Thai Govt Finally Sees The Need For Long-Term Planning

[scorecard]

I couldn't agree more!!

And no better dignitary than Virabongsa. His credentials as a leader of the Thai Pulp and Paper Association are legend and he forged the crafting of the Khor Jor Kor in 1991 with the military dictatorship government. This was the notorious decree enforced by the Thai military's Internal Security Operations Command that stripped 2,500 villages, yes that's villages not villagers, of more than 2.3 million hectares of land. Fought tooth and nail to no avail by NGOs and other humanitarian groups. This Khor Jor Kor enabled Thai companies to lease the confiscated land to build cash crop Eucalyptus and Pine plantations. Virabongsa and Plodprasop as head of RFD, the Royal Forestry Department and now your friendly Science and Technology Minister, led these initiatives and alignments with SHS , the parent of Advanced Agro and "invisible" subsidiaries. Other investors included Siam Cement Group and Bangkok Bank. Virabongsa Ramangkura was able to finesse all these relationships and represent numerous other elite business class interests into developing a pulp and paper industry with many international investors such as Asian Development Bank as well as vendors like Finnish and Swedish consulting teams, based on the premise that the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry would serve the Thai people and economic growth in Thailand. In reality, the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry became a predominantly export engine with 75% export rather than a domestic supplier of essential paper needs in developing Thailand. By the way, Advanced Agro is Double A paper, that many of us use to write our notes and papers. You can see their logo on Sathorn, one of the sacrosanct areas of inner Bangkok.

So when the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry and Advanced Agro and SHS, its parent and other scoundrel forest destruction companies, fell on hard times in 1997 and financial default on their loans, it was Virabongsa who rose to the occasion and got everybody a bye on their debt and $200 for passing go. So it's no surprise that Virabongsa again "gets the call" , to run interference among NGOS, humanitarian groups, governments, Thai people, and Thai business interests as they start to develop both a damage control, blame game scenario, as well as tee up that "Thai currying favor style" with foreign agencies like World Bank, ADB and others to attempt to line up future investments in Thailand to build "suitable infrastructure to plan for global climate change."

This flood disaster may in some way be climate change related, but the human culpability goes way back to stripping the land for self interest, isolation of business class elite and the money train in Bangkok, and the advancement of cash flow into the pockets of privileged feudal elite business class. Their focus on safeguarding Bangkok from the floods at the expense of northern provinces, is merely an extension of the attitudes that prevailed in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s and earlier when many of these causes of infrastructure breakdown and cash canaling took place. instead of proper water canaling. Bangkok represents 41% of the Thai economy, according to Thai sources, but overlooked is that 41% wouldn't exist and is dwarfed by what the Thai manufacturing, farming, fishing, rice, and rubber trade does to feed the banking, insurance, and retail centers of Bangkok. The same Thai labor that drives Bangkok's banking, insurance, services, and tourist economy are the folks that Bangkok stuck it to in planning this "protect Bangkok at all costs" approach to flood management. What goes around comes around. Virabongsa to the rescue.

Excellent contribution. So rare, here, to find such informed historical analysis. Thank you.

Indeed an excellent well researched article, a rarity in this forum!

I showed this analysis to my older Thai colleagues (they all read / speak advanced English).

They all agreed that it was a good and correct analysis of Virabongsa, and all agreed that he is a shady character to say the least.

Ironically some newspapers (today's editions) label him as 'respected'.

Again I showed this to my older Thai colleagues. They were stunned and repeated their earlier assessments - shady to say the least.

Edited November 10, 2011 by scorecard

[anterian]

And no better dignitary than Virabongsa. His credentials as a leader of the Thai Pulp and Paper Association are legend and he forged the crafting of the Khor Jor Kor in 1991 with the military dictatorship government. This was the notorious decree enforced by the Thai military's Internal Security Operations Command that stripped 2,500 villages, yes that's villages not villagers, of more than 2.3 million hectares of land. Fought tooth and nail to no avail by NGOs and other humanitarian groups. This Khor Jor Kor enabled Thai companies to lease the confiscated land to build cash crop Eucalyptus and Pine plantations. Virabongsa and Plodprasop as head of RFD, the Royal Forestry Department and now your friendly Science and Technology Minister, led these initiatives and alignments with SHS , the parent of Advanced Agro and "invisible" subsidiaries. Other investors included Siam Cement Group and Bangkok Bank. Virabongsa Ramangkura was able to finesse all these relationships and represent numerous other elite business class interests into developing a pulp and paper industry with many international investors such as Asian Development Bank as well as vendors like Finnish and Swedish consulting teams, based on the premise that the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry would serve the Thai people and economic growth in Thailand. In reality, the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry became a predominantly export engine with 75% export rather than a domestic supplier of essential paper needs in developing Thailand. By the way, Advanced Agro is Double A paper, that many of us use to write our notes and papers. You can see their logo on Sathorn, one of the sacrosanct areas of inner Bangkok.

