Time Off From Teaching

[ivan96822]

What are the teacher breaks like? For example, is there a fall break, winter break, spring break? How long for each?

Also, how long is summer break? Do teachers get paid year-round, as I do now, getting paid every fifteen days?

Can/Do teachers get tenured after a certain probationary period? How long does this take?

Please respond.Thank you.

[Towzak]

Briefly, leaving aside universities, there are two semesters in the Thai education calendar. These semesters run roughly from the middle of May until the end of September. Teaching commences again in November and runs through until the end of February/March. However, there will be a lot of leeway and it really does depend on the type of school and what contract you have signed. Thai teachers are usually back in school well before the students are and they will still be there once the students have gone. As an example, teachers are still in my school now and will be until the end of the week. The students finished two weeks ago and last week was 'English Camp' so a number of students returned for that. I think at best 7 -10 days break and its back through the gates again. A very brief respite around Xmas time and unless you work for a Catholic Missionary School you'll be stuffing foam up your jacket and playing Santa on Xmas day as well. Some schools may even organise events at the end of the second semester so don't read too deeply into the beginnings and endings of semesters. In government schools they may say its ok for you to stay away once your work is done but you will still be required to get up and sign in everyday until the Thai teachers have finished.

I can't speak for all government schools, I only ever worked in one and that was enough. But, at the end of the second semester you will not be paid for about three months unless you have something written into your contract. Again, probationary periods are up to the discretion of the school and its 'culture' and that goes along with all the other mind bending regulations they write (copy and paste) into your contract. Your position is never really safe and they can and will get rid of you as and when they feel like it regardless of what is written on the contract.

Keep smiling

[Scott]

Lots of variation in holidays. Where I work the teachers get 1 week off in October (foreign teachers slightly more--3 days). There is a summer school and we have to teach every other year. We do get paid year around. About a week off at Christmas, depending on the dates (24th to Jan. 2). About two weeks between the end of the summer session and the start of the new academic year.

[ivan96822]

How long is the work day? What time do you have to get there in the morning? How late do you stay in the afternoon?

Is there a prep period (with no kids, to do lesson planning, making copies, etc.)? How many periods and/or students do you have a day? How many hours per week?

Please advise.

[Scott]

There is variations. I work with a number of schools and some must be there at 7:00 - 4:00; one is 7:30 - 4:00. The teaching load is about 20 hours of teaching--sometimes a period isn't a full hour, between 45-60 minutes. Other times is for preparation. There is also some extras: morning duty, sport's day, etc.

There is a lot of variation from school to school.

[otherstuff1957]

As others have said - there is a lot of variation from school to school. Personally I've worked at schools where I had just 2 weeks off after the 2nd term and the usual public holidays. Some other teachers at that school got 2 months off after the 2nd term... but without pay. At the other extreme, at another school I had 3 weeks off in October, 2 weeks at New Year/Christmas, and 2 weeks + Songran after the 2nd term.

This year I have 2 weeks off in October, 1 & 1/2 weeks at NYs, and 2 weeks + Songran next summer.

[ivan96822]

Thanks for the speedy replies. Scott, if you say you teach approximately twenty hours a week, surely that does not mean you have another twenty hours for prep? (Are you at the school forty hours a week)?

That sounds like a lot of free time, considering that where I work now, I only need about three hours a week or prep time.

Also, are you free to teach what you want, when you want to, how you want to?

For example, right now I am teaching literature at a high school. I can teach Hamlet in the beginning of the school year, wait till spring time, or even finish the year off with it. I enjoy this autonomy. Is it the same way in Thailand, or is there a prescibed curriculum that must get delivered during a certain time period? Please advise. The lower-income schools in Hawaii where I work have a prescribed curriculum, and it is far from ideal.

Thanks again for the responses from the folks in this forum. Please continue to answer my questions...

[tonititan]

The lower-income schools in Hawaii where I work have a prescribed curriculum, and it is far from ideal.

