Disappearing Farang?

[vpi78]

Man this thread is such great entertainment. Economic experts that disdain government statistics in favor of their Polls of a few bar owners in low season.

But this last series of posts deserve time on Saturday Night Live. Yeah, Pattaya was way better 30 years ago. I don't know why but I was 20 then and now I am 50 now.

Correlation maybe? Nope that would involve logic and besides I have learned how to use the ignore feature to banish logic from my delusions.

[Awohalitsiktoli]

Man this thread is such great entertainment. Economic experts that disdain government statistics in favor of their Polls of a few bar owners in low season.

But this last series of posts deserve time on Saturday Night Live. Yeah, Pattaya was way better 30 years ago. I don't know why but I was 20 then and now I am 50 now.

Correlation maybe? Nope that would involve logic and besides I have learned how to use the ignore feature to banish logic from my delusions.

What is interesting to me is the number of worthless posts by people who seem to have no other goal but to be confrontational. I suppose when a poster can't respond to something in an intelligent manner he resorts to such childish behavior.

[vpi78]

Man this thread is such great entertainment. Economic experts that disdain government statistics in favor of their Polls of a few bar owners in low season.

But this last series of posts deserve time on Saturday Night Live. Yeah, Pattaya was way better 30 years ago. I don't know why but I was 20 then and now I am 50 now.

Correlation maybe? Nope that would involve logic and besides I have learned how to use the ignore feature to banish logic from my delusions.

What is interesting to me is the number of worthless posts by people who seem to have no other goal but to be confrontational. I suppose when a poster can't respond to something in an intelligent manner he resorts to such childish behavior.

It seems some of them resort to discovering the ignore feature when they can not put forth any compelling data much less an argument comprised of anything but their biased sad opinions.

sound familiar?

[JSixpack]

I exceeded the quote space again, so I've resorted to brackets to indicate quoted text.

>name='Awohalitsiktoli' timestamp='1311757964' post='4585906']

>

> Is it possible for something to change in a way that is worse than

> before the change? It is odd that some posters here appear to reject that notion.

No, they reject the notion in relation to Pattaya--overall.

> I know many farangs and ALL OF THEM think Pattaya-Jomtien was

> better in the past. That does not mean EVERYTHING was better. It

> means that their assessment is that, overall, things were better in

> the past. In fact, most say "much better."

But their thinking can't be taken seriously because it has little

evidence, logic, or reason behind it. They can't point to much of

anything missing that hasn't replaced in abundance or merely moved.

So, some old fart misses the Nid bar in its old location on 2nd Rd.

He had good times there with Miss Noi, Ped, Da, and Fon. Ah, so

wonderful; them was the days.

Now the Nid bar is GONE from that location!!! Memories have

been STOLEN. OK, it's moved to the other side of 2nd Rd., down the

street. NOT GOOD ENOUGH. It was BETTER where it was because . . .

<sputter> well, because that's where it was.

So most of the whining amounts to old men's reminiscing in rocking

chairs, I'd say; and I speak as a senior myself. When it comes to

traffic, they have a point, however. When that reaches a crisis,

something will probably be done about it. Pattaya Jomtien Road

traffic finally reached intolerable levels and lo! re-widening

(in interminable Thai fashion).

> I agree.

Surprise, surprise.

> Part of this is age related.

Oh yes indeed.

> In some situations there is not enough development. In others there

> is way too much development. In between these two extremes you find

> the best of both worlds. That has gone

No, that is here right now. Hence the crowding in.

I think this present level will be

maintained for a while except for the odd condo building here and

there. Pattaya doesn't lack for anything much now in the way of

accommodations, shopping, and "entertainment." One can only wish now

more of a focus will be on transportation/parking--but unfortunately

the government has exclusive control over that.

> and that is what many expats are upset about.

Not really, just some of their sentimental attachments being

obliterated. It's common among old folks; they mostly don't like change very much.

Maybe you should hang with younger people more.

[Awohalitsiktoli]

Man this thread is such great entertainment. Economic experts that disdain government statistics in favor of their Polls of a few bar owners in low season.

But this last series of posts deserve time on Saturday Night Live. Yeah, Pattaya was way better 30 years ago. I don't know why but I was 20 then and now I am 50 now.

Correlation maybe? Nope that would involve logic and besides I have learned how to use the ignore feature to banish logic from my delusions.

