Can I Become A Thai Citizen?

[Oasis]

I think you have good chance to get but again go and talk to special branch police head office you need 60% marks to pass and I am not sure the salary requirement for you, during my application it was an average 30,000 Baht/month but they will consider an overall picture. Please note that also you will be applying on humanitarian ground(Thai family).

Cheers

@oasis

Thanks! Will go ASAP - I don't live in BKK.

You mention that you applied and it seems to be if the application is received then one is OK. Above some answers were given, would just seek a 2nd opinion esp. as you have applied yourself!

My salary is "standard" govt. foreign teacher's wages - nothing great.

I am a qualified teacher with a masters.

Bank balance - a hundred thousand tops.

I do not own (nor does the wife) any property.

My level of Thai is: I can understand what my students and friends and family say (about 60%). Could probably speak that about 25%. Can't read or write, but I am now on that issue.

Legally in the country for 5+ years (not much more though) all on non-imm and extended since arrival (with exit permits) no breaks and no tourist visas.

Have submitted tax returns within Thailand on incomes of more that 15,000 Baht a month (Samran's quoted threshold) for 5 years.

Have never been fired from a Thai job (and with good references from Thais) and do not have a police record here or in my native country.

Comments?

[mjnaus]

I could get into the complete nonsense of what you are babbling. However, your ignorance keeps you happy and probably also keeps the local girls at the bar happy too!

Ride the happy wave my friend. The only problem is that what you advocate is not the official line. For any self respecting person who has been legal for more years than your business plan, I just can't ride your wave.

If I really wanted to live the undergound life - there are plenty of better examples to imitate.

If you read all my posts, you will get the point that I do not need a quick visa run or another 30 days. I need something that is at a level that is much higher than you can comprehend - as demonstrated by your quick fix posts.

However, thanks for taking the time to be friendly and trying to help - this is an honest thanks!

Whatever dude.... Keep up the all whining and complaining and see where that's going to get you

[Oasis]

Hi CJ,

Congratulations, well done, I am still in black hole part of the process, hope it will go soon, could you please tell how it happened, did you contact or phoned them on regular basis or just wait for them to do the things for you?

Thanks!

But do you actually have your ID card yet? 4 yrs does seem quick compared with other applications, and from the document listed on their website, there are still several more steps in the process

Hi Time Traveller. No, I do not have my ID card yet. I am awaiting His Majesty's signature then official publication in the Gazette. Anywhere from another 6 to 12 months before I actually receive my ID card, I would say. But the "black hole" part of the process is over and the remainder is merely formality.

[CWMcMurray]

Under this, the minimum salary is 40,000 Baht a month (@Samran - this means I need to be a slave for 3 more years and not 1). And the big bang is that tax needs to be paid at a minimum of 50,000 Baht for the last 3 years (excludes social 750 Baht/month contributions).

Under Thai tax law, such does not compute as a person who is married (has an extra allowance) and tax returns will not equal 50,000.

Just a though and have no idea if correct or not...

I wonder if the salary requirements and the way in which you have to apply for citizenship may be affected by your type of extension?

Maybe they are advising that you need 40,000 thb in slary becauyse you are asking about applying under Marraige to Thai wife...

...so do they assume that you must be on an extension of your non-Im for Thai wife as well and since this is the salary requirement for this type of visa extension, that is why they are saying 40k ?

Does any one know if there is a requirement to be on a extension for Thai wife if you want to apply fo rcitizenship for having a Thai wife?

OP.... Have you actually gone to the special branch and sat down and spoken with someone. I would recomend going and speaking them and advising them all of your specific details and ask (politely) if anything you can do ...

[FritsSikkink]

Just a question: when Thai schools do not even pay a pension

How are you supporting your family at retirement age when you have the Thai nationality?

Edited November 26, 2011 by FritsSikkink

[ludditeman]

Just a question: when Thai schools do not even pay a pension

How are you supporting your family at retirement age when you have the Thai nationality?

I believe Thai schools pay pensions to Thai nationals

But I wonder if a foreigner were to get Thai citizenship, would they reduce his wage to be the same as a Thai teacher?

