Driving Standards

[nonthaburial]

In my youth (oh god so long ago) at the age of 18, I sat and passed my driving test in a military Bedford 3 ton truck.Straight in at the deep end was my thought at the time.

Over the years and having driven what must be hundreds and hundreds of thousands of miles, using all sorts of transport from Tanks, Articulated Trucks, Heavy trucks, Cars and Motorcycles and even a number of Double deck buses, I have never yet had the embarrassment of being involved in a traffic accident.

I have driven on nearly every continent and as one would expect have encountered driving standards ranging from excellent to non existant. Later in my life - just for the hel_l of it- I sat and passed the UK Institute of Advanced Motorists test.

Why am I telling all this, well certainly not to boost my ego but perhaps in a round about way of putting a few records straight.

I have read on TV about people in Thailand openly proud of themselves whilst driving under the influence of alcohol. I have also read of a person who was smacked in the back of his pickup by a youth who was under the influence and the innocent victim is suffering from huge guilt feelings.

I have also read a few threads that home in on pure racialism or maybe its cultural differences, however which ever it is, driving manners (or lack of) in Thailand are totally atrocious and one must be 110% aware at all times when driving defensively here.

It says an awful lot when intoxicated people have accidents OR are found to be intoxicated here by the BIB and are let off scot free. The guy who rammed his motorcylce into the back of a pickup AND the lady who admitted that she was treated like a VIP after being found intoxicated behind the wheel should be locked up and the keys thrown away. And its certainly not an episode in life to be proud of!!

How can mature, careful drivers have any form of sympathy for brain dead idiots of all races who consider that their motorcycles, and their helmetless attitudes gives them any rights if an accident should occur.

In the last paragraph I mentioned "all races" yes isnt it sad to see farangs on vacation who joing the local idiots in driving intoxicated without helmets - something thst would probably get them locked up for a long time in their own countries. So why do they do it whilst they are here in Thailand.

I just wish it could be realised that a motor vehicle is no different to a firearm in the hands of idiots and senseless people, they are killers.

Rant Over and soapbox returned to store room!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[johnh101]

Well, today my wife failed her driving test and I not unhappy about this.

She could have gone to another test house where the instruction consists of driving forward 20 metres and then reversing around a bend, and voila a Thai Driving License.

Instead I insisted she do it 'properly' . This sadly only involved 20 hours of lessons and at the weekend I gave her a go in our car, she was not up to any standard that I would allow out on the road on her own, I told her what ever the result today to book another 20 hours of the 'advanced' driving course to which she agreed.

She failed and is not too bothered about as she admitted that she knew she is not good enough ....yet ! !

God save us all when she does pass.

[penzman]

God save us all when she does pass.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Please post on here the day she passes and include a map of the area where she will most likely be driving.

[DUNK Performance-Thailand]

As i am Thai/lao/Khmer and born and raised here i love my country. Just because we do do things such as driving and regulations the same as western countries and other countries , UK, USA and those others, there is no need to bash our driving. Go there then , why be here and then complain? We do drive well even partial intoxicated, altho i do not advice it to any my employes or driving students. I for 1 pride myself on my great driving skills, and not just that of a street or proffesional racer.

[moonoi]

As i am Thai/lao/Khmer and born and raised here i love my country. Just because we do do things such as driving and regulations the same as western countries and other countries , UK, USA and those others, there is no need to bash our driving. Go there then , why be here and then complain? We do drive well even partial intoxicated, altho i do not advice it to any my employes or driving students. I for 1 pride myself on my great driving skills, and not just that of a street or proffesional racer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its precisely this attitude that causes most of the problems with driving here No one can drive well drunk I don't care who you are or what country you come from.

[OlRedEyes]

God save us all when she does pass.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Please post on here the day she passes and include a map of the area where she will most likely be driving.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

As i am Thai/lao/Khmer and born and raised here i love my country. Just because we do do things such as driving and regulations the same as western countries and other countries , UK, USA and those others, there is no need to bash our driving. Go there then , why be here and then complain? We do drive well even partial intoxicated, altho i do not advice it to any my employes or driving students. I for 1 pride myself on my great driving skills, and not just that of a street or proffesional racer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

A map of where you will be driving will also be greatly appreciated.

[jbowman1993]

Driving poorly is just a symptom of the larger problem, a poor education system. The people who you routinely see driving this way, for the most part, have a very limited education, and they simply don't know any better. Wholesale education reform is the only way to bring about any significant change this area. As a university teacher, I am trying to do my own small part to effect a change on my students, and hope that is carries over.

