Democrat Urges Thaksin To Tell Red Shirts To Stop Causing Rifts

[webfact]

Democrat urges Thaksin to tell red shirts to stop causing rifts

The Nation

The Democrat Party Tuesday called on former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra to tell the red-shirt movement to stop causing rifts during this time of crisis.

Democrat deputy spokesman Atthaporn Pollabutr said the country now needed unity to tackle the flood crisis but the red-shirt movement continued to escalate rifts.

Atthaporn cited the moves of the Nitirat (Enlightened Jurists) group and Robert Amsterdam, a legal advisor of Thaksin, as examples of campaigns that would widen differences.

"Now, the government of Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra is almost crippled as a result of the flood crisis. The country will later on plunge deeper into crisis because of shortages and rising food costs. It will become a national crisis. As a result, all sides, including the government, the opposition and people of all political groups, should cooperate to handle the situation and help the affected people without choosing sides," Atthaporn said.

"The Thaksin network should turn to join forces with others to tackle the crisis instead of escalating rifts."

The Nitirat group has called for the amending of laws to undo coup effects while Amsterdam has been visiting red-shirt people to gather information to file a lawsuit with the International Court of Justice against the Army.

-- The Nation 2011-10-18

[pimay11]

As I said before in a previous post, first things first for the reds. Hundreds of thousands of people are loosing everything, people are dying but never mind. Opening red villages and districts, meeting with K T's legal adviser are much more important.

[DocN]

The rift right now is caused by YS-bashers, who ask the impossible of her, but offer no solution except for...yeah...well...they offer no solutions.

I guess, some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown, so they can celebrate their dirty little victory!

[gl555]

The rift right now is caused by YS-bashers, who ask the impossible of her, but offer no solution except for...yeah...well...they offer no solutions.

I guess, some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown, so they can celebrate their dirty little victory!

Well the article is true isn't it? Floods are engulfing the country and we have these morons not helping much. One wants to file a lawsuit while the other wants the laws changed so their lord and master can return. How does that help the people who have lost everything? Let's not even talk about Jatuporn and his worldwind tour to open Red districts. Yeah that helps.

As for the Yingluck bashing, well look at the mismanagement of the flood crisis from day one and you're telling us she deserves praise? We're not celebrating the suffering of people but I think these people deserve someone better equipped to help them. But of course, Red apologists like you will never see that.

Edited October 18, 2011 by gl555

[pimay11]

The rift right now is caused by YS-bashers, who ask the impossible of her, but offer no solution except for...yeah...well...they offer no solutions.

I guess, some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown, so they can celebrate their dirty little victory!

I think the following may have a little something to do with the rift. And I doubt seriously if any TV posters were polled.

Poll: Govt's Flood Relief Operations Centre gets thumbs down; 86% say flood information unclear, confused; 87% untrusting /MCOT

I trust you are incorrect in stating some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown. That would be a victory for no one.

[WarpSpeed]

and here I am just responding to a thread about Abhisit pointing fingers when it isn't appropriate timing!!

Funny, I mentioned ironic contradiction in that thread but here it's Ironic hypocrisy..

[pimay11]

and here I am just responding to a thread about Abhisit pointing fingers when it isn't appropriate timing!!

Funny, I mentioned ironic contradiction in that thread but here it's Ironic hypocrisy..

In other words you think that it is the inappropriate time for Abhist or anyone else for that matter to point out that the reds are more concerned with their agenda than focusing their attention on being a team player trying to solve the flood crisis. Correct or not?

The time opening red villages and meeting with K T's legal adviser could be well spent assisting people who have lost everything and some without hope. That to me is "Ironic hypocrisy......

[WarpSpeed]

and here I am just responding to a thread about Abhisit pointing fingers when it isn't appropriate timing!!

Funny, I mentioned ironic contradiction in that thread but here it's Ironic hypocrisy..

In other words you think that it is the inappropriate time for Abhist or anyone else for that matter to point out that the reds are more concerned with their agenda than focusing their attention on being a team player trying to solve the flood crisis. Correct or not?

The time opening red villages and meeting with K T's legal adviser could be well spent assisting people who have lost everything and some without hope. That to me is "Ironic hypocrisy......

Yes they have no business saying anything period at this point, it's not the time... But they're trying to stifle the reds on one hand and on the other making their own criticisms, hypocritically one sided as usual..

[sulasno]

this article is a piece of crap

[DocN]

The rift right now is caused by YS-bashers, who ask the impossible of her, but offer no solution except for...yeah...well...they offer no solutions.

