Road Rage

[uptheos]

but I dont think there's any excuse for him to drive the way he did, nor speak the way he did

and I dont believe people should be shot down for standing up for their rights

Go and buy a lottery ticket, luck is on your side

People shouldn't be shot down for standing up for their rights, but here they often are, right between the eyes!

Edited August 22, 2011 by uptheos

[naboo]

My advice to the OP:

Try harder to stay alive.

[Drew Aitch]

So whose fault is it really?

I think another sad fact here in Thailand is that there are a lot of OAPs riding the roads on those smallish wannabe-chopper style bikes, and going by the way some of them wobble and keep putting their feet down at slow speeds, it's quite obvious that they are not experienced bikers and certainly not riding in harmony with their machine. Not all of course, but there are a lot like this I'm afraid.

What I'm trying to say is that sometimes what seems like an incident or incident caused by others is actually brought about by the inexperienced rider though he/she probably doesn't know it. I've lost count how many times these guys slam on the breaks with over cautions riding, and to be honest I can’t wait to pass them on a busy road.

It's quite normal for people who get into accidents, or near accidents, to blame one another. My sister once said that women drivers are much better than men because they have far fewer collisions on the roads. I replied by saying that although she's correct in her observation, she is missing out one important fact, which is:

Women might have fewer accidents on the roads than men, but if only they took a few moments out to check their rear view mirrors every once in a while, they would see that they leave an awful lot of accidents behind them!

Most of us have 'near misses' on these roads, and if we made issues out of them all, I think we'd eventually go bonkers and resent every trip we took. Best to live and learn and just be the best you can for your own safety and that of your fellow motorists. Angry and upset road users are a danger to us all!

Aitch

Edited August 22, 2011 by Drew Aitch

[ikis]

LJW is very wrong saying that farangs are the worst drivers in thailand. ofcourse not. we've had driving schools, also techniques how to handle a vehicle on different surfaces etc etc. plus the normal behaving in traffic and obeying the rules.

for the locals, there is no driving school, just a video, test, money and card is yours. go out and learn in the traffic.

on the other hand, we as farangs have to adapt to the traffic culture here, which means that you can do almost anything, nobody cares and the locals drive just the way they want, not really caring about others. anything can happen.

if you can adapt to that, you are way better driver than most of the locals. if you don't, you are in danger.

one older thaifriend of mine estimated that probably 30% of thais driving some kind of vehicle here even have a driving license. so better have yours, as it helps a lot when something happens.

i'm quite sure that the big risk group is the female backpackers who have never driven a motorbike before, renting a motorbike first time in thailand.

because for some reason many of those think they can drive a 125cc scooter here in insane traffic, eventhough they haven't driven even a 50cc moped in the country side of their home town.

[qdinthailand]

I was thinking the same thing - that the man was probably a cop also.

But I could not disagree with you more about farangs being the worst drivers. You are totally wrong on that one.

Oh really!

Then you should frequent the motorbike rental places. Shortly they'll be adding new stock for the busy season - go check out the 'new' bikes. Then go back the end of busy season and check out same bikes. They look like sh*t - all scrapped up, banged up, plastic bits broken (and those are the ones still in use).

And check out the riders ... the guys (and a few gals - often passengers) walking around town all bandaged up, arms in slings, etc. You can tell them by signs of 'road rash'. OK, a few are from mtn. biking - but the majority (ask them, I sometimes do - just for yucks) are from bike crashes.

[uptheos]

And check out the riders ... the guys (and a few gals - often passengers) walking around town all bandaged up, arms in slings, etc. You can tell them by signs of 'road rash'. OK, a few are from mtn. biking - but the majority (ask them, I sometimes do - just for yucks) are from bike crashes.

Yeah I agree, these stupid farang's on holiday probably stop at red lights, stop signs etc and get rear ended. Plus they stupidly assume anyone coming from a minor road into a main one will stop or the guy in the right hand lane isn't turning left without signalling.

I'm sure there's many other things the stupid farang's think and do that makes them worse drivers.

