Unmarried Partner Visa

[sturfc]

Hi folks,

Hope somebody can help me here with some visa advice.

I am a UK national currently serving in HM Forces. My partner (unmarried) is Ethiopian and is currently living in Ethiopia with our daughter (1 year old) while I am deployed on Operations.

It is my intention on completion of my Ops tour, to terminate my military Service and relocate to Thailand. The main reason for this is I cannot get them a visa to get into the UK!!!

I myself will travel on an Education visa which will effectively give me 15 months (3 months plus 1 year) in the country studying the culture and the language, which I will need anyway. After this period I will have reached the age of 50 and then be eligible for a retirement visa. I will also have an immediate pension and gratuity for my military Service.

How though can I bet my partner and kid to accompany me? I have sent numerous emails to Hull but never seem to get a reply. I've also set emails to the Royal Thai Embassy in Washington DC (where I'm currently located) but no reply from them either. Maybe they don't know the answer themselves???? I thought maybe a Non Immigrant O visa would be the solution if the application were accompanied with a letter from myself stating that I will accept full financial responsibility for them both while they are in Thailand. If this actually possible, will Hull or London be able to process and issue the visas for us all or must I send hers and the kids applications elsewhere?

Any advice would be gratefully appreciated.

Stu

[Basil B]

Those reasons may also prohibit her from Thailand as well, but this is not the best section for asking about visas for Thailand.

If you wish to pursue the issue why you think she will not be permitted a visa for the UK then probably you can get advice here, but first question is why is likely to be refused a visa for the UK?

Edit in:

sorry miss read your email, not wife but partner

[sturfc]

Hi Basil B,

Thanks for your reply.

I thought this was the Thai Visa Forum and therefore that somebody may have encountered similar problems and may be able to advise further.

Regarding the UK visa issue, I have been advised that it would be highly unlikely that she would be granted a UK visa. The reason given was that they could not determine whether she had had the child to get a UK visa or not!! Unfortunately it does not seem to matter that I am a UK citizen and the father of the child. The UK appears to be more concerned about letting 'others' into our country who have no right whatsoever, but that is another issue.

I hope you will understand, but I believe it to be totally immoral and unfair that I have to leave my own country in order to be in the same country to raise my child. There can be no excuse or fair reasoning in denying this child the right to enter the UK. Strangely though, a few years ago I came across someone who had a very similar problem and he was a member of the FCO (Foreign and Commonwealth Office). He actually married the girl and still they refused a UK visa for both his wife and his child.

Anyway, if anybody has any advice on my issue, I would appreciate it.

Stu

[Basil B]

Sorry to here of your situation,

If you want help with Visas for Thailand best to post again in http://www.thaivisa....d-work-permits/ which deals with Visas to enter/stay in Thailand.

If you are still open to the idea of returning to UK with your partner I would stick with this section, quote: "I have been advised that it would be highly unlikely that she would be granted a UK visa. The reason given was that they could not determine whether she had had the child to get a UK visa or not!!" seems you may not have had the best advice, AFAIK the child does not qualify your partner to join you in the UK, though it can be used to substantiate you relationship.

I presume the main problem is although you may have been in a relationship for 2 or more years because of your job you will have had long periods of separation therefore not qualifying "you have both been living together as if you were married or in a civil partnership for at least two years" as stipulated by UKBA to enter or remain in the UK as the unmarried/same-sex partner.

There are other options like marrying you partner or applying for a fiance(e) settlement visa and marrying in the UK, lots of bureaucracy but probably possible.

Anyway best of luck.

Basil.

[7by7]

I thought this was the Thai Visa Forum and therefore that somebody may have encountered similar problems and may be able to advise further.

This is the Visas and migration to other countries forum. For advice on visas for Thailand you need to post in the Thai visas, residency and work permits forum.

Normally I would move this topic there; but as you have also asked about UK visas I'll leave it here and deal with that subject.

I have been advised that it would be highly unlikely that she would be granted a UK visa. The reason given was that they could not determine whether she had had the child to get a UK visa or not

Advised by whom?

Do you mean that she has applied and been refused and this was the reason given by the Entry Clearance Officer for the refusal? If so, I would say that she has very strong grounds for appeal!

Or were you advised by someone else?

The basic requirement for settlement as the unmarried partner of a British citizen or resident is that the couple must have been living together in a relationship akin to marriage outside the UK for at least the preceding two years. Brief times spent apart due to work etc. is allowed, as are holidays together in the UK.

See SET05 - Unmarried and same sex partners.

If you are unable to meet the unmarried partners requirements then an alternative would be for you to marry each other and she can then apply as your spouse; see SET03 - Spouses

Whichever one she applies for she will need to demonstrate that she meets the English language requirement when she submits her application.

You will also need to demonstrate that you can support and adequately accommodate her and your child without recourse to public funds. See Maintenance and accommodation

If you have not already done so, you should obtain a British passport for your daughter; she will not then, of course, need a visa for the UK.

Having said all that the above, the fact that you are a serving member of HM Armed forces may change all of it! Unfortunately, the only information I can find on serving or ex HM Armed Forces members and their families refers to those members who are not UK citizens.

Hopefully someone with more knowledge than I on this point can help.

