Infants At Restaurants

[KwaTime]

Hmmm I'm mixed on whether or not 2k a head for a meal is upscale. I think it is though.

I don't think it's a problem when there are infants crying in restaurants. If it disturbs your meal or date, you should request to be moved. I don't think the restaurant ever has a problem doing that. I think it's more embarrassing for the family with the infant.

[Kilgore Trout]

2000 baht per head is upscale

A true upscale restaurant is on average upwards of 10,000 baht per head and such a true "fine dining" restaurant will provide adequate ambiance.

Advice: stop slumming it, spend real money or stop complaining

Ridiculous, and you look ridiculous for posting it. 10,000 Baht on a restaurant in Thailand is an idiot's choice. If you have this kind of money to throw around, you must be impressing a lot of other similarly ridiculous people. I understand going to a nice restaurant here and spending a lot of cash, but saying that 2000 Baht is 'slumming it' makes you come across as a bit of an arse.

On topic, I agree with a large number of people that it's a risk you take. You can't blame parents for bringing their child with them, and kudos to those particular parents for getting up and walking around with the child to keep him/her entertained and quiet. I was on a flight that had a screaming baby for quite a large part of the flight, and I just felt sorry for the parent/s. It must be hard looking after a child and whilst there are obviously some inconsiderate parents out there, this post doesn't seem to be about them.

I certainly don't spend that kind of money on food, but I also don't go to average priced "family" restaurants (we are talking about an Italian joint in Thailand right, not Somchai's noodle stand?) and complain that an "upscale" restaurant allows children to dine there???

Get real

Edited May 16, 2011 by Kilgore Trout

[Daewoo]

Same same as many others. 2000/head may not be slumming it, but it is hardly exclusive either. Be prepared to have a cross section of society there, and that will include parents and kids.

It is almost impossible to have an Infant (subject of the OP) babysat. Many need 3 hourly feeds, and Murphy's Law states that it will be in the middle of your own meal time.

We very rarely dine out without our 3 kids. We have always taken them, and always impressed upon them acceptable standards of behaviour. We always take activities (books and colouring) and are often complimented on their behaviour.

If you don't take them from a young age, when can you? If you don't teach them about behaviour when dinning out at a young age, all you will have are teenagers who don't know how to behave. Maybe that is the problem with so many late middle aged guys in Thailand.

Daewoo

[IADR]

I agree that children should not be brought to resturants. If you can afford to go out to eat. you can afford a babysitter. I imagine that some of the customers are parents themselves who have hired a babysitter so that they can have a quiet meal. It is inconsiderate and selfish IMO.

If you need to bring your kid along find a family friendly resturant where everyone understands that kids will be present. Our friends have a 3 year old who we all love, but he is a major PITA. When we go out togather we are prepared to entertain him and help out but it gets old fast.

I assume you don't have kids because if you did, I dare say you may have a different approach to this.

When you work all day and then want to have a nice meal, you want your whole family there as well. That includes kids. Until restaurants put a 'No children' sign up on the door, I will continue to take mine with me. When they do put such a sign up, I will then avoid the place altogether.

[DP25]

2000 baht per head is upscale

A true upscale restaurant is on average upwards of 10,000 baht per head and such a true "fine dining" restaurant will provide adequate ambiance.

Advice: stop slumming it, spend real money or stop complaining

You stole my thunder.

Of course we (evil) parents do consider others. But in my book, 2000 baht per head is a family restuarant.

Complaining about this is a bit like going to Burger King and complaining they don't have silver service.

Family restaurant? At 2000 baht per you might as well be eating out of the trash bags with the soi dogs

[soundman]

Trollish posts, designed to provoke angry reponses have been removed from view.

[Deez]

so youre saying that if people have small kids they cant go out with there baby?

Dude, really you should grow up yourselfs........

You're telling people to grow up when you use "DUDE"..............lol

JH

"Dude" not withstanding, his point is valid.. It's nice that at least the OP's friend has some class and maturity not displayed by the OP and some others here. Strangely, I find myself again an ally of T/A and some others here, it's a privately owned restaurant that caters to the public. If you want to dine in private without interruption reserve the entire establishment and then your dinner experience is guaranteed ..

