Retirement Visa Questions – A Little Different Tha

[BobAnderson]

I am ready to start the process for seeking a retirement visa from the Phuket immigration office. But I have some questions that I am hoping all of you can help me with.

My circumstances: 52 years old, married to a farang who works here (Phuket) legally. I can document in excess of B65,000 income per month. I will spend only about four months per year in Thailand due to work/business commitments other places. I would like to start get a retirement visa now before the goal posts are moved. I am an American.

Questions:

1. Can I really get the visa based on income only? I would prefer to keep my money somewhere where it can grow! If I demonstrate an income clearly far in excess of the base requirement will that help?

2. What does the American embassy require in terms of documentation to prove income? I have leases for rental properties and bank deposits in a bank book to prove other income as well.

3. Is Penang or KL a good place to go to start the process – and what will they require there to issue the initial Non-Imm O visa? From what I have read they will want to see the letter of income from the American embassy and that is about it??? Other than, of course, a valid passport and a Non-Imm O application.

4. What documents will the Phuket immigration office require when I get there to finalize the process and request the one year extension on the initial visa? Are they friendly/helpful?

Am I way off base or this possible?

Thanks to all for your help!

Bob

[BobAnderson]

Another issue: when the visa is processed here in Thailand - for me in Phuket - will it be extended out for one year from that date? Or one year from the date of the initial visa's issuance date? Someone mentioned, on another thread, a nine-month extension. (Specifically Roger 13 said, " You would probably be required to be in Thailand for 3 months to process your first "annual" extension - which will normally be for 9 months.")

That would be a major problem for me as I can always be here in Jan and Feb, but probably never in Oct/Nov (nine months later) to follow up on the renewal.

I would hope to get the visa in Malaysia and come immediately to Phuket within a week be in to immigration to get the extension. Possible?

What has been other people's experience on the initial extension date?

Thanks again!

Bob

[Roger13]

The Annual renewal date will be the date on which you first enter the Kingdom with your Non Imm Visa. You would need to process the Annual renewal during

the week prior to this date.

The Non Imm Visa is valid for 3 months - you may - I repeat may - find that you cannot get the initial 9 month extension until during the last (3rd) month.

I think I am right in saying that the rules require you to apply for a Non Imm for retirement in your home country - although I did get mine in an Asian country - but that was 5 years ago...

With the recent tightening of the rules you might wish to check on this

[BobAnderson]

Thanks Roger, I see what you mean now on the three month thing. I may go ahead and try anyway - might be worth taking a shot at it. I can probably never stay here a full three months due to business commitments.

Any other comments from anyone on the other requirements that I may have not foreseen?

Thanks!

[dr_Pat_Pong]

A Non-Immigrant visa issued in any country is acceptable to Thai Immigration. A bottle of Johnny Black might speed the process for you. You say you'll never stay for a full three months, so why not just use a multi entry Non-Imm visa. That allows unlimited entries for a full year and enables 90 day stays on each entry.

[BobAnderson]

Thank you Dr. Patpong,

Please excuse my ignorance, but I am not familiar with the one year multi-entry Non-Imm visa. Is it a B or an O? Is it just a tourist visa or ? Will it eventually make me eligible for permanent resident as the retirement visa would?

Thank you for your patience!

Bob

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Thank you Dr. Patpong,

Please excuse my ignorance, but I am not familiar with the one year multi-entry Non-Imm visa. Is it a B or an O? Is it just a tourist visa or ? Will it eventually make me eligible for permanent resident as the retirement visa would?

Thank you for your patience!

Bob

It is a Non-Immigrant O visa, enabling stays of up to 90 days on each entry. It does not lead you towards eligibility for residence. That can only be done on that extended visa, which must be done for 3 consecutive years. An O visa is extendable for your purposes.

[BobAnderson]

Thank you Dr. Patpong. Your responses here and in the thread " New Rules Q, Effects for me?" have helped me tremendously.

