6 Chiang Mai Districts Declared Disaster Zones

[Rider808]

Inthanon gets very cold, I went up there last week on a sunny day and my fingers nearly froze off while riding my bike around noon.

Guess it depends on what the elevation is where its declared a disaster. But then again hill tribes have been there for hundreds of years and am sure they know how to adapt.

[lannarebirth]

For the first time in weeks, my wife insisted we turn the air-con on in the bedroon last night. So far at least, it's been an extremely mild winter up this way.

[mijan24]

Time to trot out the age old question.

What happened to the blankets and warm clothing that were distributed last year?

Exactly ! I have wondered the same thing for years. Don't people keep them from year to year or are there that many new people with no clothes moving to the region every year?

They sell them go get cash?

Simple answer from George - Remember Thai peoples are not known for thinking for the future.(next winter/cold season)

Edited December 11, 2011 by metisdead
There is no need to post in bold font, bold font removed.

[pastitche]

Was BKK even declared a Diaster zone with the floods?

I do not doubt it is chilly up int he mountains, the same it gets chilly every year at the same time and every year a disaster is declared to free up the funds that the people in power have pre arranged blankets to supply, I suspect at a "special" price.

Why should the area that was protected at such cost to others have been declared a disaster zone?

[lee68]

Ive seen the blankets that they give out to the people in the village my wife comes from outside of mae on in chaing mai they are so thin,they must be about 50bt each.a mil baht can buy some blankets,and im sure the ones handling the cash arnt using them

Time to trot out the age old question.

What happened to the blankets and warm clothing that were distributed last year?

It seems I read about this issue every year, so I have to agree with you.... what happened to all the donated clothes and blankets years past?

Surely they don't just throw them away when the cold season passes. If so, I have to question if they should get more aid or not. Darwin has a funny way of taking care of those who don't take care of themselves.

That said, perhaps all the "blanket money" from years past never actually made it to buy blankets. Would be tragic if that is the reason.

Also, every year they know it's going to get cold. Why don't they prepare before hand?

It seems Thailand is one "disaster" after another. Always due to being ill prepared.

[pastitche]

Time to trot out the age old question.

What happened to the blankets and warm clothing that were distributed last year?

Exactly ! I have wondered the same thing for years. Don't people keep them from year to year or are there that many new people with no clothes moving to the region every year?

I asked that very question to the resident Thai expert and fount of all knowledge on all things (Mrs P) and was told that the goods involved were of poor quality and fell apart following a few washes. She has never lived further north than Phitsanulok but of course has a fine understanding of cold climate survival.

Being a lover of domestic harmony, I hesitated too long to ask what the people in those areas did to survive for thousands of years before quilted blankets and acrylic blankets were distributed free, perhaps they lit fires or the family livestock added their body heat to the dwelling place. Wisely, I believe I chose not to ask since she is an expert in all fields including the paleoantropology of Thai prehistory.

[nikster]

I agree that many people have a hard time. Maybe you know that there has been reports over the years that they dont' take care of the blankets. Even when its cold they use them to dry chilis, in some places. Well...

I know there are reports from me (as I have spent considerable time staying with the Lisu since 1994) that they need the blankets when it's cold to keep warm.......I can't confirm or deny other stories or myths I'm afraid.

One gives or not.....it's an easy choice.

+1

BTW it's way colder here than back home at the "same temperature". Living in Pai when it got down to 10 degrees in the morning I'd be absolutely freezing and wearing all clothes I have. Winter clothes I'd go snowboarding with back home. At that point I wasn't sure whether it really felt colder or whether I am just not used to the cold anymore. Then my mom came to visit. She lives in the coldest spot in Austria where we get -20 (Celsius) every winter... and she was freezing too. Conclusion: It feels colder in Thailand - my theory is it's due to the higher humidity. As water is a good conductor of heat, and air is a very poor one (or in other words air is a good insulator, while water is a terrible one), higher humidity should "feel" colder.

