Hundreds injured as Egyptian protesters attack Israeli embassy

[Credo]

Zydeco you better review the benefits given to refugees in the US. They hardly get a free ride. For that, they need to head to Europe.

Second, these people may leave, but I very much doubt without a secure government in place, they will be considered political refugees.

[Steely Dan]

Could get interesting if the Turks call on their NATO allies to come to their aid, if Isreal (technically) attacks them. My guess is the French and British would want to whack the Jews if they could, but that the US will stay put. And if the French and British do aid the Turks, it might be meaningless since they used up all their ammo on Libya. Somehow the Germans and the Chinese will make a profit off the entire situation.

The Turks can call, but no one will likely respond. There isn't one Nato country sympathetic to Turkey. Add to that the fact that ethnic hatreds bubble just over the borders in Romania, Greece and Bulgaria and many arab countries remember the opressive Ottoman colonial rule that was in large part responsible for the screwed up borders in the region. In the meantime, Egypt is self destructing and the tens of millions of people that tried to make the palce better are looking for a way out. Guess where they will be going? Hello Europe. Welcome your new refugees.

Kid, I hope you are right, but you seem to have a lot more faith in Obama than I do. Erdogan is now going after Israeli oil/gas exploration which would guarantee a military response. Erdogan would not do this if he thought he couldn't count on U.S support.

http://www.debka.com/article/21282/

[Ulysses G.]

An Islamic leader using the "Palestinians" as pawns in order to promote a completely different agenda that has nothing to do with them - what a surprise!

Turkish Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan this week coolly moved his country step by provocative step towards an armed clash with Israel – not just over the Palestinian issue, but because he covets the gas and oil resources of the eastern Mediterranean opposite Israel's shores

[Ulysses G.]

but they do exist and they exist because of a UN mandate.

My question to those who are anti-Israel is just where will these people go?

I do not know of folks that are anti-Israel to the point of expecting them to migrate elsewhere.

That explains your stance on the matter. Perhaps you need to read the posts on this forum more carefully. The hateful posters snickering about war with Turkey and Egypt want them pushed into the sea just like Hammas and are not exactly making a secret of it.

Edited September 12, 2011 by Ulysses G.

[Pakboong]

You do realize that the money is controlled by Congress right?

Yes I do & I also realize who controls the members....hint ...It is not We The People

One-third of ALL US AID goes to Israel and Egypt.

These 2 countries receive one-third of the total aid, the majority of which

pays for armaments. Yet, neither is a "developing" country.

Learned something interesting on foreign aid today. In 1970, 22 wealthier UN countries agreed to annually give 7% of GNP to developing nations. The US, while usually giving the highest total dollar amount, has never met the 7% of GNP standard and has never out contributed the other countries in terms of meeting the 7% standard. Historically, Japan has headed the list of the real givers in terms of real dollars.

http://www.globalissues.org/article/35/foreign-aid-development-assistance#RichNationsAgreedatUNto07ofGNPToAid

[chuckd]

You do realize that the money is controlled by Congress right?

Yes I do & I also realize who controls the members....hint ...It is not We The People

One-third of ALL US AID goes to Israel and Egypt.

These 2 countries receive one-third of the total aid, the majority of which

pays for armaments. Yet, neither is a "developing" country.

Learned something interesting on foreign aid today. In 1970, 22 wealthier UN countries agreed to annually give 7% of GNP to developing nations. The US, while usually giving the highest total dollar amount, has never met the 7% of GNP standard and has never out contributed the other countries in terms of meeting the 7% standard. Historically, Japan has headed the list of the real givers in terms of real dollars.

http://www.globalissues.org/article/35/foreign-aid-development-assistance#RichNationsAgreedatUNto07ofGNPToAid

Yet the US still gives some 23% of the annual budget, while the remaining 191 nations give 77%.

The US has ALWAYS given the highest dollar amount, not 'usually'.

[Steely Dan]

An Islamic leader using the "Palestinians" as pawns in order to promote a completely different agenda that has nothing to do with them - what a surprise!

Turkish Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan this week coolly moved his country step by provocative step towards an armed clash with Israel – not just over the Palestinian issue, but because he covets the gas and oil resources of the eastern Mediterranean opposite Israel's shores

Yes fancy that the Palestinians are stooges to a planned Turkish theft and the 'useful idiots' find themselves stooges twice removed. The Egyptians are also being played here as I'm sure Erdogan would prefer that Egypt do their fighting by proxy leaving Israel too busy elsewhere to defend it's gas exploration interests.

[chuckd]

An Islamic leader using the "Palestinians" as pawns in order to promote a completely different agenda that has nothing to do with them - what a surprise!

