Chavalit's Resignation From Pheu Thai Could Be The Start Of A Major Party Split

[stepenwolf1958]

Abhisit did not correct ANY bad thing from previous time.

Did not make any change on good. Fact.

Now come on, Stepenwolf. Just because you say so doesn't make it a fact. A few supporting articles, some wiki, etc., would go a long way to prove your point. Without those your 'facts' should be labeled 'opinions'. Please try again.

From your local Dutch uncle rubl

or wishful thinking, or guesses, or propaganda ...LOL

Wrong of course.

A question for you is:

Do you know what was improved in society during this government as benefit of the people?

I have stated my argument, I think so and it is the opposite of what you think, definitely.

But, you have a chance here to oppose me by telling here what it is so well done? And what is improved, in terms of quality of life in Thailand???

Specify, please what is this government has done well, or correct the mistakes of previous governments?

Do you know at least something to say?

[yoshiwara]

While the reds were rampaging in Bangkok last year urging their supporters to burn the place down, PTP was the junior partner in a clearly defined support role. The reds held the initiative. Once the reds were broken, defeated and cleared off the streets as an armed group, it was PTPs turn to move to the forefront and prepare for the election. So they thought. They also thought they could consider the party leadership question as part of the preparation. Mingkwan's team visit to Thaksin was a significant event which many of us underestimated in its importance. By humiliating Mingkwan, Thaksin sent a definitive message to the PTP that the idea of a popular front was now going to be fully subservient to the Thaksin card. The Thaksin family was the future. All bow down. Party policy? 'Bring me back and I will sort it out in 6 months'. The message has not been lost on party leaders with power centres of their own. They are expendable. If they are jumping ship they are not stupid. But Thaksin is. His leadership is a disaster area. Remember he had it all and threw it away. Why? because he wanted more than political power in a parliamentary system. He wanted state power. The party split over the issue of LM is a recognition that the ship jumpers do not now trust how far he wants to go. The Jatuporns of this world are there for the long haul. Some of the others, thank you very much, would prefer to stay out of prison.

[Buchholz]

Maybe they are all hitting the road because the yellers just got hit with 17M US fine for occupying the airport - what would the damages from reds be?

When you want to put it that way, it's more correct to talk about the UDD leaders rather than MP's of the PTP.

Which reminds me, what's the status on lots of the UDD leaders who expressed desire to run for parliament as PTP MP. Have been been formally excepted, or is it another 'open' point?

They'll be Party-list MP's for Pheu Thai Party, and that list won't come out until it's finalized by Thaksin and released on April 24, soon, April 26, a week after dissolution, shortly, about 2 days after dissolution, end of April, second week of May uhmmm.. sometime this year.

[stepenwolf1958]

Now very briefly to tell you why people do not answer my question.

Most likely people don't want to waste their time for posts that will only get deleted because all of it is

A quick refresher course:

Chavalit's Resignation From Pheu Thai Could Be The Start Of A Major Party Split

And this my posts are not off topic.

Your euphoria that Abhisit will stay as PM next 4,5 or 45 years (your wish to be 10 or for life) was as much off topic as this my opinion.

It does not matter who split and why. Who care for Chavalit or any of them if go out or change shirt???

After all, all of them(politicians) are full of money from abusing position and led the nation in agony and chaos. So why to bother? The right question is WHO can make a progress of this nation? I am about that. In that way was my critics of competence or incompetence of this Government. Be cool.

[monkfish]

Rumor has it that the Democrats will be using LM as a tool to try and win the upcoming election.

Of course they won't be using it directly themselves but may be use the media and some mouth pieces such high ranking Generals and such.

This could be the reason Chavalit has quit, to protect himself and PTP from slander.

Anyway he can always be reinstated after the election is over.

Just hope the Internal Security Act is lifted on the run up to elections so that the media are free to publish the truth without government censorship like now.

[rubl]

Rumor has it that the Democrats will be using LM as a tool to try and win the upcoming election.

Of course they won't be using it directly themselves but may be use the media and some mouth pieces such high ranking Generals and such.

This could be the reason Chavalit has quit, to protect himself and PTP from slander.

Anyway he can always be reinstated after the election is over.

Just hope the Internal Security Act is lifted on the run up to elections so that the media are free to publish the truth without government censorship like now.

If only rumour has it, we can put it next to 'there will be a coup', now can't we? Of course that won't stop some from elaborating on the rumour

The ISA is only enforced in seven districts in Bangkok, as far as I know. It has to do with trying to keep protests by PAD, TPN and various red-shirt factions peaceful and separate from each other. No link with the media there.

So what ARE you trying to tell us here, dear Monkfish?

