British Border Agency Was Wrong To Deport Thai Bride

[FarangKenStine]

another case of TIB!

[andrewdrummond]

Andrew Drummond must have had a few last night, spot the 3 errors below:

If there is anything in my site which suggests Dennis Booth is a bad man I will correct it. I have cut short a comment at the end already. The fact is the Kanokrat Booth believes her husband is a good man. There was however a classic communication problem and she spent a considerable Thai away from her husband with her two kids in Thailand. There are reasons why the marriage was rocky I am sure.

If the story posted here about the problems of an Australian with a huge sexual appetite is even half true its major. But these things tend to get exaggerated with the telling.

Always glad to have errors pointed out. But I think this is already edited. Thai to go.

[agord]

Her side of the story doesn't add up to a pile of som tam. I especially like that she has this professional background and high so connections but wanted to work at tesco or be a waitress

[Arkady]

A good friend visited, fell for and married a Thai woman, took her back to oz, on a marriage visa which apparently expires when the marriage breaks down if that occurs within 2 (?) years. Every dollar she could grab was sent back to Thailand, where we later discovered she was buying a new Isuzu pick-up.

He finally had enough when he stopped for fuel on the way home, on payday, and the bank a/c was already empty.

Oz immigration not only let her stay, it let her bring in her Thai boyfriend on that visa. <deleted>.

She filed a AVO for "Excessive Sexual Demands" (he has it framed on his wall) and divorce claiming half his house, his car, future financial support............. after less than a year of marriage.

I suggest anyone get both sides of a story before commenting, but expect the word avarice to crop up.

Everyone that gets married should have a solid prenuptial agreement, regardless of whether husband and wife are upstanding members of society or not. Especially for marriages between thai and non-thai because the bride applicant pool is so commonly low end socio-economically. There should also be a clause referring to a will that makes it clear she will get nothing if the husband dies due to questionable circumstances as determined by the executor.

At least the so caller nigerian scammers screw you from a distance, unlike some of these wives screw you close and in your face.

But the food here is really GREAT

Or, just don't get married. Unless of course you need to pay the lower visa requirements.

A pre-nup wouldn't have helped Kiltmaker Booth, since British courts don't recognize them, unless they provide more benefit to the financially weaker party than the law would otherwise give.

Thai law only requires the division of property acquired after marriage and a list of pre-marital assets that are not to be divided in the event of divorce can be included on the Thai marriage certificate. I am not sure if a Thai pre-nup adds anything to that, despite the claims of legal advisors (I don't describe them as lawyers because most aren't), as the Thai family court is entitled to declare a pre-nup invalid if it doesn't comply with the Civil and Commercial Code, i.e. it provides for assets acquired after marriage not to be divided on divorce. However, most of the legal advisors provide a useful service in advising how to correctly file the list of pre-marital assets, as well as organizing other documentation for marriage. Unlike UK courts, Thai courts don't attempt to claim jurisdiction over assets outside their jurisdiction.

Edited January 31, 2011 by Arkady

[TPI]

I am not sure how this couple met but the bride's "wrong button" tour suggests she was an Internet bride. I don't think she should knock the concept too much, just because it didn't work out perfectly for her. She may still hit the jackpot in her divorce proceedings and, judging by the wedding photograph, both bride and groom are singularly unattractive, distinctly "on-the-shelf" specimens who couldn't expect to find any one to marry them in their home cultures. Why knock this last resort option which might work out well for some and may still work out very well for her financially? Clearly the chances for compatibility are very low in this sort of transaction and a modicum of common sense should prevail, as in the case of the old geezers coming to enjoy the dolce vita in Thailand on their basic state pensions who marry the first brassy old tart they meet at a Pattaya beer bar.

Well said!

A number of friends in Oz have "internet brides" and are very happy!

Pity the "poor geezers" who pick a "bad un", the many relationships that are very successful never seem to be reported? Many of these guys have no experience or at least very little in their own country with women, what chance do they have when they run into a "money vacumn cleaner" in deepest darkest Pattiya?

Caveat emptor (let the buyer beware!)

[OzMick]

A good friend visited, fell for and married a Thai woman, took her back to oz, on a marriage visa which apparently expires when the marriage breaks down if that occurs within 2 (?) years. Every dollar she could grab was sent back to Thailand, where we later discovered she was buying a new Isuzu pick-up.

He finally had enough when he stopped for fuel on the way home, on payday, and the bank a/c was already empty.

Oz immigration not only let her stay, it let her bring in her Thai boyfriend on that visa. <deleted>.