So when the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry and Advanced Agro and SHS, its parent and other scoundrel forest destruction companies, fell on hard times in 1997 and financial default on their loans, it was Virabongsa who rose to the occasion and got everybody a bye on their debt and $200 for passing go. So it's no surprise that Virabongsa again "gets the call" , to run interference among NGOS, humanitarian groups, governments, Thai people, and Thai business interests as they start to develop both a damage control, blame game scenario, as well as tee up that "Thai currying favor style" with foreign agencies like World Bank, ADB and others to attempt to line up future investments in Thailand to build "suitable infrastructure to plan for global climate change."

This flood disaster may in some way be climate change related, but the human culpability goes way back to stripping the land for self interest, isolation of business class elite and the money train in Bangkok, and the advancement of cash flow into the pockets of privileged feudal elite business class. Their focus on safeguarding Bangkok from the floods at the expense of northern provinces, is merely an extension of the attitudes that prevailed in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s and earlier when many of these causes of infrastructure breakdown and cash canaling took place. instead of proper water canaling. Bangkok represents 41% of the Thai economy, according to Thai sources, but overlooked is that 41% wouldn't exist and is dwarfed by what the Thai manufacturing, farming, fishing, rice, and rubber trade does to feed the banking, insurance, and retail centers of Bangkok. The same Thai labor that drives Bangkok's banking, insurance, services, and tourist economy are the folks that Bangkok stuck it to in planning this "protect Bangkok at all costs" approach to flood management. What goes around comes around. Virabongsa to the rescue.

Indeed an excellent well researched article, a rarity in this forum!

I showed this analysis to my older Thai colleagues (they all read / speak advanced English).

They all agreed that it was a good and correct analysis of Virabongsa, and all agreed that he is a shady character to say the least.

Ironically some newspapers (today's editions) label him as 'respected'.

Again I showed this to my older Thai colleagues. They were stunned and repeated their earlier assessments - shady to say the least.

When you look at the attitude of the Elite to the poor and the workers I always think of the story of the "golden Goose", then contrast it with the parable of the good shepherd.

Put simply if the Elite want to keep feeding at the trough they need to ensure that the people who put the feed in the trough stay functional, otherwise they will soon find their snouts in an empty trough.

[peterquixote]

I felt quite sad to read about Thailand, but what is Thailand is, I come to this site to be informed properly on politic and social matters.

I refer to Noitom, at 9.05 above.

Inside this comment below by Noitom, is mention of alternative crops for Thailand.

The tree species Eucalyptus can grow very fast in water sodden areas. So does Pinus radiata. In fact most trees.

Mnay countries are growing Eucalyptus, the Australian dry country tree, can find water anywhere.

Its good for pulp, and paper, and hard building material when it gets older.

Noitom comment at 9.05

Edited November 10, 2011 by peterquixote

[bridge2bridge]

WOW it took them long enough to wake up.

But TIT.

[geezer553]

the goverment here in thailand are a joke!! the king wanted 2 sort the problem out several years ago-----but the goverment decided it would cost to much money!!!

now the people of thailand are paying the price for their bad managment.....the cost of the clean up? the thai only look at the short term issues---bad planning will continue

unless we have somebody who can take the bull by the horns---and look at the bigger picture---------------its called the future ------------thailand is a wonderful place

the goverment and banks have prosperd ------------yet the people continue to suffer..........i hope yingluck can sort the future of thailand out...

[swillowbee]

... sure ... "seeing the need for long-term planning" is one thing ... smeared all over the international media, this disaster kind of screams out of the box at you.

... but, do they see the merit in it? ... umm, doubtful.

... public infrastructure as this takes years to plan, enginner and develop ... it's benefits will be unseen for years ... and, the 20-30% graft that the Thai political crooks du jour scrape off the top for themselves and their disgusting families and co-conspiritors is unlikely to happen within their current terms.

... I just don't see it ... watch for a repeat in future rainy seasons.

... one of the penalties for living in so corrupt a culture.