Careful here MrAngry

Thai Citizenship might get you a 40% pay reduction.

[samran]

Why on earth would that be the case? He's got a skill which grants him a 'premium' salary (to use the term loosely) so his nationality certainly shouldn't have anything to do with it.

Doesn't in my case.

[wayned]

Thai teachers do get pensions and they are forced to retire at 60 years old. I don't know the conditions of the retirement program but I understand that the maximum is a lump sum payment of 1, 000,000 baht. I have a Thai friend that is 52 years old and has been teaching for almost 30 years. His salary is 32,000 baht/ month. Now the OP is a citizen, so he throws away his WP and has all of the rights of a Thai,. Does he think that he would be able to work now as a Thai and keep the same salary as he did as a farang. I don't think so. He might get some credit for preious experience, but Thai teachers start at 7,000/month and get yearly increses. I don't know what he is making now, but a 40% reduction in salary might be optimistic. There's an old saying "don't jump from the frying pan into the fire"!

Just a question: when Thai schools do not even pay a pension

How are you supporting your family at retirement age when you have the Thai nationality?

I believe Thai schools pay pensions to Thai nationals

But I wonder if a foreigner were to get Thai citizenship, would they reduce his wage to be the same as a Thai teacher?

Careful here MrAngry

Thai Citizenship might get you a 40% pay reduction.

[terryq]

But a Thai citizen who had good English and teaching skill could legally offer group or one-on-one tutoring any time and any where.

Maybe even cash in hand. That could up the income significantly !!

[ludditeman]

But a Thai citizen who had good English and teaching skill could legally offer group or one-on-one tutoring any time and any where.

Maybe even cash in hand. That could up the income significantly !!

I suspect you could earn significantly more as a Tuk Tuk driver catering to American, Canadian and European tourists.

[AngryParent]

But a Thai citizen who had good English and teaching skill could legally offer group or one-on-one tutoring any time and any where.

Maybe even cash in hand. That could up the income significantly !!

I suspect you could earn significantly more as a Tuk Tuk driver catering to American, Canadian and European tourists.

That is exactly what I was thinking! I have always dreamt of working in one of those prohibited areas e.g. AngryParent Hair Cuts - he cuts fast and shaves with fury!

Or I could legally work in all those scam jobs (Tuk Tuks, jet ski etc) - He is Angry but honest!

The potential is endless!

[Mario2008]

With Thai nationaity one can become a government teacher, and after a few years they get paid more than the average foreign teacher who normally earns something bewteen 30,0000 to 35,000 a month. A lot of the older teachers earn well over 40,000. Plus pension and free medical care (inlcuding for spouse, children and parents).

[AngryParent]

I could get into the complete nonsense of what you are babbling. However, your ignorance keeps you happy and probably also keeps the local girls at the bar happy too!

Ride the happy wave my friend. The only problem is that what you advocate is not the official line. For any self respecting person who has been legal for more years than your business plan, I just can't ride your wave.

If I really wanted to live the undergound life - there are plenty of better examples to imitate.

If you read all my posts, you will get the point that I do not need a quick visa run or another 30 days. I need something that is at a level that is much higher than you can comprehend - as demonstrated by your quick fix posts.

However, thanks for taking the time to be friendly and trying to help - this is an honest thanks!

Whatever dude.... Keep up the all whining and complaining and see where that's going to get you

About the same position that not complaining and whining gets me! I.E. Zero stability for a Thai family.

[AngryParent]

would love to be a fly on the wall down at Special Branch tomorrow when the OP visits. It will either all go swimingly, or will be highly entertaining.

Sorry Samran, will not be going to BKK tomorrow. It is a full day trip, with a wife and son and they do not want to go. The 100% Thai part of the family was a party to the conversation with BKK and there is a belief that going to Bangkok will result in 'seeah wellah'. Forgive me for the transliteration 'seeah' (the same word used for a broken vehicle) and wellah (time). As mentioned earlier, it was a lengthy phone conversation - around 30-40 minutes with me talking a bit in Thai and those that can speak it fluently speaking a lot more. The Thai part of the family is fairly convinced that I cannot approach the starting gate as 40,000 Baht a month is not met. That is the basic criteria and only then the point system is used.