She filed a AVO for "Excessive Sexual Demands" (he has it framed on his wall) and divorce claiming half his house, his car, future financial support............. after less than a year of marriage.

I suggest anyone get both sides of a story before commenting, but expect the word avarice to crop up.

But did she get it? - I very much doubt so, as Oz property settlement laws are clearly based around assets gained in the course of a relationship, not those bought into it.

In short, no. But it didn't stop her from trying.

[softgeorge]

A good friend visited, fell for and married a Thai woman, took her back to oz, on a marriage visa which apparently expires when the marriage breaks down if that occurs within 2 (?) years. Every dollar she could grab was sent back to Thailand, where we later discovered she was buying a new Isuzu pick-up.

He finally had enough when he stopped for fuel on the way home, on payday, and the bank a/c was already empty.

Oz immigration not only let her stay, it let her bring in her Thai boyfriend on that visa. <deleted>.

She filed a AVO for "Excessive Sexual Demands" (he has it framed on his wall) and divorce claiming half his house, his car, future financial support............. after less than a year of marriage.

I suggest anyone get both sides of a story before commenting, but expect the word avarice to crop up.

Everyone that gets married should have a solid prenuptial agreement, regardless of whether husband and wife are upstanding members of society or not. Especially for marriages between thai and non-thai because the bride applicant pool is so commonly low end socio-economically. There should also be a clause referring to a will that makes it clear she will get nothing if the husband dies due to questionable circumstances as determined by the executor.

At least the so caller nigerian scammers screw you from a distance, unlike some of these wives screw you close and in your face.

But the food here is really GREAT

prenupt's are not legal nor are they worth the paper they are written on in Australia.

[jayjay0]

Her side of the story doesn't add up to a pile of som tam. I especially like that she has this professional background and high so connections but wanted to work at tesco or be a waitress

Kinda talks to the Bigotry of Westerners.

Qualified Thai women go wait table.

[Chris Lawrence]

Only when u are horny with no brains will this happen? Marriage manuals need to be updated and handed out to all.

But it does sound strange. Going there and knowing that he won't pick u up. Marriage/contract still in place? Like anything in life 'beware of a woman's scorn' and if it is over have the decency to end with dignity.

[oldsailor35]

Links not working Mr D.

Still not working

Not for m either !

[blackthorn2005]

Links not working Mr D.

Still not working

I hope I have corrected the link. Here it is anyway?

www.andrew-drummond.com/2010/12/11/culture-shock-a-thai-brides-fight-for-dignity/

If there is anything in my site which suggests Dennis Booth is a bad man I will correct it. I have cut short a comment at the end already. The fact is the Kanokrat Booth believes her husband is a good man. There was however a classic communication problem and she spent a considerable Thai away from her husband with her two kids in Thailand. There are reasons why the marriage was rocky I am sure.

If the story posted here about the problems of an Australian with a huge sexual appetite is even half true its major. But these things tend to get exaggerated with the telling.

'a classic communication problem and she spent a considerable Thai away' Oops

[oldsailor35]

After reading the Andrew Drummond piece,the husband comes across as not a nice piece of work.

On the other hand,the lady should have known it was not a good idea to marry a man who likes wearing skirts.

Guess he was not just wearing her skirts.......pointing with his feet to monks makes him superficial. A skirt maker, oh my holy god....:jap:

Strange that you mention the "feet towards the monk" thing. I was taught never to do that years ago, but was afraid to bring it up, thought i might be wrong. But yes, there he is feet forward, good job he has'nt got his skirt on.

[blackthorn2005]

"In the initial refusal notice the Border Agency stated that Mrs. Booth, who arrived on a Residence Permit last May, had come to see a man, who was not her husband, and that the marriage to kilt-maker Dennis Booth from 'was no longer subsisting'. "

This from the people who try & tell us they are the only ones who know how to speak "Engrish"

Nothing wrong the sentence, fail to see your point.

Nothing wrong 'with' the sentence, fail to see your point?

[frankthetank]

How many times do you Sassanachs have to be told they are "kilts" not skirts?

If it walks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck it's a duck !

Do ducks wear skirts too?

[dude007]

How many times do you Sassanachs have to be told they are "kilts" not skirts?

If it walks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck it's a duck !

WHOOAAAAAAAHHH! the best of the day!

[dumball]

jayjay0' timestamp='1296473518' post='4187704']

agord' timestamp='1296462530' post='4187403']

Her side of the story doesn't add up to a pile of som tam. I especially like that she has this professional background and high so connections but wanted to work at tesco or be a waitress

Kinda talks to the Bigotry of Westerners.

