Buying A Condo In Cm

[Hecate]

I am interested in buying a condo, and have contacted a real estate agency regarding one that I like. The price has been reduced, and it has been on the market for many months, but agent doesn't want to answer my questions or show it to me. I have sent two emails about a second condo which has also been on the market for months. Again the agent rebuffed me and hasn't answered my latest email after more than two days. I don't think I said anything offensive or wrong in my emails. I tried two other agents and they aren't interested in selling either. All of the websites are have contact forms and are in English, which presumably means they are targeting foreigners. Can anyone explain this strange and frustrating behaviour? Maybe they don't want to deal with women?

[Hecate]

I should also add that I asked a large real estate company for info on their latest project and they ignored several emails. Any ideas what the problem might be?

[Raindancer]

I should also add that I asked a large real estate company for info on their latest project and they ignored several emails. Any ideas what the problem might be?

Hi. I don't know where you come from or even whether you live in Thailand. But I assume from your questions and frustrations that you do not live here. I say that because this is normal Thai behaviour with estate agencies. My first piece of advice is never buy property in Thailand for many obvious reasons, unless of course you are buying it to rent out. But even then, I would advise against it as the market is flooded with properties for rent, especially here in Chiang Mai.

It might be better if you visited CM and found the area you intend to live or rent in and then strike a deal.

But a word of caution....make sure that the person selling the property, even through a so called Estate Agent actually owns the property and is legally entitled to sell it. You would be amazes at some of the hearttbreaking Scams that have been perpetrated, not only to Farangs, but also Thai people.

Good luck with your venture.

If you want any more assistance, please feel free to PM me

[Hecate]

I should also add that I asked a large real estate company for info on their latest project and they ignored several emails. Any ideas what the problem might be?

Hi. I don't know where you come from or even whether you live in Thailand. But I assume from your questions and frustrations that you do not live here. I say that because this is normal Thai behaviour with estate agencies. My first piece of advice is never buy property in Thailand for many obvious reasons, unless of course you are buying it to rent out. But even then, I would advise against it as the market is flooded with properties for rent, especially here in Chiang Mai.

It might be better if you visited CM and found the area you intend to live or rent in and then strike a deal.

But a word of caution....make sure that the person selling the property, even through a so called Estate Agent actually owns the property and is legally entitled to sell it. You would be amazes at some of the hearttbreaking Scams that have been perpetrated, not only to Farangs, but also Thai people.

Good luck with your venture.

If you want any more assistance, please feel free to PM me

[midas]

I should also add that I asked a large real estate company for info on their latest project and they ignored several emails. Any ideas what the problem might be?

Hi. I don't know where you come from or even whether you live in Thailand. But I assume from your questions and frustrations that you do not live here. I say that because this is normal Thai behaviour with estate agencies. My first piece of advice is never buy property in Thailand for many obvious reasons, unless of course you are buying it to rent out. But even then, I would advise against it as the market is flooded with properties for rent, especially here in Chiang Mai.

It might be better if you visited CM and found the area you intend to live or rent in and then strike a deal.

But a word of caution....make sure that the person selling the property, even through a so called Estate Agent actually owns the property and is legally entitled to sell it. You would be amazes at some of the hearttbreaking Scams that have been perpetrated, not only to Farangs, but also Thai people.

Good luck with your venture.

If you want any more assistance, please feel free to PM me

Seconded !!

I was shocked by the number of scammers in real estate in CM

[Hecate]

Thanks for the reply. You're right. I won't be in Thailand for about a month. I guess that's why the agents can't be bothered with me. It also explains why properties sit on the market forever. I have been to CM several times, though and have done quite a bit of internet research.

When you say never buy property in Thailand for obvious reasons, do you mean noise, pollution, problems getting things fixed, stagnant market, etc or something else? I plan to buy a property and live in it most of the time. Some of it looks really good, and I have just sold a property in Vancouver that is worth about six or eight times what a similar property in CM would be. Plus it's stinking cold here. I've bought and sold lots of property before and will use a lawyer. He doesn't answer my emails either.

[ProThaiExpat]

Even in the west, real estate agents offer for sale properties that they are not the "listing agent", that is the agent contracted by the owner/seller to market the property. In many countries, Thailand being one of them, only the listing agent receives the fee for selling the property so agents who have advertised the property to give the impression they have many listings, have little to profit from when you contact them.