What is interesting to me is the number of worthless posts by people who seem to have no other goal but to be confrontational. I suppose when a poster can't respond to something in an intelligent manner he resorts to such childish behavior.

It seems some of them resort to discovering the ignore feature when they can not put forth any compelling data much less an argument comprised of anything but their biased sad opinions.

sound familiar?

It is easy to tell when you have revealed a truth. The responses are crystal clear on that point. It is sort of like dental surgery and apparently a lot of you are feeling it.

[tropo]

What is interesting to me is the number of worthless posts by people who seem to have no other goal but to be confrontational. I suppose when a poster can't respond to something in an intelligent manner he resorts to such childish behavior.

When is this guy going to take a rest. Soon he'll have everyone on ignore and be talking to himself.

[thaibeachlovers]

I don't hang around in bars anymore, so I have no idea what the other Pattaya lovers don't like about the new developments, so I can only give my opinion.

Large scale investment in hotels and malls like Central obviously attract upmarket clientel. That clientel includes women and families. Those people don't like seeing bars and the "naughty" side of Pattaya. They will complain. Because they have money, and the owners of the flash hotels and malls want to protect their investment ( which needs a continuous supply of women and families ), so they will put pressure on City Hall to restrict or even eliminate the bar scene. This happened in Manila when a mayor unilaterally closed all the bars in Makati.

Thailand has a large number of beach front towns, but there is no equivalent to Pattaya elsewhere.

Since big hotels started appearing in Pattaya, prices of accomodation have dramatically increased, and large numbers of upmarket hotels are replacing the cheaper ones. At this rate, Pattaya will cost as much as Patong to live in, and none of us want that.

My preference would be for all the people that want to move Pattaya upmarket to move to another town, like Hua Hin, and invest there. Failing that, they could take the submarine for a ride, with the hatch open.

Unfortunately the damage is done, and isn't going to change back. If City Hall was about development, rather than you know what, they could move the bars to a new area, and we could all be happy, but of course nothing is going to happen, till it all turns to poo, and we have a "spa" on every corner.

As I see it, the only thing that is going to save Pattaya is a world recession. The real Pattaya people will still come, but all the mucky mucks will have lost everything in the crash, and will be too poor to come and stuff the place up. HOORAH.

[BugJackBaron]

I don't hang around in bars anymore, so I have no idea what the other Pattaya lovers don't like about the new developments, so I can only give my opinion.

Large scale investment in hotels and malls like Central obviously attract upmarket clientel. That clientel includes women and families. Those people don't like seeing bars and the "naughty" side of Pattaya. They will complain. Because they have money, and the owners of the flash hotels and malls want to protect their investment ( which needs a continuous supply of women and families ), so they will put pressure on City Hall to restrict or even eliminate the bar scene. This happened in Manila when a mayor unilaterally closed all the bars in Makati.

Thailand has a large number of beach front towns, but there is no equivalent to Pattaya elsewhere.

Since big hotels started appearing in Pattaya, prices of accomodation have dramatically increased, and large numbers of upmarket hotels are replacing the cheaper ones. At this rate, Pattaya will cost as much as Patong to live in, and none of us want that.

My preference would be for all the people that want to move Pattaya upmarket to move to another town, like Hua Hin, and invest there. Failing that, they could take the submarine for a ride, with the hatch open.

Unfortunately the damage is done, and isn't going to change back. If City Hall was about development, rather than you know what, they could move the bars to a new area, and we could all be happy, but of course nothing is going to happen, till it all turns to poo, and we have a "spa" on every corner.

As I see it, the only thing that is going to save Pattaya is a world recession. The real Pattaya people will still come, but all the mucky mucks will have lost everything in the crash, and will be too poor to come and stuff the place up. HOORAH.

Very well put.

Ridiculous. Those "upscale russians" may driive prices up in some areas but as a cheap charlie I know that i can still find a 500 baht ot 600 baht clean and quiet room in soi bouacow and even in Jomtien. You just have to know where to look. This place is not Manila - a city in a catholic country by the way - and the mayor has no intention of shutting down squat(even politicians woudn't be that stupid).

Well, that's my 2 baht worth.

Edited July 27, 2011 by BugJackBaron

[tropo]

This happened in Manila when a mayor unilaterally closed all the bars in Makati.

If you are going to use Manila as an example, you should get your facts straight.

