Racism Against Farangs

[mackes]

Thailand is unique in that perspective that it never been colonized, so no one ever teached the Thais that they are a subordinate culture, thats why they think that they are superior.

Did you really write that?

Could you explain:

1) Who the people doing the teaching should be?

2) And precisely why you think the Thais are a subordinate culture?

Yes, I wrote that.

I thought it was obvious that in the old colonization era people from european countries came to undeveloped countries telling them how to do things because they know better. That was, the colonizers come from a superior culture. Also today you can see this attitude, especially from English and French people.

I really don' think Thai (or any other culture) is a subordinate culture, on the contrary, europeans have a lot to learn in many aspect.

[metisdead]

Flame posts and general off topic nonsense posts have been removed.

[samran]

This is the system, get use to it or.....

Exactly. Back in the US a Thai once asked me how to get somewhere on the public transport. My response was "if you were rich enough to get here from thailand, then you are rich enough to take a taxi." I then pointed to the cab stand, smiled and walked away.

Wouldn't it of been hilarious if the guy pulled a gun and blew your head off for being such a tosser.

Then you are in agreement with the op that Thais who respond in kind are complete tossers as well, right?

No, just you.

[bendix]

Thailand is unique in that perspective that it never been colonized, so no one ever teached the Thais that they are a subordinate culture, thats why they think that they are superior.

Did you really write that?

Could you explain:

1) Who the people doing the teaching should be?

2) And precisely why you think the Thais are a subordinate culture?

Yes, I wrote that.

I thought it was obvious that in the old colonization era people from european countries came to undeveloped countries telling them how to do things because they know better. That was, the colonizers come from a superior culture. Also today you can see this attitude, especially from English and French people.

I really don' think Thai (or any other culture) is a subordinate culture, on the contrary, europeans have a lot to learn in many aspect.

Mea maxima culpa. I misread your intentions.

[h90]

I always find it funny when foreigners who don't speak Thai very much seem to hear the word 'farang' bandied about in sinister tones by every Tom, Dick and Somchai when out and about on public transport or at the markets.

And here I am, pretty near fluent in the language and I've very rarely heard it.

I think a few more anti-paranoia drugs need to be distributed to some members of this board.

Please give me some drugs.. im sure its great as long as you don't inform super Charlem.

I am no where near fluent in the language but i can understand most things that are said. Speaking that is an other thing completely. I still foul up a lot. But i haven't met much racism either. Besides the land thing and other idiot rules. Some Thais are dicks and idiots, same as foreigners. One of my neighbors seems to be one of those Thais, army guy would never say a word to me. But he is not well liked by the other neighbors either so he is just a dick.

Yep, funny, still, how we hear the newbies judging the Thais as a whole..It must be paranoia, really..

Like everywhere there are many different types of people, and everyone is an individual.

Even if you go to the local temple, every monk is different, hence the Buddhist proverb : 1000 monks, 1000 religions.

Everyone is different, and the racists are a minority IMO, in every country.

Now, if the OP keeps rambling, about " The Thais ", i wonder who is the racist....

Like many Thais explain each other how farangs are, like they are all the same from Northsweden to Southitaly and from Portugal to Wladivostok and no matter from what part of society.

Here we have the opposite: Thais are.......

[robblok]

I always find it funny when foreigners who don't speak Thai very much seem to hear the word 'farang' bandied about in sinister tones by every Tom, Dick and Somchai when out and about on public transport or at the markets.

And here I am, pretty near fluent in the language and I've very rarely heard it.

I think a few more anti-paranoia drugs need to be distributed to some members of this board.

Please give me some drugs.. im sure its great as long as you don't inform super Charlem.

I am no where near fluent in the language but i can understand most things that are said. Speaking that is an other thing completely. I still foul up a lot. But i haven't met much racism either. Besides the land thing and other idiot rules. Some Thais are dicks and idiots, same as foreigners. One of my neighbors seems to be one of those Thais, army guy would never say a word to me. But he is not well liked by the other neighbors either so he is just a dick.

Yep, funny, still, how we hear the newbies judging the Thais as a whole..It must be paranoia, really..

Like everywhere there are many different types of people, and everyone is an individual.

Even if you go to the local temple, every monk is different, hence the Buddhist proverb : 1000 monks, 1000 religions.