[scorecard]

And no better dignitary than Virabongsa. His credentials as a leader of the Thai Pulp and Paper Association are legend and he forged the crafting of the Khor Jor Kor in 1991 with the military dictatorship government. This was the notorious decree enforced by the Thai military's Internal Security Operations Command that stripped 2,500 villages, yes that's villages not villagers, of more than 2.3 million hectares of land. Fought tooth and nail to no avail by NGOs and other humanitarian groups. This Khor Jor Kor enabled Thai companies to lease the confiscated land to build cash crop Eucalyptus and Pine plantations. Virabongsa and Plodprasop as head of RFD, the Royal Forestry Department and now your friendly Science and Technology Minister, led these initiatives and alignments with SHS , the parent of Advanced Agro and "invisible" subsidiaries. Other investors included Siam Cement Group and Bangkok Bank. Virabongsa Ramangkura was able to finesse all these relationships and represent numerous other elite business class interests into developing a pulp and paper industry with many international investors such as Asian Development Bank as well as vendors like Finnish and Swedish consulting teams, based on the premise that the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry would serve the Thai people and economic growth in Thailand. In reality, the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry became a predominantly export engine with 75% export rather than a domestic supplier of essential paper needs in developing Thailand. By the way, Advanced Agro is Double A paper, that many of us use to write our notes and papers. You can see their logo on Sathorn, one of the sacrosanct areas of inner Bangkok.

So when the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry and Advanced Agro and SHS, its parent and other scoundrel forest destruction companies, fell on hard times in 1997 and financial default on their loans, it was Virabongsa who rose to the occasion and got everybody a bye on their debt and $200 for passing go. So it's no surprise that Virabongsa again "gets the call" , to run interference among NGOS, humanitarian groups, governments, Thai people, and Thai business interests as they start to develop both a damage control, blame game scenario, as well as tee up that "Thai currying favor style" with foreign agencies like World Bank, ADB and others to attempt to line up future investments in Thailand to build "suitable infrastructure to plan for global climate change."

This flood disaster may in some way be climate change related, but the human culpability goes way back to stripping the land for self interest, isolation of business class elite and the money train in Bangkok, and the advancement of cash flow into the pockets of privileged feudal elite business class. Their focus on safeguarding Bangkok from the floods at the expense of northern provinces, is merely an extension of the attitudes that prevailed in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s and earlier when many of these causes of infrastructure breakdown and cash canaling took place. instead of proper water canaling. Bangkok represents 41% of the Thai economy, according to Thai sources, but overlooked is that 41% wouldn't exist and is dwarfed by what the Thai manufacturing, farming, fishing, rice, and rubber trade does to feed the banking, insurance, and retail centers of Bangkok. The same Thai labor that drives Bangkok's banking, insurance, services, and tourist economy are the folks that Bangkok stuck it to in planning this "protect Bangkok at all costs" approach to flood management. What goes around comes around. Virabongsa to the rescue.

Indeed an excellent well researched article, a rarity in this forum!

I showed this analysis to my older Thai colleagues (they all read / speak advanced English).

They all agreed that it was a good and correct analysis of Virabongsa, and all agreed that he is a shady character to say the least.

Ironically some newspapers (today's editions) label him as 'respected'.

Again I showed this to my older Thai colleagues. They were stunned and repeated their earlier assessments - shady to say the least.

When you look at the attitude of the Elite to the poor and the workers I always think of the story of the "golden Goose", then contrast it with the parable of the good shepherd.

Put simply if the Elite want to keep feeding at the trough they need to ensure that the people who put the feed in the trough stay functional, otherwise they will soon find their snouts in an empty trough.

Please share, what do you by 'elite'?

[bigbamboo]

And no better dignitary than Virabongsa. His credentials as a leader of the Thai Pulp and Paper Association are legend and he forged the crafting of the Khor Jor Kor in 1991 with the military dictatorship government. This was the notorious decree enforced by the Thai military's Internal Security Operations Command that stripped 2,500 villages, yes that's villages not villagers, of more than 2.3 million hectares of land. Fought tooth and nail to no avail by NGOs and other humanitarian groups. This Khor Jor Kor enabled Thai companies to lease the confiscated land to build cash crop Eucalyptus and Pine plantations. Virabongsa and Plodprasop as head of RFD, the Royal Forestry Department and now your friendly Science and Technology Minister, led these initiatives and alignments with SHS , the parent of Advanced Agro and "invisible" subsidiaries. Other investors included Siam Cement Group and Bangkok Bank. Virabongsa Ramangkura was able to finesse all these relationships and represent numerous other elite business class interests into developing a pulp and paper industry with many international investors such as Asian Development Bank as well as vendors like Finnish and Swedish consulting teams, based on the premise that the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry would serve the Thai people and economic growth in Thailand. In reality, the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry became a predominantly export engine with 75% export rather than a domestic supplier of essential paper needs in developing Thailand. By the way, Advanced Agro is Double A paper, that many of us use to write our notes and papers. You can see their logo on Sathorn, one of the sacrosanct areas of inner Bangkok.