When you combine poor education with a life philosophy that believes in predestination (i.e. your fate will be the same, regardless of what you do, or not), you can see the problem. My wife is a well educated Thai, and she understands these issues. In her work environment, she implements education and safety programs, and the rate of accidents as dropped significantly. Also, the number of outside of work related accidents (which can be gauged when you look at hospital visits), has also dropped sharply.

Poor and uneducated people are the same the world over, and since you have had the advantages of better education, and more money (since you can afford a car), its up to you, and those like you (including me) to try to make a positive difference in our own communities.

Peace

[DUNK Performance-Thailand]

Driving poorly is just a symptom of the larger problem, a poor education system. The people who you routinely see driving this way, for the most part, have a very limited education, and they simply don't know any better.  Wholesale education reform is the only way to bring about any significant change this area.  As a university teacher, I am trying to do my own small part to effect a change on my students, and hope that is carries over.

When you combine poor education with a life philosophy that believes in predestination (i.e. your fate will be the same, regardless of what you do, or not), you can see the problem.  My wife is a well educated Thai, and she understands these issues.  In her work environment, she implements education and safety programs, and the rate of accidents as dropped significantly.  Also, the number of outside of work related accidents (which can be gauged when you look at hospital visits), has also dropped sharply.

Poor and uneducated people are the same the world over, and since you have had the advantages of better education, and more money (since you can afford a car), its up to you, and those like you (including me) to try to make a positive difference in our own communities.

Peace

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I hope that yu are not sayin that yu are teh reason for less hospital visits? Give meeh a fukin break. So many westerners come and then throw their opinoins on how people should drive and how things should be, go back where yu came frum then. Now another person saying it's because we lack education, thats just wrong. Even tho i am well educated and also a college graduate i cannot speak for every1 and so cant anyone else speak for anyone else. Their is bad driving anywhere , so dont just lay the blame here. Maybe if yu could read the road signs yud have a better driving experiance. Ive had onlee 2 accidents in the whole time ive been driving and both i was hit by a "carefree" kno everything faraang. Your too busy trying to wave at everyone " look at meeh im a faraang driving in thailand" instead of paying attention to the road. Just because yu may live here now gives yu kno presidance to judge us, we ARE THAI , so dont be so quick to judge us when yu abandoned yur old country to come here. And the guy that is all my thai wife is Thai and educated, who cares, she's a sellout , marrying a westerner to think to better her status and for money. im a businessman and proud of my country i was born and raised no matter how the driving. maybe its just the outsiders that need to adapt to the driving, not us.

[penzman]

Ive had onlee 2 accidents in the whole time ive been driving and both i was hit by a "carefree" kno everything faraang.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow! With the high number of accidents in this country, what are the odds?

[dr_Pat_Pong]

As i am Thai/lao/Khmer and born and raised here i love my country. Just because we do do things such as driving and regulations the same as western countries and other countries , UK, USA and those others, there is no need to bash our driving. Go there then , why be here and then complain? We do drive well even partial intoxicated, altho i do not advice it to any my employes or driving students. I for 1 pride myself on my great driving skills, and not just that of a street or proffesional racer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You can write better English sometimes.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Driving poorly is just a symptom of the larger problem, a poor education system. The people who you routinely see driving this way, for the most part, have a very limited education, and they simply don't know any better.  Wholesale education reform is the only way to bring about any significant change this area.  As a university teacher, I am trying to do my own small part to effect a change on my students, and hope that is carries over.

When you combine poor education with a life philosophy that believes in predestination (i.e. your fate will be the same, regardless of what you do, or not), you can see the problem.  My wife is a well educated Thai, and she understands these issues.  In her work environment, she implements education and safety programs, and the rate of accidents as dropped significantly.  Also, the number of outside of work related accidents (which can be gauged when you look at hospital visits), has also dropped sharply.

Poor and uneducated people are the same the world over, and since you have had the advantages of better education, and more money (since you can afford a car), its up to you, and those like you (including me) to try to make a positive difference in our own communities.

