Rubber Trees

[cobbler]

Just as a mater of interest.Or as a mater of freedom.Had a big rally a couple of weeks ago .Just before PM went to talk with Indonesia about the Yang issue.Started at Surat and was going town by town to Bangkok to PM's area or gov house.They had a road block.Not stopping the traffic but just gathering followers.I saw them in our area ,as they stopped at 7/11 for an hour to eat and talk to other yang farmers..All very polite and professional.TV cameras not allowed.They were told some story from a local politition ,That they would have an answer next week about a price increase.The rally didn't make it to Bangkok.They all went home.Not sure why.

The leader is now in jail.Bet you didn't know that.Police went to his house to get him.Other yang farmers are now trying to get him out.

Can any body tell me?Is this a democracy or not?Coz I don't know

[jamescollister]

Just as a matter of interest, if you can holed of selling next week it maybe a good idea. China well be closed for national holiday, they will not be buying [ some will of course ] but prices will reflect the lose of demand.

Kownity good photo and if I can get the wife to sit down and explain what it really means I will be a bit wiser. Jim

[scotbeve]

Scot,

50 satang profit margin per kg, if 40b/kg to purchase, you're going to hang hundreds of thousands of baht at risk for 1-1.25% gross profit margin !?!?!?? Blow a tire, loose a few kg to theft, or oops just about anywhere and you're hosed. Yea, if you throw enough money into it you could make some back but there's got to be a more efficient use of capital than chasing a 1-1.25% return.

Mike,

with all this talk of wet cups, I'll be in my room (you lucky dog)

Hi Glenn,

Oh no... I think you misunderstood me. I wouldn't do this for 50 satang / kg. profit. My min. can not be below 1.45 baht/kg. And tying up money for a few months is not an issue. Slow but sure is the way.

[Mosha]

Just as a matter of interest, if you can holed of selling next week it maybe a good idea. China well be closed for national holiday, they will not be buying [ some will of course ] but prices will reflect the lose of demand.

Kownity good photo and if I can get the wife to sit down and explain what it really means I will be a bit wiser. Jim

A couple of the Japanese China based car companies have shut down early. Due to falling sales. This was reported on BBC Asia business yesterday

[glennb6]

yesterday before going to bed I said "wife, I read online where the govt/private auction is paying 47b/kg in Buengkan and I'd like you to call around and find out where so we can check it out." She replied that her sister 50 km to the right of us has sold to same in her are. Said she had to leave the bags of keeyang sit for almost two days and the bags were slit on the bottom and jumped upon, all to reduce the water content. If so the weight price goes down 10%.

I have no idea if this is true, partially true, or what. She said she has no interest in finding out more as she knows all and this is true.... F me with a stick and call me Abner AAARRRRRGGGGHHHHH

[kwonitoy]

A couple more photos of the sales area.

We collect our yang the evening before it goes to the market. Try to get there early to get a lower number so as to not wait so long on weighing/pay day. I got there at 7:00am and got number 68, you can see all the bags lined up. Your name is entered onto a ledger with the amount of bags you brought and your number.

The next day the trucks arrive, scales are set up and the bags emptied out, weighed and tossed in the back. For this country its about as efficent as anything I've seen.

When your number is called you can watch the weighing, a ticket is written out with kilos, amount paid per kilo, and total amount.

When a sheet of names and numbers is complete it goes to the back where the money girls sit. One counts out the amount for the ticket, hands it to another girl who double checks it, who give it to a third who checks it again and then calls out the name and hands it over. They had a little basket sitting in front of them with 1.8 million baht in Thousand baht bills and a guy with a briefcase with more money standing behind.

As for this wet/dry rubber discussion. Our rubber is cut and collected into the cups over a period of days untill the cup is full. It's not wet, nor completly dry. Somewhere in between. The bags are cut open as they weigh only the rubber, but I've never seen anyone jumping on them.

One fellows rubber was very poor quality, not enough formic used and it was a spongie mass. This got tossed to the side and he was told his price would be 40 baht per kilo, take it or leave it. He took it.

Ken

[cobbler]

Rubber farmers are lucky compared to coconut farmers.EG.Last gov price was 30 baht per coconut.This gov has just dropped from 2 baht each to 1 baht each.Even at 2 baht each .not worth collecting.

How can this gov sleep at night knowing they are breaking people.Farmers cant even eat

Who does this to there own people?

[jamescollister]

Rubber farmers are lucky compared to coconut farmers.EG.Last gov price was 30 baht per coconut.This gov has just dropped from 2 baht each to 1 baht each.Even at 2 baht each .not worth collecting.

How can this gov sleep at night knowing they are breaking people.Farmers cant even eat

Who does this to there own people?

Never seen coconuts at 30 Baht, last year they were up to 10 Baht local price due to bugs or something down south.