The bars being shut down in Malate (not Makati) had absolutely nothing to do with tourists and families. You will never see tourist families walking around Malate - it's a dump and quite dangerous.

It was Mayor Lim (aka Dirty Harry), a former (corrupt) police official who couldn't stand the sight of foreigners who closed them down nearly 20 years ago. More recently his son was charged for drug dealing but the case was dropped a few years later. I wonder why?

The bars in Makati are still open.

Edited July 27, 2011 by tropo

[Awohalitsiktoli]

I don't hang around in bars anymore, so I have no idea what the other Pattaya lovers don't like about the new developments, so I can only give my opinion.

Large scale investment in hotels and malls like Central obviously attract upmarket clientel. That clientel includes women and families. Those people don't like seeing bars and the "naughty" side of Pattaya. They will complain. Because they have money, and the owners of the flash hotels and malls want to protect their investment ( which needs a continuous supply of women and families ), so they will put pressure on City Hall to restrict or even eliminate the bar scene. This happened in Manila when a mayor unilaterally closed all the bars in Makati.

Thailand has a large number of beach front towns, but there is no equivalent to Pattaya elsewhere.

Since big hotels started appearing in Pattaya, prices of accomodation have dramatically increased, and large numbers of upmarket hotels are replacing the cheaper ones. At this rate, Pattaya will cost as much as Patong to live in, and none of us want that.

My preference would be for all the people that want to move Pattaya upmarket to move to another town, like Hua Hin, and invest there. Failing that, they could take the submarine for a ride, with the hatch open.

Unfortunately the damage is done, and isn't going to change back. If City Hall was about development, rather than you know what, they could move the bars to a new area, and we could all be happy, but of course nothing is going to happen, till it all turns to poo, and we have a "spa" on every corner.

As I see it, the only thing that is going to save Pattaya is a world recession. The real Pattaya people will still come, but all the mucky mucks will have lost everything in the crash, and will be too poor to come and stuff the place up. HOORAH.

Good one "Failing that, they could take the submarine for a ride, with the hatch open." The unfortunate reality for them is that they are taking that ride but have not yet grasped that fact. I hate to see a really good thing destroyed by mindless development. The people who are pushing for these idiotic changes are actually in the minority. But they have a BIG MOUTH. They really hate it here (and claim to love it) and are intent on changing everything about the place. They want to destroy the entire place, kick all expats out, and start over with a new and improved "sanitary version." Lunatics! It will be interesting to see how the economic situation plays itself out. Right now it is clear the real estate ship is sinking. Sure, you can give the illusion that all is well. How? You get together with several rich investors, form a corporation, buy all of the units, and then claim "it sold out overnight because of the enormous demand." Then you sit on the units until a sucker shows up and pays ten times the value. What is interesting is what these people do not talk about: crime, pollution, overcrowded streets, poor walkways, increasing cost of living. These things are really important to expats who are thinking about retiring here. And that is why many are going elsewhere. But, no problem, the mysterious rich Russians will eventually invade and buy up everything along with hoards of rich Arabs, etc.

[craigt3365]

One extremely derogatory post towards Pattaya has been removed. Pattaya for sure has it's bad areas, but so do most cities around the world.

[poanoi]

If you had gone to the Cambodia border, you would know they too are corrupt scum,

refusing $20 dollar fee in their currency, and instead demanding over 1200 baht.

It would be a good idea to have the phone voice recorder on, while discussing fee,

and then visit Ministry of foreign affairs in Pnom Phen,

but make sure you are dressed in long jeans, or they won't let you in. :jap:

[thaibeachlovers]

This happened in Manila when a mayor unilaterally closed all the bars in Makati.

If you are going to use Manila as an example, you should get your facts straight.

The bars being shut down in Malate (not Makati) had absolutely nothing to do with tourists and families. You will never see tourist families walking around Malate - it's a dump and quite dangerous.

It was Mayor Lim (aka Dirty Harry), a former (corrupt) police official who couldn't stand the sight of foreigners who closed them down nearly 20 years ago. More recently his son was charged for drug dealing but the case was dropped a few years later. I wonder why?

The bars in Makati are still open.

my apologies for getting the name wrong, but it's what the Phillipinas I worked with in saudi told me.

I never said WHY they were closed down, just used that as an example of what MIGHT happen in Pattaya.

[thaibeachlovers]

I don't hang around in bars anymore, so I have no idea what the other Pattaya lovers don't like about the new developments, so I can only give my opinion.