So obnoxious drunks yelling and screaming at the table beside you is ok too? This is part of your "public" too.

[WarpSpeed]

Had one crying in the movie theatre yesterday. And during Preist, not exactly a movie for kids.

Well there you go, even though I'm with the child and would be unhappy about being forced to watch that movie myself, those parents are lacking on many fronts and you'll always have those types around you unfortunately. But at minimum a good, considerate parent would remove the child from the theater post haste..

[WarpSpeed]

so youre saying that if people have small kids they cant go out with there baby?

Dude, really you should grow up yourselfs........

You're telling people to grow up when you use "DUDE"..............lol

JH

"Dude" not withstanding, his point is valid.. It's nice that at least the OP's friend has some class and maturity not displayed by the OP and some others here. Strangely, I find myself again an ally of T/A and some others here, it's a privately owned restaurant that caters to the public. If you want to dine in private without interruption reserve the entire establishment and then your dinner experience is guaranteed ..

So obnoxious drunks yelling and screaming at the table beside you is ok too? This is part of your "public" too.

I'm sorry is the OP about obnoxious drunks? Or rather is it about a sleeping/quiet baby that wasn't bothering anyone by it's presence? I don't tolerate obnoxious ADULT drunks at any point in time.. But then they aren't innocent children are they? In my mind they lack even cognizant the maturity of a child this age if they're imposing their out of control drunkenness on others..

Having said that I wouldn't tolerate an obnoxious child either but, as stated I'd either give both them and their parents a look that displays my consternation or make mention in a firm but polite way to the management so that they can pass on the customers frustrations and resolve the issue in the best possible way, but................. And here's the detail apparently going over your head............. None of the above examples are related to the subject of the OP so don't apply...

[WarpSpeed]

I just hope the food was worth it, I haven't found any Italian restaurants in LOS that were worth 20b per head yet. I cook much better then any we've tried so far for much less and my family agrees and my wife does the clean up so it's a win win ..

[doggie888888]

No issues with kids...just the parents who think it is OK for their "beautiful children" to wail, scream and go feral without restraint. I do sympathise if a RESPONSIBLE parent does make an effort like trying to calm the kid or else move the kid outside where it is not quite a nuisance.

Once there was a kid behind me on a flight, he kept kicking my seat. So, I turned around to politely tell the parent to tell her kid to stop doing it. She said something like "kids will be kids" and did nothing. As I said, no issues with kids...just irresponsible and inconsiderate parents.

Edited May 16, 2011 by doggie888888

[DavidSL]

I certainly don't spend that kind of money on food, but I also don't go to average priced "family" restaurants (we are talking about an Italian joint in Thailand right, not Somchai's noodle stand?) and complain that an "upscale" restaurant allows children to dine there???

Get real

I'm confused as to how 2000 baht PER HEAD is an average priced family restaurant. I'm confused, because I've been to very nice restaurants suitable for families where you could easily get a nice Italian meal (cooked by Italians, no less), dessert and drink (not a wine or cocktail but beer or soft drink) for under 1000 baht. UNDER 1000 baht, just for those of you who don't understand money. There is absolutely no way that 2000 baht per head is an average family restaurant. Do you pay over 40 pounds per head back home for an average family meal? Because, going by the current exchange rate, this works out at more than that.

Get real...

Anyway, I'm sorry for throwing the thread off topic. I'd rather be next to a table with a child than a group of drunken oafs who don't know how to behave in polite society. I realise the OP wasn't about this, but it all mixes in, in my opinion.

[Parker1973]

Had one crying in the movie theatre yesterday. And during Preist, not exactly a movie for kids.

I saw Priest yesterday and would of gladly had a crying kid in the theatre,if only to distract me from such an awful film....;-)

[ESB7]

Why mention foreign parents/kids...is it OK with you if they were a Thai family............may I suggest that you get a take away next time.....