Peace

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I hope that yu are not sayin that yu are teh reason for less hospital visits? Give meeh a fukin break. So many westerners come and then throw their opinoins on how people should drive and how things should be, go back where yu came frum then. Now another person saying it's because we lack education, thats just wrong. Even tho i am well educated and also a college graduate i cannot speak for every1 and so cant anyone else speak for anyone else. Their is bad driving anywhere , so dont just lay the blame here. Maybe if yu could read the road signs yud have a better driving experiance. Ive had onlee 2 accidents in the whole time ive been driving and both i was hit by a "carefree" kno everything faraang. Your too busy trying to wave at everyone " look at meeh im a faraang driving in thailand" instead of paying attention to the road. Just because yu may live here now gives yu kno presidance to judge us, we ARE THAI , so dont be so quick to judge us when yu abandoned yur old country to come here. And the guy that is all my thai wife is Thai and educated, who cares, she's a sellout , marrying a westerner to think to better her status and for money. im a businessman and proud of my country i was born and raised no matter how the driving. maybe its just the outsiders that need to adapt to the driving, not us.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Mmmmm back to the old style

[DUNK Performance-Thailand]

Driving poorly is just a symptom of the larger problem, a poor education system. The people who you routinely see driving this way, for the most part, have a very limited education, and they simply don't know any better.  Wholesale education reform is the only way to bring about any significant change this area.  As a university teacher, I am trying to do my own small part to effect a change on my students, and hope that is carries over.

When you combine poor education with a life philosophy that believes in predestination (i.e. your fate will be the same, regardless of what you do, or not), you can see the problem.  My wife is a well educated Thai, and she understands these issues.  In her work environment, she implements education and safety programs, and the rate of accidents as dropped significantly.  Also, the number of outside of work related accidents (which can be gauged when you look at hospital visits), has also dropped sharply.

Poor and uneducated people are the same the world over, and since you have had the advantages of better education, and more money (since you can afford a car), its up to you, and those like you (including me) to try to make a positive difference in our own communities.

Peace

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I hope that yu are not sayin that yu are teh reason for less hospital visits? Give meeh a fukin break. So many westerners come and then throw their opinoins on how people should drive and how things should be, go back where yu came frum then. Now another person saying it's because we lack education, thats just wrong. Even tho i am well educated and also a college graduate i cannot speak for every1 and so cant anyone else speak for anyone else. Their is bad driving anywhere , so dont just lay the blame here. Maybe if yu could read the road signs yud have a better driving experiance. Ive had onlee 2 accidents in the whole time ive been driving and both i was hit by a "carefree" kno everything faraang. Your too busy trying to wave at everyone " look at meeh im a faraang driving in thailand" instead of paying attention to the road. Just because yu may live here now gives yu kno presidance to judge us, we ARE THAI , so dont be so quick to judge us when yu abandoned yur old country to come here. And the guy that is all my thai wife is Thai and educated, who cares, she's a sellout , marrying a westerner to think to better her status and for money. im a businessman and proud of my country i was born and raised no matter how the driving. maybe its just the outsiders that need to adapt to the driving, not us.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Mmmmm back to the old style

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It just depend if i am at office or in the shop, i hab to switch between a computer that has thai text to english conversion and one that has not it the program.Anyway everyone try there best the way they drive , if they dont drive like yu want to bad no one can change just like that.So we learn to accept it and we kno who to watch out for.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

The style is most annoying. Thus, I have to keep an eye on you.

[jbowman1993]

Don't Worry DUNK, I still love you!

Peace

[jbowman1993]

And the guy that is all my thai wife is Thai and educated, who cares, she's a sellout , marrying a westerner to think to better her status and for money.

Actually, I think that I must be the sellout. lol My wife makes 4x more money than I do, as a poor university professor. And I am sure that my wife has bettered my status. She has civilized me!

[johnh101]

God save us all when she does pass.

Please post on here the day she passes and include a map of the area where she will most likely be driving.

I may tell you when she passes, but sorry I won't be able to tell you where she is driving as I will be well out of the danger zone ! !

[opothai]

quote

Your too busy trying to wave at everyone " look at meeh im a faraang driving in thailand" instead of paying attention to the road.

driving in thailand is an experience, that you should never forget.

as for waving to people and look at me i'm a falang, well it's best to keep a low profile or police fines [ bribery ] comes into play.

but No 1 how can you drive and look out for people to wave to when thier are so many lorries, busses, and motor bikes all trying to win some sort of race.

i'm not saying the average driver in thailand is bad but from our experieces thier could be a little room for improvement.

[sbk]

I really don't think advocating driving while intoxicated is a good idea and suggest that anyone who continues to do so will find themselves in some trouble here

[nonthaburial]

My IP was never meant to be inflammatory, nor was it aimed with a racial bias. It was meant to be an honest observation of the driving standards in Thailand.

