Living In Thailand

[SlyAnimal]

Seems like you guys have had some negative experiences in the past?

Or perhaps just negative attitudes in general?

There are plenty of opportunities for businesses in Thailand, same as with anywhere in the world. In Isaan the rewards aren't perhaps as high in a pure $ sense, but the %s are still there. In general however, since you likely won't be "working" within your business, you need to bring money to Thailand, and live off the % returns you can get from it, or alternatively invest in your home country for the % returns there. Which is best, depends on opportunities, tax rates and your knowledge of the areas / industries.

However starting a business, especially in Thailand, is always a risk, particularly if you're not Thai, thus haven't been watching local trends, and aren't friends / related to everyone in the village/town so that you can call in favors etc to get things done.

Edited January 24, 2012 by SlyAnimal

[jamescollister]

Seems like you guys have had some negative experiences in the past?

Or perhaps just negative attitudes in general?

There are plenty of opportunities for businesses in Thailand, same as with anywhere in the world. In Isaan the rewards aren't perhaps as high in a pure $ sense, but the %s are still there. In general however, since you likely won't be "working" within your business, you need to bring money to Thailand, and live off the % returns you can get from it, or alternatively invest in your home country for the % returns there. Which is best, depends on opportunities, tax rates and your knowledge of the areas / industries.

However starting a business, especially in Thailand, is always a risk, particularly if you're not Thai, thus haven't been watching local trends, and aren't friends / related to everyone in the village/town so that you can call in favors etc to get things done.

I have been here a long time and have seen them come with bright ideas of doing this and doing that in Thailand. Off the top of my head I can't remember anyone who came as a small timer, who has made it. Those that succeed are usually BOI sponsored and have invested big money.

Beer bars, restaurants, ma and pa village shops, internet and coffee shops, all are really hobbies. Farangs can't live on the monies earned and when things are slow they are money losers.

I know that the topic of how much it costs to live has been done to death on this forum, but there is a big difference between the cost of living for those who come to retire and just enjoy the life style and those who come to make a life.

Wife set up a little farag/Thai milk shake bar, in the front of the house. Biggest cost one blender. On a hot Sat or Sunday she can make 500 Baht profit, weekdays 200 Baht. Is it a business, no it's a hobby and when she gets bored with it, there will be no more milk shakes. If she set up in town, rented a shop etc she still could only charge the same and profits would still be the same.

Interesting to know is there anyone out there who has set up a low cost business and is making money. Know a few who have little village shops, anyone doing good. Jim

[rgs2001uk]

"Seems like you guys have had some negative experiences in the past?

Or perhaps just negative attitudes in general?"

Ok I'll take the bait.

Some of us have the luxury of time on our side, I didnt come to Thailand to make my fortune, I did that elsewhere before I came here.

From what I have observed the biggest obstacle will be your partner.

Most farang usually end up in the village town their partner is from and then try and establish some sort of business, instead of approaching it from a business standpoint of location.

Next problem, is the partner actually capable of running a business, or is the idea of a business lording it over others, sipping lattes while barking out orders.

Is it some sort of social welfare to employ worthless family members, the useless brother who will not be told what to do by his younger sister, cant be losing face in front of his whisky drinking mates.

Are mom and pop too long in the tooth to change their ways and embrace modern technology, is it the old, its the way we have always done it round here, its what everybody else does, what does the farang know?

I have seen them come and go, some have been lucky and have jobs to go back to, some didnt burn their bridges.

Some of these businesses are only kept afloat by the fact the farang is working outwith of Thailand and is able to subsidise his wifes hobby.

Are you talking about coming here to make a farang wage, lets say 200k per month, yes its possible, however the initial outlay will be beyond many, lets say 30 million outlay, and at least 15 years but probably 20 to get your money back.

Are you buying a hobby for yourself, yes many have indulged themselves and some make a go of it and are still here after a few years.

Are you embarking on a social welfare programme for the family, forget it, everyone I have seen has ended in failure.

