dr_Pat_Pong Posted December 31, 2003 Share Posted December 31, 2003 Sex now...pay later . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tks Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Let me ask this. Why do the foreigners have to change over to Thai culture 100% when they marry a Thai girl? Isn't marriage about compromise and meeting in the middle? Let me get this straight...you pay for the wedding, take care of the girl for the rest of her life, probably help support the family at one point or another AND you pay a dowry to the family? Boy, what a bargain!!! There's no meeting in the middle on any of that, the foreigner gets screwed from start to finish! Does the groom have to become Thai overnight??? To say "it is Thai culture" is an excuse that is used for every type of scam done in this country. Because the Thais are raised (their culture now) that all white people have money to just waste away, they think they can screw them at any point in life and it is okay, again, cause it is "culture." How about telling them that you will compromise...and pretend it is 2004. How about you marry her, and 'take care' of her, and there is no need for a dowry??? Now, you are meeting in the middle, and are doing something that is called "fair." I know, a wacky concept in Thai culture. Guys...good luck, but is just seems like a big scam wrapped in the same old tired 'culture' excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Mist Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 My ex wife (a bloody female sheep rooter) cost me 1/2 a house $60,000. Plenty of trans-tasman travel (she couldn't make her mind up where she wanted to be) selling up and starting again every time maybe another $30,000. She was involved in a "family trust" donate money every week and to be used by family members in times of need, cant estimate that but never saw a cent of that money when we split. I reckon all up $150,000 would be a conservative figure. So tiz me maybe I would've been better giving her 1/2 the money straight up and not wasted 15 years and heaps of grief. I dont think Thais' corner the market on "culture adjustment". My wife is Thai, I never paid a Dowry (both parent deceased) and the only money that goes back is to house improvements and maintenance. My experience is good as a lot of others on this forum are. to tks you sound so familiar but if you dont like the "culture conversion" then choose another culture, nobody has a gun to your head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanTheMan Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 It is negotiable, and sometimes you don't even have to negotiate. I was told early on that my girlfriend would cost me a billion baht, but once her father got to know me, I wai'ed at all the right times, spoke a few words of Thai to him, and invited him to my Bangkok apartment for tea and cookies, it went down to 100,000. Both my American ex-wives cost me considerably more when I offloaded them; here you pay up front instead of at the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frenchFARANGbkk Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Let me ask this. Why do the foreigners have to change over to Thai culture 100% when they marry a Thai girl? Isn't marriage about compromise and meeting in the middle? Let me get this straight...you pay for the wedding, take care of the girl for the rest of her life, probably help support the family at one point or another AND you pay a dowry to the family? Boy, what a bargain!!! There's no meeting in the middle on any of that, the foreigner gets screwed from start to finish! Does the groom have to become Thai overnight??? To say "it is Thai culture" is an excuse that is used for every type of scam done in this country. Because the Thais are raised (their culture now) that all white people have money to just waste away, they think they can screw them at any point in life and it is okay, again, cause it is "culture." How about telling them that you will compromise...and pretend it is 2004. How about you marry her, and 'take care' of her, and there is no need for a dowry??? Now, you are meeting in the middle, and are doing something that is called "fair." I know, a wacky concept in Thai culture. Guys...good luck, but is just seems like a big scam wrapped in the same old tired 'culture' excuse. Exactly! Tell them it is 2004, and if they do not understand tell them byebye... (and byebye to the girl at the same time if she choose her family instead of choosing you) Sometimes I'm asking me how is it possible that men accept that?!? Is this love that can push them? Or just the reality of the poorness of their relationships? If it is just that they want to show off, give them a 5 million baht CHECK from your home country (but in baht currency), like somebody (so smart) did and told on Stickman website! No risk, and they can even keep it as a souvenir !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erco Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 The stories of Dowry's are endless, I was told it was based on Education and the parents annual income. The Dowry's I have heard that have been paid for Prostitutes astound me, they only have one avenue a stupid Farang. 200k for a Uni grad is the norm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maerim Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 TizMe You did say 20 million baht and not Turkish lira didn't you? Because if it was that its about the best part of £300 grand. Far be it from making suggestions, but nudge nudge, wink wink is as good as a nod to a blind bat bat in a coal cellar. Would it not have been cheaper to get her a high rise condo in Pattaya? