Phantom Exhaust Restrictor Caps

[Riggi]

Hi all,

has anyone removed the restrictor caps in their TA200 exhaust?

How did you do it?

Do you have any hints/tips/photos?

What was the the perfromance result like?

thanks,

Rich

[billd766]

I didn't know I had any but if you do find out can you please tell me too.

When I have the throttle wide open if I pull the clutch in I get a lot more rpm from the engine so there must be something slowing me down apart from my generously proportioned 155kg body (read fat man into that if you wish).

[Mugg]

When I have the throttle wide open if I pull the clutch in I get a lot more rpm from the engine so there must be something slowing me down

This was a joke, right? Funny if it was, if not still funny

[Mugg]

are you aware of the need for back pressure on small engines...and especially bikes? Are you just trying to get some rumble from the pipes ?...You will be giving up HP for DB's... you could but a set of tuned pipes...

or do like I did back in the day . "clothes pin a baseball card to the fender, and let it hit the spokes"

[Mugg]

here is another review of this idea

[H2oDunc]

I didn't know I had any but if you do find out can you please tell me too.

When I have the throttle wide open if I pull the clutch in I get a lot more rpm from the engine so there must be something slowing me down apart from my generously proportioned 155kg body (read fat man into that if you wish).

UNBELIEVABLE

How anybody can have such lack of understanding about such a thing in this day and age is beyond me

[Mugg]

I didn't know I had any but if you do find out can you please tell me too.

When I have the throttle wide open if I pull the clutch in I get a lot more rpm from the engine so there must be something slowing me down apart from my generously proportioned 155kg body (read fat man into that if you wish).

UNBELIEVABLE

How anybody can have such lack of understanding about such a thing in this day and age is beyond me

Well if they have never been around a clutched drive train I can some what understand.. I just hope he is the last one, I think we have them all now .. LOL..

[H2oDunc]

As far as I am aware the Honda Phantom isn't restricted. The only thing in the exhaust are the exhaust baffles which actually assist with the power output of the engine. Taking them out will simply make the bike noisier and less powerful. The bike isn't designed to be a speed machine. it is a plodder and treated well will run forever. If you want to go a little faster then I suggest you trade in your Phantom and spend some real money on a larger cc bike.

[Riggi]

OK Thanks all.

I'd read a few people mention that they had taken the restrictors out of the exhaust pipe and got better performance.

I'm not worried about the noise if it has more pick up and a higher top speed.

But if it's going to be detrimental to performance than I'll give it a miss.

I've tried searching on the internet and asking (in my limited Thai) about getting an aftermarket exhaust around Chiang Rai but can't find anywhere to get one.

An extra 50cc's would be perfect for all the hills I have to climb between Natoe and Mae Chan/Chiang Rai city.

Cheers,

Rich

[billd766]

As far as I am aware the Honda Phantom isn't restricted. The only thing in the exhaust are the exhaust baffles which actually assist with the power output of the engine. Taking them out will simply make the bike noisier and less powerful. The bike isn't designed to be a speed machine. it is a plodder and treated well will run forever. If you want to go a little faster then I suggest you trade in your Phantom and spend some real money on a larger cc bike.

It IS a plodder and all I am looking for is another 15 too 20 kph in top gear. The fastest I have ever been was going downhill where I clocked 109kph according to my GPS but the speedo was reading 125 kph.

The problem is really in the gearbox

From the Honda Phantom owners manual

POWER TRANSMISSION

Primary reduction 3.090

Gear ratio, 1st 2.545

2nd 1.687

3rd 1.280

4th 1.041

5th 0.903

6th 0.814

Final reduction 3.154

As you can see 5th and 6th gears are really over drives .

I can drive just as fast in 4th as 6th gear but it is not economical so the engine revs are there but it is not in a usable power band which is the main problem.

I suppose I could play around with the sprockets and perhaps change the existing 13/44 to perhaps 12/44 or 12/45.

Of course it would ruin the blindingly fast acceleration and I may possibly go from a standing start to 100kph in the same day but it would be perfect.

I would also need tailored racing leathers and tuck myself flat onto the tank but just the thought of me in racing leathers brings a smile to my face.