Well, this changes things a bit. I assume that you are a certified teacher in Hawaii? If so, you could also consider jobs at international schools. For most of them, the calendar would be similar to the American calendar you're used to - June/July off for summer, plus a Christmas break, spring break, fall break, and other various holidays throughout the year.

[ivan96822]

Tonititan,

Yes, qualified in Hawaii with experience here in the States. I appreciate your candor. What type of salary THB/month could I expect at an international school?

Provide your insight, friend...

[Scott]

Most bilingual schools follow the Thai Ministry of Education curriculum, so it is set, with some variation depending on subject. For example, if you teach English, you will have a book and you will be expected to finish the book. You are free to supplement the book with worksheets, stories and other things that are of interest. The conversational English taught by many foreigners is not covered by the MOE.

Mathematics follows the Thai curriculum, rather closely. Science, until they reach the high school level does as well. Social studies is varied--Foreign teachers don't usually teach Buddhism or Thai history (or Thai Mythology as I like to call it). Our teachers generally teach something else in these units.

The 20 hours is pretty much the minimum number of hours (again some differences). The amount of time needed for planning depends on the number of classes, grade levels, etc. Our health education teacher teaches from G. 1 to G. 7--that is a lot of prep work--lesson plans and exams.

In Thailand, keeping the notebooks checked regularly and well checked is very important.

Around exam time, most teachers end up taking a lot of work home.

[Ijustwannateach]

OP, you seem to be asking for information about EVERY aspect of teaching in Thailand, Thai schools, and education.

May I suggest that you start at the top of the subforum list of topics- especially the topic on guidelines *and suggested threads for reading*. Many of those threads are a bit dated but will get you started. Then read all of the pinned threads, and read the most recent of the subforum threads, perhaps 2-3 pages of them.

When you've done that, I guarantee you'll have a lot more info (and also a lot of questions, but more informed questions).

There are a couple of general questions that can and should be answered here:

You should be aware that Thailand has an incredibly complex, truly byzantine educational system which is 'administered' by a distant bureaucracy (in the public sphere, anyway). By reading a multitude of threads here as suggested above, you will get an overview of the variety. Individual school directors (principals) who are promoted from the ranks of ordinary teachers through another complex, byzantine system have the bulk of the authority over each school for a fixed period of time. They have almost limitless power over the school calendar and other policies. Private schools range from the 'real' ones listed internationally (that you should probably be applying for, including ISB, NIST, Bangkok Pattana and a few others- these are a very different world from the schools and systems mostly being described in this subforum).

The schedule is loosely arranged around two major breaks, one in March-May (Thai New Year), the other in October (flood season) (teachers may have varying amounts of these breaks as time off). The exact dates are different at every school (see above regarding directors) and probably different every year. You should also be aware that because of an ASEAN initiative, the public system may be switching to an ASEAN standard system which synchronises school calendars here with the ones more common in English speaking countries (a long break in the 'summer', May-July, shorter one in the 'winter', December-January. This bodes ill for Thailand culturally, however, and I imagine we will see more public protest over this as it becomes more clearly on the table.

There is a curriculum, which is not one of the standard English country curriculums. It is quite challenging in theory, but in practice I find most Thai teachers don't manage to fit it in- often because of unrealistic planning, partly because of unprepared students, and sadly, partly because of unprepared or incompetent teachers. The English curriculum is not generally one which focuses on literature; it is more about 'memorized vocabulary and grammar' and might kindly be described as suboptimal at most schools, though there are some very dedicated and talented Thai teachers who count as exceptions.

I'm not sure how you manage to count only 3 hours as 'prep time', given what I am aware of as standard practice in most of the US in terms of class management, parent communication, student disciplinary issues, teacher meetings of all kinds, and marking of papers, etc. As a real subject teacher here, you would have many duties too. If you just want to be an EFL teacher, it is possible to come up with the week's lessons in a relatively short time and then just crank them out, but the salary is usually lower, too.