I guess, some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown, so they can celebrate their dirty little victory!

Well the article is true isn't it? Floods are engulfing the country and we have these morons not helping much. One wants to file a lawsuit while the other wants the laws changed so their lord and master can return. How does that help the people who have lost everything? Let's not even talk about Jatuporn and his worldwind tour to open Red districts. Yeah that helps.

As for the Yingluck bashing, well look at the mismanagement of the flood crisis from day one and you're telling us she deserves praise? We're not celebrating the suffering of people but I think these people deserve someone better equipped to help them. But of course, Red apologists like you will never see that.

I guess you are well aware, that all that you are mentioning has a) nothing to do with the floods and started before anyone (even you are AV or whoesle) was even THINKING about the current crisis and that you are not helping anyone either with your bickering and c) neither is AV.

And for YS-bshing: she inherrited this mess from all who came before her in the last ...well...50++ years! If I remember correctly, AV took 8 weeks last year (after being in office for 1,5 YEARS ) to react to the flood, so IMHO she is doing as good /bad as anyone. I will judge her on what she does in 2 months, to prevent this from happening again! Do you?

[whybother]

I guess you are well aware, that all that you are mentioning has a) nothing to do with the floods and started before anyone (even you are AV or whoesle) was even THINKING about the current crisis and that you are not helping anyone either with your bickering and c) neither is AV.

And for YS-bshing: she inherrited this mess from all who came before her in the last ...well...50++ years! If I remember correctly, AV took 8 weeks last year (after being in office for 1,5 YEARS ) to react to the flood, so IMHO she is doing as good /bad as anyone. I will judge her on what she does in 2 months, to prevent this from happening again! Do you?

"AV took 8 weeks last year". No he didn't.

[DP25]

Good luck with that, appealing to Thaksin to look towards the nation's good instead of his own

[DocN]

I guess you are well aware, that all that you are mentioning has a) nothing to do with the floods and started before anyone (even you are AV or whoesle) was even THINKING about the current crisis and that you are not helping anyone either with your bickering and c) neither is AV.

And for YS-bshing: she inherrited this mess from all who came before her in the last ...well...50++ years! If I remember correctly, AV took 8 weeks last year (after being in office for 1,5 YEARS ) to react to the flood, so IMHO she is doing as good /bad as anyone. I will judge her on what she does in 2 months, to prevent this from happening again! Do you?

"AV took 8 weeks last year". No he didn't.

Longer?

[pimay11]

and here I am just responding to a thread about Abhisit pointing fingers when it isn't appropriate timing!!

Funny, I mentioned ironic contradiction in that thread but here it's Ironic hypocrisy..

In other words you think that it is the inappropriate time for Abhist or anyone else for that matter to point out that the reds are more concerned with their agenda than focusing their attention on being a team player trying to solve the flood crisis. Correct or not?

The time opening red villages and meeting with K T's legal adviser could be well spent assisting people who have lost everything and some without hope. That to me is "Ironic hypocrisy......

Yes they have no business saying anything period at this point, it's not the time... But they're trying to stifle the reds on one hand and on the other making their own criticisms, hypocritically one sided as usual..

Ok say for argument sake you are correct. Everyone should keep silent about the red's activities. Are the current actions of the reds and Mr. Amsterdam appropriate under the circumstances?

[gl555]

The rift right now is caused by YS-bashers, who ask the impossible of her, but offer no solution except for...yeah...well...they offer no solutions.

I guess, some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown, so they can celebrate their dirty little victory!

Well the article is true isn't it? Floods are engulfing the country and we have these morons not helping much. One wants to file a lawsuit while the other wants the laws changed so their lord and master can return. How does that help the people who have lost everything? Let's not even talk about Jatuporn and his worldwind tour to open Red districts. Yeah that helps.

As for the Yingluck bashing, well look at the mismanagement of the flood crisis from day one and you're telling us she deserves praise? We're not celebrating the suffering of people but I think these people deserve someone better equipped to help them. But of course, Red apologists like you will never see that.

I guess you are well aware, that all that you are mentioning has a) nothing to do with the floods and started before anyone (even you are AV or whoesle) was even THINKING about the current crisis and that you are not helping anyone either with your bickering and c) neither is AV.

And for YS-bshing: she inherrited this mess from all who came before her in the last ...well...50++ years! If I remember correctly, AV took 8 weeks last year (after being in office for 1,5 YEARS ) to react to the flood, so IMHO she is doing as good /bad as anyone. I will judge her on what she does in 2 months, to prevent this from happening again! Do you?