Instead, will try to find a local Special Branch and let all know the outcome.

If there is no local office, then....

Local special branch won't have a clue. As said, rules - and caveats - change subtly every year and the guys in BKK know what they are....

Acknowledged and accepted. However, till whenever that is next possible - electronic debates will have to be the status quo for me.

[AngryParent]

I think you have good chance to get but again go and talk to special branch police head office you need 60% marks to pass and I am not sure the salary requirement for you, during my application it was an average 30,000 Baht/month but they will consider an overall picture. Please note that also you will be applying on humanitarian ground(Thai family).

Cheers

@oasis

Thanks! Will go ASAP - I don't live in BKK.

You mention that you applied and it seems to be if the application is received then one is OK. Above some answers were given, would just seek a 2nd opinion esp. as you have applied yourself!

My salary is "standard" govt. foreign teacher's wages - nothing great.

I am a qualified teacher with a masters.

Bank balance - a hundred thousand tops.

I do not own (nor does the wife) any property.

My level of Thai is: I can understand what my students and friends and family say (about 60%). Could probably speak that about 25%. Can't read or write, but I am now on that issue.

Legally in the country for 5+ years (not much more though) all on non-imm and extended since arrival (with exit permits) no breaks and no tourist visas.

Have submitted tax returns within Thailand on incomes of more that 15,000 Baht a month (Samran's quoted threshold) for 5 years.

Have never been fired from a Thai job (and with good references from Thais) and do not have a police record here or in my native country.

Comments?

You and I think this. luditeman mentioned this and I did too (but my post was only PR law).

The Special Branch link I provided has ZERO mention of humantiarian grounds. Hey, be my guest and read the docs and tell me I am wrong.

Edited November 26, 2011 by AngryParent

[AngryParent]

Under this, the minimum salary is 40,000 Baht a month (@Samran - this means I need to be a slave for 3 more years and not 1). And the big bang is that tax needs to be paid at a minimum of 50,000 Baht for the last 3 years (excludes social 750 Baht/month contributions).

Under Thai tax law, such does not compute as a person who is married (has an extra allowance) and tax returns will not equal 50,000.

Just a though and have no idea if correct or not...

I wonder if the salary requirements and the way in which you have to apply for citizenship may be affected by your type of extension?

Maybe they are advising that you need 40,000 thb in slary becauyse you are asking about applying under Marraige to Thai wife...

...so do they assume that you must be on an extension of your non-Im for Thai wife as well and since this is the salary requirement for this type of visa extension, that is why they are saying 40k ?

Does any one know if there is a requirement to be on a extension for Thai wife if you want to apply fo rcitizenship for having a Thai wife?

OP.... Have you actually gone to the special branch and sat down and spoken with someone. I would recomend going and speaking them and advising them all of your specific details and ask (politely) if anything you can do ...

This is a post that I have wanted to reply to for some time! It is very logical and legalistic. An excellent train of thought and mind! It was logical how you linked 40,000 to marriage visa and thus citizenship based on marriage (the problem is mentioned below).

Yes, the concept of multiple routes to apply is grounded in law, residence, marriage, humanitiarian etc. Much more roots in the West, but still acknowledged in Thailand to a limited extent.

The problem is that the citizenship requirments do not really give different categories for which one can apply (unlike PR).

Citizenship seems to have an intial line for minimal qualification and then after qualification one needs to get the points and then....

[AngryParent]

With Thai nationaity one can become a government teacher, and after a few years they get paid more than the average foreign teacher who normally earns something bewteen 30,0000 to 35,000 a month. A lot of the older teachers earn well over 40,000. Plus pension and free medical care (inlcuding for spouse, children and parents).

Says something profund.

Here, poor AngryParent, slaved for many years teaching thousands of Thai kids. As I am a foreigner, my wife and son will die the day I die, as no pension and all the rights that my family should get esp as I work for the government and 2/3 0f this family is Thai. No similar rights even though I work hard like all other teachers. I work for 1 month or 30 years does not make a difference. The day I die, is the day my Thai wife and son dies.