One final question, if I may. When I apply for the "O" visa in KL or Penang - do I need to specify in which direction I might choose to head - ie: a spouse visa or a retirement visa? The final approval and review of all documents would be here in Phuket - I am guessing? Or should I assume I would get asked all relevant questions and need to provide all relevant documents at both locations?

Ultimately, what I am asking is: Do I need to decide which reason I will use (retirement or spousal visa) before I request the visa in Malaysia?

Also: Will I have trouble with requesting the retirement visa if I don't have money in a bank here - in spite of being able to document an income significantly in excess of the B65k per month?

Thanks again - your assistance and roger's have helped a lot - I much more opptimistic about getting it all done in an appropriate manner.

Bob

[dr_Pat_Pong]

It will be an O Class visa that issues Bob. Immigration will not know whether you went for retirement or spousal when you applied. They'd like to see some money in a bank in Thailand, at least for the initial application. Something to fall back on if something went wrong. Your Embassy needs to certify your income evidence documents.

[Roger13]

You could try applying for an extension earlier

but others have posted that they are not usually

entertained before the 3rd month.

But that could possibly be at the beginning

of the 3rd month.

I get the Impression that Immigration is getting more

helpful to genuine applicants so I can see no harm in

enquiring earlier ...

BTW - There is a Post in Mekhong Kurts colomn

that Marriag Visas will require a Bht 800,000

Bank Deposit - same as Retirement.

http://bangkokatoz.com/The_Rounds_26DEC2003.htm

Roger

[dr_Pat_Pong]

BTW - There is a Post in Mekhong Kurts colomn

that Marriag Visas will require a Bht 800,000

Bank Deposit - same as Retirement.

http://bangkokatoz.com/The_Rounds_26DEC2003.htm

Roger

I just talked to a seriously heavy immigration officer and he says the requirement for the marrieds is as announced, 400,000 baht in bankings / or a combination. Who knows, T i T

[lopburi3]

BTW - There is a Post in Mekhong Kurts colomn

that Marriag Visas will require a Bht 800,000

Bank Deposit - same as Retirement.

I believe that if you show 800k for support you are not subject to the review process delay and visa can be immediately extended so perhaps this is what he means.

[MekhongKurt]

This sure is all confusing. Let me clarify what I eamnt in my column "The Rounds" in the December 26, 2003 issue.

First, let me emphasize my police friend (a Police Senior Sergeant Major) stressed the change, he was told, applies only to new, first-time applicants; others are grand-fathered in. I had just pointed out that a mutual friend had recently renewed *his* marriage visa for just the 200,000, My buddy said he would check again, and called me the next day to say he went down to headquarters and raised the question to the top brass there, and that that's what they told him.

BUT there's another point to throw into this boiling pot. It seems pretty clear that the Bangkok Immigration Bureau fills 2 roles: first, as the one administering this immigration region, and, second, commanding the *rest* of the immigration offices throughout the Kingdom. My friend says all immigration offices are supposed to follow the Bangkok headquarters' orders.

I've not asked in any other immigration office outside Bangkok, but friends whom I believe to be telling the truth say they have been told different things about different kinds of visas by officers in *other* offices. What I'm suggesting is an internal breakdown in communications between Bangkok and upcountry. If so, it well may be the case that in some other city one might be issued a visa (of whatever type) with fewer hurdles than we might experience here at the national headquarters.

I don't *know* that to be true, but given that my police friend has never once steered me wrong in nearly 10 years AND that I do know foreigners who say their experiences contradict what he's told me of late, foreigners I trust, nothing else makes sense. I guess it also could be willful undermining of headquarters policy, but I think if I were a relative nobody in some provincial immigration office in Nakhon Nowhere, I'd think long and hard before directly disobeying an edict from the national headquarters.

The part that makes me despair is that finding out solid, reliable information is so hard, even when we have friends well-placed inside the system to assist us.

Given the current focus on "quality tourists" and "quality foreign residents," it doesn't seem beyond the bounds of reasonable possibility that there are moves afoot to raise the bar across the board, as has already happened with retirement visas, for example.