[LJW]

LJW is very wrong saying that farangs are the worst drivers in thailand. ofcourse not. we've had driving schools, also techniques how to handle a vehicle on different surfaces etc etc. plus the normal behaving in traffic and obeying the rules.

for the locals, there is no driving school, just a video, test, money and card is yours. go out and learn in the traffic.

on the other hand, we as farangs have to adapt to the traffic culture here, which means that you can do almost anything, nobody cares and the locals drive just the way they want, not really caring about others. anything can happen.

if you can adapt to that, you are way better driver than most of the locals. if you don't, you are in danger.

.

You think I am wrong because you (farang) have had training, and the Thais have not had any training...

Them you go on and say that Thais can drive any way they want, nobody cares....

If you really believe all of that, then you haven't been too observant, imo..

This is an example of a belief that makes you unsafe on the road...

[uptheos]

Do you think adult Thai's (driving age) need training to know that if you put your hand in the fire it will get burned?

Aren't some things just common sense?

[mrclough]

I was thinking the same thing - that the man was probably a cop also.

But I could not disagree with you more about farangs being the worst drivers. You are totally wrong on that one.

Oh really!

Then you should frequent the motorbike rental places. Shortly they'll be adding new stock for the busy season - go check out the 'new' bikes. Then go back the end of busy season and check out same bikes. They look like sh*t - all scrapped up, banged up, plastic bits broken (and those are the ones still in use).

And check out the riders ... the guys (and a few gals - often passengers) walking around town all bandaged up, arms in slings, etc. You can tell them by signs of 'road rash'. OK, a few are from mtn. biking - but the majority (ask them, I sometimes do - just for yucks) are from bike crashes.

Maybe you missed the posts above which explains the reasons for your observations.

[Paagai]

what will change the minds of those that believe they have the right to mow down innocent riders/pedestrians etc

In Thailand, almost nothing. The only Thai's I've ever seen who drive somewhat safely are still waiting for the injuries from the last accident to heal.

[hellodolly]

The man was a cop too. You were very stupid to drive the way you did.

You are very lucky. I think the worst drivers are farangs, and especially on a bike.

Damned right.

At least Thais on a motorbike mostly know their place in the scheme of things. Farangs... not so much.

some interesting replies

but I dont think there's any excuse for him to drive the way he did, nor speak the way he did

and I dont believe people should be shot down for standing up for their rights

What rites the rites to demand the same conditions here as you had back home.

Get a grip on your self. You are in Thailand now.

[rich54321]

FORGET ABOUT IT! your are safe!!!!

Its the norm in Thailand to drive as slow as possible holding up the traffic in the right hand lane, pull out on anyone, use no indicators at all, double park where ever they want, speed down the inside of cars on the road, just pull across the traffic, weave in and out of traffic, ignoring red lights - the list is just toooooooooooo long!

Crikey me they cant even look for a parking spot in the multi story car park at airport plaza - just park in front of all the cars and leave the handbrake off.

ITS NOT SURPRISING when the driving test at the test center consists of a bunch of questions then out to the track at the back and YES an instant pass - no driving on the roads under a test situation.

There is one thing - there is no land of smiles when it comes to driving the devils little red horns appear - however when there is an accident they do seem to keep an awful lot calmer than most, probably because they have to try and sort it all out because the police do not like to get involved.

[qdinthailand]

I was thinking the same thing - that the man was probably a cop also.

But I could not disagree with you more about farangs being the worst drivers. You are totally wrong on that one.

Oh really!

Then you should frequent the motorbike rental places. Shortly they'll be adding new stock for the busy season - go check out the 'new' bikes. Then go back the end of busy season and check out same bikes. They look like sh*t - all scrapped up, banged up, plastic bits broken (and those are the ones still in use).

And check out the riders ... the guys (and a few gals - often passengers) walking around town all bandaged up, arms in slings, etc. You can tell them by signs of 'road rash'. OK, a few are from mtn. biking - but the majority (ask them, I sometimes do - just for yucks) are from bike crashes.

Maybe you missed the posts above which explains the reasons for your observations.