Planning for the future doesn't have a big tradition here so not surprised the blankets "disappear" every year. If the government was smart they'd put a collection fee on each and take them back for 10 baht each. Then re-use them the next year. Or maybe blankets are so cheap to begin with that storing them would be more expensive than buying new ones? If bought in bulk from China I'd believe it...

Edited December 11, 2011 by nikster

[geriatrickid]

Again, I remind those questioning the temperature to please refer to the Thai weather service and note the temperature is in the 10C (or lower range). Combine that with the dampness and it is indeed cold. 10C in the hills can be lethal for the elderly, infirm and children.

[pastitche]

What I said in my facetious post about Mrs P is true but there is no denying that cold (and that is a relative, if not qualitative term) is a debilitating condition, unless you are protected against it with the necessary materials and it does happen that people in Thailand die during cold spells; whether these numbers are many or few or are exacerbated by self-neglect eg alcohol as suggested in posts on this subject last year, is not the point. If government or public assistance can prevent these deaths then that should be encouraged.

I have been in the north in winter and I have found it cold because I was not dressed as I would have been for a northern European winter nor did the hotel bedding match what I would have had there; if hotels can be that ill-prepared, what likelihood is there that the poor will be?

[Thaddeus]

Thai prehistory.

When did that start, about 1950 perhaps, anything before that has been re-written, anything after that has been glossed over, and re-written later.

[Johpa]

Most of these blankets are distributed to piss poor minority villages up in the hills. They are "emergency" blankets of rather poor quality and they do not, nor are they designed, to survive long. After a few washings or being hung out, even under cover, during the many months of rain, they become useless as blankets. It is not just blankets as clothing does not last all that long either in these environments where there are no storage closets in the homes. Despite the musings seen here by comfortably ensconced neo-Sahib city dwellers, you will not find such used blankets being re-sold in town markets.

These very cold temperatures do not happen every year, last year was a relatively warm "cold season", and thus the blankets rarely survive till the next instance of relatively extreme cold. And rest assured, few of you would be able to sleep in a typical highland home when the temps get below even 15° C. As others have noted, once the temps get close to 10° C we see fatalities related to the cold amongst the elderly, infirm, and very young. So it is just so nice to see so many of our brave TV posters castigate both their host donor government as well as castigate the piss poor recipient highland farmers over a 100 baat emergency blanket.

[PoodMaiDai]

In the western world, people had to store food and fuel for use in the winter months, those who didn't died, those who did lived and reproduced, hence a culture of forward planning.

In Thailand food grows all year round, it never gets really cold, hardly anyone ever dies due to lack of planning, hence a culture that never included forward planning.

How hard is that to understand?

I don't know, as the people begging for blankets.

Don't have much sympathy for a culture who refuses to prepare simply because that's not the way they do things. That's called survival of the fittest, which they are not.

It's not a ridiculous statement, it is just what they do...like it or not.

Doesn't matter if I like it or not, I'm not the one who needs a blanket and didn't think to make one, borrow one, steal one, or keep one.

Only the strongest and smartest will survive.

Simple answer from George - Remember Thai peoples are not known for thinking for the future.(next winter/cold season)

Sorry about their luck then. You'd think after about 10 or 20 years of freezing your nads off every winter, you'd toss your way of thinking to the side and make some preparations.

I think there is a word for doing the same thing repeatedly and expecting a different outcome.

Most of these blankets are distributed to piss poor minority villages up in the hills. They are "emergency" blankets of rather poor quality and they do not, nor are they designed, to survive long. After a few washings or being hung out, even under cover, during the many months of rain, they become useless as blankets. It is not just blankets as clothing does not last all that long either in these environments where there are no storage closets in the homes. Despite the musings seen here by comfortably ensconced neo-Sahib city dwellers, you will not find such used blankets being re-sold in town markets.

