Transsexual Thai Air Hostesses: Gimmick Or Equality?

[Trouble]

So this is turning into a general GLBT bashing thread. How predictable. The intolerance and ignorance is stunning.

Would you tell me even one reason - why must I tolerate their idea more than my own?

Will you tolerate if your beloved growing son says one day "Dad, I want my balls cut out, and I wanna huge silicone tits!"

Will you say "Ok son, lets do that tomorrow morning then!"?

Just yes or no? No bashes here.

Obviously you disapprove and obviously you do not tolerate their choice in life. It is NOT about tolerating an idea but a choice in life. These choices are made after years of agony on their part. They do not make the decision lightly knowing the intolerance of much of society. Why not just live and let live. Society is always changing. You might be more happy in Malaysia where there is little tolerance for GLBT community.

[Ijustwannateach]

As usual, a thread about transexuals is bring out the worst and most off-topic in our erstwhile 'straight' readers. And it always turns into sniggering schoolboy jokes, followed by homophobic discussion of the potential origins of homosexuality at large, followed by confessions of the ladyboy-fanciers.

Sigh. Should we even bother to rehash it with warnings, or shall I just close it now?

Tell you what. Let's see if people can keep to the topic (care to go back up and re-read the topic? Hint: the news article title is phrased 'Gimmick or Equality?' I'll take a look again tonight and we'll see if this is worth continuing.

[Misterwhisper]

"Would you like some nuts, sir?"

"Not from you I don't..."

[suzukiben]

So this is turning into a general GLBT bashing thread. How predictable. The intolerance and ignorance is stunning.

Would you tell me even one reason - why must I tolerate their idea more than my own?

Will you tolerate if your beloved growing son says one day "Dad, I want my balls cut out, and I wanna huge silicone tits!"

Will you say "Ok son, lets do that tomorrow morning then!"?

Just yes or no? No bashes here.

I would say yes. who gives a sh*t

[TackyToo]

^ Good thing that the worlds changing, with outdated narrow mindedness along with it.

i believe nature sometimes mixes things up in many ways from time to time, including a persons gender

Look at his photo on the prev.page.

Now you wanna tell me that this head thinks that it is smarter than a Mother Nature - to start his own game with his own rules? C'mon, gimme a break....

Nature will win just in one step: no offsprings from such a careless gamers who dare to play Gods. Bingo!

What a wasted life...wasted by his own decision and choice.

I really hope you will not go that far to quote the bible as there is more truth in every edition of “ Mickey Mouse” (fact)!

Take a day off and study NATURE. You may learn the number and variety of transsexuality, hermaphroditism and homosexuality beneath your “Gods” own creatures is far bigger than that of cardinals in the Vatican. However, if you are a true bible belter, you better stay away from such devilish science.

According to great minds like Darwin, Dawkins and Hawkins EVOLUTION is no one-way road and it has no dead end! However, after reading your post I start doubting it too. Maybe you should try answering yourself a simple beginners question for the start: If we all are “Gods” children,- then what makes Jesus so special?

[SlyAnimal]

Katoey flight attendants is fine imo, for all purposes they're ladies, regardless of what they were born as.

I had thought that they allowed katoeys to work there already, as I know that it's the dream of some of my katoey students to be an air hostess, and I hope that they can one day achieve their dreams.

As it has come up in the comments, what would I think if one of my children was a katoey.... it would be difficult for me to face, however I personally think that a lot of katoeys are just kind of brought into it by an overly female society, where they are often raised by single mothers or grandmothers, and even though there is a 3:1 ratio of women to men, if a young boy has female friends, they are usually regarded as a katoey by their friends, because friends of the other gender isn't a common thing in Thailand. If they get called a katoey since they were soo young, then they just naturally grow into it, particularly as the boys might shun them because they have "girl germs" lol

[alexakap]

You may learn the number and variety of transsexuality, hermaphroditism and homosexuality beneath your “Gods” own creatures is far bigger than that of cardinals in the Vatican.

All of'em produces no offsprings. As well as cardinals, AFAIK.

And this is the way Nature clears itself after "unsuccessful useless tries".

if you are a true bible belter

Nope, I am not.

I am simply refusing to eat sh*it just because someone love to eat sh*it.

To me, it is still a sh*it - someone likes to eat that or not.

(Im now talking about "tolerance" as a term. Lets call a cat a cat).