Also, if the property is a dump and many are in Thailand, the listing agent has long ago given up hope of selling an overpriced property so why bother showing it.

The advice that you need to "walk the neighborhood" to see what is for sale and what is a fair price is a must.

Buying a condo without thoroughly investigating the building, the Juristic person committee and determining how much the reserves are only invites disaster as many are recounting regularly on Thaivisa.

Coming to Thailand from a well managed condo building in Waikiki I was fortunate to rent a condo in what appeared to be a nice building for six months before building my home. In Thailand, all too often "investors" buy condos and don't bother to pay their common area fees, as many Thais don't as well. The result, elevators are turned off, pools not maintained, maintenance not kept up and gradual deterioration of your investment occurs even if your committee is a good one.

Even if you find a "good building" there is nothing to stop an owner from selling or renting to people you would not want to be physically so close to, ie. on the other side of a common wall, riding up in the elevator, avoiding garbage left in the hall prior to be taken down to the rubbish bin, etc.

I thank my luck stars I didn't buy a condo in CM and was able to build a house of my own design in an ideal location for me at a price far less per sq. meter than any condo I saw that was merely a box in a stack of boxes. To each his own, just tread lightly and carefully and investigate more than carefully before buying into what many have fled from.

[elektrified]

I too, would advise against purchasing a condominium in Thailand as you could lose money as many others have.

Also, Thais have to be the worst in the world when it comes to returning emails. They seldom ever do and if they do, it often takes weeks. So I would not take that personally. In Chiang Mai it is best to just drop by the business you want to communicate with and deal with it personally. If you are out of the country then it becomes difficult.

[prism]

Don't let these guys scare you into not buying a condo. I've bought several in Pattaya and sold them for a nice profit. I don't see why you can't do the same in CM although don't expect the same appreciation. My advice; Rent a place for 6 months, find a good agent and take your time and use due diligence. You should be fine if you make a smart purchase.

[Hecate]

Thanks, all, for the info. You've given me lots to think about. Maybe I'm a little too anxious to go after tempting deals on the net. Maybe I'll rent in a building that I like, and go from there. I like condos for security reasons, but there's no real incentive for management to keep you happy. My current building in Vancouver is like that. We had an okay manager when I bought years ago, but he was replaced by Bozo the Clown. We haven't had an AGM in three years.

Can anyone provide feedback on some of the newer places, Karnkanok, Mountain Front etc? Much appreciated.

[true blue]

theres lots of good, well managed apartment buildings in chaing mai,and there is abundance of new condos being built in some prime posistions,especially near the new massive complex being built on the canal road.by 700 stadium,good time to invest.

[CheGuava]

But a word of caution....make sure that the person selling the property, even through a so called Estate Agent actually owns the property and is legally entitled to sell it. You would be amazes at some of the hearttbreaking Scams that have been perpetrated, not only to Farangs, but also Thai people.

And, perpetrated not only by Farangs, but also by Thai people.

Also, a real estate agent typically won't own the place, that's why they're called an 'agent'.

Edited February 24, 2011 by CheGuava

[SadieMBeagle]

I ran into the same situation when I was trying to rent (not buy) a house in Chiang Mai. I sent a raft of emails, and got very few responses, and no phone calls. People kept telling me "Email doesn't work. You have to pick up the phone and call." This was hard for me, as I HATE talking on the phone. But I finally started making calls, and that's what started yielding results. Sure, there were still a few agents who just don't seem to want to earn their commission at all, and won't do anything for you. But those are the ones who don't call you back. Stick with the agents who actually return your calls, and are willing to show you properties when you ask them too. Oh, another thing that happened with an agent I tried...she showed me a house and I didn't like it. She insisted it was absolutely perfect for me, and was everything I asked for. Well, true, but I just didn't like it. So I said I'd have to get back to her. She got angry with me, and never called me again. So, finally I ended up with the agent who showed me houses until I found one that I liked, and didn't pressure me, and was honest about houses that weren't worth my time. The good news is, I really don't think me being a woman had any adverse effect on my home search.

I echo the sentiments of others here who advise you to come and rent for six months or even a year, so you can take your time and find the neighborhoods and buildings that you like. There's really no substitute for actually being here, IMO. In fact, don't even rent an apartment until you get here. Stay in a guesthouse for a few weeks or a month, and find a nice little place to rent for a few months.