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest IT Manager Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Or maybe buy the building Pete? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boon Mee Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 The stories of Dowry's are endless, I was told it was based on Education and the parents annual income.The Dowry's I have heard that have been paid for Prostitutes astound me, they only have one avenue a stupid Farang. 200k for a Uni grad is the norm. 200k for a Uni grad is the normYes, but watch out for the tried & true scam for the girl to get her picture taken wearing the Thammasat or Chula uniform and pass herself off as a university graduate. The poor dumb farang won't realize until the day she's asked to balance the checkbook or read something out of Thai Rath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TizMe Posted January 2, 2004 Share Posted January 2, 2004 Would it not have been cheaper to get her a high rise condo in Pattaya? Good idea, but unfortunately the flimsy balconies on Pattaya condos only seem to give way if an X and a Y cromosone are present. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meemiathai Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 tks, did you marry a thai? Did you pay a dowry? If not, what's your problem? If yes, did they point a gun to your head? I am very happy with paying the dowry and having the ability to help her family to live better! Some of you farangs like to stress that how all it is about LOVE ONLY for a marriage. Wow, how ROMANTIC? But how come is it that you put money such a high position and are so disturbed by the issue? Afterall, is love really that FREE in the West? Why come to Thailand? Stay home and enjoy your farang wives! So you both can carry a calculator at all times and clarify whose money is whose! Something I would be interested. In the West, do people just tell their parents to go to ###### if they got into financial problems? And say that I have got my own family now, and I need the money for my holiday to Miami! The Dowry's I have heard that have been paid for Prostitutes astound me, they only have one avenue a stupid Farang.200k for a Uni grad is the norm. How many times have I seen farangs complaining about the dowry issue as selling a daughter or buying a wife? And now I see a farang pricing someone who's supposed to be a wife! Do you have a price list? I would like to see!If being poor can bring me love, don't give me any money! If life can be exchanged for love, give me cancer pls! If love takes freedom away, send me to prison! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NedKelly Posted January 3, 2004 Author Share Posted January 3, 2004 hey meemiathai.......it is Thai culture that is placing a price on Thai brides........not farang. Your foot is firmly in your mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meemiathai Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 The Dowry's I have heard that have been paid for Prostitutes astound me, they only have one avenue a stupid Farang.200k for a Uni grad is the norm. Can you explain what that means?Is he suggesting prostitutes have a different price to Uni grads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meemiathai Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 It is not just Thai culture. Dowry exists here in HK and a lot of other places! For those who want less fuzz, go look for wives in orphanages! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tks Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 Hey Bronco, I am not complaining for myself...I would never marry a Thai girl, it is just not my preference. Plus, I didn't come here to find a wife. So your shallow "if you don't like it you can leave" statement, while being simple minded, doesn't apply to me. I was simply making a point for discussion. Additionally, I have "dated" Thai women, from Exec level to hiso, but never considered them for marriage. I can't say I know how the farm girl relationship thing works here. But, the girls I spoke with laughed when I brought the topic up for kicks. Their families would never ask for a dowry. One of the girls indicated how families only pull that scam if they can get away with it. These are generalizations with exceptions, so please reframe from using exceptions to prove a rule. I am not ragging on you guys in particular, I just think it is foolish that you have to conform 100% without compromise. You support the lazy family, support the girl......man, it doesn't stop. Ask yourself this....if back in England some English girl said give my family a ton of money, promise to support me and my lazy family for the rest of my life, THEN I will marry you...would you jump at that great offer? I rest my case.......guys, don't be blind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tks Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 Wow....I knew Iwoud get attacked for those comments! Okay...next round! Hey Meemiathai-- your questions: >>>tks, did you marry a thai?<<< God no! And I wasn't burned by one either, so no, I am not bitter. (I am a rather happy person) >>>Did you pay a dowry? See answer above. >>>If not, what's your problem? <<< No problem, this is a discussion board, so I raised a point. >>>If yes, did they point a gun to your head?