These very cold temperatures do not happen every year, last year was a relatively warm "cold season", and thus the blankets rarely survive till the next instance of relatively extreme cold. And rest assured, few of you would be able to sleep in a typical highland home when the temps get below even 15° C. As others have noted, once the temps get close to 10° C we see fatalities related to the cold amongst the elderly, infirm, and very young. So it is just so nice to see so many of our brave TV posters castigate both their host donor government as well as castigate the piss poor recipient highland farmers over a 100 baat emergency blanket.

Considering these village people make so many things, it would be in their best interest to start making blankets that will keep them warm and last a little longer that a month.

Would it kill the government to take a bus or two up there and take them to a shelter for the coldest part of the season?

Cavemen survived the cold. So do homeless people in Chicago and New York in the dead of winter (where it's really cold). And that's all that needs to be said about that.

[Johpa]

Considering these village people make so many things, it would be in their best interest to start making blankets that will keep them warm and last a little longer that a month.

Would it kill the government to take a bus or two up there and take them to a shelter for the coldest part of the season?

Cavemen survived the cold. So do homeless people in Chicago and New York in the dead of winter (where it's really cold). And that's all that needs to be said about that.

I reckon that speaking may not be your only disability. You need right understanding and right thought before you can speak.

Upland minority people have been dying from these cold spells for countless generations. The garments they do make are made from cotton or hemp and have little insulating properties. The "cavemen" that you refer to lived in northern climates where they hunted large game and used the fur for insulating against the cold, and such game is not existent in Southeast Asia. Homeless people in North America also die every year from exposure to the cold, especially those without donated used parkas and other clothing necessary to survive lower temps. And as for buses, I guess you haven't visited many highland villages apart from the easily reachable and thus highly atypical villages such as Doi Pui or Mae Sa Mai where these is little need to distribute blankets. In other words, if you can reach a highland village by bus, or even by car, then you are unlikely to see a need for blankets. Thus we can ignore the logistical nightmare, the impossibility, of transporting the thousands of people distributed over the breadth of Chiang Mai, Chiang Rai, and Mae Hong Son on relatively short notice during these cold spells.

[kevbap]

So what has the temperature got to drop to to be declared a 'disaster zone' ? I once read it was something like 3 days of temps under 15 degrees, is that correct? I seems strange nobody has asked the question or am i just the only one who doesn't know the answer? if so then im right back at school, being the dumb ass !

It is definitely cold here, this is my first cold spell since coming to Chiang Mai nearly a year ago and my god it makes me yearn to get back on to Samui.

Keep safe everyone and watch out for that black ice and the 'dummy police' but that's another subject !

Kevin

[pauljones]

They sell them go get cash?

Maybe some places, but if you have a personal connection you will know that they really need them and appreciate them much more than cash.

It's a question of getting them direct to the people who need them not pretend do gooder's.

Unfortunately, it's true some do get sold for a pittance in the hot season, in order to buy other things. But this is a hard life and putting stuff away for next year when you need money for something now to survive, but don't need the blanket, takes preference. It's a survive today society, which we are lucky enough not to be part of.

It can be dam_n cold in the hills. Many of these people living there wake up every day without 1 baht to their name.

They do need help.

[sanpakwan]

Time to trot out the age old question.

What happened to the blankets and warm clothing that were distributed last year?

Well I can understand the need for clothing it does wear out but it seems like blankets last for years and yet every year they ask for them. If memory serves me rite a few years ago the King or Queen made a huge donation of blankets.

Good old Nation reporting they are in urgent need but don't tell where to give.

second hand market/meu song

[canopy]

I live in some of the coldest, highest, windiest northern mountains among poor and hill tribe people in rickety houses so I have a perspective that may have some relevance. First of all it just isn't THAT cold; we're not talking Alaska, but 50-ish by night and 70-ish by day (F). It's cool, windy and dry and feels just like California. Ironically, Thai tourists from Bangkok come flocking in massive numbers exclusively this time of year to enjoy this weather. Right in the heart of this so called disaster zone they can be found outdoors singing karaoke and consuming drinks with ice all night long.