Qualified Thai women go wait table.

Rather the lack of reading skills or attention , NOTE : The lady said SHE wanted to work at Tesco or be a waitress .

[dumball]

jayjay0' timestamp='1296473518' post='4187704']

agord' timestamp='1296462530' post='4187403']

Her side of the story doesn't add up to a pile of som tam. I especially like that she has this professional background and high so connections but wanted to work at tesco or be a waitress

Kinda talks to the Bigotry of Westerners.

Qualified Thai women go wait table.

Rather the lack of reading skills or attention , NOTE : The lady said SHE wanted to work at Tesco or be a waitress .

[slipperx]

I wonder why I can't ever recall any admission of wrongdoing by the Thai immigration. Maybe that is because it is impossible for them to be wrong since everything is 'up to the officer' at the time. Makes having even the complicated rules in place here a bit of a farce since even if you adhere to them all there is still room for the 'officer' to act on his own whim. At least in Europe there is a chance of a fair hearing it seems.

The wonders of the 'Rule of Law'

[MAJIC]

Interesting that EU regulations overruled the UKBA's on the spot decision which would might well have been upheld by the tribunal if the UK hadn't acceded to the EEA agreement on immigration. I am not sure where it goes from here because she must have been on a two year marriage visa which is normally converted to ILR (indefinite leave to remain) when it expires, if the marriage is still good. What is her position now? The "resident permit" mentioned in Andrew's article is not an official classification of the UKBA. So the article leaves unclear what her UK immigration status was/is.

I think the article is fairly positive in that it illustrates the fact that the UK, like most Western liberal democracies, has an independent judicial process for issues of immigration and nationality which is totally absent in Thailand. Everything in these areas in Thai law boils done to the "discretion of the minister" and the system fails the most basic tests of transparency as a result. It is difficult to do much about this against the backdrop of a constitution that omits to recognize the rights of foreigners. On the other hand ordinary Thais without money or connections in the new age of populisim are now treated much better than they used to be by government officials and get pretty good service from district offices that used to force them to wait for hours or come back another day.

I am not sure how this couple met but the bride's "wrong button" tour suggests she was an Internet bride. I don't think she should knock the concept too much, just because it didn't work out perfectly for her. She may still hit the jackpot in her divorce proceedings and, judging by the wedding photograph, both bride and groom are singularly unattractive, distinctly "on-the-shelf" specimens who couldn't expect to find any one to marry them in their home cultures. Why knock this last resort option which might work out well for some and may still work out very well for her financially? Clearly the chances for compatibility are very low in this sort of transaction and a modicum of common sense should prevail, as in the case of the old geezers coming to enjoy the dolce vita in Thailand on their basic state pensions who marry the first brassy old tart they meet at a Pattaya beer bar.

Agreed,that's why they fight to stay in the UK rather than rush back to Thailand,they have Human Rights, something, in short supply in their own Country.

Edited January 31, 2011 by MAJIC

[Patsycat]

Isn't there some clause in Scottish law - that after you have lived together for a certain number of years, you are entitled to being a "common law wife" thereby being able to demand half of your other half's earnings? Or did they get rid of that?

Mr Booths knees are too skinny to wear a kilt.

Edited January 31, 2011 by Patsycat

[Bagwan]

How many times do you Sassanachs have to be told they are "kilts" not skirts?

Are you sure that the subject of your ire is English?

No Englishman would ever be brave/stupid enough to go up to a big, hairy Scotsman and insinuate that his friend from north of the border was less than one hundred percent pure heterosexual? Unless, of course, he was inordinately fond of hospital food, that is.

During WW1 the Germans called the 51st Highland Division 'the devils in skirts' or 'the ladies from Hell'. Only the ignorant, or a US evangelist, would make untoward comment about Jock proudly wearing the tartan. Pity about their football though.

The Greeks can be a blood thirsty lot and they have soldiers wearing what look like tutus. Not a good idea to make one of them a butt for your jokes or you might find yourself holding your guts in your hands - or experiencing a pain in the ass.

[Bagwan]

"In the initial refusal notice the Border Agency stated that Mrs. Booth, who arrived on a Residence Permit last May, had come to see a man, who was not her husband, and that the marriage to kilt-maker Dennis Booth from 'was no longer subsisting'. "

This from the people who try & tell us they are the only ones who know how to speak "Engrish"

What a gaffe from the grammar police. Use of the word 'subsisting' is entirely appropriate. BTW, in the final sentence 'to' should be used instead of the ampersand. .