My advice, in a nutshell:

1. Call, don't email

2. Rent first, buy later

Good luck!

[sfokevin]

One suggestion if you are in the market to buy a condo... Use the online websites to search & find a nice looking building and unit that suits you - Then go in person to the condo building and ask the reception/office for a listing of owners that are interested in selling in the building - Most larger building keep a (long!) list of units for sale in the building reception office - This also will give you a good indication if the Website has inflated the sale price for the web savvy farrangs...

But as some have alluded to: Buying is easy - Selling is not so easy (But possible in time) so make sure you really want it...

I would also add that it is cheap & easy to rent - and it gives you a very good way to try the building/neighborhood out... :jap:

Edited February 24, 2011 by sfokevin

[No1]

Can anyone provide feedback on some of the newer places, Karnkanok, Mountain Front etc? Much appreciated.

Have you used the search function? There are many threads on them with useful advice.

One suggestion if you are in the market to buy a condo... Use the online websites to search & find a nice looking building and unit that suits you - Then go in person to the condo building and ask the reception/office for a listing of owners that are interested in selling in the building - Most larger building keep a (long!) list of units for sale in the building reception office

Can't agree more.

[Hecate]

Thanks for all the advice. Definitely better than what I got from the agents. I'll go directly to the buildings once I'm in town. I think I can figure out which units are for sale from the websites, and I'll save my unanswered emails as proof that I tried the traditional route first. I won't buy anything without extensive research, if I buy anything at all, and then I'll lawyer it to death.

I guess if you do buy anything it's for keeps, because if it's this difficult to buy, it's got to be even worse to sell. Scary.

[orang37]

Sawasdee Khrup, Khun Hecate,

Would like to just reinforce the suggestions of Khun Prism and Khun SadieMBeagle that you come and live here first, for at least six months, get to know the city, and its surrounding areas. Visit condos personally, hopefully meet with people who've purchased and lived there for years and can clue you in on the rough spots, the hidden pitfalls.

In this trial period of living here, hopefully, you can get an idea of what lifestyle is right for you, where you want to hang out, shop, exercise, what zones of the city you want to nearer to, or farther away from. Your experience with Thai traffic (whether you'll want to travel around by car or motorcycle), and learning how to use public transport here (tuk-tuks, and flag-down-red-trucks) may influence your ultimate choice.

Avoid agents, and consider using a Bangkok lawyer, or a lawyer highly recommended here on this forum, for due diligence on title and ownership rights (there are lots of bent lawyers here, as well as pretzellized real-estate agents).

Keep your money out of the country until ready to buy, and research how you are going to stay here legally (type of visa).

And, if you haven't lived here for a while, get a sense if Chiang Mai, and Thailand, is really "right" for you: you will go through "culture shock" if you have not lived here before for some period of time.

best wishes, ~o:37;

[ChiangMaiFun]

To answer your first question is easy TIT! they have no concept of customer service and that's just the way it is - don't let people scare you into not buying - I own a few and, although you have to work at it they were all rented out last year - this year is a little more difficult.

I know many farangs who have bought here (mostly for rental income) and many more just to live in - no serious problems unless you overpay of course.

[shepsel]

It is nice to look at condo websites and look at the various units that are available. Unless you are familiar with Chiang Mai and the condo locations throughout the city and suburbs, it would be most advantageous to you to rent something for three to six months, and in the meantime go to various parts of the city you would think you would like to live in and go to the management office and ask if they know if there are any condos for sale in that specific building. If you don't plan on owing a vehicle it would be most advantageous to live in Central Chiang Mai where there are songtaews to take you everywhere you might want to go. Before considering to purchase it would be wise to speak to owners in the building as well as tenants to get a "feel" for it.

Also remember that prices vary by square footage, and view, but the three most important rules of real estate are: 1. Location. 2. Location. 3. Location. Adequately maintained and managed condominium buildings will retain their value in the city centre. They are easier to rent out and sell than those in the suburbs where access is relied upon private transportation. This is part of condominium lifestyle. If you are buying a new condo, you will probably have to install your own kitchen and cupboards as well as air conditioning, hot water, etc, etc. If you are purchasing a used condo, you will likely have to remodel to your specifications unless you find something that you can live with.