Anyway, this is a free market economy for all intensive purposes, the Government can not control the prices. The world out side does and be it rubber planters or coconut farmers, they are not forced to sell to the Government. They can sell to anyone they want, overseas or local buyers.

Nothing stops me or a co op exporting direct, if coconut farmers can not make a living, then there are too many coconuts and not enough demand. Just like in manufacturing, if you can't compete, you either make something else or go broke.

That's the way of the world. Jim

[Mosha]

The coconut buyers are like rocking horse shit round here. Perhaps the pickers are on strike. I bet they've seen "The Rise of Planet of The Apes"

[thaiguzzi]

Ken/Kwonitoy,

yep, that's the place. It's the only place we have ever sold since we started selling may last year. The set up is pretty much exactly like Ken describes. We beat you to it this week, no 54!. The missus gets her 505 trees worth delivered by m/c and trailer, never more than 4 bags asap, then the amount from the 1850 trees can be delivered at a relaxed pace with 2-wheel Kubota and trailer in the afternoon, 'cos we've already got our queue number.

Glenn, as i said, the auction in Bung Khan will be the same as Ken just described, and i have in previous posts. Bags sit overnight, one night not two, and no jumping up and down on the product. We are doing cup rubber, not grapes.

Mike.

[thaiguzzi]

Ken,

we take ours out of the cup ON the day of the sale, hence my missus (and sometimes me) up at 5.00am to have it bagged before getting the kids ready for school. You may lose a couple of kgs taking it out of the cup the evening before. Every little bit helps.

Regards,

Mike.

[gregj69]

A couple more photos of the sales area.

We collect our yang the evening before it goes to the market. Try to get there early to get a lower number so as to not wait so long on weighing/pay day. I got there at 7:00am and got number 68, you can see all the bags lined up. Your name is entered onto a ledger with the amount of bags you brought and your number.

The next day the trucks arrive, scales are set up and the bags emptied out, weighed and tossed in the back. For this country its about as efficent as anything I've seen.

When your number is called you can watch the weighing, a ticket is written out with kilos, amount paid per kilo, and total amount.

When a sheet of names and numbers is complete it goes to the back where the money girls sit. One counts out the amount for the ticket, hands it to another girl who double checks it, who give it to a third who checks it again and then calls out the name and hands it over. They had a little basket sitting in front of them with 1.8 million baht in Thousand baht bills and a guy with a briefcase with more money standing behind.

As for this wet/dry rubber discussion. Our rubber is cut and collected into the cups over a period of days untill the cup is full. It's not wet, nor completly dry. Somewhere in between. The bags are cut open as they weigh only the rubber, but I've never seen anyone jumping on them.

One fellows rubber was very poor quality, not enough formic used and it was a spongie mass. This got tossed to the side and he was told his price would be 40 baht per kilo, take it or leave it. He took it.

Ken

Anyone know if they have a market like this in Loei?

Bye the way, a big thanks to Jim and Rhys for their help in the last week.

Greg

[gregj69]

yesterday before going to bed I said "wife, I read online where the govt/private auction is paying 47b/kg in Buengkan and I'd like you to call around and find out where so we can check it out." She replied that her sister 50 km to the right of us has sold to same in her are. Said she had to leave the bags of keeyang sit for almost two days and the bags were slit on the bottom and jumped upon, all to reduce the water content. If so the weight price goes down 10%.

I have no idea if this is true, partially true, or what. She said she has no interest in finding out more as she knows all and this is true.... F me with a stick and call me Abner AAARRRRRGGGGHHHHH

Are you sure we are not married to the same woman - sounds exactly like my wife!

Greg

[glennb6]

Greg, they're all someones cousin or second niece or half sister right

Mine has mostly reverted back to 'thai-village-brain' from 'semi-falang-brain' after living in falangland for 9 yrs. The revision began almost immediately after the 747 entered Thai airspace. Re-addition to silly Thai soap-operas is in progress now.

chokdee

[Mosha]

We all are Greg

[jamescollister]

Greg, they're all someones cousin or second niece or half sister right

Mine has mostly reverted back to 'thai-village-brain' from 'semi-falang-brain' after living in falangland for 9 yrs. The revision began almost immediately after the 747 entered Thai airspace. Re-addition to silly Thai soap-operas is in progress now.

chokdee

They all revert, mine did, problem is I am becomimg just the same, live in the moment. Will never like Thai soaps though.Jim

[cobbler]

Rubber farmers are lucky compared to coconut farmers.EG.Last gov price was 30 baht per coconut.This gov has just dropped from 2 baht each to 1 baht each.Even at 2 baht each .not worth collecting.

How can this gov sleep at night knowing they are breaking people.Farmers cant even eat

Who does this to there own people?