Everyone is different, and the racists are a minority IMO, in every country.

Now, if the OP keeps rambling, about " The Thais ", i wonder who is the racist....

Like many Thais explain each other how farangs are, like they are all the same from Northsweden to Southitaly and from Portugal to Wladivostok and no matter from what part of society.

Here we have the opposite: Thais are.......

Yep, completely the opposite. Its easy to comment on a group that your not part of. Here you just say Thais and lob them all under the same group. I think its a natural thing to do. Not a good thing mind you.

Just like all people Thais are different, you can meet a taxi driver complaining about other taxi drivers not using their meters when you talk about it. Just because someone is from a certain group does not mean he is like everyone in the group.

But we use groups to make it easier and often the label does fit (of course the bigger and more diverse the group the less likely it is). Im pretty sure you can find more cheese lovers in Holland then in Thailand.. ect.. so up to a certain level labels do fit.

[Kilgore Trout]

Then you are in agreement with the op that Thais who respond in kind are complete tossers as well, right?

No, just you.

Then you are a hypocrite. Please tell my why you will accept this kind of behavior from Thais but not from Westerners?

Is it because you think Thais are inferior and less should be expected from them? Seems to be the only logical conclusion.

Please sir, take your racist views elsewhere.

[theblether]

I think your missing the point here.

The OP is 42, single, good hearted and compassionate.

She's got that Parisien chic style thing going on and she wears expensive perfume.

She sounds hot. I'm going to ask her out for dinner.

The rest of you carry on with the debate.......

[F1fanatic]

An interesting thread has turned into a 'bash fest'.

Of course most Thais are racist - as are most people in other nations!

Read the anti-immigration comments in UK newspapers... And, before anyone says this is 'cos the UK is being 'swamped' (which to a certain extent I agree with - they are certainly pushing wages down), those racist sentiments were there a couple of decades ago - if not longer.

[HidyHo]

Based on what I read in the thread and how she come across, even I don't like OP.

[David48]

I think your missing the point here.

The OP is 42, single, good hearted and compassionate.

She's got that Parisien chic style thing going on and she wears expensive perfume.

She sounds hot. I'm going to ask her out for dinner.

The rest of you carry on with the debate.......

Not if I get there first!

Young man ... I live closer then you.

Despite ALL that has been written and will be written in the future ... she does seem an interesting person to share a wine with and chew the fat about different things ... even if we disagree 100%.

I smell a scent of sarcasm (Mr Blether) ... not a hint of expensive perfume.

Would be spending the 20,00 Baht on getting the dogs de-sexed and not on their welfare ... they’re Soi Dogs and can take care of themselves.

Edited March 29, 2012 by David48

[David48]

Based on what I read in the thread and how she come across, even I don't like OP.

HidyHo ... welcome back.

How can you like or not like the 'OP'.

We don't know her ... but we do judge and comment on her actions, statements and replies.

Walk a mile in her shoes then try and understand her.

I just found it hard to sympathise with her ... that's all.

[h90]

I think your missing the point here.

The OP is 42, single, good hearted and compassionate.

She's got that Parisien chic style thing going on and she wears expensive perfume.

She sounds hot. I'm going to ask her out for dinner.

The rest of you carry on with the debate.......

But you should order the food. Thais may not take the order from her because they are all racists.

[F1fanatic]

I think your missing the point here.

The OP is 42, single, good hearted and compassionate.

She's got that Parisien chic style thing going on and she wears expensive perfume.

She sounds hot. I'm going to ask her out for dinner.

The rest of you carry on with the debate.......

Not if I get there first!

Young man ... I live closer then you.

Despite ALL that has been written and will be written in the future ... she does seem an interesting person to share a wine with and chew the fat about different things ... even if we disagree 100%.

I smell a scent of sarcasm (Mr Blether) ... not a hint of expensive perfume.

Would be spending the 20,00 Baht on getting the dogs de-sexed and not on their welfare ... they’re Soi Dogs and can take care of themselves.

Not all soi dogs "can take care of themselves". I've adopted two soi dogs (that I really didn't want/need) 'cos they were dying on the street...

[theblether]

I think your missing the point here.

The OP is 42, single, good hearted and compassionate.

