Is There A Real It Shortage In Thailand?

[Fireball]

Is there a real IT shortage in Bangkok? I have an MCSE as well as the BSc (Hons) Computing & Informatics, 7 years work experience in IT support in the UK which includes the following technology:

* Windows 2000 Server support

* Red Hat Linux/Advanced Server support

* TCP/IP & Networking support

* MSSQL support

* mySQL support

* ASP, PHP, HTML, Perl, BASH programming

* plus more

I'm a UK citizen, 30 years old.

My other post is here.

Thanks!

[MattFS218]

No there's no shortage, but you probably aren't going to work for 175 baht an hour

[Fireball]

Matt, I dont mind taking a large salary reduction. I think the average salary in 2002 for an IT person with my skills was between 30-50,000 baht a month which translates to £500-£700/month at 72 baht to the pound.

27K is like £13 or 936 baht an hour! But hey, after living expenses (very moderate lifestyle - I dont go out at all), we have nothing left over just about!

cheers

James

[britmaveric]

Going to be near impossible I'm afraid - Thai(s) are paid a mere fraction of what you would like. Plus being fluent in Thai probably is a must.

More likely elsewhere in Asia - Singapore.

[~G~]

Matt, I dont mind taking a large salary reduction. I think the average salary in 2002 for an IT person with my skills was between 30-50,000 baht a month which translates to £500-£700/month at 72 baht to the pound.

27K is like £13 or 936 baht an hour! But hey, after living expenses (very moderate lifestyle - I dont go out at all), we have nothing left over just about!

cheers

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

- 30K baht a month

- 22 days of work a month, that's 1,364 baht a day

- 8 hours of work a day, that's 170 baht an hour (~175 baht/hr Matt mentioned)

This is a 82% salary cut...

Edited October 20, 2005 by ~G~

[Fireball]

Matt, I dont mind taking a large salary reduction. I think the average salary in 2002 for an IT person with my skills was between 30-50,000 baht a month which translates to £500-£700/month at 72 baht to the pound.

27K is like £13 or 936 baht an hour! But hey, after living expenses (very moderate lifestyle - I dont go out at all), we have nothing left over just about!

cheers

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

- 30K baht a month

- 22 days of work a month, that's 1,364 baht a day

- 8 hours of work a day, that's 170 baht an hour (~175 baht/hr Matt mentioned)

This is a 82% salary cut...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But a meal costs 20 baht and rent 3600 baht / month doesnt it?

Thats cheap as hel_l!

[bendix]

yes, that's absolutely right. you'll get a ten room mansion complete with swimming pool for that.

and you can buy a car for 2000 baht, hire servants for 50 baht a month, and power / gas / phones / internet / insurance / pensions etc are actually free - yes, yes, it's true.

I suggest you give up your job in the UK, believe the bullshit that the girl you met in a gogo bar tells you, and come over and truly live the life of a farang king.

good luck.

we look forward to reading about your jump in Pattaya Mail in 3 years.

[dantilley]

Matt, I dont mind taking a large salary reduction. I think the average salary in 2002 for an IT person with my skills was between 30-50,000 baht a month which translates to £500-£700/month at 72 baht to the pound.

27K is like £13 or 936 baht an hour! But hey, after living expenses (very moderate lifestyle - I dont go out at all), we have nothing left over just about!

cheers

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

- 30K baht a month

- 22 days of work a month, that's 1,364 baht a day

- 8 hours of work a day, that's 170 baht an hour (~175 baht/hr Matt mentioned)

This is a 82% salary cut...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But a meal costs 20 baht and rent 3600 baht / month doesnt it?

Thats cheap as hel_l!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Meals only cost 20 baht each if you go to the cheapest street stall every day and eat their most basic meal each time, and only drink water with it. Well, in Bangkok that's the case anyway - I assume that's where you will want to be living? Can't see much chance of getting work elsewhere anyway...

Also, If you get a place for 3,600 Baht it certainly wouldn't be suitable for a wife and baby! You'd be talking at least 3 times that amount for a 2 bedroom flat, and that may be in a run-down or inconvenient area. In my appartment block the 2 bedroom flats are 15,000 a month and that is about average.

