Credit Cards For Foreigners

[theoldgit]

I thought I would ask the question about credit cards for foreigners in Thailand again.

It has often been said that a foreigner living in Thailand but not working, so no Work Permit, would find it neigh on impossible to get a credit card without putting down a deposit equal to, or higher than, the credit limit.

Has anybody had any recent experience of this?

It's normally said that that banks will not authorise credit cards to foreigners unless they have a work record, presumably on the assumption that people with a work record are less likely to give up on their job, default on the card and return to their own country. Where as a retiree who has been resident in Thailand for many years, and maybe with a good bank record, is considered a bad risk.

Any thoughts or experiences?

[CharlieH]

In my experience the deposit has to equal the limit of the card. Although I dont see the need for one. You can use the debit card for majority of uses including online transactions so what would be the point, unless you actually want to try to use money you dont have (credit) and get your self into debt.

[Pib]

During my first year in Thailand as a retiree, I tried to get a credit card a couple of times. But each time, it came down to since I didn't have a work permit I couldn't get an unsecured card (they didn't care that my retirement income/pension was much higher than the monthly income requirement to qualify for credit card); I could only get a secured card where you accomplish a secured deposit of around 150K baht to get a credit card limit of 100K. I just said no to a secured card.

So, I just continued to use my Bangkok Bank debit card to buy stuff. Then after I got my no foreign transaction fee Mastercard credit card from Capital One which also earns a 2% or 1% cash back, I haven't used my Bangkok Bank debit card very much. Plus my U.S. credit card provides protection under U.S. consumer protection laws versus the particularly non-existent Thai consumer protection laws. I pay the balance off monthly and just smile at the 2% cash back I'm getting on my Lotus, Big C, Carrefour, Foodland, gas station, etc., buys and 1% on other buys.

Below is a Bangkok Bank web page talking about applying for a credit card...notice an expat needs a work permit. But with that being said, I seen TV post where retirees with no work permit have got credit cards, although some of the posts were not really clear whether they were unsecured or secured cards.

http://www.bangkokba...to%20Apply.aspx

Edited May 1, 2011 by Pib

[zzaa09]

In my experience the deposit has to equal the limit of the card. Although I dont see the need for one. You can use the debit card for majority of uses including online transactions so what would be the point, unless you actually want to try to use money you dont have (credit) and get your self into debt.

Leaving beyond your means is looked upon as quite sophisticated.

[Pib]

Leaving beyond your means is looked upon as quite sophisticated.

Yeap, many governments sure do it....guess they are just trying to set a good example for the individual taxpayers on how to manage a household budget.

But back to the OP's question, I just remembered that I had an email exchange with a couple of Bangkok Bank reps about 9 months ago regarding requirements to get a credit card, with me stressing I get a very nice pension income which is much more than their 20K baht monthly income requirement, I own a home (paid off), and I've been in Thailand several years now on a retirement visa, but their answer was I needed a work permit and income documentation to get an unsecured card...the work permit was the killer. I initiated this exchange when I began looking seriously about getting a credit card that didn't involve a foreign transaction fee. But as mentioned in my earlier post, I ended up getting a U.S. credit card with no foreign transaction fee which also paid cash back rewards, so I just forgot about trying for a Thai bank credit card and stored away my other U.S. credit cards which charge a foreign transaction fee in the safe. Guess I just wanted to get a Thai credit card for the sake of having one/could come in handy sometimes and would have paid it off monthly.

[Yenoormit]

What people are not saying here is that even with a work permit you are still NEVER a resident of Thailand and are just guests. Even retirement visas, you"re still a guest. Would your country give a credit card to foreign guest? Also even with a work permit most banks require that you have worked for the same company with the one work permit for minimum 2 year but some ask for 4 years.

[pomchop]

During my first year in Thailand as a retiree, I tried to get a credit card a couple of times. But each time, it came down to since I didn't have a work permit I couldn't get an unsecured card (they didn't care that my retirement income/pension was much higher than the monthly income requirement to qualify for credit card); I could only get a secured card where you accomplish a secured deposit of around 150K baht to get a credit card limit of 100K. I just said no to a secured card.

So, I just continued to use my Bangkok Bank debit card to buy stuff. Then after I got my no foreign transaction fee Mastercard credit card from Capital One which also earns a 2% or 1% cash back, I haven't used my Bangkok Bank debit card very much. Plus my U.S. credit card provides protection under U.S. consumer protection laws versus the particularly non-existent Thai consumer protection laws. I pay the balance off monthly and just smile at the 2% cash back I'm getting on my Lotus, Big C, Carrefour, Foodland, gas station, etc., buys and 1% on other buys.

Below is a Bangkok Bank web page talking about applying for a credit card...notice an expat needs a work permit. But with that being said, I seen TV post where retirees with no work permit have got credit cards, although some of the posts were not really clear whether they were unsecured or secured cards.

http://www.bangkokba...to%20Apply.aspx

I also just got a capital one card that has no annual fee and does NOT charge the "foreign transaction fee" of 3% but instead gives me 2% cash back....so 5% difference. I have a Chase card that I have carried for 20 years that has an annual fee yet they gouge their customers for the additional 3% fee. I asked them to waive it and of course they refused.