Basically, you're wasting your current qualifications if you do anything less than shoot for the 'real' internationals- which are all private schools, it should be noted- where you'll probably start out at 130K+ and excellent benefits- but they do take their pound of flesh and you will feel like you're working most of the day, most days.

[Scott]

That is probably the best overall summary of teaching in Thailand I've read. A very accurate assessment.

[ivan96822]

Teach,

Thanks for the response. One more question to ask: 130K? Thai baht? US? Weekly? Monthly? Yearly?

Please explain that. I have already been perusing the other forums and had hoped to get some quick, no-nonsense answers from those in the know...I've gotten great responses from great people already.

Please clear up the "130K" thing for me... (Others, i.e., Scott, or anyone else, feel free to explain this to me should Teach not decide to).

Thanks again.

[marty147]

Thanks for the speedy replies. Scott, if you say you teach approximately twenty hours a week, surely that does not mean you have another twenty hours for prep? (Are you at the school forty hours a week)?

That sounds like a lot of free time, considering that where I work now, I only need about three hours a week or prep time.

I would question the quality of your lessons if you can prepare for 15 hours of teaching in 3 hours!

The general rule of thumb is that each hour of teaching requires at least the same amount of time for planning. However, If you are teaching the same 1-hour topic to 15 different classes then 3 hours prep time would be adequate.

The more time and effort that is spent on planning and prep, the easier the actual teaching will be.

The GOOD teachers that I know will easily spend 40 hours at school plus evening and weekend work.

I also know some very BAD teachers that do very little preparation and this is reflected in the quality of their lessons.

When do you mark your students' books and what about attendance documents and other admin duties?

Personally, my duties don't finish the moment that I walk out of the classroom. I am still available throughout the day for students to ask questions and I actively encourage them to do so.

I would love a job that requires teachers to be on school premises for only 15 hours and the rest of the week is free time.

However, I prefer my school where quality of teaching takes priority over free time and where I know that the students are receiving engaging and fulfilling lessons with dedicated teachers.

[ivan96822]

Thanks for the speedy replies. Scott, if you say you teach approximately twenty hours a week, surely that does not mean you have another twenty hours for prep? (Are you at the school forty hours a week)?

That sounds like a lot of free time, considering that where I work now, I only need about three hours a week or prep time.

I would question the quality of your lessons if you can prepare for 15 hours of teaching in 3 hours!

The general rule of thumb is that each hour of teaching requires at least the same amount of time for planning. However, If you are teaching the same 1-hour topic to 15 different classes then 3 hours prep time would be adequate.

The more time and effort that is spent on planning and prep, the easier the actual teaching will be.

The GOOD teachers that I know will easily spend 40 hours at school plus evening and weekend work.

I also know some very BAD teachers that do very little preparation and this is reflected in the quality of their lessons.

When do you mark your students' books and what about attendance documents and other admin duties?

Personally, my duties don't finish the moment that I walk out of the classroom. I am still available throughout the day for students to ask questions and I actively encourage them to do so.

I would love a job that requires teachers to be on school premises for only 15 hours and the rest of the week is free time.

However, I prefer my school where quality of teaching takes priority over free time and where I know that the students are receiving engaging and fulfilling lessons with dedicated teachers.

You can question the quality of my teaching all you want. You don't know me. I have always been one of the most popular English teachers at the schools I have worked at, and I make lessons that are meaningful and constructive to the lives of my students.

For your information, in Hawaii, I am responsible for teaching 11th graders (four periods) and 12th graders (two periods). I only see each group every other day, so I only have 3 hours and 30 minutes with each class per week. On my days with Juniors, I teach the same lesson four times in a row (per day); on my days with Seniors, I teach the same lesson two times in a row (per day). Thus, three hours per week is more than sufficient time for planning, especially since I know what I am doing. There are plenty of senior and new teachers at my school who "wing it," constantly showing movies or making students do rote lessons such as copying vocabulary words out of a dictionary for thirty minutes at a time. That is a joke.