Ummmm, IMO, farangs - especially Europeans, U.S. and Canadian - think that because driving isn't done the way they were trained, per customs and procedures in their country, that drivers elsewhere are bad drivers. Here in S.E. Asia (not just Thailand), also Africa, middle east, South America, Central America - it's more chaotic to Westerners, so the drivers must be worse drivers. Not necessarily so. Its just different - not necessarily wrong (that's your bias coming into play).

Here in Thailand, drivers 'cooperate' way more in their driving than in the 'western' world. The western world is full of road rage - at least the U.S. - because people 'take up other people's space' and all kinds of other stupid reasons for shooting/playing demolition derby/drive like Grand Theft Auto. And they die in roughly the same numbers, have same numbers of accidents all over the world (whereas road conditions - construction, surface conditions, signage, lane markings, traffic signals and other controls - or lack thereof - don't play a role in causing crashes?)

So you're a farang driving in a foreign country. You drive the way locals do - leave your preconceived ideas at home - and get on with it.

BTW - I've spent the majority of the past 5 years traveling by motorbike through the world;

4 months Mexico/Central America

18 months South America

9 months Africa

1 month Turkey/Middle East

6 months Europe

another 6 months in s.e. Asia

the rest in North America

I've seen a lot of driving - good, bad, right, wrong, different. You adapt, or become road kill.

[LJW]

I was thinking the same thing - that the man was probably a cop also.

But I could not disagree with you more about farangs being the worst drivers. You are totally wrong on that one.

Oh really!

Then you should frequent the motorbike rental places. Shortly they'll be adding new stock for the busy season - go check out the 'new' bikes. Then go back the end of busy season and check out same bikes. They look like sh*t - all scrapped up, banged up, plastic bits broken (and those are the ones still in use).

And check out the riders ... the guys (and a few gals - often passengers) walking around town all bandaged up, arms in slings, etc. You can tell them by signs of 'road rash'. OK, a few are from mtn. biking - but the majority (ask them, I sometimes do - just for yucks) are from bike crashes.

Maybe you missed the posts above which explains the reasons for your observations.

Ummmm, IMO, farangs - especially Europeans, U.S. and Canadian - think that because driving isn't done the way they were trained, per customs and procedures in their country, that drivers elsewhere are bad drivers. Here in S.E. Asia (not just Thailand), also Africa, middle east, South America, Central America - it's more chaotic to Westerners, so the drivers must be worse drivers. Not necessarily so. Its just different - not necessarily wrong (that's your bias coming into play).

Here in Thailand, drivers 'cooperate' way more in their driving than in the 'western' world. The western world is full of road rage - at least the U.S. - because people 'take up other people's space' and all kinds of other stupid reasons for shooting/playing demolition derby/drive like Grand Theft Auto. And they die in roughly the same numbers, have same numbers of accidents all over the world (whereas road conditions - construction, surface conditions, signage, lane markings, traffic signals and other controls - or lack thereof - don't play a role in causing crashes?)

So you're a farang driving in a foreign country. You drive the way locals do - leave your preconceived ideas at home - and get on with it.

BTW - I've spent the majority of the past 5 years traveling by motorbike through the world;

4 months Mexico/Central America

18 months South America

9 months Africa

1 month Turkey/Middle East

6 months Europe

another 6 months in s.e. Asia

the rest in North America

I've seen a lot of driving - good, bad, right, wrong, different. You adapt, or become road kill.

Thank you for your wisdom

[funcat]

This is maybe not exactly related to the topic,but...the guy was shot dead at the gas station by the pump attendant for...1.5 Baht !!!...the driver ask for 600 Baht of gas and the guy overfill by 1.5 Baht...so he shot the driver!(there is probably more to this story,but...)

...hope the link work...

http://video.sanook.com/%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%94%E0%B9%87%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%9B%E0%B8%B1%E0%B9%89%E0%B8%A1%E0%B9%82%E0%B8%AB%E0%B8%94%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%9A%E0%B8%95%E0%B8%B1%E0%B8%A7_%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%AB%E0%B8%A2%E0%B8%B7%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%AD%E0%B9%84%E0%B8%A1%E0%B9%88%E0%B9%84%E0%B8%8A%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%95%E0%B8%B3%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%A7%E0%B8%88-440163-player.html

[Tonto21]

The man was a cop too. You were very stupid to drive the way you did.