So now they have zero business from me, no more annual fee, and thus they will earn zero from me. If millions of the Chase type customers would just tell them that either drop the gouge foreign transaction fee or we will drop your card I suspect you would see a change. While 3% seems a small fee it does add up over time and if Capital One can offer a no fee card plus give you cash back, then surely Chase doesn't have to charge the fee on cards that charge an annual fee just to carry the card. My advice, drop your 'fee" card and go with a non fee company. Of course, Up to You. Just my opinion. Your opinion may vary.

[flying]

I also just got a capital one card that has no annual fee and does NOT charge the "foreign transaction fee"

Sounds like you have kept up your western cards while you live in Thailand.

If that is correct may I ask what was the requirements?

Is it just a matter of keeping a US? address?

Thanks

Edited May 1, 2011 by flying

[LAKRA]

I got a credit card from Bangkok Bank and had to open a deposit account equal to the credit card limit. I just got the Thai employee at the bank to fill in everything and I think it helped that I have an account which is longer than 6 months, a billing address in Thailand, and a Non Immigrant O visa. It took 2 weeks to get it.

[thrilled]

I pay cash most of the time.I use my schwab card,and any bank fees that occur are reimburshed.

[pomchop]

I also just got a capital one card that has no annual fee and does NOT charge the "foreign transaction fee"

Sounds like you have kept up your western cards while you live in Thailand.

If that is correct may I ask what was the requirements?

Is it just a matter of keeping a US? address?

Thanks

Yes I keep two separate credit cards and two ATM cards from USA. I do them all via a USA address and then set up the online bill paying so i can pay from my USA checking account. No real requirements i guess except decent credit. They approved me online within about one minute. Then they mail the card to your usa address within one week...Then you have to call (or have someone else call) an 800 number from the SAME home phone number you used when filling out application. They will ask for your home usa mailing address, your date of birth, AND the last four digits of your soc security number. Then they activiate the card. That was with capital one. I am not sure if they would send to you outside of usa or not as I didn't ask. Good luck.

Here is a link that tells you some options for no foreign fee, no annual fee cards. http://www.smartcreditchoices.com/educationcenter/article54.php?gclid=CP7DwLvsx6gCFQQ7gwodehexqg

[Phuket1]

I have a credit card (visa) from Siam Commercial in Phuket. I have it now for 5 years and it is on my wife's account as she is my quarantor. I didn't need a deposit account with equal balance. And I don't work in Thailand.

[jamora]

I hold a CITIbank credit card and a SCB credit card. Both of them on my wife's account. That way I can get the same credit limit as her without any formalities.

[katabeachbum]

BOT (Bank of Thailand) requires security deposit for any foreigner wanting credit card, unless you have workpermit. So CC is available for those willing to deposit equally or 120% of CC limit. I found the application and process very simple, and CC by mail 2 weeks later. I chose a 64k baht gold card from Ayudhya (yellow bank) and can top it up in any yellow branch when needed.

Debet cards can not be used to rent cars online, most tickets, check in and reservation upmarket hotels etc, thus the need of CC

[fredlk]

Shortly after I settled here American Express gave me a Thai Baht credit card with a huge limit based only on my retirement visa plus my income specification.

The points I earn go towards my Thai Royal Orchid membership and thanks to them I've had many an upgrade.

[theoldgit]

Shortly after I settled here American Express gave me a Thai Baht credit card with a huge limit based only on my retirement visa plus my income specification.

And this is the reason that I have doubts about the "BOT (Bank of Thailand) requires security deposit for any foreigner wanting credit card, unless you have work permit" requirement. I don't doubt this is what the poster of this statement was told, but maybe this was another case if staff don't know the rules then they make something up.

I still don't understand that someone with a work permit, even if they have been employed for two or three years, is a better risk than a pensioner maybe receiving 100,000 Baht a month and living in their own home, surely someone with a work permit is just as likely to default as a long term resident pensioner.

I think that properly managed credit cards are almost essential in the modern world, as others say a debit card should be sufficient, or even the online virtual cards, but the online cards cannot be used for the majority of airline bookings and, in most cases, debit cards cannot be used to rent a car.

I don't know if foreigners in western countries can get get credit cards, I suspect that if they have a house and a regular income they could get a card with a small credit limit, which may be increased after they have proved it can be managed properly.

I don't like the idea of depositing 120% of the credit limit, probably at a nil or very low interest rate, and then paying 20% to borrow your own money, but I suppose if needs must.

Having a secondary card on your spouses account gets round the issue of having a card to book airline tickets and rent cars, but does nothing to build up a credit record.

So it seems that nothing has changed since this subject was last raised, apart from American Express who I'm sure don't aren't flouting BOT rules, thank you all for your comments.