[Kilgore Trout]

I certainly don't spend that kind of money on food, but I also don't go to average priced "family" restaurants (we are talking about an Italian joint in Thailand right, not Somchai's noodle stand?) and complain that an "upscale" restaurant allows children to dine there???

Get real

I'm confused as to how 2000 baht PER HEAD is an average priced family restaurant. I'm confused, because I've been to very nice restaurants suitable for families where you could easily get a nice Italian meal (cooked by Italians, no less), dessert and drink (not a wine or cocktail but beer or soft drink) for under 1000 baht. UNDER 1000 baht, just for those of you who don't understand money. There is absolutely no way that 2000 baht per head is an average family restaurant. Do you pay over 40 pounds per head back home for an average family meal? Because, going by the current exchange rate, this works out at more than that.

Get real...

Anyway, I'm sorry for throwing the thread off topic. I'd rather be next to a table with a child than a group of drunken oafs who don't know how to behave in polite society. I realise the OP wasn't about this, but it all mixes in, in my opinion.

Depends on what the meal consists of; if you are having a apertif,bottle of wine; appetizers, main courses, desserts, coffee, possibly a cognac or brandy after the meal then I don't think 2000bht per head is that outrageous.

Red lobster in the states for example; a family restaurant in every sense of the word and NOT considered expensive, can VERY easily come to 50-60 dollars PER PERSON.

I have also been to the UK where a pint at a restaurant can easily be up to 10 pounds, so a big meal could easily get up to 40 pounds.

Get real or go to McDonalds

[up-country_sinclair]

In my opinion, these parents are incredibly selfish.

They've essentially decided that ruining the meals of everyone else in the restaurant isn't as important as their own meal.

Purely out of consideration to other diners, parents should leave their babies at home.

Edited May 16, 2011 by up-country_sinclair

[Gaccha]

This all comes down to the recent Western centring of all human life experience around the children of a nuclear family. Every burp or fart or gurgle by the children is applauded and given its own diary entry. Going out for a meal with parents and their offspring is a pointless activity as every interesting conversation is stopped by the parents so they can listen to their vile children's rambling incoherence.

This has not yet reached Thailand, so when the child-centred, saintly Western parents bring their children this provokes a clear breach in the social norms. They simply shouldn't be there. Children should not be observed, heard, seen, discussed, mentored, or partake in any social activity of adults.

This tedious centring of the child, focusing on it in breach of the norms of civility and good conduct is just not acceptable here. And if there was a God, then I would thank God.

[Nawtier]

In my opinion, these parents are incredibly selfish.

They've essentially decided that ruining the meals of everyone else in the restaurant isn't as important as their own meal.

Purely out of consideration to other diners, parents should leave their babies at home.

Have you ever considered that perhaps you may also upset other diners when you walk into a restaurant....just with your presence alone ??

[DavidSL]

Depends on what the meal consists of; if you are having a apertif,bottle of wine; appetizers, main courses, desserts, coffee, possibly a cognac or brandy after the meal then I don't think 2000bht per head is that outrageous.

And that is an 'average family meal' how?

Red lobster in the states for example; a family restaurant in every sense of the word and NOT considered expensive, can VERY easily come to 50-60 dollars PER PERSON.

I have also been to the UK where a pint at a restaurant can easily be up to 10 pounds, so a big meal could easily get up to 40 pounds.

Get real or go to McDonalds

But the mistake you're making here is comparing a normal family restaurant in America to a normal family restaurant in Bangkok. There are lots of 'normal' family restaurants here that cater to Western tastes that don't cost that much. I seriously doubt you were charged 10 pounds for a pint in England - although our prices are ridiculously high, 10 pounds is a mockery. If that is indeed true, then it shows what you consider normal and I think we can end the discussion there. You are obviously a man of certain tastes!

McDonalds as the alternative to a 2000 baht meal? I think you're living in the wrong Thailand!