If we all are “Gods” children,- then what makes Jesus so special?

Dunno what way he is "so special" to you.

[TackyToo]

So this is turning into a general GLBT bashing thread. How predictable. The intolerance and ignorance is stunning.

Would you tell me even one reason - why must I tolerate their idea more than my own?

Will you tolerate if your beloved growing son says one day "Dad, I want my balls cut out, and I wanna huge silicone tits!"

Will you say "Ok son, lets do that tomorrow morning then!"?

Just yes or no? No bashes here.

Would you tell me even one reason - why must I tolerate their idea more than my own?

Definition of the word tolerance:

The capacity for or the practice of recognizing and respecting the beliefs or practices of others.

Don't the men in black preach that to altarboys anymore?

[F1fanatic]

Personally, I have no problem with it at all and think it should be supported. BUT, unfortunately I doubt its a good marketing ploy.

There are way too many Western men who dislike gays and/or trans-sexuals. The Western world is (generally) far less tolerant than Thailand.

[merlen10002]

^ Good thing that the worlds changing, with outdated narrow mindedness along with it.

i believe nature sometimes mixes things up in many ways from time to time, including a persons gender

Look at his photo on the prev.page.

Now you wanna tell me that this head thinks that it is smarter than a Mother Nature - to start his own game with his own rules? C'mon, gimme a break....

Nature will win just in one step: no offsprings from such a careless gamers who dare to play Gods. Bingo!

What a wasted life...wasted by his own decision and choice.

Maybe the late Kerry Packer was right when he said,, I got some bad news for you there is no god,, but the good news is there is no hell either so you dont have to worry about going there.

[animatic]

I've been witness to young boys being raised as girls from a young age by their grandparents. How many of these flight attendants did not have a choice. You see a gatoeuy is able to receive a sinsot to the grandparents where a Thai man will not. If it was their choice, so be it, but many times it is not and people should be aware of this.

Learned response as opposed to genetics.

The parents grandparents are just bowing to the acted out wishes of the child,

rather than forcing them to conform to gener stereotypes.

I have yet to hear of any Grandparents forcing a boy to become a katoey.

[alexakap]

As it has come up in the comments, what would I think if one of my children was a katoey.... it would be difficult for me to face, however I personally think that a lot of katoeys are just kind of brought into it by an overly female society, where they are often raised by single mothers or grandmothers, and even though there is a 3:1 ratio of women to men, if a young boy has female friends, they are usually regarded as a katoey by their friends, because friends of the other gender isn't a common thing in Thailand. If they get called a katoey since they were soo young, then they just naturally grow into it, particularly as the boys might shun them because they have "girl germs" lol

True.

As for me, I think that all of these "katoeys", "transes" etcetcetc is a result of lacks of "masculine" among thai men. Thai men lack of "macho power". Always soft, smile, never to confront, blahblahblah - in most of Western cultures they would be called "no-balls men". Almost all of them.

And what we expect from their children? Sure, they no need their balls. They simply sees no use of "being macho", as sees no examples.

[alexakap]

Definition of the word tolerance:

The capacity for or the practice of recognizing and respecting the beliefs or practices of others.

I know the definition, thanks.

You did not answer to my question. WHY must I respect their practices at the first place - prior to my own ones? Sorry, I dare not.

[mickyboy]

Oh come on, how about some photos?

Does the company have promo shots?

BTW The funniest comment I ever saw on this subject was " where there's an apple there's usuall a banana".

got a can of lager mate opps i mean miss

[alexakap]

the good news is there is no hell either so you dont have to worry about going there.

As I always say..."In heavens the weather is great...but in hell you'll get much interesting mob!"

Haha!

[mickyboy]

So this is turning into a general GLBT bashing thread. How predictable. The intolerance and ignorance is stunning.

Would you tell me even one reason - why must I tolerate their idea more than my own?

Will you tolerate if your beloved growing son says one day "Dad, I want my balls cut out, and I wanna huge silicone tits!"

Will you say "Ok son, lets do that tomorrow morning then!"?

Just yes or no? No bashes here.

#

i say yes if that what make you happy but can i feel them after as your mother wont let me touch her

[DP25]

Personally, I have no problem with it at all and think it should be supported. BUT, unfortunately I doubt its a good marketing ploy.

There are way too many Western men who dislike gays and/or trans-sexuals. The Western world is (generally) far less tolerant than Thailand.