Large scale investment in hotels and malls like Central obviously attract upmarket clientel. That clientel includes women and families. Those people don't like seeing bars and the "naughty" side of Pattaya. They will complain. Because they have money, and the owners of the flash hotels and malls want to protect their investment ( which needs a continuous supply of women and families ), so they will put pressure on City Hall to restrict or even eliminate the bar scene. This happened in Manila when a mayor unilaterally closed all the bars in Makati.

Thailand has a large number of beach front towns, but there is no equivalent to Pattaya elsewhere.

Since big hotels started appearing in Pattaya, prices of accomodation have dramatically increased, and large numbers of upmarket hotels are replacing the cheaper ones. At this rate, Pattaya will cost as much as Patong to live in, and none of us want that.

My preference would be for all the people that want to move Pattaya upmarket to move to another town, like Hua Hin, and invest there. Failing that, they could take the submarine for a ride, with the hatch open.

Unfortunately the damage is done, and isn't going to change back. If City Hall was about development, rather than you know what, they could move the bars to a new area, and we could all be happy, but of course nothing is going to happen, till it all turns to poo, and we have a "spa" on every corner.

As I see it, the only thing that is going to save Pattaya is a world recession. The real Pattaya people will still come, but all the mucky mucks will have lost everything in the crash, and will be too poor to come and stuff the place up. HOORAH.

Very well put.

Ridiculous. Those "upscale russians" may driive prices up in some areas but as a cheap charlie I know that i can still find a 500 baht ot 600 baht clean and quiet room in soi bouacow and even in Jomtien. You just have to know where to look. This place is not Manila - a city in a catholic country by the way - and the mayor has no intention of shutting down squat(even politicians woudn't be that stupid).

Well, that's my 2 baht worth.

My point isn't that cheap places aren't available- I know where to get a room for 350 bht. My point is that as Pattaya moves upmarket prices rise and the cheap hotels are replaced with more expensive, leading to less choices for economy accomodations than used to be.

There's no saying what politicians will do, and many are incredibly stupid.

If all the companies that own upmarket property in Pattaya got together and offered City Hall a very large sum of money to close every bar in Pattaya, what do you think would happen??????

[thaibeachlovers]

I have said previously that I want Pattaya to remain a broken and unpleasant eyesore. That is not true, I'd love it to be a model city, well laid out, efficient, clean and well maintained.

However, if the only way to hold back the hordes of trendies that would invade such a place, inflating prices and closing down the nightlife, is to have a decrepit, dangerous, broken place, then I'll take the crumbling wreck that is Pattaya.

BTW I've seen it happen before. Chaweng used to be a nice beach, with a mix of accomodation and some bar life, but then it became trendy, and look what a horrible place it has become!

[Awohalitsiktoli]

One extremely derogatory post towards Pattaya has been removed. Pattaya for sure has it's bad areas, but so do most cities around the world.

Believe it or not, I was about to respond to him to let him know that the place has many good points too. The so-called "Doomsayers" (even though we are not) are only pointing out what we see as a negative development trend. I know, from other posts, that you have lived all over the world, so you are certainly aware that development is not always a good thing. Still, it is important to state (to be fair) that pointing out problems with the city does not mean the place is rotten to the core and should be avoided like the Black Death. That is not the case. As I have said many times, there are much worse places to be on the planet.

[craigt3365]

One extremely derogatory post towards Pattaya has been removed. Pattaya for sure has it's bad areas, but so do most cities around the world.

Believe it or not, I was about to respond to him to let him know that the place has many good points too. The so-called "Doomsayers" (even though we are not) are only pointing out what we see as a negative development trend. I know, from other posts, that you have lived all over the world, so you are certainly aware that development is not always a good thing. Still, it is important to state (to be fair) that pointing out problems with the city does not mean the place is rotten to the core and should be avoided like the Black Death. That is not the case. As I have said many times, there are much worse places to be on the planet.

100% understood and agreed. If you saw the post, you understand it was a bit over the top with a lot of foul language. As most of us know, avoid Central Pattaya, and it's a completely different world.

[TJo]

For those that believe Pattaya is moving upscale, have you ever been to an upscale resort town? In all my travels to resorts around the world I have never seen a more downmarket, grubby dump. The amount of time, energy and money that would need to be spent to make this happen means Pattaya's future will always be at the bottom of the pile.