This all comes down to the recent Western centring of all human life experience around the children of a nuclear family. Every burp or fart or gurgle by the children is applauded and given its own diary entry. Going out for a meal with parents and their offspring is a pointless activity as every interesting conversation is stopped by the parents so they can listen to their vile children's rambling incoherence.

This has not yet reached Thailand, so when the child-centred, saintly Western parents bring their children this provokes a clear breach in the social norms. They simply shouldn't be there. Children should not be observed, heard, seen, discussed, mentored, or partake in any social activity of adults.

This tedious centring of the child, focusing on it in breach of the norms of civility and good conduct is just not acceptable here. And if there was a God, then I would thank God.

Some parents love their children and bring them up accordingly. Over-nurturing is bad, I agree, but the extent to which you describe it sounds more like a bitterness on your part than actual experience. I think children nowadays are spoiled by Western rules and imposed safety regulations more than over-bearing parents.

I'm sure there are plenty of grown-ups here who never received that loving family environment and grew into healthy adults, but I don't think it should be a hard and fast rule in society.

[Nawtier]

This all comes down to the recent Western centring of all human life experience around the children of a nuclear family. Every burp or fart or gurgle by the children is applauded and given its own diary entry. Going out for a meal with parents and their offspring is a pointless activity as every interesting conversation is stopped by the parents so they can listen to their vile children's rambling incoherence.

This has not yet reached Thailand, so when the child-centred, saintly Western parents bring their children this provokes a clear breach in the social norms. They simply shouldn't be there. Children should not be observed, heard, seen, discussed, mentored, or partake in any social activity of adults.

This tedious centring of the child, focusing on it in breach of the norms of civility and good conduct is just not acceptable here. And if there was a God, then I would thank God.

Lol........guess you never got what you wanted at xmas huh.......or daddy ran off with the milkman.

[Ulysses G.]

Very few parents appear aware that other diners in the same restaurant are not enchanted by their children...

They should teach their brats some manners... or not bringing them at all in a restaurant!

This is true, and as a parent I find it very offensive and an imposition myself that they think their little darlings are so much more special then everyone else's and you should just love them in spite of how much they misbehave or impose or whether or not you even like children at all. But obviously based on what the OP posted these parents were not in that category.

Children should be locked in the basement at home until they turn 18 and in some places 21.

[transam]

Very few parents appear aware that other diners in the same restaurant are not enchanted by their children...

They should teach their brats some manners... or not bringing them at all in a restaurant!

This is true, and as a parent I find it very offensive and an imposition myself that they think their little darlings are so much more special then everyone else's and you should just love them in spite of how much they misbehave or impose or whether or not you even like children at all. But obviously based on what the OP posted these parents were not in that category.

Children should be locked in the basement at home until they turn 18 and in some places 21.

Hi dad.

[Kilgore Trout]

Depends on what the meal consists of; if you are having a apertif,bottle of wine; appetizers, main courses, desserts, coffee, possibly a cognac or brandy after the meal then I don't think 2000bht per head is that outrageous.

And that is an 'average family meal' how?

Red lobster in the states for example; a family restaurant in every sense of the word and NOT considered expensive, can VERY easily come to 50-60 dollars PER PERSON.

I have also been to the UK where a pint at a restaurant can easily be up to 10 pounds, so a big meal could easily get up to 40 pounds.

Get real or go to McDonalds

But the mistake you're making here is comparing a normal family restaurant in America to a normal family restaurant in Bangkok. There are lots of 'normal' family restaurants here that cater to Western tastes that don't cost that much. I seriously doubt you were charged 10 pounds for a pint in England - although our prices are ridiculously high, 10 pounds is a mockery. If that is indeed true, then it shows what you consider normal and I think we can end the discussion there. You are obviously a man of certain tastes!

McDonalds as the alternative to a 2000 baht meal? I think you're living in the wrong Thailand!

This all comes down to the recent Western centring of all human life experience around the children of a nuclear family. Every burp or fart or gurgle by the children is applauded and given its own diary entry. Going out for a meal with parents and their offspring is a pointless activity as every interesting conversation is stopped by the parents so they can listen to their vile children's rambling incoherence.