She's got that Parisien chic style thing going on and she wears expensive perfume.

She sounds hot. I'm going to ask her out for dinner.

The rest of you carry on with the debate.......

Not if I get there first!

Young man ... I live closer then you.

Despite ALL that has been written and will be written in the future ... she does seem an interesting person to share a wine with and chew the fat about different things ... even if we disagree 100%.

I smell a scent of sarcasm (Mr Blether) ... not a hint of expensive perfume.

Would be spending the 20,00 Baht on getting the dogs de-sexed and not on their welfare ... they’re Soi Dogs and can take care of themselves.

Look beyond any notion of sarcasm kind sir.

The OP is feeling besieged.

The OP is loney.

[David48]

The OP is loney.

Ummm ...

Looney or lonely

Assuming lonely ... I agree

[David48]

Would be spending the 20,00 Baht on getting the dogs de-sexed and not on their welfare ... they’re Soi Dogs and can take care of themselves.

Not all soi dogs "can take care of themselves". I've adopted two soi dogs (that I really didn't want/need) 'cos they were dying on the street...

F1fanatic ... you have a good heart.

[theblether]

Would be spending the 20,00 Baht on getting the dogs de-sexed and not on their welfare ... they’re Soi Dogs and can take care of themselves.

Not all soi dogs "can take care of themselves". I've adopted two soi dogs (that I really didn't want/need) 'cos they were dying on the street...

F1fanatic ... you have a good heart.

I wonder if f1 would adopt me if she found me lying in the street.

I wonder where she lives?

[David48]

Not all soi dogs "can take care of themselves". I've adopted two soi dogs (that I really didn't want/need) 'cos they were dying on the street...

F1fanatic ... you have a good heart.

I wonder if f1 would adopt me if she found me lying in the street.

I wonder where she lives?

If I found you lying on the street ... off to a Thai orphanage for you, young Scotsman!

Or a kind lactating Mother ... what would you prefer?

Only option #1 available ... this is TVF, I forgot.

[F1fanatic]

Would be spending the 20,00 Baht on getting the dogs de-sexed and not on their welfare ... they’re Soi Dogs and can take care of themselves.

Not all soi dogs "can take care of themselves". I've adopted two soi dogs (that I really didn't want/need) 'cos they were dying on the street...

F1fanatic ... you have a good heart.

I wonder if f1 would adopt me if she found me lying in the street.

I wonder where she lives?

No I wouldn't .

I tried to help out a Western guy once (who was obviously in trouble) - by giving him food, water etc. He ended up committing suicide outside my house when he got in trouble again a few months later and I didn't immediately rush to help him. (He turned up at my door late at night - and I was pissed off that he didn't contact me at all when he was OK.)

It was horrible - as you can imagine - so yes, I will be more considerate next time but there is zero chance that I would 'adopt' someone in that position. They need to go home.

[theblether]

Choices, choices.

I think we've just vandalized this thread. 230 worthy replies and now we have reduced it to soi dogs and lactating mothers.

I think we're in trouble with the grown ups.

I'm blaming you. Just so you know.

[David48]

Choices, choices.

I think we've just vandalized this thread. 230 worthy replies and now we have reduced it to soi dogs and lactating mothers.

I think we're in trouble with the grown ups.

I'm blaming you. Just so you know.

Why blame F1fanatic ... she seems quite nice.

[F1fanatic]

Choices, choices.

I think we've just vandalized this thread. 230 worthy replies and now we have reduced it to soi dogs and lactating mothers.

I think we're in trouble with the grown ups.

I'm blaming you. Just so you know.

You start good threads that I enjoy, but you are deficient in empathy.

Mind you - I blame me too!

[David48]

No I wouldn't .

I tried to help out a Western guy once (who was obviously in trouble) - by giving him food, water etc. He ended up committing suicide outside my house when he got in trouble again a few months later and I didn't immediately rush to help him. (He turned up at my door late at night - and I was pissed off that he didn't contact me at all when he was OK.)

It was horrible - as you can imagine - so yes, I will be more considerate next time but there is zero chance that I would 'adopt' someone in that position. They need to go home.

F1fanatic

I can think of few things worse then that.

A single act of kindness comes back to haunt the giver.