Yes you're right, Jatuporn opening Red districts, Amsterdam wanting to sue the Thai Military nor Nitarat wanting to amend the law has anything to do with the floods. And yet when it happened, right in the middle of it, they're busy doing just that. So what if it started before? They couldn't put that aside until the crisis is over?

The problem with you Red supporters is when someone criticises your side, it's 'bickering'. Yet you're happy to keep quiet when Nitarat, Amsterdam, Jatuporn and whomever is a crony to Thaksin do stupid stuff while the country is drowning.

As for Thaksin's stooge. She's in the hot seat now so if there's a screw up or a mismanagement, of course she should get blamed. But then, it's typical of the Reds to always blame someone else right? She and her cabinet screwed up from day one of this crisis. The lack of communication, the mismanagement and the bringing in of the military late when it lots of areas were already flooded. Oh wait, that's not her fault right? It was a mess she inherited. Yeah she inherited an unqualified cabinet her brother appointed.

Edited October 18, 2011 by gl555

[givenall]

Well said article but I don’t think make any differences,they are for take it all or nothing, and don’t really care about Thailand or herpeople

[WarpSpeed]

The rift right now is caused by YS-bashers, who ask the impossible of her, but offer no solution except for...yeah...well...they offer no solutions.

I guess, some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown, so they can celebrate their dirty little victory!

Well the article is true isn't it? Floods are engulfing the country and we have these morons not helping much. One wants to file a lawsuit while the other wants the laws changed so their lord and master can return. How does that help the people who have lost everything? Let's not even talk about Jatuporn and his worldwind tour to open Red districts. Yeah that helps.

As for the Yingluck bashing, well look at the mismanagement of the flood crisis from day one and you're telling us she deserves praise? We're not celebrating the suffering of people but I think these people deserve someone better equipped to help them. But of course, Red apologists like you will never see that.

I guess you are well aware, that all that you are mentioning has a) nothing to do with the floods and started before anyone (even you are AV or whoesle) was even THINKING about the current crisis and that you are not helping anyone either with your bickering and c) neither is AV.

And for YS-bshing: she inherrited this mess from all who came before her in the last ...well...50++ years! If I remember correctly, AV took 8 weeks last year (after being in office for 1,5 YEARS ) to react to the flood, so IMHO she is doing as good /bad as anyone. I will judge her on what she does in 2 months, to prevent this from happening again! Do you?

Not wanting to redirect the topic but this same ilk of posters using the attack on Yinglucks admin are also the same types who use the opposite tactic in defending another certain world leader who came into office with a similar crisis on his hands but in his case it is defensible to have walked into the crisis and have done nothing constructive in spite of massive promises to the contrary. This other world leader has now had almost 4 years and still little, to no action but it's ok because he's a Dem. . No double standards or hypocrisy being applied here at all..

[WarpSpeed]

and here I am just responding to a thread about Abhisit pointing fingers when it isn't appropriate timing!!

Funny, I mentioned ironic contradiction in that thread but here it's Ironic hypocrisy..

In other words you think that it is the inappropriate time for Abhist or anyone else for that matter to point out that the reds are more concerned with their agenda than focusing their attention on being a team player trying to solve the flood crisis. Correct or not?

The time opening red villages and meeting with K T's legal adviser could be well spent assisting people who have lost everything and some without hope. That to me is "Ironic hypocrisy......

Yes they have no business saying anything period at this point, it's not the time... But they're trying to stifle the reds on one hand and on the other making their own criticisms, hypocritically one sided as usual..

Ok say for argument sake you are correct. Everyone should keep silent about the red's activities. Are the current actions of the reds and Mr. Amsterdam appropriate under the circumstances?

Ummmm did I single out the reds activities?? I said the criticisms from BOTH sides should cease, it's not the time, the time is after the floods have been dealt with..

Amsterdam has nothing at all to do with the floods why is he even being brought up?

[DocN]

"you red supporters"? I am as far from being a YS-supporter than Thailand is from the moon. Just because someone says, people should just generally shut up and work together FOR ONES for the greater good, doesn't make me Thaksin- supporter.

Nitarat, Amsterdam etc. have their own agenda and they started all this way before there was even a flood insight!

And my oh-so-fearless- leader: what would you have done different, with a quantity of rainwater that this arguably larger than any before, with a flood and disaster management that is practically not existing and where everyone opens or closes damns and reservoirs as they like...and you allow her ...what...3 weeks to completely change all that was done wrong in ages???