As for getting a job, definitely stick to the programming angle rather than IT support. Be prepared to work freelance for a while and be prepared to be out of work for a long time. Initial things that I can see are in your favour:

- Having a Thai wife and child. Companies you approach will feel better about hiring you if you have a connecttion like that, means you won't be buggering off within 2 months. Also means you probably won't be a sexpat

- Having PHP and MySQL skills. Loads of PHP going on in Thailand right now.

Things you have against you:

- No Thai language skills.

- Not being in the country right now. There's no way you can get a job from in the UK unless you work for a multi-national company that posts you out here. And that's not something you can just walk into, i.e. you can't get a job and then immediately say "right, post me out to Thailand please".

- Being a farrang. This is the big one. Most companies will employ a predominantly Thai workforce, not just due to lower salaries but also to avoid the hassles of sorting out work permits, and many companies just have a blinkered, automatic policy of chucking the farrangs' CVs in the bin as soon as they arrive without thinking.

Now, one thing I will say is that when you're asking around and researching this, you will get a lot of very negative responses. People will tell you it is impossible to get a job and that 99.9% of all jobs go to Thais: this is not true. Yes, it is difficult to get a job, but it is not impossible. If you're really serious about this, there's loads of advice I can give you and directions to point you in. But if this is just a passing interest or a pipe-dream then forget it - you do have to be commited to the cause.

[MattFS218]

Yes, 175baht/hr and that's assuming you only work 5 days a week and 8 hours a day. Most Thai's normally work 6 day weeks and possibly 9-10+ hours a day. Then subtract 10% for taxes, and you aren't left with much.

20 baht can get you noodle soup with some fish balls in a suburb. In a town like Bangkok or Pattaya, it will cost you 30 baht. If you want something with seafood try 45 baht.....

3600 baht in Pattaya will get you a studio apartment and you will be lucky to get a flushing toilet and good luck with any a/c. But even if it did have a/c, the electricity bill will cost you at least another 1000 (assuming you only run it a few hours a day). Think about it....then again, I've been here a year and have treasured every moment of it, but I've already made a large stack of change in the States.

Most Thai employers WILL shy away from employing you...because as a farang your reliability and likelihood you will put up to the work hours and low wage and against you. Good luck tho.

[~G~]

Matt, I dont mind taking a large salary reduction. I think the average salary in 2002 for an IT person with my skills was between 30-50,000 baht a month which translates to £500-£700/month at 72 baht to the pound.

27K is like £13 or 936 baht an hour! But hey, after living expenses (very moderate lifestyle - I dont go out at all), we have nothing left over just about!

cheers

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

- 30K baht a month

- 22 days of work a month, that's 1,364 baht a day

- 8 hours of work a day, that's 170 baht an hour (~175 baht/hr Matt mentioned)

This is a 82% salary cut...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But a meal costs 20 baht and rent 3600 baht / month doesnt it?

Thats cheap as hel_l!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, you didn't say you want luxuries, did you?

Keep it simple:

- Sleep in the office and save the rent. This will also save you transportation expenses to and from work. Who can afford that!?

- Why buy a meal for 20 baht when you can get MAMA noodles for less than 10 baht? One a day will be enough.

- Drink a lot of FREE coffee in the office to compensate for the noodly diet.

- When you need to border-run, hitch hike.

[Guest endure]

Is there a real IT shortage in Bangkok? I have an MCSE as well as the BSc (Hons) Computing & Informatics, 7 years work experience in IT support in the UK which includes the following technology:

* Windows 2000 Server support

* Red Hat Linux/Advanced Server support

* TCP/IP & Networking support

* MSSQL support

* mySQL support

* ASP, PHP, HTML, Perl, BASH programming

* plus more

I'm a UK citizen, 30 years old.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Can you speak fluent Thai? If not how do you intend to to communicate technicalities with your fellow employees?

[dantilley]

Can you speak fluent Thai? If not how do you intend to to communicate technicalities with your fellow employees?

May not be an issue as many Bangkok based companies, especially farrang owned companies, have a policy of speaking English in the office.

[Fireball]

Bendix - Youre a funny guy. I like your sarcasm

Dantilley - I am very serious about moving there but am willing and patient enough to do it the right way no matter how long it takes. Thanks for your advice.

What is the minimum amount of baht I should bring over with me, my wife and our 11 month old daughter?

MattFS218 - I am actually half-japanese, half-english and look it. Maybe they'll warm to that dont you agree?