Never seen coconuts at 30 Baht, last year they were up to 10 Baht local price due to bugs or something down south.

Anyway, this is a free market economy for all intensive purposes, the Government can not control the prices. The world out side does and be it rubber planters or coconut farmers, they are not forced to sell to the Government. They can sell to anyone they want, overseas or local buyers.

Nothing stops me or a co op exporting direct, if coconut farmers can not make a living, then there are too many coconuts and not enough demand. Just like in manufacturing, if you can't compete, you either make something else or go broke.

That's the way of the world. Jim

Nice to have a blindfold on and not know how this system really works here.Think it's better falang don't know too much.I can blame my Mrs for that. Edited September 30, 2012 by cobbler

[cobbler]

Mike,

the only 'govt' sort of office I've seen in Buengkan is the office of rubber replanting something or other on Hwy 212. I will encourage wife to find out more about this. Do you have any details or specifics?

Glenn these prices are the Government buying scheme, we sold some sheet to the co op under this alleged scheme. 6 weeks and still awaiting payment. Read somewhere that buyers, not growers were selling rubber under the scheme and all payments in Issan have been frozen until a police investigation. Better money in hand now than more sometime in the future [maybe ] Jim

Edited September 30, 2012 by cobbler

[cobbler]

The coconut buyers are like rocking horse shit round here. Perhaps the pickers are on strike. I bet they've seen "The Rise of Planet of The Apes"

This is right.Ok if you can find outside buyer.But if not you're buggered.

[cobbler]

Rubber farmers are lucky compared to coconut farmers.EG.Last gov price was 30 baht per coconut.This gov has just dropped from 2 baht each to 1 baht each.Even at 2 baht each .not worth collecting.

How can this gov sleep at night knowing they are breaking people.Farmers cant even eat

Who does this to there own people?

Never seen coconuts at 30 Baht, last year they were up to 10 Baht local price due to bugs or something down south.

Anyway, this is a free market economy for all intensive purposes, the Government can not control the prices. The world out side does and be it rubber planters or coconut farmers, they are not forced to sell to the Government. They can sell to anyone they want, overseas or local buyers.

Nothing stops me or a co op exporting direct, if coconut farmers can not make a living, then there are too many coconuts and not enough demand. Just like in manufacturing, if you can't compete, you either make something else or go broke.

That's the way of the world. Jim

So what you are saying is.Suddenly there is no need for coconut products.OH OK.

They were 30 baht during the last gov.This gov used the reason that worms were found .As excuse to drop prices.Probably better to believe what gov tells you eh?LOL

Oh by the way ,UM The gov ordered a lot of coconuts from another country at the same time to fill the gap in the market.oops Who said that?They weren't making money from that were they.No .of course not.Did you remember or forget 'it costs 100,000.000 baht to get a good seat in gov here.Of course they do it coz they love there country.''Not coz they make billions after they get in.Blind fold time IGLEOW.LOL

Blindfold time IGLEOW

Edited September 30, 2012 by cobbler

[jamescollister]

Mike,

the only 'govt' sort of office I've seen in Buengkan is the office of rubber replanting something or other on Hwy 212. I will encourage wife to find out more about this. Do you have any details or specifics?

Glenn these prices are the Government buying scheme, we sold some sheet to the co op under this alleged scheme. 6 weeks and still awaiting payment. Read somewhere that buyers, not growers were selling rubber under the scheme and all payments in Issan have been frozen until a police investigation. Better money in hand now than more sometime in the future [maybe ] Jim

Still going to say its outside that sets prices

?

Have a look at the prices in Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia or India. On the other side of the world South America. Prices are similar everywhere, if you are selling coconuts to Europe or coconut produces you source them from the cheapest place. If no one wants Thai coconuts someone else is selling them cheaper, elsewhere. Same goes for rubber, Thai Government does not control the world tire market. They buy where they can get the best price and we sell to anyone who pays the highest price, be it Gov or private. Jim

[cobbler]

Mike,

the only 'govt' sort of office I've seen in Buengkan is the office of rubber replanting something or other on Hwy 212. I will encourage wife to find out more about this. Do you have any details or specifics?

Glenn these prices are the Government buying scheme, we sold some sheet to the co op under this alleged scheme. 6 weeks and still awaiting payment. Read somewhere that buyers, not growers were selling rubber under the scheme and all payments in Issan have been frozen until a police investigation. Better money in hand now than more sometime in the future [maybe ] Jim

Still going to say its outside that sets prices

?

Have a look at the prices in Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia or India. On the other side of the world South America. Prices are similar everywhere, if you are selling coconuts to Europe or coconut produces you source them from the cheapest place. If no one wants Thai coconuts someone else is selling them cheaper, elsewhere. Same goes for rubber, Thai Government does not control the world tire market. They buy where they can get the best price and we sell to anyone who pays the highest price, be it Gov or private. Jim

Fair call.Good comment.So it's a bit of this and a bit of that.