The above is one of the reasons why I chose the name AngryParent.

[tombkk]

I think you have good chance to get but again go and talk to special branch police head office you need 60% marks to pass and I am not sure the salary requirement for you, during my application it was an average 30,000 Baht/month but they will consider an overall picture. Please note that also you will be applying on humanitarian ground(Thai family).

Cheers

@oasis

Thanks! Will go ASAP - I don't live in BKK.

You mention that you applied and it seems to be if the application is received then one is OK. Above some answers were given, would just seek a 2nd opinion esp. as you have applied yourself!

My salary is "standard" govt. foreign teacher's wages - nothing great.

I am a qualified teacher with a masters.

Bank balance - a hundred thousand tops.

I do not own (nor does the wife) any property.

My level of Thai is: I can understand what my students and friends and family say (about 60%). Could probably speak that about 25%. Can't read or write, but I am now on that issue.

Legally in the country for 5+ years (not much more though) all on non-imm and extended since arrival (with exit permits) no breaks and no tourist visas.

Have submitted tax returns within Thailand on incomes of more that 15,000 Baht a month (Samran's quoted threshold) for 5 years.

Have never been fired from a Thai job (and with good references from Thais) and do not have a police record here or in my native country.

Comments?

You and I think this. luditeman mentioned this and I did too (but my post was only PR law).

The Special Branch link I provided has ZERO mention of humantiarian grounds. Hey, be my guest and read the docs and tell me I am wrong.

Your only choice then is to go to Bangkok and ask the Special Branch people, as has been said in this thread many times. You would have to invest a WHOLE day of your life, unfortunately. If that is too much, I am not sure how serious you are.

[AngryParent]

I think you have good chance to get but again go and talk to special branch police head office you need 60% marks to pass and I am not sure the salary requirement for you, during my application it was an average 30,000 Baht/month but they will consider an overall picture. Please note that also you will be applying on humanitarian ground(Thai family).

Cheers

@oasis

Thanks! Will go ASAP - I don't live in BKK.

You mention that you applied and it seems to be if the application is received then one is OK. Above some answers were given, would just seek a 2nd opinion esp. as you have applied yourself!

My salary is "standard" govt. foreign teacher's wages - nothing great.

I am a qualified teacher with a masters.

Bank balance - a hundred thousand tops.

I do not own (nor does the wife) any property.

My level of Thai is: I can understand what my students and friends and family say (about 60%). Could probably speak that about 25%. Can't read or write, but I am now on that issue.

Legally in the country for 5+ years (not much more though) all on non-imm and extended since arrival (with exit permits) no breaks and no tourist visas.

Have submitted tax returns within Thailand on incomes of more that 15,000 Baht a month (Samran's quoted threshold) for 5 years.

Have never been fired from a Thai job (and with good references from Thais) and do not have a police record here or in my native country.

Comments?

You and I think this. luditeman mentioned this and I did too (but my post was only PR law).

The Special Branch link I provided has ZERO mention of humantiarian grounds. Hey, be my guest and read the docs and tell me I am wrong.

Your only choice then is to go to Bangkok and ask the Special Branch people, as has been said in this thread many times. You would have to invest a WHOLE day of your life, unfortunately. If that is too much, I am not sure how serious you are.

To which I already have replied that that is an ideal and I intend to do it one day in the near future. However, 99% seems to look bad for me and the family as confirimed by lengthy conversations and printed documents. Granted, that one percent is not resolved, but those who seem to attack me on failure to do the 1% fail to recoginze that 99% is against what has been stated by others.And please forgive me for saying that the 99% was confirmed (live - verbally and in writing) with the office that is responsible for this matter.

Edited November 26, 2011 by AngryParent

[FritsSikkink]

With Thai nationaity one can become a government teacher, and after a few years they get paid more than the average foreign teacher who normally earns something bewteen 30,0000 to 35,000 a month. A lot of the older teachers earn well over 40,000. Plus pension and free medical care (inlcuding for spouse, children and parents).

Says something profund.

