detail and speed,

getting the meat on ice in the shortest possible time.

What happens after it leaves the slaughterhouse is up to the market vendor.

Some markets have a separate room for meat.

Some of them are even air conditioned with strap curtains over the doors

Others have nothing but tables on the sidewalk,

with an old fan motor spinning plastic bags to give the flies frequent exercise.

If you carry the meat home and cook it well,

everything the fly left will be quite harmless

The other side of this answer is that the places that look darling

are not necessarily more sanitary

Consider that the most formidable microbes thrive in a hospital,

so imagine a pretty market room that isn't kept truly clean EVERY day.

You will potentially get just as sick from pretty meat as from meat with fly eggs visible.

Good News is that most meat in Thailand is sold the same day that it was killed.

Sorry I can't guarantee you that meat in Thailand would not make you sick,

but I've not been food poisoned here in 6 years,

with the minor stomach rumblings from nicer places.

At the slaughterhouse, I've seen animals that died on the truck,

or during unloading.

Soft pampered sheltered animals

who had apparent heart attack in the heat noise and cramped quarters.

Just failed to unload themselves from the truck.

One day two animals died while unloading from one truck.

The truck was contracted to a big name that everyone would immediately recognize.

They aren't separated from the living animals process,

just taken in first when the night slaughter team comes to work.

Nobody outside ever seems to know exactly how long that animal has been dead.

The holding pen stock handlers were not dismayed that multiple animals died.

It was all part of their normal day.

So would I rather eat from my messy looking farm,

or from the spiffy slaughterhouse going to a brand name cellophane package?

[fruity]

If you are worried about a few flies,

then perhaps Thailand isn't for you.

We do have flies

just like your home country has in warm weather months.

We just have no Winter, so you can see them 365 days.

Case by case basis of course.

No one could make one call for the many slaughterhouses of the whole nation.

Mae Sot now has a brand new sparkling slaughterhouse

while the old one it replaced was a sight to behold from the street

I kill my own livestock on the farm,

so I know the potential problems.

I have to instruct the men,

and then enforce what I told them,

because if I turned my back it would be done any sloppy way they please.

If I want the cuts to be recognizable I do the butchering myself.

because they will just whack the carcase in random pieces.

Their logic is, It's food,

you are going to cut it in tiny pieces eventually,

so how could the exact appearance matter in between?

I found it funny,

after I recovered from first being furious,

that an animal could be cut in such unusual ways,

because proper butchering is done according to the logical divisions of the body.

A carcase just wants to fall apart in an orderly fashion

It's not me doing it in the difficult outlandish way.

Never mind cutting neatly at bone joints...they have a machete to break right through bones.

My farm process is not fancy, it definitely does not look pristine,

but when the meat goes onto the ice,

it's been tidy every step in spite of the farm surroundings.

If someone was to see it all from the front gate,

they might be completely put off.

I'll eat from my own sooner than from someone else's.

So it is with a slaughterhouse.

It doesn't necessarily need a shiny roof with sparkling paint on the outside

Open air works about as well.

It's the attention to detail and speed,

getting the meat on ice in the shortest possible time.

What happens after it leaves the slaughterhouse is up to the market vendor.

Some markets have a separate room for meat.

Some of them are even air conditioned with strap curtains over the doors

Others have nothing but tables on the sidewalk,

with an old fan motor spinning plastic bags to give the flies frequent exercise.

If you carry the meat home and cook it well,

everything the fly left will be quite harmless

The other side of this answer is that the places that look darling

are not necessarily more sanitary

Consider that the most formidable microbes thrive in a hospital,

so imagine a pretty market room that isn't kept truly clean EVERY day.

You will potentially get just as sick from pretty meat as from meat with fly eggs visible.

Good News is that most meat in Thailand is sold the same day that it was killed.

Sorry I can't guarantee you that meat in Thailand would not make you sick,

but I've not been food poisoned here in 6 years,

with the minor stomach rumblings from nicer places.

At the slaughterhouse, I've seen animals that died on the truck,

or during unloading.

Soft pampered sheltered animals

who had apparent heart attack in the heat noise and cramped quarters.

Just failed to unload themselves from the truck.

One day two animals died while unloading from one truck.

The truck was contracted to a big name that everyone would immediately recognize.

They aren't separated from the living animals process,

just taken in first when the night slaughter team comes to work.

Nobody outside ever seems to know exactly how long that animal has been dead.

The holding pen stock handlers were not dismayed that multiple animals died.

It was all part of their normal day.

So would I rather eat from my messy looking farm,

or from the spiffy slaughterhouse going to a brand name cellophane package?

W.E,

Any ideas where I could obtain a captive bolt stun gun here in Thailand? I assume slaughter houses here will use these as a means of dispatching their subjects?

I would very much like to obtain a stun gun, which would be used exclusively 'on farm' when the time comes to say cheerio to sows that have served us well. In my opinion the most humane, stress free method.

Have found companies in the UK & States, however, I would think getting one brought into Thailand would be a nightmare?

Any ideas / info appreciated.

Cheers

Fruity

[WatersEdge]

Hi Fruity,

I use a framing hammer for Hogs.

One sharp pop front and center.

Goats have armor plate front and center,

so you have to pop them on top from behind.

The goal is for the animal to be unconscious but heart still pumping

so that when you cut the throat all the blood pumps out.

Thus the term "stun" gun

I've not killed a Beef in Thailand,

but they have to be securely tied in case one pop doesn't quite do it.

It's no fun to have a beef that almost went down.

An afterthought...

Are you thinking of the villain character in "No Country for Old Men"

He was formidable with a slaughterhouse stun gun.

At home I use either a .22 handgun, or a 12 ga shotgun

Edited January 26, 2011 by WatersEdge

[fruity]

Hi Fruity,

I use a framing hammer for Hogs.