Talk about relastic measures and fairness!

Edited October 18, 2011 by metisdead
Mangled quote edited out as it is difficult to determine who said what.

[scorecard]

The rift right now is caused by YS-bashers, who ask the impossible of her, but offer no solution except for...yeah...well...they offer no solutions.

I guess, some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown, so they can celebrate their dirty little victory!

Well the article is true isn't it? Floods are engulfing the country and we have these morons not helping much. One wants to file a lawsuit while the other wants the laws changed so their lord and master can return. How does that help the people who have lost everything? Let's not even talk about Jatuporn and his worldwind tour to open Red districts. Yeah that helps.

As for the Yingluck bashing, well look at the mismanagement of the flood crisis from day one and you're telling us she deserves praise? We're not celebrating the suffering of people but I think these people deserve someone better equipped to help them. But of course, Red apologists like you will never see that.

Her puppet brother needs to be blamed also. He surrounded his dear little sister with totally incapable people, none of whom have any serious insight into anything, and the result is there for all to to see. And the science minister is the best example.

I sometimes wonder how long it will take for her to realize that she's been seriously used by her big brother, all for his selfish ends.

[whybother]

I guess you are well aware, that all that you are mentioning has a) nothing to do with the floods and started before anyone (even you are AV or whoesle) was even THINKING about the current crisis and that you are not helping anyone either with your bickering and c) neither is AV.

And for YS-bshing: she inherrited this mess from all who came before her in the last ...well...50++ years! If I remember correctly, AV took 8 weeks last year (after being in office for 1,5 YEARS ) to react to the flood, so IMHO she is doing as good /bad as anyone. I will judge her on what she does in 2 months, to prevent this from happening again! Do you?

"AV took 8 weeks last year". No he didn't.

Longer?

The floods started from early October. The army was involved in relief work from late October. Relief money was being handed out in early November.

[DocN]

I guess you are well aware, that all that you are mentioning has a) nothing to do with the floods and started before anyone (even you are AV or whoesle) was even THINKING about the current crisis and that you are not helping anyone either with your bickering and c) neither is AV.

And for YS-bshing: she inherrited this mess from all who came before her in the last ...well...50++ years! If I remember correctly, AV took 8 weeks last year (after being in office for 1,5 YEARS ) to react to the flood, so IMHO she is doing as good /bad as anyone. I will judge her on what she does in 2 months, to prevent this from happening again! Do you?

"AV took 8 weeks last year". No he didn't.

Longer?

The floods started from early October. The army was involved in relief work from late October. Relief money was being handed out in early November.

Ok...so it was 4 weeks. Still pretty long for 1,5 years in position, when everyone is expecting YS to work miracles within 2 months in office. Not saying she could do better, though!

[slapout]

That some inept individuals have brought attention to themselves seems to be a factor in any natural disaster in any country. Criticism of individuals and groups whose response or lack thereof, by those affected by any disaster, can be and should be expected by all involved.

When the PM is visiting neighboring countries, instead of preparing to a foregone acknowledged, " There is a flood coming", the majority of ministry officials ignore the PM's instructions to get out with the people affected, individuals are proposing barter/trade of Thai product for foreign expertise, A PR man/firm is in country trying to pursue a lawsuit, A 'other half' is promoting a poll that suggests the PM is seen as doing a good job, People are doing budgets for a flood aftermath which is not finished, no one seems to be in charge or accurate info release, other release warning/info which has to be corrected, then you have those warning about the affect on business, tourism, etc and others saying there will be no affect, Industrial Parks falling to flooding over a length of 60 miles =-, shortage of bags for sandbag barriers, and the people are expected to be singing 'happy days are here again' after they swim/wade/boat/float to a dry place for a BBQ?

As has been pointed out many times " their is a vast difference between stupidity and ignorance."

[whybother]

The floods started from early October. The army was involved in relief work from late October. Relief money was being handed out in early November.

Ok...so it was 4 weeks. Still pretty long for 1,5 years in position, when everyone is expecting YS to work miracles within 2 months in office. Not saying she could do better, though!

Try 2 weeks.

Abhisit was dealing with flash floods. Yingluck has had a month knowing that the flood waters were going to move from the North through Ayutthaya and down to Bangkok.

[DocN]

You farangs -- quit complaining. This is not your war. Thailand will become a shithole like the Philippines and we can thank the Thai people for that. This is not Thaksin's fault at all. It's the fault of every selfish, greedy Thai in this country. Because of these selfish greedy Thais, scumbags will always be able to milk these stupid, selfish and greedy people.