So when the Thai Pulp and Paper Industry and Advanced Agro and SHS, its parent and other scoundrel forest destruction companies, fell on hard times in 1997 and financial default on their loans, it was Virabongsa who rose to the occasion and got everybody a bye on their debt and $200 for passing go. So it's no surprise that Virabongsa again "gets the call" , to run interference among NGOS, humanitarian groups, governments, Thai people, and Thai business interests as they start to develop both a damage control, blame game scenario, as well as tee up that "Thai currying favor style" with foreign agencies like World Bank, ADB and others to attempt to line up future investments in Thailand to build "suitable infrastructure to plan for global climate change."

This flood disaster may in some way be climate change related, but the human culpability goes way back to stripping the land for self interest, isolation of business class elite and the money train in Bangkok, and the advancement of cash flow into the pockets of privileged feudal elite business class. Their focus on safeguarding Bangkok from the floods at the expense of northern provinces, is merely an extension of the attitudes that prevailed in the 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s and earlier when many of these causes of infrastructure breakdown and cash canaling took place. instead of proper water canaling. Bangkok represents 41% of the Thai economy, according to Thai sources, but overlooked is that 41% wouldn't exist and is dwarfed by what the Thai manufacturing, farming, fishing, rice, and rubber trade does to feed the banking, insurance, and retail centers of Bangkok. The same Thai labor that drives Bangkok's banking, insurance, services, and tourist economy are the folks that Bangkok stuck it to in planning this "protect Bangkok at all costs" approach to flood management. What goes around comes around. Virabongsa to the rescue.

Thai teachers in 'social' class could do well to use this as an article for discussion. There must be some students out there who could take this and learn from it.

[plumeria]

"Finally"???

If that alone does not immediately and totally disqualify everyone in the current government then there is no hope for a better future.

[plumeria]

I felt quite sad to read about Thailand, but what is Thailand is, I come to this site to be informed properly on politic and social matters.

I refer to Noitom, at 9.05 above.

Inside this comment below by Noitom, is mention of alternative crops for Thailand.

The tree species Eucalyptus can grow very fast in water sodden areas. So does Pinus radiata. In fact most trees.

Mnay countries are growing Eucalyptus, the Australian dry country tree, can find water anywhere.

Its good for pulp, and paper, and hard building material when it gets older.

Noitom comment at 9.05

Eucalyptus is NOT a good idea if you truly know anything about the tree. I plant Eucalyptus only on rocks where almost nothing else will grow just to have something green. Under any other circumstances it's merely playing into the hands of the exploitive capitalists -- ruin your land so they can turn a quick Euro buying your trees cheap for scaffold material or pulp for paper or some other very low quality value added (??) product.

Eucalyptus is the end of the line for that spot on the planet. And you'll find it also slowly kills any competition around it in a nefarious, imperialist manner.

In other words, the government will probably reforest all of Central Thailand with Eucalyptus funded by the World Bank for an obscene and exorbitant amount of money and call it the salvation of the country.

[Markaew]

"Virabongsa has said the Yingluck government will do its best to ensure this year's flooding will not happen again."

"Crossing her fingers and hoping to die" isn't enough.

They seem to use that phase quite a bit here, "We/I will do our/my best".

Translation: Don't expect too much as long as you speak the correct rhetoric.

[KKK]

the goverment here in thailand are a joke!! ...now the people of thailand are paying the price for their bad managment....bad planning will continue

unless we have somebody who can take the bull by the horns...yet the people continue to suffer..........i hope yingluck can sort the future of thailand out...

It is not only yingluck or her government that needs to sort out the future..it is the people who continually vote into power corrupt and stupid self-serving governments that need to get themselves sorted out.

You only get what you voted for....

[KKK]

I felt quite sad to read about Thailand, but what is Thailand is, I come to this site to be informed properly on politic and social matters.

I refer to Noitom, at 9.05 above.

Inside this comment below by Noitom, is mention of alternative crops for Thailand.

The tree species Eucalyptus can grow very fast in water sodden areas. So does Pinus radiata. In fact most trees.

Mnay countries are growing Eucalyptus, the Australian dry country tree, can find water anywhere.

Its good for pulp, and paper, and hard building material when it gets older.

Noitom comment at 9.05

Eucalyptus is NOT a good idea if you truly know anything about the tree. I plant Eucalyptus only on rocks where almost nothing else will grow just to have something green. Under any other circumstances it's merely playing into the hands of the exploitive capitalists -- ruin your land so they can turn a quick Euro buying your trees cheap for scaffold material or pulp for paper or some other very low quality value added (??) product.

Eucalyptus is the end of the line for that spot on the planet. And you'll find it also slowly kills any competition around it in a nefarious, imperialist manner.

In other words, the government will probably reforest all of Central Thailand with Eucalyptus funded by the World Bank for an obscene and exorbitant amount of money and call it the salvation of the country.

I would tend to agree with plumeria. Eucalyptus is quick cash earner but destroys the land leaving it useless for other crops.