Edited April 19, 2011 by rubl

[Buchholz]

Rumor has it that the Democrats will be using LM as a tool to try and win the upcoming election.

Are these rumors coming from the Red Shirts in one of their many publications available at the news stand?

[animatic]

"Rumor has it" is not news,

nor is it discussion of the prevailing effects of the day.

Rumor mongering is no more than trumpeting fears of those who chatter on street corners, and not discussion of assorted press releases and actual statements of the players.

Pointing out rumors and showing that they are odd, and thus probable manipulations by one side or the other may be fair play, but it may also be propagating rumors for one side just as much as street whispers.

Edited April 20, 2011 by animatic

[Ricardo]

What is that what Thaksin was doing wrong so Abhisit stopped it and make it better?

Abhisit did not correct ANY bad thing from previous time.

Did not make any change on good. Fact.

So the current=government making the hospitals free, or introducing a (small) old-age pension, were not "change on good" ? I disagree. You got your "Fact" wrong. Why not admit it ?

Perhaps Chavalit was frustrated that, when TRT/PPP/PTP were in-power after Thaksin had gone, they failed to do either of these, thus helping the Democrat-led coalition-government to show how they too can help the poor ? But they had a more-important agenda, helping Thaksin with his legal-problems, so ignored the collapsing global-economy & its likely effect on the poor in Thailand.

Or perhaps he just wanted to dodge the 'flack', from possible LM-allegations, as he did previously when it was announced that he, Chavalit was the commander of the 'PATsies' (People's Army of Thailand).

[animatic]

If Chavalit had imagined that the risks of associating with Thaksins minions had diminished once he took a high party post, he no doubt was mistaken. Once the Red leaders were released and then the absurd attempt to blend them into PTP started, he was a gonner.

The Red Leaders took their release and PTP promises of a pay day and immunity as MPS as a go ahead light to do as they had done before, and of course being clearly uncouth men, they over stepped and allowed the government to cleanly tie them and PTP together as Anti-Monarchy and thus not friends of the majority of Thai citizens.

Chavalit just realized who well Thaksin's two teams have been played! The euphoria of Red Leaders releases is now smothered by the realization that they are sinking the whole ship, not just the life boat they had been thrown.

Chavalits last run in with Thaksins manipulation was the PAT army of Sae Dang and General 'switching side's Panlop.

We know Chavalit freaked on that general ship, and we know how well that turned out for the loose cannon Sae Dang. Interestingly since then Panlop is utterly silent...

I wonder what his game plan is at present?

Edited April 20, 2011 by animatic

[thaihome]

Chavalit is well familiar with what being even slightly portrayed as anti-royalist can do to your political future. Between the elections in 1992 he suggested that the PM be directly elected and was slammed by Kukrit and others for saying that. In the March election his NAP won some 70 seats, in the following Sept election that went down to about 50.

Chavalit is extremely sensitive about his standing with royal family. I would guess last weekend was just too much and he quit.

TH

[ballpoint]

Chavalit is well familiar with what being even slightly portrayed as anti-royalist can do to your political future. Between the elections in 1992 he suggested that the PM be directly elected and was slammed by Kukrit and others for saying that. In the March election his NAP won some 70 seats, in the following Sept election that went down to about 50.

Chavalit is extremely sensitive about his standing with royal family. I would guess last weekend was just too much and he quit.

TH

Well, there will be a privy council spot vacant in the not too distant future...

[Buchholz]

Pheu Thai Party MP's Jatuporn and Karun

The two Red Shirts above and one Red Shirt below are the subjects of an impeachment attempt:

Pheu Thai Party MP and Deputy House Speaker Apiwan Wiriyachai

The above case involving the impeachment of three Pheu Thai Party MP's (including the Deputy Speaker of the House) is underway now:

the impeachment case against three Pheu Thai MPs for defaming the Privy Council president on the red-shirt rally stage.

the submission of 30,000 signatures in 2009 for the impeachment of Pheu Thai MPs Apiwan Viriyachai, Jatuporn Prompan, and Karun Hosakul.

The National Anti-Corruption Commission will next have to send the case over to the Senate Speaker for further action.

New words from Red Shirt Leader and Pheu Thai Party MP and Impeachment Defendant and Deputy Pheu Thai Party Leader and Deputy House Speaker Colonel Apiwan...

Apiwan: Pheu Thai-UDD roles separated

BANGKOK, 19 April 2011 (NNT) – Deputy House Speaker and Pheu Thai Party Deputy Leader Colonel Apiwan Wiriyachai has voiced his agreement to the proposed separation of the roles of the opposition Pheu Thai Party and the United Front of Democracy Against Dictatorship (UDD).