One sharp pop front and center.

Goats have armor plate front and center,

so you have to pop them on top from behind.

The goal is for the animal to be unconscious but heart still pumping

so that when you cut the throat all the blood pumps out.

Thus the term "stun" gun

I've not killed a Beef in Thailand,

but they have to be securely tied in case one pop doesn't quite do it.

It's no fun to have a beef that almost went down.

An afterthought...

Are you thinking of the villain character in "No Country for Old Men"

He was formidable with a slaughterhouse stun gun.

At home I use either a .22 handgun, or a 12 ga shotgun

Hi W.E.

Thanks for the reply. By framing hammer do you mean a mallet / mell? This is the usual method in these parts, however, I don't like it, too much margin for error & terror in my opinion. The captive bolt stun guns come in many guises, but are basically a hand gun that fires a heavy bolt in order to stun / render unconcious the animal. Commonly referred to as humane killers......No country for old men....lol.....how appt:).....Much the same thing

What I like about these is the fact that the animal suffers zero stress & can be dropped before it has a chance to realise anything is amiss.

Cheers

Fruity

[jubby]

I'd be interested in a Captive Bolt Gun myself.

I've seen and heard the neighbours dispatching pigs with what I'd call a sledge hammer, occasionally and its definately not a one blow affair.

More like ten

As for Fly blown butchers , Quite a lot of local butchers use an area completely surrounded by flyscreens

[WatersEdge]

The end product....tasty meat on the plate

depends a great deal on the process to get it there.

Not all meat is grown equal,

but two good animals can also diverge after death.

1. The animal should be calm cool and at rest

when he is very unexpectedly whacked.

If there is adrenalin in the blood it will effect the meat.

Hunting deer I would never kill an animal that has been running....sure path to stinky venison.

The only shot I'll take is for an animal enjoying life perfectly calm.

2. The blood should be immediately drained, as it also will taint the meat flavor

3. The entire carcase should be cooled as rapidly as possible after killing.

I soak a hog in a huge tub of cool water for around half an hour

just as soon as he is gutted.

For a deer I'd do the same, gut him immediately and look for a nearby creek or pond to chill the carcase in.

After bringing to cool water temperature, get the meat packed in ice shortly thereafter.

For beef & deer you then age it 2 to 3 weeks in a dry cooler with good air space,

just above freezing temperature

You are looking for the first hint of white mold forming in the inside of the body cavity where the kidney used to be.

Right on the tenderloin

or on the exposed flesh at the inside of the rear legs where you split the pelvis

[fruity]

The end product....tasty meat on the plate

depends a great deal on the process to get it there.

Not all meat is grown equal,

but two good animals can also diverge after death.

1. The animal should be calm cool and at rest

when he is very unexpectedly whacked.

If there is adrenalin in the blood it will effect the meat.

Hunting deer I would never kill an animal that has been running....sure path to stinky venison.

The only shot I'll take is for an animal enjoying life perfectly calm.

2. The blood should be immediately drained, as it also will taint the meat flavor

3. The entire carcase should be cooled as rapidly as possible after killing.

I soak a hog in a huge tub of cool water for around half an hour

just as soon as he is gutted.

For a deer I'd do the same, gut him immediately and look for a nearby creek or pond to chill the carcase in.

After bringing to cool water temperature, get the meat packed in ice shortly thereafter.

For beef & deer you then age it 2 to 3 weeks in a dry cooler with good air space,

just above freezing temperature

You are looking for the first hint of white mold forming in the inside of the body cavity where the kidney used to be.

Right on the tenderloin

or on the exposed flesh at the inside of the rear legs where you split the pelvis

Couldn't agree more. Any form of stress proir to slaughter has a detrimental effect on the meat,this being number two reason I'd like to obtain a humane killer-stun gun. First reason as already stated is to despatch the animal, which has served me well over a considerable time in as humane a way as is possible. Imagine the stress of being driven / shoved into a crate, transported then remaining in the crate until the time comes for the guy with the sledgehammer as Jubby says to take a half dozen swings before achieving his goal. Not for my sows, all of which in future will be killed on site, butchered and the meat sold locally. Whenever we do this, the demand for pork always exceeds the supply with quite literally a line of locals waiting for their order to be cut, weighed and bagged.

[bina]

thais are correect. for them, any cut becomes small pieces in the food so why bother. we bought a pig recently (this being israel they come from christian arabs up north that have a liscense to raise pigs). the whole thing takes a few hours: a few bops on the head, then the pig is bled and the blood caught to be used later (very tasty actually).the pig dies from blood loss, i dont know if it causes pain but there is no struggle and the bleeding goes fast. then, once dead, hot water poured over the skin and the skin shaved with a few gillette razors. then the pig is taken apart. five to ten guys, one bottle of vodka several very sharp machetes and knives and lots of yummy tidbits on the bbq while the work is done, with in about three hours, the entire pig is no longer. every single bit has been partioned, cleaned (intestiines and stuff), sliced, bagged and handled out to whomever bought the pig. we pay 1400 for a pig, divided by four people. every single piece of pig is used. ears, eyes, baby pigs (if they were in a sow that for some reason was sold, although some thais like husband wont eat them, others will), tongues, tails, skin, fat layers.. intestines are thoroughly washed out and then put on long sticks to roast and then sliced thin and eaten with hot spicy sauce; skin becomes 'cracklins', raw liver is eaten , the blood becomes blood pudding and fried, and some blood mixed in the vodka for the 'real men'.... everything hosed down and no muss no fuss. btw, hubby stays away until the pig is unconcious. like many thais, he wont actually slaughter 'higher mammals', fish and chicken no problem.

bina

[teletiger]

I've only once seen a pig 'bopped". Locally, all our pigs are "stuck". Pig is caged (better) or tied and then left to relax.