They would need to take the skin from the Thai Army blimp to find the material big enough in one piece.

Edited April 5, 2011 by billd766

[dave_boo]

are you aware of the need for back pressure on small engines...and especially bikes? Are you just trying to get some rumble from the pipes ?...You will be giving up HP for DB's... you could but a set of tuned pipes...

or do like I did back in the day . "clothes pin a baseball card to the fender, and let it hit the spokes"

Except that back pressure is usually achieved in the first 24" or so of the system; removing baffles probably won't do much of anything other than annoying people....

I didn't know I had any but if you do find out can you please tell me too.

When I have the throttle wide open if I pull the clutch in I get a lot more rpm from the engine so there must be something slowing me down apart from my generously proportioned 155kg body (read fat man into that if you wish).

UNBELIEVABLE

How anybody can have such lack of understanding about such a thing in this day and age is beyond me

I've known Bill for quite a while now, and if it was not calling him a fairy I'd say he has an impish sense of humour...(plus I pin his weight more at 110 or thereabouts)

[Mugg]

are you aware of the need for back pressure on small engines...and especially bikes? Are you just trying to get some rumble from the pipes ?...You will be giving up HP for DB's... you could but a set of tuned pipes...

or do like I did back in the day . "clothes pin a baseball card to the fender, and let it hit the spokes"

Except that back pressure is usually achieved in the first 24" or so of the system; removing baffles probably won't do much of anything other than annoying people....

I didn't know I had any but if you do find out can you please tell me too.

When I have the throttle wide open if I pull the clutch in I get a lot more rpm from the engine so there must be something slowing me down apart from my generously proportioned 155kg body (read fat man into that if you wish).

UNBELIEVABLE

How anybody can have such lack of understanding about such a thing in this day and age is beyond me

I've known Bill for quite a while now, and if it was not calling him a fairy I'd say he has an impish sense of humour...(plus I pin his weight more at 110 or thereabouts)

Well Bill owes me a beer for making me spend 30 minutes cleaning the coffee off my keyboard , monitor and the velvet painting of Elvis, when I read that...

[dave_boo]

As far as I am aware the Honda Phantom isn't restricted. The only thing in the exhaust are the exhaust baffles which actually assist with the power output of the engine. Taking them out will simply make the bike noisier and less powerful. The bike isn't designed to be a speed machine. it is a plodder and treated well will run forever. If you want to go a little faster then I suggest you trade in your Phantom and spend some real money on a larger cc bike.

It IS a plodder and all I am looking for is another 15 too 20 kph in top gear. The fastest I have ever been was going downhill where I clocked 109kph according to my GPS but the speedo was reading 125 kph.

The problem is really in the gearbox

From the Honda Phantom owners manual

POWER TRANSMISSION

Primary reduction 3.090

Gear ratio, 1st 2.545

2nd 1.687

3rd 1.280

4th 1.041

5th 0.903

6th 0.814

Final reduction 3.154

As you can see 5th and 6th gears are really over drives .

I can drive just as fast in 4th as 6th gear but it is not economical so the engine revs are there but it is not in a usable power band which is the main problem.

I suppose I could play around with the sprockets and perhaps change the existing 13/44 to perhaps 12/44 or 12/45.

Of course it would ruin the blindingly fast acceleration and I may possibly go from a standing start to 100kph in the same day but it would be perfect.

I would also need tailored racing leathers and tuck myself flat onto the tank but just the thought of me in racing leathers brings a smile to my face.

They would need to take the skin from the Thai Army blimp to find the material big enough in one piece.

The sad thing is that you're already running a lower speed ratio (13/44 is 3,385) than stock (13/41 should be stock if the ratio is 3,154).

If my figuring is correct, and I understand you properly, than you're pulling ~9500 RPM in 4^th at top speed (100 kph) compared to your ~6700 RPM in 6^th. So, if your claims of 100 kph in 4th with the throttle pinned are correct, than dropping a 12/44 setup on your bike will move your theoretical top speed to 119 kph at 9500 RPM. Fourth will be good for 65-93 (these numbers and all following are from 6700 to 9500 RPM), fifth 75-107, and sixth 83-119. Will this actually net you the extra 15-20 kph you're looking for? I would lean towards no. It appears that you are power bound, not gearing.