Colonel Apiwan stated that the Pheu Thai Party and the UDD usually hold separate activities, and that ex-Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra had already made clear that the operations of the two political groups must not be mixed together.

The Deputy Party Leader however admitted that both the Pheu Thai Party and the UDD have a common goal in calling for democracy and justice. He said party candidates, who are also core leaders of the UDD must separate their roles clearly but he believed that the action should not be problematic.

Colonel Apiwan added that the separation of the Pheu Thai Party from the UDD did not mean that the UDD would be isolated because half of the UDD members are supporters of the Pheu Thai Party while another half are backing democracy.

Regarding the resignation of former Prime Minister and Pheu Thai Party Chairperson General Chavalit Yongchaiyudh from Pheu Thai Party membership, the deputy house speaker responded that he did not know the reason for the abrupt resignation, but said the Party must still move ahead.

Colonel Apiwan also voiced agreement with the new regulation of the Election Commission (EC) banning electoral candidates from making allusions to the monarchy. He noted that the EC should have enforced such a regulation long ago, and his party has no problem to comply with it.

-- NNT 2011-04-19

[Ricardo]

<snip for brevity>

Colonel Apiwan added that the separation of the Pheu Thai Party from the UDD did not mean that the UDD would be isolated because half of the UDD members are supporters of the Pheu Thai Party while another half are backing democracy.

<snip>

Curious that he seems to believe, one can either support PTP or democracy, but not both at the same time ? Are they then mutually-exclusive ?

[Buchholz]

However another news source tells that deputy party leader Plodprasop Surasawadi has declared that PT will win 265 constituancy seats including 16 to 18 in BKK thereby being to form a one party Govt.

He also said thay Chavalit's resignation would make no difference as he was only a list MP and that no others would follow him.

whoopsy daisy.... watch your step Plodprasop...

In a related development, five members of Pheu Thai have also followed General Chavalit’s footstep by submitting their resignation as party executives.

NNT 2011-04-18

AND

Some Pheu Thai politicians are about to quit their executive positions to avoid punishment by party dissolution if they become entangled in campaign violations.

Suphon Fongngam is expected to resign as Party Secretary-General this week.

The Pheu Thai executive board would be left with a skeletal staff of administrators to oversee routine affairs.

The Nation 2011-04-18

An Executive Board without a Party Chairman, without a PTP MP Chairman, and soon without a Secretary-General, headed by a Party Leader who has tried to resign four times.... all this, two months before an election.

Time to add another key member of the Pheu Thai Party Executive Board...

At Pheu Thai, Chavalit Vichayasut has resigned as the Party's Deputy Secretary-General

What say you now, Plodprasop???

.

Edited April 21, 2011 by Buchholz

[Buchholz]

Now it seems even the Issan-region MP's from the Pheu Thai Party are getting fed up with Thaksin's dominance of their Party.

The other paper has an article today regarding the disgruntled MP's, numbering 40, who want Thaksin to stay out.

They are also concerned about the Red Shirt Suspected Terrorists Out On Bail getting Party-list MP positions with the Pheu Thai Party as it sends the wrong message.

They want other Pheu Thai Party MP's that plan on visiting Thaksin in Dubai shortly to relay their concerns to the Party Boss.

[metisdead]

Some off topic posts have been removed.

[hyperdimension]

<snip for brevity>

Colonel Apiwan added that the separation of the Pheu Thai Party from the UDD did not mean that the UDD would be isolated because half of the UDD members are supporters of the Pheu Thai Party while another half are backing democracy.

<snip>

Curious that he seems to believe, one can either support PTP or democracy, but not both at the same time ? Are they then mutually-exclusive ?

Yes, the Pheu Thai Party and The Democrat Party are very much mutually exclusive.

[Ricardo]

<snip for brevity>

Colonel Apiwan added that the separation of the Pheu Thai Party from the UDD did not mean that the UDD would be isolated because half of the UDD members are supporters of the Pheu Thai Party while another half are backing democracy.

<snip>

Curious that he seems to believe, one can either support PTP or democracy, but not both at the same time ? Are they then mutually-exclusive ?

Yes, the Pheu Thai Party and The Democrat Party are very much mutually exclusive.

Aren't many former PPP/PTP-MPs are now in a coalition-government led by the Democrat Party ? Perhaps not so "very much mutually exclusive" then.

Perhaps even Chavalit may end up, in a party which allies itself to the DP, after the next election. Stranger things have happened in Thai politics !

But my point, which you carefully avoided or misunderstood, was that a PTP spokesman has just said that "half of the UDD members are supporters of the Pheu Thai Party while another half are backing democracy". Aren't we all supposed to pretend, against all the recent evidence to the contrary, that PTP is a democratic (with a small "d") political-party ?