Turkish Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan this week coolly moved his country step by provocative step towards an armed clash with Israel – not just over the Palestinian issue, but because he covets the gas and oil resources of the eastern Mediterranean opposite Israel's shores

Yes fancy that the Palestinians are stooges to a planned Turkish theft and the 'useful idiots' find themselves stooges twice removed. The Egyptians are also being played here as I'm sure Erdogan would prefer that Egypt do their fighting by proxy leaving Israel too busy elsewhere to defend it's gas exploration interests.

And where is the White House in all this? Their silence is deafening.

[Ulysses G.]

They just announced that they are going to base drones in Turkey. Maybe Barrack Hussien Obama really does think that he can get away with throwing Israel under the bus.

Edited September 12, 2011 by Ulysses G.

[Steely Dan]

And where is the White House in all this? Their silence is deafening.

Yes isn't it just.

Turkey continues its belligerence with more sanctions, threats, and bluster.

The Islamonazi, Tayyip Erdogan, has officially joined the ranks of every other cranky despot that has ever arisen to power in the Islamic world.

If the U.S. had a real leader, this steaming turd would be better behaved. But he knows that he is living in a time with no world leadership, and so knows he can get away with any mischief he chooses to make.

http://quitenormal.wordpress.com/2011/09/06/turkeys-erdogan-escalates-suspends-trade-defense-military-relations-with-israel-and-threatens-to-attack-cyprus/

[JemJem]

And where is the White House in all this? Their silence is deafening.

Yes isn't it just.

Turkey continues its belligerence with more sanctions, threats, and bluster.

The Islamonazi, Tayyip Erdogan, has officially joined the ranks of every other cranky despot that has ever arisen to power in the Islamic world.

If the U.S. had a real leader, this steaming turd would be better behaved. But he knows that he is living in a time with no world leadership, and so knows he can get away with any mischief he chooses to make.

http://quitenormal.wordpress.com/2011/09/06/turkeys-erdogan-escalates-suspends-trade-defense-military-relations-with-israel-and-threatens-to-attack-cyprus/

I doubt very much that Turkey will or can attack Cyprus.

Erdogan should first lead an official apology for the crimes against humanity committed in Anatolia in the past. I will say the same thing for Israel (ie. crimes against humanity against Palestinians).

As I said before, I am a fan of neither of the 2 regimes...they have a lot of things to apologise for and even compensate for.

Jem

[Credo]

I am sure the White House has a lot to say, but since much of what is going on requires diplomacy, it's not going to said publicly.

[Scott]

I strongly suggest you chose your words carefully when referring to any group of people, if you want your post to remain. 'Useful idiots' and other terms aimed at any group of people are considered racist and unnecessarily derogatory.

Some posters' anger is understandable, but take care in your wording.

[chuckd]

I am sure the White House has a lot to say, but since much of what is going on requires diplomacy, it's not going to said publicly.

The following article from the Telegraph seems rather public.

One thing I have found after working with the Saudi and Iranian militaries for some 30 years is their governments have no respect for weakness. The rule applies to virtually all Arab/Islamic countries I dealt with and is not exclusive to only one or two. When Obama approached the Arab nations with his kumbaya approach, apologizing for the US and, particularly, when he bowed to the King of Saudi Arabia, the entire Arab world stood up and took notice. Their world is one of domination and they saw Obama as somebody that can be dominated. In short, he does not have their respect or, even more importantly, their fear.

______________________________________________________

Egypt's military rulers ignored pleas from US as mob attacked Israeli embassy

By Adrian Blomfield, Jerusalem 11:34PM BST 11 Sep 2011473

With six Israeli security guards fending off an angry mob rampaging through the mission, Leon Panetta, the US defence secretary, tried for two hours to get hold of Field Marshal Hussein Tantawi, Egypt's de facto head of state, to demand an immediate rescue operation.

Aides told Mr Panetta that the general could not be found, Israeli officials were quoted as saying. The response prompted fury in Washington, and threats of US retribution. Field Marshal Tantawi's mysterious disappearance intensified speculation that Egypt's generals had deliberately failed to protect the embassy for political gain.

The armed forces, which are running Egypt until a civilian government is elected at the end of the year, are thought to be desperate to retain the political influence and financial privileges they enjoyed under President Hosni Mubarak, who was toppled by protests in February.

Article here: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/egypt/8756111/Egypts-military-rulers-ignored-pleas-from-US-as-mob-attacked-Israeli-embassy.html

[koheesti]

War is coming and I suspect the U.N vote on the Palestinian state is the starting pistol.

Could be but the reason may or may not be due to the UN voting Pro Palestine.

But the rejection of its validity by the US & Israel.

If there is a war, it will because the Arab countries want to try their hand at destroying the only non-Islamic country in the region yet again. The "Palestinians" are just an excuse.

Assuming there is war and Israel loses, and all Jews are killed or chased out of the region - what happen next? Will the Middle East be all moonbeams and unicorns? No more hate, just peace and love? Or will they set their sights on someone else?

[Scott]

One post questioning moderation has been removed and several off-topic posts.

Please stay on the topic please.

[koheesti]

You do realize that the money is controlled by Congress right?