<<< I would never marry a Thai girl. My choice, that's all. If you like them, great for you! Is that the only reason guys come to Thailand, to find a wife? I did not come here for that. So, since I don't like Thai women, I have to leave now? If you want to support a girl, and her family, go for it! Does that allow you the option of crying about it if you willingly do it? Well, since you chose to do it, your cries may fall on deaf ears. Look, I am on the guys side here...my biggest point of all of this is you guys should not have to bend over 100%, there should be some compromise. Why is that so bad? Because you are in Thailand? Don't let these families jerk you around by the nose. You think you can't find another 20ish skinny Thai girl to fall head over heels for? Man, there are millions of them here. What is the worst she can do? Break up with you? Oh gosh....you won't be able to replace her, in about, oh, five minutes! I think it was Stickman who said guys do things here that they would never even think of back in their home country. Like common sense gets sucked out of a guy at Don Muang and never returns. Since guys are ###### bent on paying a dowry, here is another compromise. How about this, if she stays married to you faithfully for say, five years, or ten, you pay a small amount. But nothing till then. Say it is an English custom for her to prove her love to you! Good luck guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meemiathai Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 It's good that you do not have a problem. And yes, this is a discussion board and that's why I'm talking to you. Let me ask this. Why do the foreigners have to change over to Thai culture 100% when they marry a Thai girl? Isn't marriage about compromise and meeting in the middle? Let me get this straight...you pay for the wedding, take care of the girl for the rest of her life, probably help support the family at one point or another AND you pay a dowry to the family? Boy, what a bargain!!!I can just say that you have been poisoned by Stickman's website. You are just listening to the farang side in that website. Try yourself to hear from the Thai side and probably see it yourself. "foreigners have to change over to Thai culture 100% when they marry a Thai girl" that is bullshit! Most aren't capable of that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tks Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 Wait...I just fell out of my chair....let me catch my breath! Okay...I am finsihed laughing! meemiathai--Thank you so much!!!! Your post...that was great, I applaud you! You said most foreigners "can't adapt to the Thai culture." Wait, just writing that made me crack up again! In the thousands of years this "culture" has been around, look at how far it has progressed! Still a third rate, third world country. But hey, at least there were no soi dogs around for APEC. I will say I love Thai food though! And the next thing out of your mouth "So why are you here?" Go on, a simplistic response which I expect. This place is what it is. Not that that in and of itself is bad, but let's not make it out like it is some advanced or civilized country. Nice weather, cheap housing. Low cost of living... But, it's still a joke around the world with a reputation for one thing, which is why the all too honest P.M. is trying to change it so bad. You know, closing the bars early and that sort of thing. I have to be fair, maybe in another 5,000 years Thailand will reduce the amount of sex workers from 2.8 MILLION to oh, I don't know, maybe 1.8 million. This is getting fun. Tag, you're it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 There'll be Virtual Sex Workers by then TKS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meemiathai Posted January 3, 2004 Share Posted January 3, 2004 Very nice! Nice to see a farang honestly expressing himself. Coz it's not easy to hear true feelings from some of the farangs here. At least I understand more on what the stories from Stickman's website are based on. And it has given me a more positive side about Thailand. And I am sure it took me a longer time than you to finish laughing! Thank you very much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkthai Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 Additionally, I have "dated" Thai women, from Exec level to hiso, but never considered them for marriage. I can't say I know how the farm girl relationship thing works here. But, the girls I spoke with laughed when I brought the topic up for kicks. Their families would never ask for a dowry. One of the girls indicated how families only pull that scam if they can get away with it. No, the bride's families would never ask for a "dowry". It falls upon the groom's family to bring up the issue of bride's price less the bride's family lose face. This is especially true as you work your way up the social and wealth ladder of Thailand. In most cases, if the families are good, you will get back the bride's price however, it will be up to them to decide if they will keep the bride's price or give it back...not you. Try getting married to an "exec" or "high so" without a mentioning "dowry". Amazing!