Then along comes DUNK who has, in an attempt to justify the standards here, merely confirmed my earlier observations as wellas turning it into a racial thread.

Some of DUNKS comments qualify him for the same "lock up and throw the keys away" suggestion and it certainly worries me that a self confessed educated man with a Uni degree can spout off such drivel.

Horses for courses I guess !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dr_Pat_Pong]

He has taken his leave

[dr.cruella]

I'm one who is in Thai gov. university. I don't care what you try to present urself like a prof. and showoff ur educated thai wife(Mostly farang try to up their gf's status. i CAN SAY THIS BCOZ i CAN CHECK FROM dbs SYSTEM THAT WHO IS YOUR GF)

Go to my point, if you don't like us. I am asking you "Why do you stay in my country?

If you think that Thailand country " all it bad, girl need just money, liar, poor laws and regulations, take an advantage from your white skin...etc.

Easyway to go to the airport and leave from Thailand. Ride on bus no.95,34,59 or by taxi.

DO IT IF YOU DON'T LIKE US.

IF YOU WANNA TAKE AN ADVATAGE FROM PEOPLE IN DEVELOPING COUNTRY LIKE THAILAND. FOLLOW US NOT JUDGE BY YOUR OWN STANDARD.

[jayenram]

I have asked this question of Thai drivers in the past and have not received any satisfactory answers.

Do you consider the following to be the Thai driving style which, as foreigners, we should all imitate?

Allowing up to 20 persons to ride in the back of an open pick-up.

Carrying 30 paks of rice (c. 2,400 kg) on the back of a 750 kg pick-up.

Driving the wrong way on a dual carriageway to save time.

Driving the wrong way down a one-way street to save time.

Ignoring red lights if there is apparently no traffic coming the other way.

Ignoring red lights if there is traffic coming the other way.

Driving a two seater motorbike with four passengers.

Ignoring all road lane markings.

Overtaking under any circumstances as long as you flash your headlights.

Turning right across oncoming traffic as if you have the right-of-way.

Pulling out left from a junction assuming you have the right-of-way.

Leaving your motorbike helmet in the front basket until you see a police check.

Effecting a full 'U' turn without looking if you have forgotten to put your helmet in the basket.

Driving without any form of licence.

Driving without any form of insurance.

Driving on slick tyres.

Pushing an 'out of fuel' motorbike with your left foot to the nearest gas station.

Driving without lights at night (saving electricity).

Driving whilst never having read, or understood, the Thai highway code.

I'm sure there are more examples that I personally haven't noticed.

[nonthaburial]

jayenram I do wish that you would stop nit picking

[moonoi]

I'm one who is in Thai gov. university. I don't care what you try to present urself like a prof. and showoff ur educated thai wife(Mostly farang try to up their gf's status. i CAN SAY THIS BCOZ i CAN CHECK FROM dbs SYSTEM THAT WHO IS YOUR GF)

Go to my point, if you don't like us. I am asking you "Why do you stay in my country?

If you think that Thailand country " all it bad, girl need just money, liar, poor laws and regulations, take an advantage from your white skin...etc.

Easyway to go to the airport and leave from Thailand. Ride on bus no.95,34,59 or by taxi.

DO IT IF YOU DON'T LIKE US.

IF YOU WANNA TAKE AN ADVATAGE FROM PEOPLE IN DEVELOPING COUNTRY LIKE THAILAND. FOLLOW US NOT JUDGE BY YOUR OWN STANDARD.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I thought this thread was about driving standards!!!!!! Not about farang wanting to increase the status of there thai gf/wife (which I very much doubt happens anyway)

I like thai people and thailand, however I think there is place for constructive critism....no one is perfect.

I think the biggest problem for most people is a lack of awareness of what is going on around them.....they just concentrate on the road ahead (admittedly sometimes not even the road) and don't use mirrors for what they are supposed to be for etc etc. Also it would be nice if people were a little more courteous.....letting me out of a side road in front of you isn't going to make you any latter arriving at your destination....perhaps this selfishness contributes to the traffic issues.........although thai police don't help much either wonder if they'll ever implement a proper traffic management system

EDIT: Forgot to add that the thai road law is also not the problem, its not that disimilar to western europe.....the problem is lack of enforcement here too,....

Edited December 15, 2005 by moonoi

[zzap]

I have asked this question of Thai drivers in the past and have not received any satisfactory answers.

Do you consider the following to be the Thai driving style which, as foreigners, we should all imitate?