After 30 mins or so, someone will casually put a steel spike through the ribs into the heart....and out. Very fast. There is 1 or 2 seconds of squealing and then the pig relaxes again. The pig bleeds to death and doesn't know a thing about it. The pig is opened up on it's back and the blood scooped out of the chest cavity. Sorry for the gore, but my point is that it is a very humane way to kill the pig.

I once saw a French butcher use a meat tenderiser as a club (on a loose pig) and then cut the aorta. He was good and it was quick, but too many chances for "many a slip twix cup and lip".

Any animal needs to be relaxed at the moment of dispatch.

All towns will have a government slaughterhouse. You will need an official pass. Failing that, 200 baht on the gate.

Enquire in your local feed depot. They will point you in the right direction.

Never personally had a problem with the "flyblown" stalls at the markets. I think the lack of food poisoning cases in Thailand speaks for itself. A front gate Beef stall, outside Lampang, proudly proclaimed "killed this morning". Mmmmmm.....tender then!

Regards.

[Foreverford]

If you are worried about a few flies,

then perhaps Thailand isn't for you.

We do have flies

just like your home country has in warm weather months.

We just have no Winter, so you can see them 365 days.

Case by case basis of course.

No one could make one call for the many slaughterhouses of the whole nation.

Mae Sot now has a brand new sparkling slaughterhouse

while the old one it replaced was a sight to behold from the street

I kill my own livestock on the farm,

so I know the potential problems.

I have to instruct the men,

and then enforce what I told them,

because if I turned my back it would be done any sloppy way they please.

If I want the cuts to be recognizable I do the butchering myself.

because they will just whack the carcase in random pieces.

Their logic is, It's food,

you are going to cut it in tiny pieces eventually,

so how could the exact appearance matter in between?

I found it funny,

after I recovered from first being furious,

that an animal could be cut in such unusual ways,

because proper butchering is done according to the logical divisions of the body.

A carcase just wants to fall apart in an orderly fashion

It's not me doing it in the difficult outlandish way.

Never mind cutting neatly at bone joints...they have a machete to break right through bones.

My farm process is not fancy, it definitely does not look pristine,

but when the meat goes onto the ice,

it's been tidy every step in spite of the farm surroundings.

If someone was to see it all from the front gate,

they might be completely put off.

I'll eat from my own sooner than from someone else's.

So it is with a slaughterhouse.

It doesn't necessarily need a shiny roof with sparkling paint on the outside

Open air works about as well.

It's the attention to detail and speed,

getting the meat on ice in the shortest possible time.

What happens after it leaves the slaughterhouse is up to the market vendor.

Some markets have a separate room for meat.

Some of them are even air conditioned with strap curtains over the doors

Others have nothing but tables on the sidewalk,

with an old fan motor spinning plastic bags to give the flies frequent exercise.

If you carry the meat home and cook it well,

everything the fly left will be quite harmless

The other side of this answer is that the places that look darling

are not necessarily more sanitary

Consider that the most formidable microbes thrive in a hospital,

so imagine a pretty market room that isn't kept truly clean EVERY day.

You will potentially get just as sick from pretty meat as from meat with fly eggs visible.

Good News is that most meat in Thailand is sold the same day that it was killed.

Sorry I can't guarantee you that meat in Thailand would not make you sick,

but I've not been food poisoned here in 6 years,

with the minor stomach rumblings from nicer places.

At the slaughterhouse, I've seen animals that died on the truck,

or during unloading.

Soft pampered sheltered animals

who had apparent heart attack in the heat noise and cramped quarters.

Just failed to unload themselves from the truck.

One day two animals died while unloading from one truck.

The truck was contracted to a big name that everyone would immediately recognize.

They aren't separated from the living animals process,

just taken in first when the night slaughter team comes to work.

Nobody outside ever seems to know exactly how long that animal has been dead.

The holding pen stock handlers were not dismayed that multiple animals died.

It was all part of their normal day.

So would I rather eat from my messy looking farm,

or from the spiffy slaughterhouse going to a brand name cellophane package?

W.E,

Any ideas where I could obtain a captive bolt stun gun here in Thailand? I assume slaughter houses here will use these as a means of dispatching their subjects?

I would very much like to obtain a stun gun, which would be used exclusively 'on farm' when the time comes to say cheerio to sows that have served us well. In my opinion the most humane, stress free method.

Have found companies in the UK & States, however, I would think getting one brought into Thailand would be a nightmare?

Any ideas / info appreciated.

Cheers

Fruity

Howdy there Fruity Toot Toot

I think I'll get the bro-in-law on it and maybe we can make one out of an air cylinder and a bike pump or tap air off an air compressor (better). I think something about the size of cherry tomatoe would ber about right size and then have some sort of safety cabling on it so it can't travel more than 3-4 inches out of the device. Don't know if blundt ended (flat) would be better than rounded ball-like but we can talk about it mybe next week.