I agree with you that the more planning you do, the more easier this profession is. That is why I have all my lesson plans saved and can use them again in the future.

As for taking work home and correcting papers on weekends, that is for individuals with no lives. I get to work at 6:30 in the morning, work till about 2:40, and hang out until about 4:00. Teachers who bring loads of work home to do at dinner time or on weekends are amateurs. I also spend every lunch period in my classroom tutoring my English language learners (should they need the help).

As for administrative duties and other issues (such as marking books, attendance, etc.) it is called multi-tasking. Do you really need to clear your schedule on a Wednesday afternoon to call a parent about disciplinary issues? If a student acts up in my class (excessively, mind you), I stop the lesson and get his parent on the speaker phone in front of the entire classroom, then have the student explain to his mommy or daddy why he is acting like a fourth grader in a high school setting. If they are "tricky" or I don't get someone on the phone, they go to the counselor. I am not a babysitter. That is somebody else's job.

I appreciate your speedy response, but unless you know somebody don't think you can make all sorts of generalizations about their quality of teaching. Reading your post, I could assume that you are working for some Isaan school teaching them silly little lessons about the "difficulties" of homonyms. But I don't assume, as assumptions are the mother of all mess-ups.

Thank you for your time, and if somebody could clarify the "130K" issue I mentioned earlier, I would really appreciate it.

[Scott]

A lot of variables to consider. One constant here, however, is that this sub-forum is for and about teaching in Thailand, so I think we can dispense with arguments.

Thai schools put a significant amount of 'nonsense' that might not be found in most western schools.

[ivan96822]

A lot of variables to consider. One constant here, however, is that this sub-forum is for and about teaching in Thailand, so I think we can dispense with arguments.

Thai schools put a significant amount of 'nonsense' that might not be found in most western schools.

Any clarification available about the "130K," Scott? Please advise. Thanks.

[HeavyDrinker]

you'll be stuffing foam up your jacket and playing Santa on Xmas day as well.

Never mind the 130K, could someone clarify this?

My wife once made me dress up as Santa for some charity thing and it was Hell on Earth but I only had 20 kids attacking me.

Do you really have to do stuff like this in school?

[Scott]

I am assuming the 130K is monthly.

[ivan96822]

I am assuming the 130K is monthly.

My math skills are terrible. 130K/4 = 32500 Baht...

Divided by $US/30, 32500Baht = $1083US per month.

Is this the final figure that all parties can agree upon? Goodness sakes, I've been trying to chip away at this math figure for the last twelve hours.

Hopefully a friendly associate can confirm these figures and include the currency (i.e., Baht, US, Euro)? Personally, only interested in Baht or US.

Please help out, friends. Thanks again for your time.

[Scott]

I believe it's around US $4,000 a month.

[Ijustwannateach]

Um, I meant monthly, so that's roughly USD $4000 +/- depending on exchange rates. (per month).

I would imagine it is also negotiable depending on your experience and performance and its relevance to the school's individual needs. These are NOT easy jobs, I repeat. I would be very surprised if you could manage to get away with 3 prep hours there given the paperwork required. You'd probably also be required to run some of the school activities. Far from being the same as a public school job in the states, I would suppose that the workload is actually higher.

But the cost of living is much less.

Anyway, good luck with it! And thanks for the glowing endorsement of my dark description, Scott...

[Ijustwannateach]

Jinx!

[ivan96822]

Um, I meant monthly, so that's roughly USD $4000 +/- depending on exchange rates. (per month).

I would imagine it is also negotiable depending on your experience and performance and its relevance to the school's individual needs. These are NOT easy jobs, I repeat. I would be very surprised if you could manage to get away with 3 prep hours there given the paperwork required. You'd probably also be required to run some of the school activities. Far from being the same as a public school job in the states, I would suppose that the workload is actually higher.