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Mist Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 Your point is taken tks but consider this. Can you think of a country (1st world if there is such a thing) where the immigrants are expected to "culture convert" on arrival, where comments like "why do they speak in their own lingo, rude arn't they?why cant the barstards speak english anyway?" If they married a local, that would get the tongues wagging and if the local spouse changed culture well!!! Does that sound slightly familiar? Which country 3 points foint for guessing? The point is when people move to another country and culture they are expected to change. I guess in Thailand I can see many parallels in attitude to our unnamed 1st world country, which one? Many would fit the bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tks Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 Hey hkthai--please reread my post. The "hiso and exec" women I spoke of were the ones laughing about a dowry. There are still a small amount of hiso's that ask for a dowry and yes, give it back, you are correct. That is really becoming or is the minority nowadays, according to the Thais I have spoken with over the years. Because of business relationships as well as personal, I interact with a rather elevated level in Thailand. (Believe me, that is nothing to boast about, it has nothing to do with me as a person, but what they think I can do for them in business, they would no doubt rather have a Thai do this for them if one could) I repeat, I am not ragging on the guys here, I am on their side. If they want to pay for a bride, it is up to them, but it is not necessary to do so, especially for some uneducated, deceitful farm girl. The Thai culture raises these girls (farm girl and non-farm girl alike) to see a "walking ATM machine" when a white guy walks by. When a 50 year old white guy hooks up with some 20 year old Isaan farm girl, this 20 year old already knows, through her "cultural" training, how to remove this guy's money from his pocket. This is an extreme example but applies in a general sense. I take issue with it all falling under tha scam of the word "culture." Guys, you cannot, no matter how wonderful of a person you are, change the cultural programming these girls are bombarded with over the decades of their life (I know I can't and I have a long background in doing just such a thing). Good, bad, or indifferent, that's how it is. Guys often come to me when they go through these scenarios (because of my background) and it turns my stomach to hear these stories. I hate having to tell the truth, but it all ends up the same (I wish it didn't). To be honest, I have seen ONE scenario/couple which has been legit, just one. As for the Stickman reference, I quoted him just once, I never said he was God, but his on the nose commentary is very often correct. I appreciate someone who sees reality as it is, no matter how ugly. I take the same approach. The truth is ugly in this scenario, because guy's feelings and money are at stake. Peel away the layers of the onion and you get the truth. To the guys who PMed me in support of these points...thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hkthai Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 Hey hkthai--please reread my post. The "hiso and exec" women I spoke of were the ones laughing about a dowry. There are still a small amount of hiso's that ask for a dowry and yes, give it back, you are correct. That is really becoming or is the minority nowadays, according to the Thais I have spoken with over the years. Because of business relationships as well as personal, I interact with a rather elevated level in Thailand. (Believe me, that is nothing to boast about, it has nothing to do with me as a person, but what they think I can do for them in business, they would no doubt rather have a Thai do this for them if one could) Perhaps you should ask the "hiso and exec" a more specific question to the cultural norms for thai marriages. They will tell you that a bride's price is paid for in thai marriages. This is ESPECIALLY so for "hiso and exec" given their position in society. Anyone telling you that bride's price are not paid does not subscribe to Thai culture or didn't feel the need relate thai marriages in it's entirety otherwise. BTW, this is not exclusive to farang. Thai men also pay. Of course, as mentioned in my earlier post, bride's price are typically given back (usually as a gift to the brides to be). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Mist Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 BTW, this is not exclusive to farang. Thai men also pay. Of course, as mentioned in my earlier post, bride's price are typically given back (usually as a gift to the brides to be). true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest IT Manager Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 I just started discussing a bride price for my mia noi. I am expected to pay... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_Pat_Pong Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 even with your attributes ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Mist Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 even with your attributes ? Finally a comment, good onya Doc, but you misspelt assets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_Pat_Pong Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 even with your attributes ? Finally a comment, good onya Doc, but you misspelt assets Grasp for a dictionary son. First principles, don't argue ( or correct ) your betters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Mist Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 I've heard that one b4 "dont correct your betters", so the social structure prevails or are we talking intelligence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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