Having absolutely no idea the dyno results of the TA-200, but merely looking at wikipedia's article it appears that the max horsepower comes on at 8000 RPM. With your current gearing 8000 RPM is 107 KPH in 6th. Hence you're at the peak horsepower and still struggling along. I doubt that moving the gearing down to match peak torque will do much since that at peak HP you're still 90,5% of peak torque...according to wikipedia's numbers.

Have you thought about getting the bugger tuned up? Your consumption seems rather high to me and if you look at the threads from Singapore they're getting much better.

**edit**

As I was looking over your numbers and punching them into my spreadsheet I noticed that the Phantom's 4th gear is exactly the same as the old model CBR's 5th...

[billd766]

As far as I am aware the Honda Phantom isn't restricted. The only thing in the exhaust are the exhaust baffles which actually assist with the power output of the engine. Taking them out will simply make the bike noisier and less powerful. The bike isn't designed to be a speed machine. it is a plodder and treated well will run forever. If you want to go a little faster then I suggest you trade in your Phantom and spend some real money on a larger cc bike.

It IS a plodder and all I am looking for is another 15 too 20 kph in top gear. The fastest I have ever been was going downhill where I clocked 109kph according to my GPS but the speedo was reading 125 kph.

The problem is really in the gearbox

From the Honda Phantom owners manual

POWER TRANSMISSION

Primary reduction 3.090

Gear ratio, 1st 2.545

2nd 1.687

3rd 1.280

4th 1.041

5th 0.903

6th 0.814

Final reduction 3.154

As you can see 5th and 6th gears are really over drives .

I can drive just as fast in 4th as 6th gear but it is not economical so the engine revs are there but it is not in a usable power band which is the main problem.

I suppose I could play around with the sprockets and perhaps change the existing 13/44 to perhaps 12/44 or 12/45.

Of course it would ruin the blindingly fast acceleration and I may possibly go from a standing start to 100kph in the same day but it would be perfect.

I would also need tailored racing leathers and tuck myself flat onto the tank but just the thought of me in racing leathers brings a smile to my face.

They would need to take the skin from the Thai Army blimp to find the material big enough in one piece.

The sad thing is that you're already running a lower speed ratio (13/44 is 3,385) than stock (13/41 should be stock if the ratio is 3,154).

If my figuring is correct, and I understand you properly, than you're pulling ~9500 RPM in 4^th at top speed (100 kph) compared to your ~6700 RPM in 6^th. So, if your claims of 100 kph in 4th with the throttle pinned are correct, than dropping a 12/44 setup on your bike will move your theoretical top speed to 119 kph at 9500 RPM. Fourth will be good for 65-93 (these numbers and all following are from 6700 to 9500 RPM), fifth 75-107, and sixth 83-119. Will this actually net you the extra 15-20 kph you're looking for? I would lean towards no. It appears that you are power bound, not gearing.

Having absolutely no idea the dyno results of the TA-200, but merely looking at wikipedia's article it appears that the max horsepower comes on at 8000 RPM. With your current gearing 8000 RPM is 107 KPH in 6th. Hence you're at the peak horsepower and still struggling along. I doubt that moving the gearing down to match peak torque will do much since that at peak HP you're still 90,5% of peak torque...according to wikipedia's numbers.

Have you thought about getting the bugger tuned up? Your consumption seems rather high to me and if you look at the threads from Singapore they're getting much better.

**edit**

As I was looking over your numbers and punching them into my spreadsheet I noticed that the Phantom's 4th gear is exactly the same as the old model CBR's 5th...

Sorry Dave.

You are correct it should be 13/41 and not 13/45.

Fat fingers on the keyboard again.

Getting it tuned up sounds a good idea. Perhaps there is somewhere in Nakhon Sawan that could do it. Other than that I suppose BKK or Chiang Mai.

I have to do a 90 report in NS in a few days so I will look around there for something.