This airline only flies to Asian locations at the moment. They attract mostly curiosity with Asians, just look at all the Chinese tour buses in front of the various transgender cabaret shows, so I don't think it will be a problem. This could be a good business decision.

They could have some nasty incidents flying to certain countries though

[arrowsdawdle]

lets stop all this discrimation. as long as she is qualified, capable and attractive..i will take her (him).

Attempting to deny the mutually exclusive realities of male and female biology and expecting the world to participate in their fairy tale is the ultimate discrimination.

[Jingthing]

lets stop all this discrimation. as long as she is qualified, capable and attractive..i will take her (him).

Attempting to deny the mutually exclusive realities of male and female biology and expecting the world to participate in their fairy tale is the ultimate discrimination.

Not sure how allowing sexual minorities fair treatment in society denies the biological mechanics of reproduction. Who is saying someone with a manufactured vagina or same sex sex acts can bear children anymore than heterosexual sex acts with a sterile penis or vagina can participate in reproduction? Where's the discrimination you speak of? Edited March 12, 2012 by Jingthing

[arrowsdawdle]

With her crisp uniform, immaculate makeup and hair swept up, Mew looks like any other air hostess, but she's one of a handful of Thai transsexuals blazing a trail in the skies.

"He", not "she". One can change the looking, but can't change his blood, the genes etc....

Ppl trying to play Gods again. Will fail again...

Genes can play tricks on the body. Its proven that person can be born in the wrong gendered body and be totally at odds with their sex. A person who truly believes they were born in the wrong sex, is, imo, the sex they chose to be, even before surgery. Those who complete a full transgender, are, imo, totally the sex they were meant to be and should be treated as such. I dont believe in "Gods", i believe nature sometimes mixes things up in many ways from time to time, including a persons gender. Nature is not infallible.

Regardless, has nothing to do with her ability to be good at her job or not. So what if she used to be "technically" male.

1. Show your proof about your genes statement.
   
2. Show how in nature bulls relinquish their johnsons and give milk.
   

What you believe has no basis in fact without proof and in this case what you believe is about as useful as reverse on a motorcycle.

Edited March 12, 2012 by arrowsdawdle

[arrowsdawdle]

Personally, I have no problem with it at all and think it should be supported. BUT, unfortunately I doubt its a good marketing ploy.

There are way too many Western men who dislike gays and/or trans-sexuals. The Western world is (generally) far less tolerant than Thailand.

This airline only flies to Asian locations at the moment. They attract mostly curiosity with Asians, just look at all the Chinese tour buses in front of the various transgender cabaret shows, so I don't think it will be a problem. This could be a good business decision.

They could have some nasty incidents flying to certain countries though

What about layovers? Airlines typically room crew together. Where do you put such confusiion? Whose rights take precedence? What about public restrooms? The civilized world has laws.

[arrowsdawdle]

all you people giving them a hard time did you take one home by mistake once ??

The operative word here is mistake.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Oh come on, how about some photos? Does the company have promo shots?

Old news

http://www.theage.com.au/travel/travel-news/thai-airline-hires-transsexual-flight-attendants-20110128-1a7gv.html

And I believe in human's idiocity, short-thinking and selfish.

Doesn't change the fact that the only proper way to address a transsexual is with the pronoun they prefer. Many Olympic athletes have found out they were raised as the "wrong" sex when their medal got taken away, first they ever heard of it.

Some scientists - you do believe in science don't you, or are you a creationist/intelligent design mouth-breather? estimate that millions of human babies are born with “ambiguous genitalia”, AKA “intersexuality.”

And many more are 100% positive in their hearts they were born into a body with the wrong sex, often from a very young age.

And many many more simply choose to change - and why shouldn't they? It's their body, who are you to judge? Live and let live. Although I have to admit I do hate it when I don't find out she's actually a he until we're actually getting undressed - since coming to Thailand I've gotten **much** better at spotting them from at least arm's length 8-)

[BigJohnnyBKK]

What about layovers? Airlines typically room crew together. Where do you put such confusiion? Whose rights take precedence? What about public restrooms? The civilized world has laws.

It's your lack of civilization that's showing by making an issue of this. Believe me those that work in the airline industry are much more sophisticated and simply don't worry about such trivialities.

My original understanding was that the airline was **only** hiring trans anyway, so problem solved.