You are very lucky. I think the worst drivers are farangs, and especially on a bike.

<deleted>............ Are you going on about?

[Fishenough]

Qdinthailand your correct on the wording - learn to cooperate.

Would not say farangs are the worst drivers in Chiang Mai, as from a quick passing on the road is no way to judge their skill. But the percentage of farangs drivers behaving badly is all too common. I have lost my temper twice, in Chiang Mai, at stupid aggressive drivers, and in both cases it was a farang operating the other vehicle.

List of all those too common driving habits you can witness in Thailand;

• If you have to be first in line, and off the line at every intersection, commonly without a helmet,
  you might be a farang.
  
• If you weave side to side randomly showing your enjoyment of being on a motorcycle, not matter where your riding,
  you might be a backpacker/farang.
  
• You ride through parking lots, intersections, and high traffic areas dragging both feet on the ground,
  you might be a farang/backpacker
  
• You shout English profanity at those that dare get in your path of travel, and really show it to those that irritate you in the process by extending your middle finger,
  you might be farang.
  
• You stay in the right lane and drive marginaly faster then left lane traffic on your high powered Phantom or Nouvo,
  You might be a farang.
  
• You successfully drive xxxx distance in Thailand and ever so often proclaim how terible all other drivers on the road are,
  You might be a farang
  
• ?
  

[cmsally]

A few rules for driving in Chiang Mai:

1 Assume everyone is stupid and going to do the unexpected.

2 Those with Lamphun license plates are a law unto themselves and never check to see if anyone else should have right of way.

3 If you're on the highway and someone is right up your butt almost in the bed of your pick up truck, then they're from Bangkok; let them pass they live in a big city and have extra high stress levels.

4 Lunch time and dinner time , all those other drivers have only one thing on their mind - FOOD - they are not interested in you, only in finding the nearest parking place to their favourite restaurant.

[mrclough]

Qdinthailand your correct on the wording - learn to cooperate.

Would not say farangs are the worst drivers in Chiang Mai, as from a quick passing on the road is no way to judge their skill. But the percentage of farangs drivers behaving badly is all too common. I have lost my temper twice, in Chiang Mai, at stupid aggressive drivers, and in both cases it was a farang operating the other vehicle.

List of all those too common driving habits you can witness in Thailand;

• If you have to be first in line, and off the line at every intersection, commonly without a helmet,
  you might be a farang.
• If you weave side to side randomly showing your enjoyment of being on a motorcycle, not matter where your riding,
  you might be a backpacker/farang.
• You ride through parking lots, intersections, and high traffic areas dragging both feet on the ground,
  you might be a farang/backpacker
• You shout English profanity at those that dare get in your path of travel, and really show it to those that irritate you in the process by extending your middle finger,
  you might be farang.
• You stay in the right lane and drive marginaly faster then left lane traffic on your high powered Phantom or Nouvo,
  You might be a farang.
• You successfully drive xxxx distance in Thailand and ever so often proclaim how terible all other drivers on the road are,
  You might be a farang
• ?

So, does this amount to "same same but different"? lol

[mallmagician]

I can only say my experience here vs the UK. You have to adapt here to their style of driving. Sure. Does that mean that their style is right? No way.

The unofficial road rules here are just plain dangerous. I don't care what anyone says, but Thai drivers vs English drivers... English are much much better. And I have driven here an equal amount of time as the UK.

Will we ever change the dangerous parts of their driving style, probably not. But education is the key, and I don't mean the one finger salute and expletives and red faces.....

Education for the Thai learner drivers, and education for the visitors to Thailand about what to be careful of on the roads here.

I love Thailand, and sure I haven't been here as long as some other posters, but the idea that farang are worse drivers is just wrong wrong. We are better trained, and better drivers on the whole. Admittedly, we have to adapt to survive, but JUST BECAUSE THE THAIS CAN SURVIVE THE DRIVING CONDITIONS HERE BETTER THAN FARANG DOESN'T MAKE THEM BETTER DRIVERS....JUST MORE EXPERIENCED IN BAD DRIVING.....