~G~ - Sleep in my current employers office would be better. £1550 take home pay, nothing for rent, nothing for rates, they even have a gym and shower room in the attic plus a kitchen. This way I'd save £1550 minus food costs! Nah, seriously I need at least a room in a shared house for some privacy. I'm married with a baby and the Thai-wife will probably be moving to Thailand next month while I stay in the UK saving shitloads every month (or so the theory goes).

endure - I can speak very little Thai. Is it easy to learn in your opinion? How long would it take to be understood by a native speaker?

Edited October 21, 2005 by Fireball

[britmaveric]

Fireball - knowing Thai is essential - I'd want to know what everyone was saying and it will give you major advantage/value.

- Japanese look, uh not sure that would help you any.

[solo siam]

You could always get an Internet Job, Perhaps doing support in the UK or USA - Timings excellent seeing as when its daytime here its not there. Might be worth asking your current employer if they would take you on in that capacity for a hefty pay decrease (say 50%).

[Dickie_Doo]

Bendix - Youre a funny guy. I like your sarcasm

Er...Bendix isn't being sarcastic, As a matter-of- fact northerner. he was being literal.

Its usually at about this point in a topic he starts dropping heavy hints about his THB 500,000 a month salary. (Eg by revealing his monthly tax bill)

[phuketsiam]

Thats a good suggestion, while your in UK make some contacts to do freelancing work remotely, you won't be legal in Thaland, but you will make much more money, give you time to learn Thai and find a job. In my experience most programming jobs go to Thai's, the forigners are more likely to get a SA or PM position, target the forign owned companies, there are a few out there, they are far more likley to hire a non thai.

[Seen all,learnt nothing]

Ah ha Fireball so there you are. Thought you'd forgotten about us.

Or you thought if you posted in another forum you will get different advice.

And so you will.

Move to LOS tomorrow with your wife and family. Thailand awaits you.

Paradise.

Thailand has a dearth of IT professionals. Fanantastic salaries. Yours for the taking. Dream location. All you need is:

* Windows 2000 Server support

* Red Hat Linux/Advanced Server support

* TCP/IP & Networking support

* MSSQL support

* mySQL support

* ASP, PHP, HTML, Perl, BASH programming

* plus more

I'm impressed. But my next door neighbours cat isn't.

Why are you on a low salary. Because SE Asia overtook US/Europe in the IT field long ago.

You won't get a decent job because Thailand and SE Asia already has the skills.

Ask yourself if they need you.

You would get a teaching job in Thailand because, old adage, those who can DO, those who can't TEACH. 30-40K THB a month. WOW.

Got the message at last?

[brianbrain]

I came to Thailand three years ago with a resume and intentions similar to your own. I found it impossible to find the sort of job you are looking for and I am certain it will be the same for you. Don't kid yourself otherwise. For the likes of ourselves, the only realistic alternative is to work at school or university teaching English, ICT, or maths. That's what I do, and as a single guy with a very simple life and long working day I save about 45,000 baht per month from my Thai income. I have other income from UK rental property that I do not touch.

The really important point is that I am a single guy and happy to lead a very simple life. I live in a one room apartment, eat Thai food three times a day (150 baht per day), work odd hours, use the bus a lot, and rarely take taxis. Unlike you, I do not have a wife and child to support. There is no way my current salary would be sufficient to pay for a decent two or three room apartment, car, education for my child, family entertainment, etc. Life for you will be bloody miserable.

One final thing, if you do decide to teach in Thailand, you will totally screw up your chances of returning to a good IT job in the UK (unless you had some amazingly scarce skill, which you don’t). I confirmed this myself on a recent visit home. Prior to leaving the UK I earned 30,000 GBP per annum. Now I’d have to start again at 20,000 GBP or worse. If you don’t believe me, phone up a decent recruitment agency and tell them you’ve been working in Thailand for three years. On that wage, I'm better off staying here.

Good luck with your decision.

Is there a real IT shortage in Bangkok? I have an MCSE as well as the BSc (Hons) Computing & Informatics, 7 years work experience in IT support in the UK which includes the following technology:

* Windows 2000 Server support

* Red Hat Linux/Advanced Server support

* TCP/IP & Networking support

* MSSQL support

* mySQL support

* ASP, PHP, HTML, Perl, BASH programming

* plus more

I'm a UK citizen, 30 years old.

My other post is here.