[alant]

How many times do you Sassanachs have to be told they are "kilts" not skirts?

If it walks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck it's a duck !

[Bagwan]

Her side of the story doesn't add up to a pile of som tam. I especially like that she has this professional background and high so connections but wanted to work at tesco or be a waitress

Kinda talks to the Bigotry of Westerners.

Qualified Thai women go wait table.

There are Thai qualifications and there are those that carry some weight in the First World. Thai educational qualifications are not worth the paper that they are written on which is why the well heeled send their kids to the International schools in Thailand and then abroad to further their studies. Further more there is no shortage in Thailand of ladies with accountancy qualifications operating supermarket tills. A case of physician heal thyself? I see nothing shameful about waiting on tables, indeed I believe that in Italy one is proud to do so. It is an art, one sadly lacking in Thailand by my experience.

I note that it was stated that the lady wanted to work at Tesco which is a plus and at variance with all those travelling Thai ladies who prefer to provide personal services. Many recent arrivals to the UK are distinctly work shy and want to live off the State. Not so in this case. Good on her.

[alant]

After reading the Andrew Drummond piece,the husband comes across as not a nice piece of work.

On the other hand,the lady should have known it was not a good idea to marry a man who likes wearing skirts.

This is an indication of radical racial actions against the national dress of Scotland. This type of racisiam is no acceptable.

[ianbaggie]

It is sad that English racism even permeates this message board.

However, having lived with it for more than 60 years, it rarely surprises me any more how far they can travel and still retain their contempt for other people's traditions and way of life.

kwai!! The English are only racist to their own people - NOt to foreigners!! Thats why i donbt live there - Englsnds needs MORE racism not less!!

[MJP]

It is sad that English racism even permeates this message board.

However, having lived with it for more than 60 years, it rarely surprises me any more how far they can travel and still retain their contempt for other people's traditions and way of life.

kwai!! The English are only racist to their own people - NOt to foreigners!! Thats why i donbt live there - Englsnds needs MORE racism not less!!

Not racism, more a common sense approach to immigration.

An old friend from the UK just spent a year getting an Australian visa and work permit for him and his English wife. He's a 38 year old GP and she's a specialist nurse. It wasn't easy.

[Thongkorn]

How many times do you Sassanachs have to be told they are "kilts" not skirts?

If it walks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck it's a duck !

Would cross dresser surfice. man who wears a skirt.

[Beetlejuice]

The women denied having an affair?

Really? So for what other reasons would the guy attempt to blank his wife if she was the ever loving, caring, naive little loyal wifey she claims to be?

This woman is persisting with her case to stay in Britain for financial gain, pure and simple.

From experience I know that no matter how naive this Thai women is, there are those that have learnt all the tricks and will quickly advise her on how to take dear old hubby to the cleaners using the soft touch UK legal system. She will probably be given legal aid, so she has everything to gain and nothing to lose.

The court will view her as a poor naive lady from a third world country, ill treated by a much older man who should have known better and she will play the game.

It appears that the guy is a prominent businessman and I am sure that if he was living on social security benefits, in a run down council flat somewhere, that this woman wouldn’t even bother making the effort.

No matter how this case goes against the hubby, the women will be permitted to stay in Britain, given accommodation and financial supported, either by claiming benefits or by the hubby imposed to do so through the courts.

Once the case is over, she will become well established in Britain, perhaps have a string of farangs on the go and suddenly within an instant her naivity will disappear.

It`s going to be like a lottery win for her, every which way she cannot lose.

[agord]

Her side of the story doesn't add up to a pile of som tam. I especially like that she has this professional background and high so connections but wanted to work at tesco or be a waitress

Kinda talks to the Bigotry of Westerners.

Qualified Thai women go wait table.

There are Thai qualifications and there are those that carry some weight in the First World. Thai educational qualifications are not worth the paper that they are written on which is why the well heeled send their kids to the International schools in Thailand and then abroad to further their studies. Further more there is no shortage in Thailand of ladies with accountancy qualifications operating supermarket tills. A case of physician heal thyself? I see nothing shameful about waiting on tables, indeed I believe that in Italy one is proud to do so. It is an art, one sadly lacking in Thailand by my experience.

I note that it was stated that the lady wanted to work at Tesco which is a plus and at variance with all those travelling Thai ladies who prefer to provide personal services. Many recent arrivals to the UK are distinctly work shy and want to live off the State. Not so in this case. Good on her.

My point was that once she had worked in a career that was challen ging and interesting to her (Im assuming) so I found it strange that she would be satisfied in a job such as this?