[mallmagician]

I could put it another way...

I've had 1 accident in the UK, I was reversed into.

Same amount of time driving here, I've had countless near misses, and a couple of prangs.

Is my driving skill to blame? I don't think so. I believe my better training has enabled me to avoid the inevitable in all those near misses.

My biggest fault, is my hot head when someone wrongs me, but I'm getting better at coping with that, as I know I will come unstuck one day.....

[cloudhopper]

Even after 10 years driving here I still have the irresistible urge to dispense the bird on occasion but I'm slowly getting better.

One of these would at least make doing that difficult - http://www.flixxy.com/top-gear-marauder-test-drive.htm

Maybe when they tell me I have only 30 days to live I'll buy one and have a night on the town.

[LJW]

JUST BECAUSE THE THAIS CAN SURVIVE THE DRIVING CONDITIONS HERE BETTER THAN FARANG DOESN'T MAKE THEM BETTER DRIVERS....JUST MORE EXPERIENCED IN BAD DRIVING.....

Yes, but with one exception... More experienced with bad driving

In implies all Thai drivers are bad, with implies experience with bad drivers.

[Fishenough]

• If you think every other driver, but you, on the road is stupid and incompetent,
  you might be a farang,
  or a ThaiVisa poster
  

[Raindancer]

• If you think every other driver, but you, on the road is stupid and incompetent,
  you might be a farang,
  or a ThaiVisa poster

Edited August 23, 2011 by Raindancer

[Berkshire]

• If you weave side to side randomly showing your enjoyment of being on a motorcycle, not matter where your riding,
  you might be a backpacker/farang.
• You shout English profanity at those that dare get in your path of travel, and really show it to those that irritate you in the process by extending your middle finger,
  you might be farang.
• You stay in the right lane and drive marginaly faster then left lane traffic on your high powered Phantom or Nouvo,
  You might be a farang.
• You successfully drive xxxx distance in Thailand and ever so often proclaim how terible all other drivers on the road are,
  You might be a farang

Funny...and some valid points.

[Tokay]

Let it go. You are on a bike, he is in a truck. Bigger car gets the right of way. Deal with it and be lucky you didn't have an accident.

[keo]

Here in Thailand, drivers 'cooperate' way more in their driving than in the 'western' world.

I disagree. I find drivers in Thailand to be much more selfish and inconsiderate than drivers in the UK. How often do drivers in Thailand give way and let you out when things are busy? e.g. coming off a Nimman Soi onto the main street. Hardly ever in my experience. In fact what I see is cars going around a car that is half way out already (turning right). They go out of their way NOT to give way. How often do you see Thai drivers causing gridlock by sitting in the middle of intersections, so when the traffic lights change nobody can go anywhere? I've seen it countless times when driving at the weekend. I don't mind people jumping red lights, but when my light goes green and they are still pushing through one after another, it just takes the piss. Or when was the last time a Thai gave you a friendly acknowledgement when you gave way to them in a narrow Soi? And does anyone really know who has right of way on a roundabout? The person with the heaviest foot and the strongest nerve?

IMHO all these things are in contrast to my years of experience of driving in Scotland. Don't get me wrong, the UK is not some kind of driving utopia, but I'd say people drive a lot more considerately there. Not that driving in Thailand gets my back up that much, I'm certainly not about to confront someone for cutting me off, or consider reporting them to the police. But if you ask me Thai drivers aren't so much cooperating with each other, but simply ignoring each other.

[thaimiller]

Let it go. You are on a bike, he is in a truck. Bigger car gets the right of way. Deal with it and be lucky you didn't have an accident.

:thumbsup:

[LJW]

I am so happy that I still enjoy driving in Thailand after so many years. And I think most Thai (car) drivers do fine with their driving. I have never seen a serious accident, nor have I ever had an accident with someone. I think it is largly a feeling of being relaxed, unlike many Thai and Farang drivers, that keeps me cool and operating well while driving.