What exactly is Pattaya's draw, once you remove the bar scene, which most definitely IS dying? The filthy eroded beach, the dismal shopping, the miserable and tacky theme parks?

[dogtim]

For those that believe Pattaya is moving upscale, have you ever been to an upscale resort town? In all my travels to resorts around the world I have never seen a more downmarket, grubby dump. The amount of time, energy and money that would need to be spent to make this happen means Pattaya's future will always be at the bottom of the pile.

What exactly is Pattaya's draw, once you remove the bar scene, which most definitely IS dying? The filthy eroded beach, the dismal shopping, the miserable and tacky theme parks?

I agree. But you can get cheap implants!

Edited July 28, 2011 by dogtim

[Tolley]

For those that believe Pattaya is moving upscale, have you ever been to an upscale resort town? In all my travels to resorts around the world I have never seen a more downmarket, grubby dump. The amount of time, energy and money that would need to be spent to make this happen means Pattaya's future will always be at the bottom of the pile.

What exactly is Pattaya's draw, once you remove the bar scene, which most definitely IS dying? The filthy eroded beach, the dismal shopping, the miserable and tacky theme parks?

Can you point me the direction of the theme parks. I must have missed them on my nights out in Pattaya.

[craigt3365]

For those that believe Pattaya is moving upscale, have you ever been to an upscale resort town? In all my travels to resorts around the world I have never seen a more downmarket, grubby dump. The amount of time, energy and money that would need to be spent to make this happen means Pattaya's future will always be at the bottom of the pile.

What exactly is Pattaya's draw, once you remove the bar scene, which most definitely IS dying? The filthy eroded beach, the dismal shopping, the miserable and tacky theme parks?

Can you point me the direction of the theme parks. I must have missed them on my nights out in Pattaya.

I thought Walking Street was a theme park????

[JSixpack]

I've put my comments in blue. Had to go inside to avoid exceeding my quote space.

I don't hang around in bars anymore, so I have no idea what the other Pattaya lovers don't like about the new developments, so I can only give my opinion.

Got news for ya: the other Pattaya lovers mostly like the new developments.

Large scale investment in hotels and malls like Central obviously attract upmarket clientel. That clientel includes women and families. Those people don't like seeing bars and the "naughty" side of Pattaya. They will complain. Because they have money, and the owners of the flash hotels and malls want to protect their investment ( which needs a continuous supply of women and families ), so they will put pressure on City Hall to restrict or even eliminate the bar scene.

This is just your paranoid fantasy. Bangkok, for example, attracts infinitely MORE tourist families, not to mention the millions of families living there, yet Nana, Patpong, Soi Cowboy etc. are still going strong. The Thai equivalents, the questionable karaoke bars and massage parlors are still scattered around everywhere.

Pattaya adapts itself to offer something for everyone.

This happened in Manila when a mayor unilaterally closed all the bars in Makati.

No, that never happened. As tropo pointed out, you don't know what you're talking about; given such blithe disinformation, for the good of the public your keyboard really should be disconnected.

And there has been NO sign of that "unilateral closing" here. Just the opposite, in fact: more bars & go-gos have been constructed. Four or five new go-gos have just opened up!

Thailand has a large number of beach front towns, but there is no equivalent to Pattaya elsewhere.

Not on the scale of PTY, anyway. But doesn't Bang Chang seem reminiscent of your beloved Old Pattaya?

Since big hotels started appearing in Pattaya, prices of accomodation have dramatically increased, and large numbers of upmarket hotels are replacing the cheaper ones. At this rate, Pattaya will cost as much as Patong to live in, and none of us want that.

More fantasy. The reality is that many MORE budget accommodations were built around Soi Buakaow, Lenkee, Chaiyapoon, and LK Metro. Meanwhile the old ones are all pretty much there. Diana Inn's still going strong. For even cheaper, check the side sois, such as Soi Post Office and Soi Yamato. On a better scale, budget chains have arisen such as the Sawasdee chain. Even the cheapest roach coaches in town on 2nd Rd near Tim Beer Bar are still there.

That said, inflation has been hitting everywhere in Thailand (and the world). It would be easy for YOU to blame this on tourism, but the causes are much more fundamental. And you CAN'T show that prices have inflated in PTY more than they have in BKK, percentage-wise.