I have found that agents are pretty useless in Chiang Mai. Many of them have a few listings, but there is no Multiple Listing Service (MLS) where every real estate agent can access and show another agency listings. So, it will take a bit of legwork and time on your part to find suitable and fair priced accommodations. Agents show what they have--not what you necessarily want and it would be advisable if you want to use an agent--use several of them. Always use a qualified lawyer for closing the deal and transferring the deed.

I personally think it is better to get a long term renewable lease for period of three to five year increments for a set period of time on a condo rather than purchase. The market is flooded and it is naturally a buyers and renters market. And, I have calculated on a 4 million baht apartment (100 meters or larger) it would take more than twenty years to pay off the principal at zero percent interest versus renting at the price I am paying in rent. Thus, I can leave the money I would have invested for the condo in investments and use the investment interest to pay my rent and still have my cash available to me by selling my stock investments. rather than real estate investment.

[ramrod711]

Thanks for the reply. You're right. I won't be in Thailand for about a month. I guess that's why the agents can't be bothered with me. It also explains why properties sit on the market forever. I have been to CM several times, though and have done quite a bit of internet research.

When you say never buy property in Thailand for obvious reasons, do you mean noise, pollution, problems getting things fixed, stagnant market, etc or something else? I plan to buy a property and live in it most of the time. Some of it looks really good, and I have just sold a property in Vancouver that is worth about six or eight times what a similar property in CM would be. Plus it's stinking cold here. I've bought and sold lots of property before and will use a lawyer. He doesn't answer my emails either.

I'M FROM BRITISH COLUMBIA AS WELL. I HAVE LIVED IN CHIANG MAI FOR 5 YEARS AND LOVE IT. BEWARE, THERE ARE LAWS WHICH LIMIT THE NUMBER OF FOREIGNERS THAT CAN OWN CONDOS IN A BUILDING. I KNOW OF ONE BUILDING IN CHIANG MAI WHERE A FORMER MANAGER SOLD THE PARKING LOT AND THE LAND THAT WAS PUT ASIDE FOR THE SWIMMING POOL. THE RESIDENTS HAVE BEEN TRYING TO GET THIS LAND BACK FOR SEVERAL YEARS WITH LITTLE SUCCESS BUT LOTS OF PROMISES THAT IT CAN BE DONE IF ONE IS WILLING TO PAY THE PROPER OFFICIAL. I WOULD RENT UNTIL YOU KNOW THAT THE BUILDING THAT YOU ARE CONSIDERING IS A GOOD PLACE TO BUY.

[Nuff Said]

Thanks for the reply. You're right. I won't be in Thailand for about a month. I guess that's why the agents can't be bothered with me. It also explains why properties sit on the market forever. I have been to CM several times, though and have done quite a bit of internet research.

When you say never buy property in Thailand for obvious reasons, do you mean noise, pollution, problems getting things fixed, stagnant market, etc or something else? I plan to buy a property and live in it most of the time. Some of it looks really good, and I have just sold a property in Vancouver that is worth about six or eight times what a similar property in CM would be. Plus it's stinking cold here. I've bought and sold lots of property before and will use a lawyer. He doesn't answer my emails either.

I'M FROM BRITISH COLUMBIA AS WELL. I HAVE LIVED IN CHIANG MAI FOR 5 YEARS AND LOVE IT. BEWARE, THERE ARE LAWS WHICH LIMIT THE NUMBER OF FOREIGNERS THAT CAN OWN CONDOS IN A BUILDING. I KNOW OF ONE BUILDING IN CHIANG MAI WHERE A FORMER MANAGER SOLD THE PARKING LOT AND THE LAND THAT WAS PUT ASIDE FOR THE SWIMMING POOL. THE RESIDENTS HAVE BEEN TRYING TO GET THIS LAND BACK FOR SEVERAL YEARS WITH LITTLE SUCCESS BUT LOTS OF PROMISES THAT IT CAN BE DONE IF ONE IS WILLING TO PAY THE PROPER OFFICIAL. I WOULD RENT UNTIL YOU KNOW THAT THE BUILDING THAT YOU ARE CONSIDERING IS A GOOD PLACE TO BUY.

Post removed.

Edited February 28, 2011 by Nuff Said