[FOODLOVER]

I've been witness to young boys being raised as girls from a young age by their grandparents. How many of these flight attendants did not have a choice. You see a gatoeuy is able to receive a sinsot to the grandparents where a Thai man will not. If it was their choice, so be it, but many times it is not and people should be aware of this.

Learned response as opposed to genetics.

The parents grandparents are just bowing to the acted out wishes of the child,

rather than forcing them to conform to gener stereotypes.

I have yet to hear of any Grandparents forcing a boy to become a katoey.

Absolutely not, dressed as a girl and was only given girl toys and told to sit like a nice little girl. At eleven I was shown "Fashion" photos of him in full make-up. He has never been treated as a male from birth. This was not by choice and the whole freaking family has no problems with this. My head is about to explode from my conservative upbringing but hey tit and all that but certainly was not his choice. I believe the choice was made for him and that his grandparents who believe financially he would be able to support himself as a lovely little missus. He even is thin and very much wants to watch his figure. Trips me out mak mak. If he was adolescent and his tendencies were apparent and this was his choice, no problem but after all the ramifications of his decisions were pointed out, not to try to change his mind but to wake him up to the realities and opportunities he would be missing. Would probably schedule a visit with the psychologist before the dress shop as well.

FYI that's not a picture of me in my avatar. (Not that there is anything wrong with that).

[eek]

With her crisp uniform, immaculate makeup and hair swept up, Mew looks like any other air hostess, but she's one of a handful of Thai transsexuals blazing a trail in the skies.

"He", not "she". One can change the looking, but can't change his blood, the genes etc....

Ppl trying to play Gods again. Will fail again...

Genes can play tricks on the body. Its proven that person can be born in the wrong gendered body and be totally at odds with their sex. A person who truly believes they were born in the wrong sex, is, imo, the sex they chose to be, even before surgery. Those who complete a full transgender, are, imo, totally the sex they were meant to be and should be treated as such. I dont believe in "Gods", i believe nature sometimes mixes things up in many ways from time to time, including a persons gender. Nature is not infallible.

Regardless, has nothing to do with her ability to be good at her job or not. So what if she used to be "technically" male.

1. Show your proof about your genes statement.
   
2. Show how in nature bulls relinquish their johnsons and give milk.
   

What you believe has no basis in fact without proof and in this case what you believe is about as useful as reverse on a motorcycle.

If you want to find out more, how about use your fingers and have a search on google..? I read different articles on this several years ago as was interested to understand more. Im not out to show you proof. <deleted> am i, "Professor Eek, at your bidding"? Ahh but, anyway, had a quick google and heres one article that mentions how things can get mixed up: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WrongGeneticSex The net is swamped with scientific articles on this. If you want to know more, or read more in depth, or more scientific reads, google is your oyster.

Some people really do get their knickers in a twist over this kind of stuff. And, as said by others, it is really irrelevant in regards to the persons job.

[kiniyow]

Equality~~~No matter if a Man or Woman or Transgender....If they know the Job then fair play...

[2unique]

With her crisp uniform, immaculate makeup and hair swept up, Mew looks like any other air hostess, but she's one of a handful of Thai transsexuals blazing a trail in the skies.

"He", not "she". One can change the looking, but can't change his blood, the genes etc....

Ppl trying to play Gods again. Will fail again...

Genes can play tricks on the body. Its proven that person can be born in the wrong gendered body and be totally at odds with their sex. A person who truly believes they were born in the wrong sex, is, imo, the sex they chose to be, even before surgery. Those who complete a full transgender, are, imo, totally the sex they were meant to be and should be treated as such. I dont believe in "Gods", i believe nature sometimes mixes things up in many ways from time to time, including a persons gender. Nature is not infallible.

Regardless, has nothing to do with her ability to be good at her job or not. So what if she used to be "technically" male.

1. Show your proof about your genes statement.
   
2. Show how in nature bulls relinquish their johnsons and give milk.
   

What you believe has no basis in fact without proof and in this case what you believe is about as useful as reverse on a motorcycle.

Sequential hermaphroditism

[cowslip]

It would seem that most posters on this thread can only define themselves and the world around them in terms of their genitals

Edited March 12, 2012 by cowslip

[EyesWideOpen]

If the airline wants true equality, then as long as they are hiring hostesses that are men dressed as women, then it only stands to reason they should throw in a few women dressed like men. A few tough butch looking toms, with short haircuts, would round things out nicely... :-)