Allowing up to 20 persons to ride in the back of an open pick-up.

Carrying 30 paks of rice (c. 2,400 kg) on the back of a 750 kg pick-up.

Driving the wrong way on a dual carriageway to save time.

Driving the wrong way down a one-way street to save time.

Ignoring red lights if there is apparently no traffic coming the other way.

Ignoring red lights if there is traffic coming the other way.

Driving a two seater motorbike with four passengers.

Ignoring all road lane markings.

Overtaking under any circumstances as long as you flash your headlights.

Turning right across oncoming traffic as if you have the right-of-way.

Pulling out left from a junction assuming you have the right-of-way.

Leaving your motorbike helmet in the front basket until you see a police check.

Effecting a full 'U' turn without looking if you have forgotten to put your helmet in the basket.

Driving without any form of licence.

Driving without any form of insurance.

Driving on slick tyres.

Pushing an 'out of fuel' motorbike with your left foot to the nearest gas station.

Driving without lights at night (saving electricity).

Driving whilst never having read, or understood, the Thai highway code.

I'm sure there are more examples that I personally haven't noticed.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Perhaps 'they' are less indoctrinated to follow rigid sets of rules, something most visitors like about the place in other areas of life... And perhaps they are better equipped to move in the traffic of their own country than the average visitor?

[RamdomChances]

I dont really have much problem with Thai drivers, actually the driving is quite prebictable here after a while. Trying to enforce the same rules and standerds as your home country here will just not work, you've just got to adapt to the driving style here. The thing is most of the driving laws are very simular to most western countries , they are just seldom enforced

Saying that I think if someone opend a thread in a board about any country everyone could find something to complain about...strangley I've naver heard anybody admit to being a bad driver ....but everyone else is

dr.cruella is there a database now listing all the falangs here and the social status of their GF's...WOW, next thing you know they will get a central computer records for things like ID cards and driving licences

RC

[Butterfly]

I dont really have much problem with Thai drivers, actually the driving is quite prebictable here after a while. Trying to enforce the same rules and standerds as your home country here will just not work, you've just got to adapt to the driving style here. The thing is most of the driving laws are very simular to most western countries , they are just seldom enforced

RC

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually this is a good point. I have also started to adapt to the "local" driving and I am starting to like it. You need to be a little bit more careful. Thais must be doing something right because with all those security violations they have, you would expect a greater number of accidents.

Anyway, I have always been a safe driver but now here I am taking more risk. Emergency lane because a slow truck is on the way ? no problem. Quite effective driving actually. However, the non-existant distance between cars is the only thing that make me worried.

This week I almost hit 5 motorcycles again, but who cares they are expendable

[Thaiboxer]

Some good points have been made; in particular the one about traffic laws being similar to Western traffic laws. Lack of law enforcement is a big problem here and not just in regards to traffic. Driving standards here are not as good as in many Western countries and anybody who has lived in or traveled in the West and here can see that. If driver education were standardized; perhaps offered in public schools and if traffic laws were enforced properly, surely the driving standards would be equivalent to those in the West. Having said that, let me say that compared to many other countries, driving standards here are not that bad. Some African countries and parts of the Middle East have a reputation for being MUCH worse than here.

[tom yum goong]

i agree you can adapt to driving here. after a while you know that the car in front who is indicating right is actually going to break hard and make a sudden left turn. i guess its a kind of ESP. it takes a while but if you are always on your toes, you can avoid being in an accident.

however, i dont agree that if you don't like the standard of driving, you should leave. dr cruella's attitude is why this country is unable to move forward. unfortunately it is prevalent throughout Thai society, educated and uneducated. perhaps even more so among my educated countrymen (and women).

driving standards here are dire. its no accident that Thai roads are some of the most dangerous in the world. bad driving and poor road manners also contribute to traffic congestion.

what can be done about it? for a start the driving test is way too easy. its even more scary that the people who are so inept at driving that they manage to fail what should be a simple formality, are able to purchase their licence by greasing a grubby palm with a paltry 500 baht.

also the fact that there is no "learner driver' system. Basically you get your licence first, then learn to drive. surely thats the wrong way round?

dr cruella, get your head out of the sand or out of wherever you've stuck it. if no one complained, nothing would ever improve.

[jayenram]

Perhaps 'they' are less indoctrinated to follow rigid sets of rules, something most visitors like about the place in other areas of life... And perhaps they are better equipped to move in the traffic of their own country than the average visitor?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Still no satisfactory answers though.