Interesting thing about this is when i had my hogs in Monterey County in California my budddy and I did all our own slughtering and then had the carcass worked at the local farm butcher. Man could he make sausage and bacon. Still the best I have ever had. Anywho the first litter it was time to start the process and I took out the old Iver Johnson 8 shot 22 pistol my Unc had given me (what a useless thing it was, as all hand guns basically are) to drop these guys. Now I've been on the runway of a wild charging boar in the mountains of Northern California and the boar didn't win this one but it was 102% total luck that I'm still here today but that's another story, so I finished off a few wild and domestic things in my day up to a few huindred kilos in the ocean and on land and quite a few in the air. Anywhoo again, without sounding repetitive, so I babied over one of my litlle sweethearts into the far reaches of the old barn and figured what wouold be best spot and put a "long rifle" into its skull as my buddy waited with the "sticking" knife. Well there was no big boom bang and goodbye, the hog squealed and gesticulated more than when i got it high on good old homemade sourmash that I was raising them on (and truckk loadfs of brussel sprouts) and dang nab didn't stop umntil it was compleely bled out. Like you talked about good buddy I felt devestated that I had made one of my "babies" suffer so much because i couldn't place a bullet in the correct spot (I heard the stories of guys bouncing shotsof the skulls of wild charging boars because they didn't factor that long sloping snout skull). After dressng it we were going to take it to the butcher and I decided i wanted to split it and see how my bullet missed its target. The brain of a "market"hog is about the size of an egg (and probably a lot more intelligent than a humans in most cases) and when I split the skull I found that the bullet had travelled straight through the center of the brain cavity and basically bisected the brain in the longest way possible. there couldn't be a better way to put them down with the weapon we had. This s has always been an issue for me here as i am sure the fami8ly wuill have nothing to do with this process so the idea of having a stun gun that will drop them without the wild flailing and screaming will be a good thing. peace and love and an old Ford Tractor does wear out but definitely not as fast as this old Ford operator

[IsaanAussie]

If you are worried about a few flies,

then perhaps Thailand isn't for you.

We do have flies

just like your home country has in warm weather months.

We just have no Winter, so you can see them 365 days.

Case by case basis of course.

No one could make one call for the many slaughterhouses of the whole nation.

Mae Sot now has a brand new sparkling slaughterhouse

while the old one it replaced was a sight to behold from the street

I kill my own livestock on the farm,

so I know the potential problems.

I have to instruct the men,

and then enforce what I told them,

because if I turned my back it would be done any sloppy way they please.

If I want the cuts to be recognizable I do the butchering myself.

because they will just whack the carcase in random pieces.

Their logic is, It's food,

you are going to cut it in tiny pieces eventually,

so how could the exact appearance matter in between?

I found it funny,

after I recovered from first being furious,

that an animal could be cut in such unusual ways,

because proper butchering is done according to the logical divisions of the body.

A carcase just wants to fall apart in an orderly fashion

It's not me doing it in the difficult outlandish way.

Never mind cutting neatly at bone joints...they have a machete to break right through bones.

My farm process is not fancy, it definitely does not look pristine,

but when the meat goes onto the ice,

it's been tidy every step in spite of the farm surroundings.

If someone was to see it all from the front gate,

they might be completely put off.

I'll eat from my own sooner than from someone else's.

So it is with a slaughterhouse.

It doesn't necessarily need a shiny roof with sparkling paint on the outside

Open air works about as well.

It's the attention to detail and speed,

getting the meat on ice in the shortest possible time.

What happens after it leaves the slaughterhouse is up to the market vendor.

Some markets have a separate room for meat.

Some of them are even air conditioned with strap curtains over the doors

Others have nothing but tables on the sidewalk,

with an old fan motor spinning plastic bags to give the flies frequent exercise.

If you carry the meat home and cook it well,

everything the fly left will be quite harmless

The other side of this answer is that the places that look darling

are not necessarily more sanitary

Consider that the most formidable microbes thrive in a hospital,

so imagine a pretty market room that isn't kept truly clean EVERY day.

You will potentially get just as sick from pretty meat as from meat with fly eggs visible.

Good News is that most meat in Thailand is sold the same day that it was killed.

Sorry I can't guarantee you that meat in Thailand would not make you sick,

but I've not been food poisoned here in 6 years,

with the minor stomach rumblings from nicer places.

At the slaughterhouse, I've seen animals that died on the truck,

or during unloading.

Soft pampered sheltered animals

who had apparent heart attack in the heat noise and cramped quarters.

Just failed to unload themselves from the truck.

One day two animals died while unloading from one truck.

The truck was contracted to a big name that everyone would immediately recognize.

They aren't separated from the living animals process,

just taken in first when the night slaughter team comes to work.

Nobody outside ever seems to know exactly how long that animal has been dead.

The holding pen stock handlers were not dismayed that multiple animals died.

It was all part of their normal day.

So would I rather eat from my messy looking farm,

or from the spiffy slaughterhouse going to a brand name cellophane package?

W.E,

Any ideas where I could obtain a captive bolt stun gun here in Thailand? I assume slaughter houses here will use these as a means of dispatching their subjects?

I would very much like to obtain a stun gun, which would be used exclusively 'on farm' when the time comes to say cheerio to sows that have served us well. In my opinion the most humane, stress free method.

Have found companies in the UK & States, however, I would think getting one brought into Thailand would be a nightmare?

Any ideas / info appreciated.

Cheers

Fruity

Howdy there Fruity Toot Toot

I think I'll get the bro-in-law on it and maybe we can make one out of an air cylinder and a bike pump or tap air off an air compressor (better). I think something about the size of cherry tomatoe would ber about right size and then have some sort of safety cabling on it so it can't travel more than 3-4 inches out of the device. Don't know if blundt ended (flat) would be better than rounded ball-like but we can talk about it mybe next week.