Yes I do & I also realize who controls the members....hint ...It is not We The People

One-third of ALL US AID goes to Israel and Egypt.

These 2 countries receive one-third of the total aid, the majority of which

pays for armaments. Yet, neither is a "developing" country.

Learned something interesting on foreign aid today. In 1970, 22 wealthier UN countries agreed to annually give 7% of GNP to developing nations. The US, while usually giving the highest total dollar amount, has never met the 7% of GNP standard and has never out contributed the other countries in terms of meeting the 7% standard. Historically, Japan has headed the list of the real givers in terms of real dollars.

http://www.globaliss...Nto07ofGNPToAid

Yet the US still gives some 23% of the annual budget, while the remaining 191 nations give 77%.

The US has ALWAYS given the highest dollar amount, not 'usually'.

Highest dollar amount is the only thing that really matters to recipients, not what percentage it makes up of how much the giver has.

[Steely Dan]

Assuming there is war and Israel loses, and all Jews are killed or chased out of the region - what happen next? Will the Middle East be all moonbeams and unicorns? No more hate, just peace and love? Or will they set their sights on someone else?

The first and second jihads would suggest they would not stop at Israel, unless Israel is also the root cause of all the violence Europe unlike Israel would most likely go down without a fight though.

Edited September 12, 2011 by Steely Dan

[Wallaby]

______________________________________________________

Egypt's military rulers ignored pleas from US as mob attacked Israeli embassy

By Adrian Blomfield, Jerusalem 11:34PM BST 11 Sep 2011473

With six Israeli security guards fending off an angry mob rampaging through the mission, Leon Panetta, the US defence secretary, tried for two hours to get hold of Field Marshal Hussein Tantawi, Egypt's de facto head of state, to demand an immediate rescue operation.

Aides told Mr Panetta that the general could not be found, Israeli officials were quoted as saying. The response prompted fury in Washington, and threats of US retribution. Field Marshal Tantawi's mysterious disappearance intensified speculation that Egypt's generals had deliberately failed to protect the embassy for political gain.

The armed forces, which are running Egypt until a civilian government is elected at the end of the year, are thought to be desperate to retain the political influence and financial privileges they enjoyed under President Hosni Mubarak, who was toppled by protests in February.

Article here: http://www.telegraph...li-embassy.html

This article paints it a bit different

When the Egyptian commando leader estimated his men were in sufficient strength, they seized the rioters in the stairwell. Contact was made with the trapped Israeli guards, who were outfitted with Arab headwear and cloaks, and taken down to armoured vehicles parked at the entrance. They were whisked away to Cairo airport, where they boarded an Israeli air force plane along with ambassador Yitzhak Levanon and about 80 other Israelis, including the families of diplomats, and flown to Israel.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/israel-eases-tensions-over-embassy-assault/story-fn7ycml4-1226134276284

[Credo]

Gee, so the silence wasn't so deafening.

[Steely Dan]

The following article from the Telegraph seems rather public.

Article here: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/egypt/8756111/Egypts-military-rulers-ignored-pleas-from-US-as-mob-attacked-Israeli-embassy.html

Officials in Israel, as well as a number of political activists in Cairo, have claimed that Field Marshal Tantawi turned down an opportunity to rein in the violence at the embassy in order to prove that, without a strong army, Egypt would descend into violence and anarchy.

As I observed before if BHO has any sense he will realize that Egypt is not ready for democracy so give tacit support to a new strongman to put the Islamists back in the box.

[Credo]

The rhetoric will be democratic reforms blah,blah,blah, but the support will go to anything and anyone that makes it a reasonably stable ally, or at least non-enemy. It's not going to be dissimilar to the coup in Thailand and the military take over. There were some sanctions, but mostly this was for show.

In a country like Egypt an unstable government is particularly dangerous. There are some bad folks living there and I am sure both Pakistan and Afghanistan have a large number who might want a holiday along the Mediterranean.

[chuckd]

Gee, so the silence wasn't so deafening.

Two entirely different versions of the same story. The Telegraph says the Egyptians would not talk to Panetta. The Australian version is the Israelis could not get through but Obama called and made connection with the Egyptian military.

Like all media, you believe the one you want.

I guess we will have to wait for the unexpurgated version of the story from Wikileaks.

My opinion is the silence is still deafening on Egypt and Syria both.

[Wallaby]

Gee, so the silence wasn't so deafening.

Two entirely different versions of the same story. The Telegraph says the Egyptians would not talk to Panetta. The Australian version is the Israelis could not get through but Obama called and made connection with the Egyptian military.

Like all media, you believe the one you want.

I guess we will have to wait for the unexpurgated version of the story from Wikileaks.

My opinion is the silence is still deafening on Egypt and Syria both.

I wouldn't go putting a hell of a lot of trust on our media anyway. We take all their reports with a grain of salt. It depends who owns the paper as to what is reported.