But the cost of living is much less.

Anyway, good luck with it! And thanks for the glowing endorsement of my dark description, Scott...

Okay, more questions regarding this topic of salary. How much (typically) is taken out of paychecks after taxes? I mean, $4000/US a month (even in the States) is a small fortune. Surely the international schools do not pay approximately $4000/US a month? How much can a teacher realistically expect to walk away from? Please let me know.

As it stands here in the States, I literally get about 50% of what I actually get paid after taxes. Please let me know. In conversation with a colleague who taught in South-East Asia (not Thailand), he said that "there are no taxes." Difficult to believe. Is this true? Please provide some generous insight.

Thanks.

[Scott]

There are taxes here. I don't know the amount, however.

[tonititan]

I work at an international school, and I pay about 20% in taxes. I believe it depends on your salary - I was in a lower tax bracket when I started here, and I think I only paid 10-15% at the time. I have heard of some international schools in BKK who pay tax for teachers, but I don't know if that is true.

[ivan96822]

I work at an international school, and I pay about 20% in taxes. I believe it depends on your salary - I was in a lower tax bracket when I started here, and I think I only paid 10-15% at the time. I have heard of some international schools in BKK who pay tax for teachers, but I don't know if that is true.

Toni,

At the international school, how many hours a week do you work? How many students do you have? What are your daily hours (typically)? Any prep period? Summer/fall/winter/spring breaks? Please respond.

More important: Do you enjoy your work?

Again, looking forward to your response.

[SlyAnimal]

Did a quick search on Tax in Thailand:

0 - 150,000 Exempt

150,001 - 500,000 10%

500,001 - 1,000,000 20%

1,000,001 - 4,000,000 30%

4,000,001 and over 37%

Also there's a huge amount of stuff which you can write off e.g. if you have a wife / kids etc then you get some tax deductions.

Compared to whatever you're paying in the states, tax in Thailand will seem non existent

So your 130,000 Bhat a month is pretty considerable. Significantly more than your standard "Conversation English" teacher :-P

Edited October 27, 2011 by SlyAnimal

[ivan96822]

Did a quick search on Tax in Thailand:

0 - 150,000 Exempt

150,001 - 500,000 10%

500,001 - 1,000,000 20%

1,000,001 - 4,000,000 30%

4,000,001 and over 37%

Also there's a huge amount of stuff which you can write off e.g. if you have a wife / kids etc then you get some tax deductions.

Compared to whatever you're paying in the states, tax in Thailand will seem non existent

So your 130,000 Bhat a month is pretty considerable. Significantly more than your standard "Conversation English" teacher :-P

Okay, Sly, forgive me if you feel this confrontational...BUT...I can not believe that they would pay that exorbitant amount (130K ThB) a month. Period. I went to Pattaya, and once my toes hit the sand, some slick came up and told me that I had won some type of lottery. I ain't buying it.

If that salary is true, as you mentioned, Thailand obviously beckons the licensed teacher's way. I am making a quarter of that here in the States, and am enjoying my lifestyle. This begs the question, then: if it is so great there in BKK (which I know it is very okay, as I stayed there and enjoyed the lifestyle, temperament, etc), why are they throwing such big fish in towards qualified applicants? Luring Westerners to an extremely polluted capital city that happens to be conveniently located to tremendous nightlife, fabulous (though sticky) weather, and other exotic delights?

Please respond with some particularly specific details. Thanks again for (if you did) actually reading this post.

[Scott]

I think somebody has quoted salaries a little less than 130,000 baht per month. I have heard of 120,000, but I have also heard of 90,000.

The jobs at the true international schools are good positions and they are not all that easy to get.

A lot of people hired from overseas still have bills in their home country. These can include a mortgage, car payment etc., thus a lot of companies pay such high salaries. The expectation is that you will not remain in a foreign country forever.