Interesting thing about this is when i had my hogs in Monterey County in California my budddy and I did all our own slughtering and then had the carcass worked at the local farm butcher. Man could he make sausage and bacon. Still the best I have ever had. Anywho the first litter it was time to start the process and I took out the old Iver Johnson 8 shot 22 pistol my Unc had given me (what a useless thing it was, as all hand guns basically are) to drop these guys. Now I've been on the runway of a wild charging boar in the mountains of Northern California and the boar didn't win this one but it was 102% total luck that I'm still here today but that's another story, so I finished off a few wild and domestic things in my day up to a few huindred kilos in the ocean and on land and quite a few in the air. Anywhoo again, without sounding repetitive, so I babied over one of my litlle sweethearts into the far reaches of the old barn and figured what wouold be best spot and put a "long rifle" into its skull as my buddy waited with the "sticking" knife. Well there was no big boom bang and goodbye, the hog squealed and gesticulated more than when i got it high on good old homemade sourmash that I was raising them on (and truckk loadfs of brussel sprouts) and dang nab didn't stop umntil it was compleely bled out. Like you talked about good buddy I felt devestated that I had made one of my "babies" suffer so much because i couldn't place a bullet in the correct spot (I heard the stories of guys bouncing shotsof the skulls of wild charging boars because they didn't factor that long sloping snout skull). After dressng it we were going to take it to the butcher and I decided i wanted to split it and see how my bullet missed its target. The brain of a "market"hog is about the size of an egg (and probably a lot more intelligent than a humans in most cases) and when I split the skull I found that the bullet had travelled straight through the center of the brain cavity and basically bisected the brain in the longest way possible. there couldn't be a better way to put them down with the weapon we had. This s has always been an issue for me here as i am sure the fami8ly wuill have nothing to do with this process so the idea of having a stun gun that will drop them without the wild flailing and screaming will be a good thing. peace and love and an old Ford Tractor does wear out but definitely not as fast as this old Ford operator

So where the H>E>L>L have you been FEF? By the way, I despatched my eldest boar yesterday at 330kg. He is delicious!

[Foreverford]

If you are worried about a few flies,

then perhaps Thailand isn't for you.

We do have flies

just like your home country has in warm weather months.

We just have no Winter, so you can see them 365 days.

Case by case basis of course.

No one could make one call for the many slaughterhouses of the whole nation.

Mae Sot now has a brand new sparkling slaughterhouse

while the old one it replaced was a sight to behold from the street

I kill my own livestock on the farm,

so I know the potential problems.

I have to instruct the men,

and then enforce what I told them,

because if I turned my back it would be done any sloppy way they please.

If I want the cuts to be recognizable I do the butchering myself.

because they will just whack the carcase in random pieces.

Their logic is, It's food,

you are going to cut it in tiny pieces eventually,

so how could the exact appearance matter in between?

I found it funny,

after I recovered from first being furious,

that an animal could be cut in such unusual ways,

because proper butchering is done according to the logical divisions of the body.

A carcase just wants to fall apart in an orderly fashion

It's not me doing it in the difficult outlandish way.

Never mind cutting neatly at bone joints...they have a machete to break right through bones.

My farm process is not fancy, it definitely does not look pristine,

but when the meat goes onto the ice,

it's been tidy every step in spite of the farm surroundings.

If someone was to see it all from the front gate,

they might be completely put off.

I'll eat from my own sooner than from someone else's.

So it is with a slaughterhouse.

It doesn't necessarily need a shiny roof with sparkling paint on the outside

Open air works about as well.

It's the attention to detail and speed,

getting the meat on ice in the shortest possible time.

What happens after it leaves the slaughterhouse is up to the market vendor.

Some markets have a separate room for meat.

Some of them are even air conditioned with strap curtains over the doors

Others have nothing but tables on the sidewalk,

with an old fan motor spinning plastic bags to give the flies frequent exercise.

If you carry the meat home and cook it well,

everything the fly left will be quite harmless

The other side of this answer is that the places that look darling

are not necessarily more sanitary

Consider that the most formidable microbes thrive in a hospital,

so imagine a pretty market room that isn't kept truly clean EVERY day.

You will potentially get just as sick from pretty meat as from meat with fly eggs visible.

Good News is that most meat in Thailand is sold the same day that it was killed.

Sorry I can't guarantee you that meat in Thailand would not make you sick,

but I've not been food poisoned here in 6 years,

with the minor stomach rumblings from nicer places.

At the slaughterhouse, I've seen animals that died on the truck,

or during unloading.

Soft pampered sheltered animals

who had apparent heart attack in the heat noise and cramped quarters.

Just failed to unload themselves from the truck.

One day two animals died while unloading from one truck.

The truck was contracted to a big name that everyone would immediately recognize.

They aren't separated from the living animals process,

just taken in first when the night slaughter team comes to work.

Nobody outside ever seems to know exactly how long that animal has been dead.

The holding pen stock handlers were not dismayed that multiple animals died.

It was all part of their normal day.

So would I rather eat from my messy looking farm,

or from the spiffy slaughterhouse going to a brand name cellophane package?

W.E,

Any ideas where I could obtain a captive bolt stun gun here in Thailand? I assume slaughter houses here will use these as a means of dispatching their subjects?

I would very much like to obtain a stun gun, which would be used exclusively 'on farm' when the time comes to say cheerio to sows that have served us well. In my opinion the most humane, stress free method.

Have found companies in the UK & States, however, I would think getting one brought into Thailand would be a nightmare?

Any ideas / info appreciated.

Cheers

Fruity

Howdy there Fruity Toot Toot

I think I'll get the bro-in-law on it and maybe we can make one out of an air cylinder and a bike pump or tap air off an air compressor (better). I think something about the size of cherry tomatoe would ber about right size and then have some sort of safety cabling on it so it can't travel more than 3-4 inches out of the device. Don't know if blundt ended (flat) would be better than rounded ball-like but we can talk about it mybe next week.