Here, poor AngryParent, slaved for many years teaching thousands of Thai kids. As I am a foreigner, my wife and son will die the day I die, as no pension and all the rights that my family should get esp as I work for the government and 2/3 0f this family is Thai. No similar rights even though I work hard like all other teachers. I work for 1 month or 30 years does not make a difference. The day I die, is the day my Thai wife and son dies.

The above is one of the reasons why I chose the name AngryParent.

I think you use the word slave to much. Try to read Thai and get some more education so you can work at a higher level and earn a bit more money.

then put something in a pension fund too so when you die or can't work anymore your family still can live on.

[AngryParent]

With Thai nationaity one can become a government teacher, and after a few years they get paid more than the average foreign teacher who normally earns something bewteen 30,0000 to 35,000 a month. A lot of the older teachers earn well over 40,000. Plus pension and free medical care (inlcuding for spouse, children and parents).

Says something profund.

Here, poor AngryParent, slaved for many years teaching thousands of Thai kids. As I am a foreigner, my wife and son will die the day I die, as no pension and all the rights that my family should get esp as I work for the government and 2/3 0f this family is Thai. No similar rights even though I work hard like all other teachers. I work for 1 month or 30 years does not make a difference. The day I die, is the day my Thai wife and son dies.

The above is one of the reasons why I chose the name AngryParent.

I think you use the word slave to much. Try to read Thai and get some more education so you can work at a higher level and earn a bit more money.

then put something in a pension fund too so when you die or can't work anymore your family still can live on.

OK, I will spend the next 48 hours to read Thai ... K.. gai chicken... (oops something went wrong, the K and G did not work in harmony). I will put 10% of my salary into a pension. Should I choose a BKK pension fund or an offshore fund at a salary of 30-40,000 (Dollars or Thai Baht)?

Now that I have jumped up and down, will my Thai wife and son feel the security that this idiot teacher does not?

Edited November 26, 2011 by AngryParent

[ludditeman]

Here, poor AngryParent, slaved for many years teaching thousands of Thai kids. As I am a foreigner, my wife and son will die the day I die, as no pension and all the rights that my family should get esp as I work for the government and 2/3 0f this family is Thai. No similar rights even though I work hard like all other teachers. I work for 1 month or 30 years does not make a difference. The day I die, is the day my Thai wife and son dies.

You really are being a bit overly dramatic here, they will survive your death, but at first it will be harder for them.

Your son hopefully will speak both Thai and English perfectly and have a tremendous advantage over those that only speak Thai.

He should do well, with or without a high level of education, he will be able to travel the world without Visa worries.

Just stop having such a panic attack and try to enjoy yourself a bit more. Don't be too serious, mai nair jai.

How old are you?

Are you in good health?

Why all the 'I'm doomed' talk?

Edited November 26, 2011 by ludditeman

[AngryParent]

Here, poor AngryParent, slaved for many years teaching thousands of Thai kids. As I am a foreigner, my wife and son will die the day I die, as no pension and all the rights that my family should get esp as I work for the government and 2/3 0f this family is Thai. No similar rights even though I work hard like all other teachers. I work for 1 month or 30 years does not make a difference. The day I die, is the day my Thai wife and son dies.

You really are being a bit overly dramatic here, they will survive your death, but at first it will be harder for them.

Your son hopefully will speak both Thai and English perfectly and have a tremendous advantage over those that only speak Thai.

He should do well, with or without a high level of education, he will be able to travel the world without Visa worries.

Just stop having such a panic attack and try to enjoy yourself a bit more. Don't be too serious, mai nair jai.

How old are you?

Are you in good health?

Why all the 'I'm doomed' talk?

I am always amused by those that claim the realities of life are overly dramatic.

You asked 3 questions and the answers are as follows:

1. Over the age of minority.

2. Don't know, but I am sure Dr Watson will give a prognosis.

3. The doomed talk logically, empiracally and philisophically originates from the concept that Thai sons and wives are doomed by the legal position: that lacks human rights support of the current nationality system.