This has not yet reached Thailand, so when the child-centred, saintly Western parents bring their children this provokes a clear breach in the social norms. They simply shouldn't be there. Children should not be observed, heard, seen, discussed, mentored, or partake in any social activity of adults.

This tedious centring of the child, focusing on it in breach of the norms of civility and good conduct is just not acceptable here. And if there was a God, then I would thank God.

Some parents love their children and bring them up accordingly. Over-nurturing is bad, I agree, but the extent to which you describe it sounds more like a bitterness on your part than actual experience. I think children nowadays are spoiled by Western rules and imposed safety regulations more than over-bearing parents.

I'm sure there are plenty of grown-ups here who never received that loving family environment and grew into healthy adults, but I don't think it should be a hard and fast rule in society.

David, you are the one who began the comparison with back home

However, I probably exaggerate by a couple of pounds; but it is getting ridiculous, it hurts to look at a bill.

And yes, when I sit down with my family I need at least a bottle of wine and a few drinks

But...lest we get off topic

[DavidSL]

David, you are the one who began the comparison with back home

However, I probably exaggerate by a couple of pounds; but it is getting ridiculous, it hurts to look at a bill.

And yes, when I sit down with my family I need at least a bottle of wine and a few drinks

But...lest we get off topic

If you're with your family ordering a bottle of wine then I understand! Comparisons aside, we spend what we spend, and yes, this is getting silly.

I wish I could afford a 2000 baht meal!

Anyway, enough - you have your places, I have mine.

[Senia]

for me it's really a question of sitters, I have 1 semi - decent part time nanny, but she is still unable to keep an eye on him for longer than 3 hours. She's the best I ve got so far.

there's also my husband who doesn't trust anybody with the baby , I have to agree with him on this. Unless it's a relative or very close friend, a stranger ( anywhere not just Thailand ) will get frustrated taking care of a young one for long periods. I get frustrated sometimes, the lack of adult company, lack of sleep , constant worrying etc. And I am his mother !!! imagine a stranger going through this ....... but I digress

i would have agreed with you when I was single but I really cannot now. I am glad that we are in Thailand because most Thai's love kids ....... all kids. So maybe learn that from the locals, I am trying to .

[Senia]

what is a 2000 baht meal ???? back home that would be one of the places to bring kids to

[Senia]

Very few parents appear aware that other diners in the same restaurant are not enchanted by their children...

They should teach their brats some manners... or not bringing them at all in a restaurant!

you tell that to me at a restaurant and I will show my child proper table manners when I gouge your eyes out with a fork !!!!!

[canuckamuck]

I have three small children, I sure wouldn't want them at a nice restaurant. When they are older OK, but not currently.

Not much can be done about air travel though. It is an unfortunate reality that kids occasionally need to be on flights. The same is true for obnoxious adults; sometimes they have to fly too.

[Boo]

my son has come to any restaurant we wanted since he was a baby. he is well behaved, can eat his food alone & knows how to behave at the table. if other diners have an issue with it tough crap, i pay my money same as anyone else, if they want to control who sits next to them then eat at home or book a private dining room. simples.

on the occasions where were have foubd ourselve next to undesirables, usually drunk assed farang, we move table to go eat elsewhere. that's the normal course of actions when in a public place & someone is bothering you.

[cardholder]

If I go to 5 star restaurant, for example, for a romantic meal for 2, I would be disappointed if I was sat next to noisy or unruly children (or, I take your point - noisy or unruly adults would be just as bad).

When my children were younger, my wife and I would occasionally go out for a meal on our own - the last thing we wanted was to be distracted by other people's children.

I also think that there is a natural order to this sort of thing - it soon becomes apparent which restaurants are 'children friendly'. In Thailand, most are because of the often 'casual' mode of eating and the fact that the Thais are child-friendly. Equally, adults should be able to find 'adult only' restaurants if they so wish.

Edited May 23, 2011 by sbk
off topic personal attack removed