Interesting thing about this is when i had my hogs in Monterey County in California my budddy and I did all our own slughtering and then had the carcass worked at the local farm butcher. Man could he make sausage and bacon. Still the best I have ever had. Anywho the first litter it was time to start the process and I took out the old Iver Johnson 8 shot 22 pistol my Unc had given me (what a useless thing it was, as all hand guns basically are) to drop these guys. Now I've been on the runway of a wild charging boar in the mountains of Northern California and the boar didn't win this one but it was 102% total luck that I'm still here today but that's another story, so I finished off a few wild and domestic things in my day up to a few huindred kilos in the ocean and on land and quite a few in the air. Anywhoo again, without sounding repetitive, so I babied over one of my litlle sweethearts into the far reaches of the old barn and figured what wouold be best spot and put a "long rifle" into its skull as my buddy waited with the "sticking" knife. Well there was no big boom bang and goodbye, the hog squealed and gesticulated more than when i got it high on good old homemade sourmash that I was raising them on (and truckk loadfs of brussel sprouts) and dang nab didn't stop umntil it was compleely bled out. Like you talked about good buddy I felt devestated that I had made one of my "babies" suffer so much because i couldn't place a bullet in the correct spot (I heard the stories of guys bouncing shotsof the skulls of wild charging boars because they didn't factor that long sloping snout skull). After dressng it we were going to take it to the butcher and I decided i wanted to split it and see how my bullet missed its target. The brain of a "market"hog is about the size of an egg (and probably a lot more intelligent than a humans in most cases) and when I split the skull I found that the bullet had travelled straight through the center of the brain cavity and basically bisected the brain in the longest way possible. there couldn't be a better way to put them down with the weapon we had. This s has always been an issue for me here as i am sure the fami8ly wuill have nothing to do with this process so the idea of having a stun gun that will drop them without the wild flailing and screaming will be a good thing. peace and love and an old Ford Tractor does wear out but definitely not as fast as this old Ford operator

So where the H>E>L>L have you been FEF? By the way, I despatched my eldest boar yesterday at 330kg. He is delicious!

Well hey buddy I've been around and a square but just doesn't seem to be enough time in the days for what it is all about almost put two 46 hour days on the farm and tractor in a matter of a week . My oh my am I getting too old for this stuff but almost got the master plan finished but will update ya when i get a chance at "on the farm" when I continue my last post. peace and love me

[IsaanAussie]

FEF: Well hey buddy I've been around and a square but just doesn't seem to be enough time in the days for what it is all about almost put two 46 hour days on the farm and tractor in a matter of a week . My oh my am I getting too old for this stuff but almost got the master plan finished but will update ya when i get a chance at "on the farm" when I continue my last post. peace and love me

Well howdy yourself. I have been having some great results with biochar from rice hulls. Unfortunately not so much with the local vet's attendance so have had to tell the girly piggy wigs that we are out of bottled and they will just have to settle for draft. As Fruity would probably put it, Young Cyril would be well pleased. Well the young boar is looking a bit knackered as he is on an intensive training program at the moment. Mind you he isnt slow to get sniffing about for the next lesson.

More on topic, I had the eldest boar, one from Fruity "converted" into edibles a couple of days ago by a local pig murderer. Didnt look, didnt ask as to the how but his 330 kgs has yielded some beautiful pork. Can you imagine a piece of loin a metre long?

Edited January 30, 2011 by IsaanAussie

[oldsailor35]

If you are worried about a few flies,

then perhaps Thailand isn't for you.

We do have flies

just like your home country has in warm weather months.

We just have no Winter, so you can see them 365 days.

Case by case basis of course.

No one could make one call for the many slaughterhouses of the whole nation.

Mae Sot now has a brand new sparkling slaughterhouse

while the old one it replaced was a sight to behold from the street

I kill my own livestock on the farm,

so I know the potential problems.

I have to instruct the men,

and then enforce what I told them,

because if I turned my back it would be done any sloppy way they please.

If I want the cuts to be recognizable I do the butchering myself.

because they will just whack the carcase in random pieces.

Their logic is, It's food,

you are going to cut it in tiny pieces eventually,

so how could the exact appearance matter in between?

I found it funny,

after I recovered from first being furious,

that an animal could be cut in such unusual ways,

because proper butchering is done according to the logical divisions of the body.

A carcase just wants to fall apart in an orderly fashion

It's not me doing it in the difficult outlandish way.

Never mind cutting neatly at bone joints...they have a machete to break right through bones.

My farm process is not fancy, it definitely does not look pristine,

but when the meat goes onto the ice,

it's been tidy every step in spite of the farm surroundings.

If someone was to see it all from the front gate,

they might be completely put off.

I'll eat from my own sooner than from someone else's.

So it is with a slaughterhouse.

It doesn't necessarily need a shiny roof with sparkling paint on the outside

Open air works about as well.

It's the attention to detail and speed,

getting the meat on ice in the shortest possible time.

What happens after it leaves the slaughterhouse is up to the market vendor.

Some markets have a separate room for meat.

Some of them are even air conditioned with strap curtains over the doors

Others have nothing but tables on the sidewalk,

with an old fan motor spinning plastic bags to give the flies frequent exercise.

If you carry the meat home and cook it well,

everything the fly left will be quite harmless

The other side of this answer is that the places that look darling

are not necessarily more sanitary

Consider that the most formidable microbes thrive in a hospital,

so imagine a pretty market room that isn't kept truly clean EVERY day.

You will potentially get just as sick from pretty meat as from meat with fly eggs visible.

Good News is that most meat in Thailand is sold the same day that it was killed.

Sorry I can't guarantee you that meat in Thailand would not make you sick,

but I've not been food poisoned here in 6 years,

with the minor stomach rumblings from nicer places.

At the slaughterhouse, I've seen animals that died on the truck,

or during unloading.

Soft pampered sheltered animals

who had apparent heart attack in the heat noise and cramped quarters.

Just failed to unload themselves from the truck.

One day two animals died while unloading from one truck.

The truck was contracted to a big name that everyone would immediately recognize.