BTW, on a point not directly related, does anyone know if the letter-to-the-edior of "The Pattaya Mail" complaining that the writer had gotten a notice from HSBC, his bank here, saying foreigners are no longer for interest have any merit? That would sure make me even more hesitant to put up 800,000 baht -- something I'm already strongly disinclined to do. I didn't know about this until the banks were closed for the New Year's holiday, so don't have any information at all. And as I currently do no banking in Thailand, of course I've gotten no notices one way or the other

Hope I've clarified my column story a bit..

[harpman88]

This is in Re to Doc Pat_Pong's suggestion of going with a Non O multi

entry vs the "geeza visa". I (still in U.S.) qualify for either or. Knowing all the requirements for the retirement visa,

what are the pros and cons of going with the Non O multi instead? Most importantly

how easily is the multi renewable after the 1st year is up? This very issue has been debated on another Thai related

website at which a friend of mine was once the forum administrator. Anyway,the

consensus of opinion there was that the Non O multi is,in most cases,the best one to go with,although Im sure that this

may vary depending on one's circumstances.

Your thoughts and input most welcome!

Thanx in advance "harpman88" (its almost

"crunch time" for my decision.)

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Geezer, married or whatever ...it is an O visa you need. You can apply for an O/A at a Thai Embassy or Consulate, which enables a one year stay once you get to Thailand. You'll meed to exhibit your ability to open a bank account in Thailand with 800,000 baht once you get here. You will need a police clearance certificate and a health clearance certificate. For mine, it is easier to apply for the extension in Thailand. Annual renewals are no problem as long as you continue to maintain the required bank account.

[JimGant]

All I know about retiring in Thailand visa-wise I have gleaned from this forum. Let me summarize, and then let someone more knowledgeable critique.

It is not really an "either or" decision for the NonImmigrant "O" or the retirement visa. The first can lead to the second. Yes, you see advertised on Thai Embassy DC and Thai Consulate LA websites instructions for obtaining an "O-A" retirement visa. But as best I can tell, this is an unnecessary hassle, requiring notarized police, medical, and financial certifications which then get you only a 90 day single entry NonImmigrant visa -- the one year "O-A" status still has to be completed with Thai Immigration in Thailand. So, to avoid the medical and police check hassle, it's best to request a multi-entry NonImmigrant "O" visa and then complete the retirement one-year stay process in Thailand. As such, no police background check and *probably* no medical checkup would be required -- only the financial requirements. (I say *probably* on the medical as there seems to be some uncertainty on this requirement. But even if required, the cost and simplicity of getting a medical clearance in Thailand is far superior to doing so in the US).

Your main obstacle might be in obtaining the NonImmigrant "O" visa. Each Embassy and Consulate seems to have wide discretion on its issuance. Applying for one with reason being "retirement" might require nothing more than proof of financial ability and a clean appearance. However, at places like Los Angeles, I have a feeling they would require upfront the entire "O-A" gamut, i.e., police, medical, etal. Anyway, the subject of obtaining an NonImm "O" is covered widely in this forum. Search on "Houston" for a start.

Finally, you may not want to get the one-year retirement visa extension if you plan to be in and out of the country extensively (my situation). If you can't be here the same time every year (for renewal), or are here for only 90 day chunks or less, the NonImmigrant "O" (no "OA" status) would be, IMHO, the best choice.*

* Question for someone: Is "O-A" actually stamped in the passport when you receive one year extension authorization for either retirement or marriage purposes?

[JimGant]

which then get you only a 90 day single entry NonImmigrant visa -- the one year "O-A" status still has to be completed with Thai Immigration in Thailand

The link to the above is:

http://www.thai-la.net/visa/retire.htm

[dr_Pat_Pong]

I am 100 per cent in agreement Jim. It SEEMS like a good idea getting 12 months on arrival, but it is a monstrous hassle. Go for the plain old O everytime