Heard it all, beauty saloons, internet cafes, massage parlours, taxi companies, printing press etc etc.

Have a look at some of these farang bars, if you are lucky after all expenses you may clear an ELTs salary.

Yes Thailand has a positive outlook on business start up, so easy, park up at the side of the road and start selling grilled chicken.

However I have seen more than a few whose partner thinks that beneath her, loss of face, she is now a mia farang and expects all that goes with it.

Head over to the farming section and have a read, essential reading for many who are heading to the country.

Plenty of knowledgable posters with heaps of experience who can tell you the truth about being here, rather than the BS that is spoken in the many farang watering holes littering Issan.

[zzaa09]

On the flip side, one could just chase down decent employment - work for someone else - and cast aside the expected headaches of owning and operating a business.

Retired or not.

[jamescollister]

Well put there rgs

The reality is that just like anywhere in the world a business that makes money costs money to buy.

On a side note, anyone have 300,000 US dollars lying around. I have a Vietnamese buyer who wants 40 metric tons of rubber a month and on checking with the bank I find I have only 30,000 Baht, a bit short and I am not joking by the way. JIm

[zzaa09]

"Seems like you guys have had some negative experiences in the past?

Or perhaps just negative attitudes in general?"

Ok I'll take the bait.

Some of us have the luxury of time on our side, I didnt come to Thailand to make my fortune, I did that elsewhere before I came here.

From what I have observed the biggest obstacle will be your partner.

Most farang usually end up in the village town their partner is from and then try and establish some sort of business, instead of approaching it from a business standpoint of location.

Next problem, is the partner actually capable of running a business, or is the idea of a business lording it over others, sipping lattes while barking out orders.

Is it some sort of social welfare to employ worthless family members, the useless brother who will not be told what to do by his younger sister, cant be losing face in front of his whisky drinking mates.

Are mom and pop too long in the tooth to change their ways and embrace modern technology, is it the old, its the way we have always done it round here, its what everybody else does, what does the farang know?

I have seen them come and go, some have been lucky and have jobs to go back to, some didnt burn their bridges.

Some of these businesses are only kept afloat by the fact the farang is working outwith of Thailand and is able to subsidise his wifes hobby.

Are you talking about coming here to make a farang wage, lets say 200k per month, yes its possible, however the initial outlay will be beyond many, lets say 30 million outlay, and at least 15 years but probably 20 to get your money back.

Are you buying a hobby for yourself, yes many have indulged themselves and some make a go of it and are still here after a few years.

Are you embarking on a social welfare programme for the family, forget it, everyone I have seen has ended in failure.

Heard it all, beauty saloons, internet cafes, massage parlours, taxi companies, printing press etc etc.

Have a look at some of these farang bars, if you are lucky after all expenses you may clear an ELTs salary.

Yes Thailand has a positive outlook on business start up, so easy, park up at the side of the road and start selling grilled chicken.

However I have seen more than a few whose partner thinks that beneath her, loss of face, she is now a mia farang and expects all that goes with it.

Head over to the farming section and have a read, essential reading for many who are heading to the country.

Plenty of knowledgable posters with heaps of experience who can tell you the truth about being here, rather than the BS that is spoken in the many farang watering holes littering Issan.

Well thought out, my friend. The truth will sting sometimes.

Yet, for every 10 farang that fail or struggle there will be a couple success stories of assorted flavours.

For us that have settled here a while and experienced all the sights and sounds will surely advise that it's almost a hit and miss sort of thing. Even those surfaced successes will show struggles and downsides in reality. This applies to the supposed niche market, as well.

For us, a substantial amount of acreage parcels has panned out. Developed and stratagised quite well.

[jamescollister]

"Seems like you guys have had some negative experiences in the past?

Or perhaps just negative attitudes in general?"

Ok I'll take the bait.

Some of us have the luxury of time on our side, I didnt come to Thailand to make my fortune, I did that elsewhere before I came here.