They aren't separated from the living animals process,

just taken in first when the night slaughter team comes to work.

Nobody outside ever seems to know exactly how long that animal has been dead.

The holding pen stock handlers were not dismayed that multiple animals died.

It was all part of their normal day.

So would I rather eat from my messy looking farm,

or from the spiffy slaughterhouse going to a brand name cellophane package?

First let me say, You obviously have very little training or exposure to food hygeine

Second. I am quite happy with life in Thailand

Third. I also have cattle on my property in Queensland where we kill for our own freezers. This is done in the open, no" fancy shiny roof" however the carcass is NOT immediately chopped up and put on ice. This is a completely wrong proceedure ( learn something now).............................. The carcass is hung for about 4 days in a portable chiller box, before butchering. NOTE ! this will give you better meat. Understand ??????? duhhhhhhhhhh

Then my "Trained butcher tradesman" comes back and butchers the carcass to my liking, he uses a bandsaw to cut bones and even makes sausages (all on site) with hygene in mind, something that you obviously no nothing about. But there some people will do anything to few a few baht. Oh bye the way..............my home butcher has hand washing facilities, don't see that very often in the village market especially after a visit to the aquat!

Good luck.

Edited January 30, 2011 by oldsailor35

[bina]

can we continue discussing butchering without butchering eachother on the keyboard?

one post removed from view, discussions of hygiene and 'curing' etc welcome; insulting members for discussing their own un orthodox methods, definately not welcome.

bina

[IsaanAussie]

Yesterday I decided to slaughter a spare gilt who was the fifth in a batch and as their new "Mum's" pen with four feeders is all but finished, she had to go. There had been promises to buy her from several locals but none had materialised for weeks, so into the truck and over to the butcher.

This time I thought I would try to get some loin chops out of the deal so set about sketching what was wanted. Peels of laughter for the two guys, "Same, same I do in Pattaya!" was the reply. Well the results are in the chiller under ice and it remains to be seen what the chops are like when everything is cooled down.

Last night was actually the first time I had been there to witness the fatal deed. Bag over the head, wait for the pig to lay down and go quiet, then cut the jugular. Not a peep from the pig. It was like she was asleep, amazing.

Isaan Aussie

[Foreverford]

Yesterday I decided to slaughter a spare gilt who was the fifth in a batch and as their new "Mum's" pen with four feeders is all but finished, she had to go. There had been promises to buy her from several locals but none had materialised for weeks, so into the truck and over to the butcher.

This time I thought I would try to get some loin chops out of the deal so set about sketching what was wanted. Peels of laughter for the two guys, "Same, same I do in Pattaya!" was the reply. Well the results are in the chiller under ice and it remains to be seen what the chops are like when everything is cooled down.

Last night was actually the first time I had been there to witness the fatal deed. Bag over the head, wait for the pig to lay down and go quiet, then cut the jugular. Not a peep from the pig. It was like she was asleep, amazing.

Isaan Aussie

Hey Norteno that is very very interesting I wonder what Fruity thinks of this method. First I've ever heard of it and sounds very interesting. We always went deep after shooting looking for the aorta but could see how a prick of the jugular could do what you said with a subduerd beast, very interesting senor. me

[IsaanAussie]

Yesterday I decided to slaughter a spare gilt who was the fifth in a batch and as their new "Mum's" pen with four feeders is all but finished, she had to go. There had been promises to buy her from several locals but none had materialised for weeks, so into the truck and over to the butcher.

This time I thought I would try to get some loin chops out of the deal so set about sketching what was wanted. Peels of laughter for the two guys, "Same, same I do in Pattaya!" was the reply. Well the results are in the chiller under ice and it remains to be seen what the chops are like when everything is cooled down.

Last night was actually the first time I had been there to witness the fatal deed. Bag over the head, wait for the pig to lay down and go quiet, then cut the jugular. Not a peep from the pig. It was like she was asleep, amazing.

Isaan Aussie

Hey Norteno that is very very interesting I wonder what Fruity thinks of this method. First I've ever heard of it and sounds very interesting. We always went deep after shooting looking for the aorta but could see how a prick of the jugular could do what you said with a subduerd beast, very interesting senor. me

Well you should see the chops I was waiting to get at. Neatly cut up between the ribs with the ribs removed and the spine intact. Two slices of loin attached to a slice of backbone. Oh well, loin steak anyone?

[fruity]

Yesterday I decided to slaughter a spare gilt who was the fifth in a batch and as their new "Mum's" pen with four feeders is all but finished, she had to go. There had been promises to buy her from several locals but none had materialised for weeks, so into the truck and over to the butcher.

This time I thought I would try to get some loin chops out of the deal so set about sketching what was wanted. Peels of laughter for the two guys, "Same, same I do in Pattaya!" was the reply. Well the results are in the chiller under ice and it remains to be seen what the chops are like when everything is cooled down.

Last night was actually the first time I had been there to witness the fatal deed. Bag over the head, wait for the pig to lay down and go quiet, then cut the jugular. Not a peep from the pig. It was like she was asleep, amazing.

Isaan Aussie

LOL........Typical! Explain what you want & they 'pretend' to understand. I agree with F.F; never heard of the bag over the head, lay down method before. Must say, I'd think in the majority of cases it wouldn't work. Maybe I'm wrong, but won't be trying it to find out.

Hey Norteno that is very very interesting I wonder what Fruity thinks of this method. First I've ever heard of it and sounds very interesting. We always went deep after shooting looking for the aorta but could see how a prick of the jugular could do what you said with a subduerd beast, very interesting senor. me

Well you should see the chops I was waiting to get at. Neatly cut up between the ribs with the ribs removed and the spine intact. Two slices of loin attached to a slice of backbone. Oh well, loin steak anyone?