[FritsSikkink]

Here, poor AngryParent, slaved for many years teaching thousands of Thai kids. As I am a foreigner, my wife and son will die the day I die, as no pension and all the rights that my family should get esp as I work for the government and 2/3 0f this family is Thai. No similar rights even though I work hard like all other teachers. I work for 1 month or 30 years does not make a difference. The day I die, is the day my Thai wife and son dies.

You really are being a bit overly dramatic here, they will survive your death, but at first it will be harder for them.

Your son hopefully will speak both Thai and English perfectly and have a tremendous advantage over those that only speak Thai.

He should do well, with or without a high level of education, he will be able to travel the world without Visa worries.

Just stop having such a panic attack and try to enjoy yourself a bit more. Don't be too serious, mai nair jai.

How old are you?

Are you in good health?

Why all the 'I'm doomed' talk?

I am always amused by those that claim the realities of life are overly dramatic.

You asked 3 questions and the answers are as follows:

1. Over the age of minority.

2. Don't know, but I am sure Dr Watson will give a prognosis.

3. The doomed talk logically, empiracally and philisophically originates from the concept that Thai sons and wives are doomed by the legal position: that lacks human rights support of the current nationality system.

You could use the time you spend here to improve your qualifications so you have a better chance of getting a better paid job.

[AngryParent]

Here, poor AngryParent, slaved for many years teaching thousands of Thai kids. As I am a foreigner, my wife and son will die the day I die, as no pension and all the rights that my family should get esp as I work for the government and 2/3 0f this family is Thai. No similar rights even though I work hard like all other teachers. I work for 1 month or 30 years does not make a difference. The day I die, is the day my Thai wife and son dies.

You really are being a bit overly dramatic here, they will survive your death, but at first it will be harder for them.

Your son hopefully will speak both Thai and English perfectly and have a tremendous advantage over those that only speak Thai.

He should do well, with or without a high level of education, he will be able to travel the world without Visa worries.

Just stop having such a panic attack and try to enjoy yourself a bit more. Don't be too serious, mai nair jai.

How old are you?

Are you in good health?

Why all the 'I'm doomed' talk?

I am always amused by those that claim the realities of life are overly dramatic.

You asked 3 questions and the answers are as follows:

1. Over the age of minority.

2. Don't know, but I am sure Dr Watson will give a prognosis.

3. The doomed talk logically, empiracally and philisophically originates from the concept that Thai sons and wives are doomed by the legal position: that lacks human rights support of the current nationality system.

You could use the time you spend here to improve your qualifications so you have a better chance of getting a better paid job.

Will a PHD add lots more to a masters and qualified teachers status? I think Mario mentioned the limits for foreign teachers salary a few posts back.

There comes a time when enough is enough. Chasing carrots has been done before.

Make what you make of my posts.

[Phatcharanan]

There comes a time when enough is enough. Chasing carrots has been done before.

Make what you make of my posts.

Such a drama queen.

[endure]

There comes a time when enough is enough. Chasing carrots has been done before.

Make what you make of my posts.

Such a drama queen.

You have to admit it's better than watching the soaps.

[ludditeman]

You have to admit it's better than watching the soaps.

Nope, the soaps help improve my Thai vocabulary.

[endure]

You have to admit it's better than watching the soaps.

Nope, the soaps help improve my Thai vocabulary.

But AngryParent demonstrates the benefits of cultivating the Thai virtue of jai yen yen by showing his lack of it

[Boksida]

Here, poor AngryParent, slaved for many years teaching thousands of Thai kids. As I am a foreigner, my wife and son will die the day I die, as no pension and all the rights that my family should get esp as I work for the government and 2/3 0f this family is Thai. No similar rights even though I work hard like all other teachers. I work for 1 month or 30 years does not make a difference. The day I die, is the day my Thai wife and son dies.

The above is one of the reasons why I chose the name AngryParent.

You may be overlooking the fact that the majority of Thai workers are not government employees. Very few companies in the private sector have any sort of pension scheme. You may get one-off severance pay if you are fired, but resigning gets you nothing. Many of these people earn less, and work harder, than you..

There are millions of Thais in the same boat as you but their families do not seem to be dropping like flies.