Edited April 21, 2011 by Ricardo

[rubl]

Apiwan: Pheu Thai-UDD roles separated

BANGKOK, 19 April 2011 (NNT) – Deputy House Speaker and Pheu Thai Party Deputy Leader Colonel Apiwan Wiriyachai has voiced his agreement to the proposed separation of the roles of the opposition Pheu Thai Party and the United Front of Democracy Against Dictatorship (UDD).

OMG, does this mean that up till now PTP and UDD did NOT have separate roles ? Who would have thought

[hyperdimension]

But my point, which you carefully avoided or misunderstood

I understood, just playing with the words "democracy" and "Democrat" and the fact that it is very unlikely that the Democrat party and Pheu Thai Party would mix together to form a one-party government.

Edited April 21, 2011 by hyperdimension

[dunkin2012]

that's my wish..................

[yoshiwara]

Now it seems even the Issan-region MP's from the Pheu Thai Party are getting fed up with Thaksin's dominance of their Party.

The other paper has an article today regarding the disgruntled MP's, numbering 40, who want Thaksin to stay out.

They are also concerned about the Red Shirt Suspected Terrorists Out On Bail getting Party-list MP positions with the Pheu Thai Party as it sends the wrong message.

They want other Pheu Thai Party MP's that plan on visiting Thaksin in Dubai shortly to relay their concerns to the Party Boss.

Another visit to the man the red apologists want to say is not the centre of the red cobweb. Well some of them. The others are now slinking over to their real position which is that he should be supported wholeheartedly. So what have we got here? Well there was talk of merging the red and PTP interests so that they would both be seen to be pulling in the same direction and the reds could get a new paint job to restore the 'peaceful agenda' image. And as demonstration of that love-in, the red leaders would get a few parliamentary positions to seal the deal. That was the story. Whoaa! Not so fast Batman! A number of key issues that knock the Goldilocks story on the head. First, Thaksin wants his sister in as his proxy. Second, she needs a Praetorian guard and Jatuporn needs a bigger team. Thirdly, Thaksin wants now to control a party even more tightly which he wants to run primarily for ensuring his return. No doubters to have power or influence. He wants the red leaders (gofers) there to do his bidding and corral his sister for that matter just in case. See the old pattern here? He wants it all! That is the dynamic for the splitting and grumbles taking place. The Thai CP and other left organisations hitched up for the 'popular front' (Thaksin is not the issue)are being outplayed at every turn. By the time the election is called they will be stitched up firmly in his pocket, embarrassed or not.

Edited April 21, 2011 by yoshiwara

[Ricardo]

But my point, which you carefully avoided or misunderstood

I understood, just playing with the words "democracy" and "Democrat" and the fact that it is very unlikely that the Democrat party and Pheu Thai Party would mix together to form a one-party government.

Thank You.

"very unlikely", yes probably, but definitely not totally impossible that they might form a multi-party coalition ?

Imagine if Thaksin were unfortunately involved in a fatal-accident in the next few months, and the political-dinosaurs wished to keep their snouts in the trough, then all sorts of people might convert to the idea of a 'Democrat/PTP Reconciliation-Alliance'.

All purely in the best-interests of the country, naturally. And perhaps former-PM Chavalit might emerge to be the saviour reconciliation-candidate for PM ?

Politics is a dirtier game, than either of us might wish it to be, I fear. :jap:

[Buchholz]

Now it seems even the Issan-region MP's from the Pheu Thai Party are getting fed up with Thaksin's dominance of their Party.

The other paper has an article today regarding the disgruntled MP's, numbering 40, who want Thaksin to stay out.

They are also concerned about the Red Shirt Suspected Terrorists Out On Bail getting Party-list MP positions with the Pheu Thai Party as it sends the wrong message.

They want other Pheu Thai Party MP's that plan on visiting Thaksin in Dubai shortly to relay their concerns to the Party Boss.

Many northeastern MPs from the opposition Pheu Thai Party are reluctant to defect to a new political party to be formed by Pheu Thai's former chairman Chavalit Yongchaiyudh and veteran politician Snoh Thienthong.

Although they are uneasy about former premier Thaksin Shinawatra's influence over the party and had thoughts of defecting, the Pheu Thai MPs are now unsure whether they can win the upcoming election in the Northeast without relying on the popularity of Pheu Thai and Thaksin in the region, according to sources.

The sources said yesterday that the incumbent MPs, who are close to Chavalit and Snoh, also were afraid they could be viewed as being ungrateful to Thaksin.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2011/04/22/national/Pheu-Thai-MPs-defer-defection-plans-30153672.html

The Nation - April 22, 2011