[fruity]

Yesterday I decided to slaughter a spare gilt who was the fifth in a batch and as their new "Mum's" pen with four feeders is all but finished, she had to go. There had been promises to buy her from several locals but none had materialised for weeks, so into the truck and over to the butcher.

This time I thought I would try to get some loin chops out of the deal so set about sketching what was wanted. Peels of laughter for the two guys, "Same, same I do in Pattaya!" was the reply. Well the results are in the chiller under ice and it remains to be seen what the chops are like when everything is cooled down.

Last night was actually the first time I had been there to witness the fatal deed. Bag over the head, wait for the pig to lay down and go quiet, then cut the jugular. Not a peep from the pig. It was like she was asleep, amazing.

Isaan Aussie

Hey Norteno that is very very interesting I wonder what Fruity thinks of this method. First I've ever heard of it and sounds very interesting. We always went deep after shooting looking for the aorta but could see how a prick of the jugular could do what you said with a subduerd beast, very interesting senor. me

Well you should see the chops I was waiting to get at. Neatly cut up between the ribs with the ribs removed and the spine intact. Two slices of loin attached to a slice of backbone. Oh well, loin steak anyone?

Don't know what happened there?............replied then nothing! lol.....As I had previously said, before the escape into cyberspace. Nothing surprises me here anymore. They 'pretend' to understand what you want, but in reality, don't have the foggiest.

Like ForeverFord, I've never encounered the bag over the head-lay down method of slaughtering before. I'd guess, although could be wrong, that in the majority of cases this simply wouldn't work?

[oldsailor35]

can we continue discussing butchering without butchering eachother on the keyboard?

one post removed from view, discussions of hygiene and 'curing' etc welcome; insulting members for discussing their own un orthodox methods, definately not welcome.

bina

Sorry about that mod, but there are always those that just lurk waiting to snipe when someone asks a perfectly comprehensible question. They seem to get hugh satisfaction in 'belittling' others. In my opinion, this type of person are usually nobodys and really should be ignored. However i just cannot resist letting them know the level of my respect for their low social acceptance.

[tim armstrong]

Reading all this stuff about blood and butchery starts to make my teeth get longer, and its a full moon too! Its a long time since I last killed a sheep. But seriously, the hood over the head of many animals is a good old trick, and for pigs a last beer in a bucket with some mash puts them to sleep. I hate killing pigs, their squeals are all a bit too real. Good topic though, and funny how one's attitude changes if your no longer into serious farming.

[teletiger]

However i just cannot resist letting them know the level of my respect for their low social acceptance.

Anybody know what that means? Anybody?....Bueller??

'And of course we should apologise to Bina for any over-reaction to statements that may or may not have meant what we thought they did.

O/T. Bina, just a quick word on the feelings of Israelis to the current affairs in Egypt?

Regards.

[WatersEdge]

Teletiger,

I'm the culprit....but I have a plausible excuse.

I have a childhood development deficiency due to deprived beginnings.

I missed out on the social graces that the other boys learned in kindergarten

because I went straight to first grade.

I was also at one time horridly timid around pretty girls

probably because I have no sister, only brothers.

It's a man's world out on the farm 75 miles from a loaf of bread.

My mother tried to civilize us, it certainly was no fault of hers.

Nowadays I just keep trying to be nice

no matter how many times it turns out wrong,

Each time expecting a different outcome in the face of repeated rejection.

Don't worry much...I'm still young, there's still time.

I truly mean well, I just say it all wrong sometimes.

[charlie10]

Not one for slaughter houses. Best to butcher on site - no stress and distress for the animal. That's important to me.

Most locals know how to kill and cut up pigs(or indeed most other animals). One knock over the head with a wooden 'club' and a sticking knife in the jugular is the method preferred for killing pigs in my village. The blood is kept for use in cooking. It's quick and no suffering as far as I can see. It's done outdoors Thai style, and the meat gets sold that morning to the locals as a lahb making kit with a range of meat and offal cuts and a small bag of blood. We have no problems with flies during this slaugher and cutting up process and as the meat is consumed that day no health dangers.

If anyone does know where to get a stun gun I'd be interested as it would offer a less brutal looking and sure fire way of ensuring the pig is properly stunned.

Re bag over head method: is a plastic bag used or is it simply a large rice bag like those used to store rice in a rice shed? It sounds like a less violent way of rendering the animal unconcious if indeed it doesn't struggle during the suffocation process.

[grimleybob]

Teletiger,

I'm the culprit....but I have a plausible excuse.

I have a childhood development deficiency due to deprived beginnings.

I missed out on the social graces that the other boys learned in kindergarten

because I went straight to first grade.

I was also at one time horridly timid around pretty girls

probably because I have no sister, only brothers.

It's a man's world out on the farm 75 miles from a loaf of bread.

My mother tried to civilize us, it certainly was no fault of hers.

Nowadays I just keep trying to be nice

no matter how many times it turns out wrong,

Each time expecting a different outcome in the face of repeated rejection.

Don't worry much...I'm still young, there's still time.

I truly mean well, I just say it all wrong sometimes.

If there's one thing worse than BS it's sarcastic BS.

Keep it coming .I love it

I never miss your posts

If only half the other poster's were as knowlegeable and helpfull as you (BS free comment)

Bob

[FlyingSaucer]

i changed to vegetarian / vegan diet...... since then i was never sick again..... even bodybuilding is possible and its more effective with plant based diet www.veganbodybuilding.com

[CHANGOVER]

i changed to vegetarian / vegan diet...... since then i was never sick again..... even bodybuilding is possible and its more effective with plant based diet www.veganbodybuilding.com

If that's you in the avatar I think it's too late to start eating meat again you're already dead!