TVE? VP? Scouse?

a few years ago I came across someone who had a very similar problem and he was a member of the FCO (Foreign and Commonwealth Office). He actually married the girl and still they refused a UK visa for both his wife and his child.

Without knowing the circumstances of the applicant and sponsor and the wording of the refusal notice it is impossible to comment on the rights and wrongs of a refusal.

If you do decide that living in Thailand is what you want to do, then say so and I will move this topic to the appropriate forum.

I have amended the topic title to give a clearer picture of what you want to know.

[VisasPlus]

I thought this was the Thai Visa Forum and therefore that somebody may have encountered similar problems and may be able to advise further.

This is the Visas and migration to other countries forum. For advice on visas for Thailand you need to post in the Thai visas, residency and work permits forum.

Normally I would move this topic there; but as you have also asked about UK visas I'll leave it here and deal with that subject.

I have been advised that it would be highly unlikely that she would be granted a UK visa. The reason given was that they could not determine whether she had had the child to get a UK visa or not

Advised by whom?

Do you mean that she has applied and been refused and this was the reason given by the Entry Clearance Officer for the refusal? If so, I would say that she has very strong grounds for appeal!

Or were you advised by someone else?

The basic requirement for settlement as the unmarried partner of a British citizen or resident is that the couple must have been living together in a relationship akin to marriage outside the UK for at least the preceding two years. Brief times spent apart due to work etc. is allowed, as are holidays together in the UK.

See SET05 - Unmarried and same sex partners.

If you are unable to meet the unmarried partners requirements then an alternative would be for you to marry each other and she can then apply as your spouse; see SET03 - Spouses

Whichever one she applies for she will need to demonstrate that she meets the English language requirement when she submits her application.

You will also need to demonstrate that you can support and adequately accommodate her and your child without recourse to public funds. See Maintenance and accommodation

If you have not already done so, you should obtain a British passport for your daughter; she will not then, of course, need a visa for the UK.

Having said all that the above, the fact that you are a serving member of HM Armed forces may change all of it! Unfortunately, the only information I can find on serving or ex HM Armed Forces members and their families refers to those members who are not UK citizens.

Hopefully someone with more knowledge than I on this point can help.

TVE? VP? Scouse?

a few years ago I came across someone who had a very similar problem and he was a member of the FCO (Foreign and Commonwealth Office). He actually married the girl and still they refused a UK visa for both his wife and his child.

Without knowing the circumstances of the applicant and sponsor and the wording of the refusal notice it is impossible to comment on the rights and wrongs of a refusal.

If you do decide that living in Thailand is what you want to do, then say so and I will move this topic to the appropriate forum.

I have amended the topic title to give a clearer picture of what you want to know.

Serving members ( who are not British citizens) of the British Armed Forces are exempt from immigration control. However, dependants of all serving mermbers, no matter whether they are British citizens or not, are all subject to immigration control. Therefore , the Ethiopian spouse needs to qualify for a settlement visa if she wants to live in the UK.

None of us can comment, I think, on what would happen if the OP's partner applies for a settlement visa without knowing the background to the relationship. To say that she will not qualify for a visa, without us having further information, would not be fair, and the "advice" the OP has already received may well be wrong.

[sturfc]

Thanks for your comments so far regarding this subject.

The advice I have received 'informally' is from the British Embassies in Addis Ababa and Washington DC. Both were of the same understanding.

Unfortunately I cannot satisfy the criteria that we have lived together 'officially' for 2 years. This is due to the fact that as a member of HM Forces, the MOD does not recognise unmarried partners. The fact that we did 'unofficially' live together is not recognised. During this time, the position I held was in a Diplomatic post which meant with security restrictions, she could also not 'officially' live with me.

At this present moment in time, I am in the process of gathering the necessary documentation together to apply for a British passport for my daughter. This should be a formality due to the British citizenship law. When this has been obtained, this will support an application for a visa for my partner, however, this could well be revoked and again looked at as her way of attempting to enter the UK. Her visa application will not however be a formality and will be forwarded for review which will take some months. In the likelihood of refusal and appeal, the process will be ongoing for more months, during which they will not be in the UK and I would. Strangely during this time our daughter will have a British passport but her mother will not therefore our daughter will be able to enter the UK, but will be unable to travel without her mother.

To summarise the above, I don't believe I have any other alternative but to relocate, and therefore have chosen Thailand. I may well have to also pay for an Education visa for my partner as well if this becomes my only way of obtaining a visa for her. During our time in Thailand I would obviously continue to progress the UK visa application for her as well.

7by7,

I would be gratefulif you could transfer this to the correct forum.

Many thanks

[7by7]

I still do not see why, if she meets the requirements, the application should be subject to review nor why she should be deemed to have had a child with you merely to obtain settlement in the UK.

OK, you don't meet the unmarried partners criteria, but could still marry and go for a spouse visa or go for a fiance visa and marry in the UK.

But if you are saying that ECOs in two separate embassies have told you different, then maybe it is so.

As per your request, I am moving this topic.

[lopburi3]

You do not mention why no marriage after termination of service; which would seem to solve your UK problem if you did so.

She would not qualify for any special visa consideration in Thailand. Only if you were married and on one year extensions of stay would she qualify for any visa other than tourist. Thailand does not recognize such relationships at all.