[cobbler]

So what this means for Thai rubber is 'we are in for a long hard road now that Myanmar is opening up to the world and they mave masses of rubber plantations .Hmmm.Cockerdoodledoo may have been right in what he was saying.How can Thai compete against Myanmar's cheap labor..Producing yang much cheaper than Thai

[jamescollister]

So what this means for Thai rubber is 'we are in for a long hard road now that Myanmar is opening up to the world and they mave masses of rubber plantations .Hmmm.Cockerdoodledoo may have been right in what he was saying.How can Thai compete against Myanmar's cheap labor..Producing yang much cheaper than Thai

Don't see why Burma would have all these rubber plantations, who planted them and why. They have been on an export black list for years, or are these plantations from the time of British rule, if so they are good for lumber only.

Even if they go for rubber big time, they will replace Malaysian out put. Labour costs in Malaysia are growing and I have read of plantations paying 80% to their tappers. That's way many plantations grow rubber for lumber not rubber production.

People will still be buying cars in years to come and rubber will follow the boom and doom cycle. If you can get through the doom, things will be good in the boom. Jim

[JungleBiker]

Some of you, especially the Brits, may be interested to know that it was the Brits that first brought rubber to Asia. In 1876, Sir Henry Wickham took 70,000 rubber seeds from Brazil to Kew Gardens in England (for which he was paid GBP740). About 2,800 of those seeds germinated and then some of these seedlings were shipped to several countries in the British Empire, including Malaysia and Ceylon (Sri Lanka) in Asia. That was the start of the Asian rubber industry - and the end of the Brazilian rubber industry!

[Mosha]

Some of you, especially the Brits, may be interested to know that it was the Brits that first brought rubber to Asia. In 1876, Sir Henry Wickham took 70,000 rubber seeds from Brazil to Kew Gardens in England (for which he was paid GBP740). About 2,800 of those seeds germinated and then some of these seedlings were shipped to several countries in the British Empire, including Malaysia and Ceylon (Sri Lanka) in Asia. That was the start of the Asian rubber industry - and the end of the Brazilian rubber industry!

It originates in Para province, hence Yang Para.

[Mosha]

USS 81 Baht, bad news is the buyer is broke

[jamescollister]

Some of you, especially the Brits, may be interested to know that it was the Brits that first brought rubber to Asia. In 1876, Sir Henry Wickham took 70,000 rubber seeds from Brazil to Kew Gardens in England (for which he was paid GBP740). About 2,800 of those seeds germinated and then some of these seedlings were shipped to several countries in the British Empire, including Malaysia and Ceylon (Sri Lanka) in Asia. That was the start of the Asian rubber industry - and the end of the Brazilian rubber industry!

The first rubber tree to allegedly be planted in Thailand is still alive. Can't remember where, but some one with good net can probably find it. Jim

[how241]

Mike,

the only 'govt' sort of office I've seen in Buengkan is the office of rubber replanting something or other on Hwy 212. I will encourage wife to find out more about this. Do you have any details or specifics?

Glenn these prices are the Government buying scheme, we sold some sheet to the co op under this alleged scheme. 6 weeks and still awaiting payment. Read somewhere that buyers, not growers were selling rubber under the scheme and all payments in Issan have been frozen until a police investigation. Better money in hand now than more sometime in the future [maybe ] Jim

Still going to say its outside that sets prices

?

Have a look at the prices in Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia or India. On the other side of the world South America. Prices are similar everywhere, if you are selling coconuts to Europe or coconut produces you source them from the cheapest place. If no one wants Thai coconuts someone else is selling them cheaper, elsewhere. Same goes for rubber, Thai Government does not control the world tire market. They buy where they can get the best price and we sell to anyone who pays the highest price, be it Gov or private. Jim

Good points. They even have rubber "Futures' markets so it gets traded just like oil, gold, ecoffer, almost everything. These markets get manipulated by the big money players and banks, same as the stock markets. Also, prices go up and down in cycles as do the ecomonies of the world. Right now we are entering into a slower period of world growth so demand will be slower and prices tend to drop. I don't think that a small country like Thailand can really change or effect the world price for rubber or anything else. It used to be simple supply and demand but now with the 'players' and 'futures' markets it has become a different game that outsiders can only watch and accept whatever happens. Good luck to all. The world markets have become one big casino. Edited September 30, 2012 by how241

[glennb6]

the question should be "what the hell is the govt doing buying rubber (or rice or any other commodity) ??! Other than screw up the sort of natural sort of free market, skew the near and medium term prices, and lie about it to the stupid people, what good does it do? Yea, it's how they make their money....