Thanks!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Dickie_Doo]

Correct - if you have any ambitions to pursue a career back in civilization in the future; the presence of Thailand on your tech CV will kill that stone dead.

Every intelligent employer in the world knows what it implies.

If you work here as an English teacher, you risk never getting another meaningful job as long as you live. Nobody in their right mind would put that on a CV. Better to say you took a year's sabbatical.

[BkkTechie]

IT Shortage..depends..upon if u hav the requiste skills.....if u r lucky - u will probably get a job..and a employer...willing to sponsor yr work permit...

but the pay would still be very low by any standards...and contrary to popular beleif thailand is not all that cheap when u r on a thai salary of 40 - 50 K baht a month.

and yes ofcourse u become totally unemployable newhere else in the civilised world...as most thai companies r small mickey mouse software dev houses..doing almost school like projects - the thai industry is probably a decade behind every1 else..

[dantilley]

Dantilley - I am very serious about moving there but am willing and patient enough to do it the right way no matter how long it takes. Thanks for your advice.

What is the minimum amount of baht I should bring over with me, my wife and our 11 month old daughter?

Well, I wouldn't bring over any Baht - keep your money in your UK bank account and Draw from there. As for how much you'll need... well to be honest I have no idea as to how much you need to support a wife and child. But if you can work out a monthly budget smoehow I'd bank on it taking 6 months to get a job over here. And then if your money's running low then just bite the bullet and teach English.

[Fireball]

Great, finally I have some real shock stories to bring me down from my cloud where I was day dreaming about living in paradise for the rest of my life, eating tasty stir fry squid, lying on the beach every month soaking up the sun and scuba diving in fantastic clear waters thriving with a multitude of aquatic life.

I would like to keep my IT career on track but I think teaching English would be ok. A palmist once predicted I'd become a teacher

Gah, I dont know anymore. It all seems like too much of a risk now.

The way this is going I might as well save £20000 and buy a business in Thailand instead. And how long will that take? bloody years!

So many options, all with their own risk factor. I must choose carefully or plunge myself into desolation.

I've got the message now but I'm not succumbing to your warnings just yet. I'm going to send my cv to several recruitment agencies and farang companies and see what I get back.

I'll post the results, here.

BTW how do you survive? Please tell me your secrets...

[britmaveric]

Singapore or Maylasia far easier IMHO.

[cobra]

... A palmist once predicted I'd become a teacher 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well that should settle it then

Really, your making fair money now where your at, continue,

Save, invest, than come over to live, not work.

[MattFS218]

MattFS218 - I am actually half-japanese, half-english and look it. Maybe they'll warm to that dont you agree?

I'm a Chinese American, and I can tell you your face won't help a bit. It doesn't matter so much with farang bosses (I've been lucky because of my two serious jobs, I've been hired by Farang) but Thai bosses will see you and say--why should I pay you a foreigner salary when you look Thai. Lower level Thai salaries for IT work in Thailand can be lower than 15,000 baht/month.

My marketability as an employee, even by western standards is pretty high and it wasn’t all that easy getting a job, so you'd better be darn good and prepared to be paid shit. You might consider starting your own business on the Internet...it is probably a more viable solution.

Matt

[naka]

... A palmist once predicted I'd become a teacher 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well that should settle it then

Really, your making fair money now where your at, continue,

Save, invest, than come over to live, not work.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good advice from Cobra.

But a meal costs 20 baht and rent 3600 baht / month doesnt it?

Do you really want to live a paupers existence here ? You are already complaining about your poor living standard in Farangland !

BTW how do you survive? Please tell me your secrets...

Well, in my case I worked for 25 years for a UK/Aus multinational in Asia.

Coming here "on spec." to work could be your worst finacial decision ever especially as you say you have practically no capital.

And, as some have already mentioned, such a move will probably negatively affect your career at a later date.

[raro]

Did someone mention the school fees already? Or you want your kid to go to the temple school and start a great carreer as a motorcycle taxi driver?

[~G~]

I would like to keep my IT career on track but I think teaching English would be ok.

A wife, a child, a teacher's salary.

The way this is going I might as well save £20000 and buy a business in Thailand instead. And how long will that take? bloody years!

One word - don't. That will be even more risky than your previous ideas.

[The_Moog]

I'm going to send my cv to several recruitment agencies and farang companies and see what I get back.

I'll post the results, here.

They won't send you an acknowledgment or reply.