So again -- foreigners will have to accept this fact. There's nothing we can do except move our families out of harm's way -- if it's any better in our home countries.

Well and eloquently put!

[Emptyset]

I don't think Nitarat group has anything to do with Thaksin (so how could he force them to focus on the floods and what benefit would that be anyway? They're legal scholars, not irrigation experts). And have we even heard from them since the floods started anyway? Jatuporn spent a few hours opening a red shirt district and we're still hearing about it 10 days later even though he's since organized a charity event for the flood victims. I read that Nattawud was giving 'advice' to FROC, which was laughed at. I'd assume Jatuporn's advice would be even less useful, so what else is the guy supposed to do but organize charity events?

As for Amsterdam, does he really have much of an effect on anything? Especially floodwise? Few would've known he was in Bangkok until the Dems tried to have him arrested.

[metisdead]

A post using derogatory comments directed at Thais and Thailand has been removed:

8) Not to post extremely negative views of Thailand or derogatory comments directed towards all Thais.

[Emptyset]

As I said before in a previous post, first things first for the reds. Hundreds of thousands of people are loosing everything, people are dying but never mind. Opening red villages and districts, meeting with K T's legal adviser are much more important.

So you expect everyone to spend their time helping solve the flood problem every minute of every day? In that case why are people spending valueble time when (presumably) they could be doing something useful, criticizing Jatuporn for something that he spent a few hours doing 10 days ago? This Democrat chap could surely be out sandbagging rather than wasting time talking to newspapers. Every minute is crucial at a time like this.

Anyway, all the reds I know are spending practically all their time helping with flood charities. I haven't heard much political talk from them for the past couple of weeks. Not to mention the fact that quite a lot of reds are too busy being flood victims to prioritize politics. Many reds are pitching in, some no doubt aren't... pretty much the same with any large group of people I suppose. Although I wonder if some of those who are involved in the flood relief charity organized by red shirts would've got involved if they weren't a member of the group - after all being a group member does tend to push you into getting involved.

Edited October 18, 2011 by Emptyset

[tlansford]

Pretty funny statement from the Dems - Asking the hunted, fugitive former prime minister, a convicted criminal banned from politics to help stop people from causing rifts during a time of crisis.

On the other hand Abhisit seems to forget about his party threatening impeachments in August just weeks after the first flash floods hit... yeah, that's not a rift-generating activity, just a bit of good-natured fun between political rivals, ya know...

Of course "his" flood problem in March only caused the deaths of 53 people - I guess he was lucky that it didn't hit such densely populated areas or continue for 3 months.

But in March the Navy jumped right in with their big boat and save a lot of Thais and tourists, ... the same day that the Lomprayah ferry resumed operations.

IMO, there are 3 distinct tasks, none of which involve rifts. 1) deal with the floods today. Then at the appropriate time, look at 2) the emergency response effort for improvement, and the 3) long-term flood prevention measures. (but that is stating the obvious, isn't it). No matter what goes on in the news here, there are still a lot of people in need out there. It's a good time to donate whatever it is you can, time or money.

ah, ... as for that Navy operation last March, I have my own photos and video, just a little something to share...

<< BTW, the canoe in the first shot is, you guessed it, actually in the street....>>

<< Really nice boat these guys have ... took around 2,000, 2,500 people with them. >>

[Mosha]

The rift right now is caused by YS-bashers, who ask the impossible of her, but offer no solution except for...yeah...well...they offer no solutions.

I guess, some are simply waiting for Bangkok to drown, so they can celebrate their dirty little victory!

Well the article is true isn't it? Floods are engulfing the country and we have these morons not helping much. One wants to file a lawsuit while the other wants the laws changed so their lord and master can return. How does that help the people who have lost everything? Let's not even talk about Jatuporn and his worldwind tour to open Red districts. Yeah that helps.

As for the Yingluck bashing, well look at the mismanagement of the flood crisis from day one and you're telling us she deserves praise? We're not celebrating the suffering of people but I think these people deserve someone better equipped to help them. But of course, Red apologists like you will never see that.

Her puppet brother needs to be blamed also. He surrounded his dear little sister with totally incapable people, none of whom have any serious insight into anything, and the result is there for all to to see. And the science minister is the best example.

I sometimes wonder how long it will take for her to realize that she's been seriously used by her big brother, all for his selfish ends.

Scorecard, I think you meant puppeteer , as for the article in the op. It's like asking a scorpion not to sting. It's in their nature.