Thus, this is a simple man made problem. The problem is as long as there are handouts of warm clothing every year, there just isn't any motivation for these poor folks to be bothered to keep any themselves and who can blame them? There is no need to feel sorry for these people, declare national disaster areas, and give them free stuff. That hurts everyone in the long run because it denies these people from a basic personal responsibility, clothing is wasted, the system is open to corruption, and it takes away from focusing on higher priority needs in the country. Today's weather is consistent with what they and their ancestors have faced long before outsiders felt assistance was needed. I am sure it is all well intentioned, but the smart course would be to phase out this yearly nonsense and impress upon them the fable "The Ant and The Grasshopper". These people are actually ingenious at taking care of themselves and each other in times of need if you let them. I pray welfare, daycare and nursing homes never make it here. Their time proven systems are superior. They were better off without the free blankets.

[mijan24]

Time to trot out the age old question.

What happened to the blankets and warm clothing that were distributed last year?

Exactly ! I have wondered the same thing for years. Don't people keep them from year to year or are there that many new people with no clothes moving to the region every year?

I asked that very question to the resident Thai expert and fount of all knowledge on all things (Mrs P) and was told that the goods involved were of poor quality and fell apart following a few washes. She has never lived further north than Phitsanulok but of course has a fine understanding of cold climate survival.

Being a lover of domestic harmony, I hesitated too long to ask what the people in those areas did to survive for thousands of years before quilted blankets and acrylic blankets were distributed free, perhaps they lit fires or the family livestock added their body heat to the dwelling place. Wisely, I believe I chose not to ask since she is an expert in all fields including the paleoantropology of Thai prehistory.

Off topic slightly but your post leads to one of my favourite sayings:

My wife always gives Sound Advice

99% Sound

1% Advice

Keep this under your hat :jap:

Edited December 12, 2011 by mijan24

[TongueThaied]

Time to trot out the age old question.

What happened to the blankets and warm clothing that were distributed last year?

You must have missed the hot "hot weather sale" in Hot last year.

[TAWP]

The government shouldn't deal with yearly (or monthly) handouts.

If this was an unexpected event, a sudden change in yearly behavior, fine. But it is not.

[Tanaka]

What a brilliant way for the Chinese Thai too add more to their riches up there, in the hills cold, daytime temperatures very warm.

In country from Udon 14 degrees last night 26 degrees now. so it is cool during the dark hours, but everyone in this area has a fire outside their home, bbq sticky rice, no blankets here.

This has been going on for donkeys years, and apart from the hill people-forget the blankets if people want to be warm and are in need they have to forget mobile cards-laos kow-cigs-lottery-and stop the son and daughter running around on the motor bike. Then they could buy warm clothing.

Lots of people queing now in Udon Night Market to buy second hand warm clothing.

[MESmith]

The hilltribes suffer in the colder months, that's a fact. But they need to be weaned from depending on annual gifts of poor quality blankets. Emergency donations should be for unexpected emergencies. Cold nights in the cold season are predictable & should be prepared for. Perhaps, a better solution is to encourage them to make their own quilts. They are quite proficient at weaving, so maybe they can be provided with polyester stuffing with which to make quilts. "Give a man a fish, he'll eat for one day. Teach him how to fish, he'll eat for a lifetime......" If you've made your own quilt, you're more likely to take of it for the future. Maybe quilts can be produced by the more productive, developed villages to be sold to the govt to be given as aid to the poorer, less able villagers?

[canopy]

Good ideas.

In my observation they suffer a lot more during the wet months. Their dirt roads to access fields in the hills turn into treacherous quagmires of mud that causes their vehicles to slide out of control, smash into the banks causing damage to vehicle and occupants, and get stuck. And they must work all day by hand on steep, unrelenting fields of mud. And when they come home mold is everywhere, their clothes don't air dry in the damp weather and their roof leaks. The whole blanket debacle I can only presume happened when people saw a foreign news piece on an unusual freezing cold spell elsewhere in the world and not to be outdone thought "aha, we will do that too". Don't get me wrong, there are times to help people in need but normal, predictable weather patterns are hardly one of them.

Edited December 13, 2011 by canopy