[flying]

Yes I keep two separate credit cards and two ATM cards from USA. I do them all via a USA address and then set up the online bill paying so i can pay from my USA checking account. No real requirements i guess except decent credit. They approved me online within about one minute. Then they mail the card to your usa address within one week...Then you have to call (or have someone else call) an 800 number from the SAME home phone number you used when filling out application. They will ask for your home usa mailing address, your date of birth, AND the last four digits of your soc security number. Then they activiate the card. That was with capital one. I am not sure if they would send to you outside of usa or not as I didn't ask. Good luck.

Here is a link that tells you some options for no foreign fee, no annual fee cards. http://www.smartcreditchoices.com/educationcenter/article54.php?gclid=CP7DwLvsx6gCFQQ7gwodehexqg

Ok thanks for the info pomchop

I was curious as I still live in the USA but stay in Thailand a few months a year.

I always alert my CC company that I will be in Thailand so they are not alarmed by any charges they may see.

But looking ahead to retiring there I wondered

Thanks again for the info

[fredlk]

And this is the reason that I have doubts about the "BOT (Bank of Thailand) requires security deposit for any foreigner wanting credit card, unless you have work permit" requirement

They told me that they are officially based in Singapore and therefore do not have to meet the requirement.

[theoldgit]

And this is the reason that I have doubts about the "BOT (Bank of Thailand) requires security deposit for any foreigner wanting credit card, unless you have work permit" requirement

They told me that they are officially based in Singapore and therefore do not have to meet the requirement.

Aha, the plot thickens.

But don't the statements come from Hong Kong?

[katabeachbum]

And this is the reason that I have doubts about the "BOT (Bank of Thailand) requires security deposit for any foreigner wanting credit card, unless you have work permit" requirement

They told me that they are officially based in Singapore and therefore do not have to meet the requirement.

yepp, AmEx is not a Thai CC company/bank, and thus not regulated by BOT. and AmEx is almost useless in Thailand. VISA #1, Mastercard barely #2, and the rest.........................

[Bakseedaa]

I have a credit card (visa) from Siam Commercial in Phuket. I have it now for 5 years and it is on my wife's account as she is my quarantor. I didn't need a deposit account with equal balance. And I don't work in Thailand.

But really its your wifes card with your name on it.. For a Thai credit Card you have to be in the fourth year of the same Work Permit, bank account for the same period, but really its best with your debit card... much easier..

[fredlk]

yepp, AmEx is not a Thai CC company/bank, and thus not regulated by BOT. and AmEx is almost useless in Thailand. VISA #1, Mastercard barely #2, and the rest.........................

I applied at their office here at PhayaThai, Bangkok and I use my card everywhere ..... yes everywhere. Only Shell doesn't accept it but Petronas does and many others.

Lotus takes American Express as does Central, HomeWorks, etc etc etc.

[katabeachbum]

I don't like the idea of depositing 120% of the credit limit, probably at a nil or very low interest rate, and then paying 20% to borrow your own money, but I suppose if needs must.

Having a secondary card on your spouses account gets round the issue of having a card to book airline tickets and rent cars, but does nothing to build up a credit record.

pay the balance on invoice every month. makes good credit score, and no interest

BTW as I recall BOT does not only require the banks to require WP but also tax payment history, unless CC secured by deposit

and AmEx does not give you Thai creditscore, as it is not Thai debt

[theoldgit]

but really its best with your debit card... much easier..

Unless you want to book a flight online with a carrier who requires sight of the card used to make a booking, my experience is that you cannot use debit cards online - certainly not Kasikorn anyway.

Or you want to rent a car, again my experience is that car hire companies will not accept debit cards for security deposits.

I do agree that debit cards are fine for everyday point of sale purchases worldwide, though I have had some problems with a few UK retailers who don't know that "chip and pin" is not used worldwide.

[theoldgit]

Only Shell doesn't accept it but Petronas does and many others.

Lotus takes American Express as does Central, HomeWorks, etc etc etc.

Shell started accepting Amex last month.

[fredlk]

and AmEx does not give you Thai creditscore, as it is not Thai debt

Not true.

Every year like clockwork I receive a copy of the letter they sent to the Bank of Thailand with my payment history. They do this every year and also for my Partner Card.

Needless to say I now have an extremely good credit-rating here in Thailand although I don't really know what to do with it.

[katabeachbum]

but really its best with your debit card... much easier..

Unless you want to book a flight online with a carrier who requires sight of the card used to make a booking, my experience is that you cannot use debit cards online - certainly not Kasikorn anyway.

Or you want to rent a car, again my experience is that car hire companies will not accept debit cards for security deposits.

I do agree that debit cards are fine for everyday point of sale purchases worldwide, though I have had some problems with a few UK retailers who don't know that "chip and pin" is not used worldwide.

It goes wihout saying I wouldnt bother to have CC if I could manage with only Debet cards

[theoldgit]

AmEx does not give you Thai creditscore, as it is not Thai debt

But it does report the details of your account, balance any missed payments etc, to the Thai Credit Bureau.

[fredlk]

Shell started accepting Amex last month.

That's good news. I always use my Visa or MasterCard there and stopped asking them about 6 months ago.

My car needs their 95 V-Power.

[theoldgit]

It goes wihout saying I wouldnt bother to have CC if I could manage with only Debet cards

Agree 100%