From what I have observed the biggest obstacle will be your partner.

Most farang usually end up in the village town their partner is from and then try and establish some sort of business, instead of approaching it from a business standpoint of location.

Next problem, is the partner actually capable of running a business, or is the idea of a business lording it over others, sipping lattes while barking out orders.

Is it some sort of social welfare to employ worthless family members, the useless brother who will not be told what to do by his younger sister, cant be losing face in front of his whisky drinking mates.

Are mom and pop too long in the tooth to change their ways and embrace modern technology, is it the old, its the way we have always done it round here, its what everybody else does, what does the farang know?

I have seen them come and go, some have been lucky and have jobs to go back to, some didnt burn their bridges.

Some of these businesses are only kept afloat by the fact the farang is working outwith of Thailand and is able to subsidise his wifes hobby.

Are you talking about coming here to make a farang wage, lets say 200k per month, yes its possible, however the initial outlay will be beyond many, lets say 30 million outlay, and at least 15 years but probably 20 to get your money back.

Are you buying a hobby for yourself, yes many have indulged themselves and some make a go of it and are still here after a few years.

Are you embarking on a social welfare programme for the family, forget it, everyone I have seen has ended in failure.

Heard it all, beauty saloons, internet cafes, massage parlours, taxi companies, printing press etc etc.

Have a look at some of these farang bars, if you are lucky after all expenses you may clear an ELTs salary.

Yes Thailand has a positive outlook on business start up, so easy, park up at the side of the road and start selling grilled chicken.

However I have seen more than a few whose partner thinks that beneath her, loss of face, she is now a mia farang and expects all that goes with it.

Head over to the farming section and have a read, essential reading for many who are heading to the country.

Plenty of knowledgable posters with heaps of experience who can tell you the truth about being here, rather than the BS that is spoken in the many farang watering holes littering Issan.

Well thought out, my friend. The truth will sting sometimes.

Yet, for every 10 farang that fail or struggle there will be a couple success stories of assorted flavours.

For us that have settled here a while and experienced all the sights and sounds will surely advise that it's almost a hit and miss sort of thing. Even those surfaced successes will show struggles and downsides in reality. This applies to the supposed niche market, as well.

For us, a substantial amount of acreage parcels has panned out. Developed and stratagised quite well.

zzaa you must be an optimist, 1 in 10, think more like one in 100 that make it. jim

[rick75]

What about rental accommodation, could be as basic as say convert two 4 story shop houses into small Thai rooms 4 floors 2 rooms per floor per building @1500 - 2000bht/month, through to something a little larger purpose built 2 story 30 rooms...any guys had experience with this type of thing I have seen a couple for sale on the Thai sites, the numbers seem to stack up ok......obviously wife owns it I lease it etc etc

We are talking in the cities or larger centres focused on working Thais or students, this is not luxury accommodation, its cheap.

Any thoughts?

[jamescollister]

What about rental accommodation, could be as basic as say convert two 4 story shop houses into small Thai rooms 4 floors 2 rooms per floor per building @1500 - 2000bht/month, through to something a little larger purpose built 2 story 30 rooms...any guys had experience with this type of thing I have seen a couple for sale on the Thai sites, the numbers seem to stack up ok......obviously wife owns it I lease it etc etc

We are talking in the cities or larger centres focused on working Thais or students, this is not luxury accommodation, its cheap.

Any thoughts?

Never really looked too deeply into the shop house idea, but Thais seem to build them all over the place. Most out side of cities and large towns, just lay empty . So location, location, location as they say. If it's in the right place, bet it won't be cheap. Just as an example in our nearest town, Buntharik. Not even really what you would call a town, a singe fronted shop house on the main road sold for 4 mil Baht last month. May be a good long term investment, but don't think you would recoup the investment through rent for many many years to come.