As I see it, the only thing that is going to save Pattaya is a world recession. The real Pattaya people will still come, but all the mucky mucks will have lost everything in the crash, and will be too poor to come and stuff the place up. HOORAH.

Well, you do love to dream. You see, Pattaya doesn't need "saving." It's doing great and most of us like it as it is, warts and all.

Edited July 28, 2011 by JSixpack

[tropo]

For those that believe Pattaya is moving upscale, have you ever been to an upscale resort town?

Of course it is moving upscale. It's not a belief, it's a fact. You should visit there sometime and check out some 5 star resorts.

[JSixpack]

the bar scene, which most definitely IS dying?

The bar scene has been and is growing, not dying. Four or five go-gos just opened up and renovations all over town are taking place. Go read Nightmarch's column.

Edited July 28, 2011 by JSixpack

[SolarOhm]

Pattaya has changed over the decades. I am not convinced Central Festival is economically viable - the over priced stores are packed mainly by bored sales staff.

There are road improvements - such as the road from Pattaya to Jomtien (Struth - 3 years back I almost got killed when my scooter plummeted into a crevasse just before the traffic lights)

If farangs are vanishings - I am not sure they are - it is because Germans are now being outnumbered by Russians, plus there are more Chinese tourists.

I don't see fewer farangs. Times are certainly changing and there is more diversity (and a dramatic increase in the number of lady boys, and western louts - wish they would get together and leave the greater number of Thai chicks to the people like myself).

[BugJackBaron]

I don't hang around in bars anymore, so I have no idea what the other Pattaya lovers don't like about the new developments, so I can only give my opinion.

Large scale investment in hotels and malls like Central obviously attract upmarket clientel. That clientel includes women and families. Those people don't like seeing bars and the "naughty" side of Pattaya. They will complain. Because they have money, and the owners of the flash hotels and malls want to protect their investment ( which needs a continuous supply of women and families ), so they will put pressure on City Hall to restrict or even eliminate the bar scene. This happened in Manila when a mayor unilaterally closed all the bars in Makati.

Thailand has a large number of beach front towns, but there is no equivalent to Pattaya elsewhere.

Since big hotels started appearing in Pattaya, prices of accomodation have dramatically increased, and large numbers of upmarket hotels are replacing the cheaper ones. At this rate, Pattaya will cost as much as Patong to live in, and none of us want that.

My preference would be for all the people that want to move Pattaya upmarket to move to another town, like Hua Hin, and invest there. Failing that, they could take the submarine for a ride, with the hatch open.

Unfortunately the damage is done, and isn't going to change back. If City Hall was about development, rather than you know what, they could move the bars to a new area, and we could all be happy, but of course nothing is going to happen, till it all turns to poo, and we have a "spa" on every corner.

As I see it, the only thing that is going to save Pattaya is a world recession. The real Pattaya people will still come, but all the mucky mucks will have lost everything in the crash, and will be too poor to come and stuff the place up. HOORAH.

Very well put.

Ridiculous. Those "upscale russians" may driive prices up in some areas but as a cheap charlie I know that i can still find a 500 baht ot 600 baht clean and quiet room in soi bouacow and even in Jomtien. You just have to know where to look. This place is not Manila - a city in a catholic country by the way - and the mayor has no intention of shutting down squat(even politicians woudn't be that stupid).

Well, that's my 2 baht worth.

My point isn't that cheap places aren't available- I know where to get a room for 350 bht. My point is that as Pattaya moves upmarket prices rise and the cheap hotels are replaced with more expensive, leading to less choices for economy accomodations than used to be.

There's no saying what politicians will do, and many are incredibly stupid.

If all the companies that own upmarket property in Pattaya got together and offered City Hall a very large sum of money to close every bar in Pattaya, what do you think would happen??????

You might want to ask yourself why they haven't done so(aside from the fact that many hate each other) in Patters or upscale Phucket(plenty of seedy bars still there). Maybe you should look at the way some prices in those upscale establishments have PLUMMETED because, guess what, no high end customers want them. Check out the relatively new one next to the Jomtien market. Over less than a year, a drop from 17000 to 10000 a month. You may be surprised to find some of those high end real estate agents have hedged their bets and are actually contibuting to new entertainment complexes.

Were all cheap accomadation from Soi Boucow to vanish you may have a case. But as of now, there is no evidence that much is changing beyond the normal seasonal fluctuations.