Been told that Thais build them because of the low bank interest. If they have spare cash build something and let it sit and hope the values grow over the years. Jim

[sinbin]

How to set up business, Thai style. First, find an empty shop available for rent. Then go around and have a look and see what everyone else is selling. So then you start selling the same thing. Seems to work work for the Thais.

[rgs2001uk]

What about rental accommodation, could be as basic as say convert two 4 story shop houses into small Thai rooms 4 floors 2 rooms per floor per building @1500 - 2000bht/month, through to something a little larger purpose built 2 story 30 rooms...any guys had experience with this type of thing I have seen a couple for sale on the Thai sites, the numbers seem to stack up ok......obviously wife owns it I lease it etc etc

We are talking in the cities or larger centres focused on working Thais or students, this is not luxury accommodation, its cheap.

Any thoughts?

Well as you know Issan is a fair old land mass, you would need to try and identify an area or particular town.

The two biggest obstacles will be cost of land and property.

You mention Thai websites, so I assume you are able to read Thai,

http://www.smilehomes.com/apartment_catalog.htm

The above is a link for various styles of apt buildings, in theory the build costs should be the same anywhere, I dont know about the cost of land fill and piling which will of course be extra.

This assumes you already own the land.

http://www.ddproperty.com/

This is probably one of the better sites giving options for various property types by area, although the prices asked are open to question, a case of a bit of local knowledge helping.

Anyway, lets cut to the chase, depending on which way you go, townhouses which can be expensive, or buying land and building your own block of flats, or buying an existing lot, you could easily be looking at a min of 8, 10, 12 or 15 million baht.

While it aint retirement money its a fair old chunk of change.

Before I dropped that sort of coin I would be looking for the maximum possible protection, quite franky a lease wouldnt cut it for me.

The fact you mentioned lease implies you also have reservations.

For that reason I would be more inclined to consider buying a condo in my own name in Bkk and renting it out.

Its hard to be more specific, each case will differ depending on age, money available, will this be your only source of income or will it be supplemented by other income from overseas eg a pension, whats your spread of assets etc etc.

The mere fact that you are asking these questions already puts you ahead of many, the ones who just turn up here and wing it.

I know of at least two guys who are quietly going about their business with no fanfare or fuss, they should make it.

For our more affluent members, the following may be of some assistance, for those who think Issan is a cheap place, read and weep,

http://www.ddproperty.com/properties/search?search[place_type_id]=5&search[post_type_id]=3&search[province_code]=40&search[district_code]=&search[price_min]=&search[price_max]=&commit=%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%B4%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%84%E0%B9%89%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%AB%E0%B8%B2

The 239 million on 3 rai is a bit to steep for me.

[zzaa09]

What about rental accommodation, could be as basic as say convert two 4 story shop houses into small Thai rooms 4 floors 2 rooms per floor per building @1500 - 2000bht/month, through to something a little larger purpose built 2 story 30 rooms...any guys had experience with this type of thing I have seen a couple for sale on the Thai sites, the numbers seem to stack up ok......obviously wife owns it I lease it etc etc

We are talking in the cities or larger centres focused on working Thais or students, this is not luxury accommodation, its cheap.

Any thoughts?

I believe, in some cases, rentals can be a decent long-term value - if things go south the pain is lessened. A good relationship with the landlord will help....and carte blanche.

With that kind of space and imagination [and cash] one could develop something nice.

There are dozens of examples, in city situations, of multi-level buildings that have been converted into a couple of different business ventures [yet related]. As James has mention, location would be key......depending on what you're promoting.

[rick75]

rgs2001uk, in regards to the lease I don't have reservations I just added that so we didn't have to listen to your mad if you trust your wife type conversations.

If we were looking at condos we would be looking at the cheap Thai owned ones also, She has a friend Here in Australia that owns 3 condo's in Bkk, the rental returns are ok

but for 2 million baht price tag return is only 20k a month per condo.

I was just throwing the idea out there, we are both only young and will be working here in Australia for quit a few years to come, but for something down the track