Sometimes it's a case of dammed if you do and guilty for ever if you don't.

Thanks for sharing ...

theblether ... looks as if you will end up as a Soi Dog snack.

Nice knowing you

Edited March 29, 2012 by David48

[F1fanatic]

No I wouldn't .

I tried to help out a Western guy once (who was obviously in trouble) - by giving him food, water etc. He ended up committing suicide outside my house when he got in trouble again a few months later and I didn't immediately rush to help him. (He turned up at my door late at night - and I was pissed off that he didn't contact me at all when he was OK.)

It was horrible - as you can imagine - so yes, I will be more considerate next time but there is zero chance that I would 'adopt' someone in that position. They need to go home.

F1fanatic

I can think of few things worse then that.

A single act of kindness comes back to haunt the giver.

Sometimes it's a case of dammed if you do and guilty for ever if you don't.

Thanks for sharing ...

theblether ... looks as if you will end up as a Soi Dog snack.

I agree - 'no good deed goes unpunished' is correct in my experience.

[theblether]

Now i'm empathy free dog food.

I wasn't expecting that.

[arthurwait]

When I first read the op's topic, I felt that I couldn’t empathise with her situation or question.

Now, I just feel sadness ...

She obviously has an inner strength and a compassionate, caring nature.

Sort of reminds me of that lovable excentric Aunt who never married, never really knew true love (or knew true love once but now that that moment has been lost) and for some reason, every day seems a battle just to survive with some dignity.

I don't suggest for one moment aneliane is that Auntie sitting in the corner, alone, patting the dog.

Maybe not so much the originial question that needs answering, but some warmth and compassion needs to be shown.

Sometimes we don't need to have answers ...

I don't need compassion, I need honnesty.

Ok it is obviously impossible to adress this issue here and every answer is unfortunately questioning me.

It is a shame that you cannot deal with a dent in your paradise pretty pic,

My personal situation has nothing to do with the establish racism in this country, and as I said previously I met other foreigners who admit they experienced it. Amongs them, a british journalist for the financial times, an italian manager at UNO, a korean painter, a head teacher in an international school.

I actually read here also on Thaivisa some posts about the institutionalization of racism in Thailand.

I realize it is a taboo question for most of you I think are in denial.

I love Thailand, but I am able to look at this country and see its failures.

I wish I could have found some people who share the same views, here but I think I gave too much info about me which gave arguments to people in denial.

Oh well, live and learn !

Best wishes!

No one is in denial of course there are some racists like every country, but people don't think the situations you describe are down to racism, more a failure to communicate or that the people just don't like you. If you do do like someone has already pointed out go down the 20Baht veggie eatery in your 3000B clothes from Paragon and think you are like the poor locals in their 20B from the second hand market clothes then is it surprising they don't like you. That along with not learning the language and thinking everything that people say is derogratory to you when you can't even understand them. Your facial expresion must show when you think you are being insulted. How do you even know they are saying farang and not farang meaning guava, man farang (potato), man farang tohd (chips), mahg farang (chewing gum), rab bra tahn (eat) , when they are speaking fast and you don't understand the other words they say ?

You've also got to remember people here aren't taught the same manners or ways here. I had the same as someone posted earlier many times when I first came here standing politely waiting to be served while the woman busy working at her stall was busy chopping not paying any attention to me, while every Thai just came along and shouted what they wanted while I stood there. Eventually what looked like her husband came across and rescued/ served me. It's just the way she worked while busy. I was thinking the same is this because I'm white ,but no it wasn't.

The bank got a new girl handing out the queue tickets, several times I went and as I'm about to press the button and she would barge in front of me and get a ticket for the Thai she was already with even though no where near the machine. I thought you racist <deleted> and just ignored her and treated her like she didn't exist for a few months before one day my wife came back from the bank and said the girls at the bank asked what the girl had done to upset me, so I told my wife and she said she does it to her as well. The next day at the bank my wife told her and she apologised and said her training was to serve the person she was with. The problem wasn't that she was racist, just hadn't been taught the same manners as me and was following her appalling training to the letter in her first job. She wasn't there for much longer, maybe other people (Thais) complained about her as well.

Same bank sitting in the queue for half an hour or more the bank had already locked it's doors and they let some guy in who just went straight upto the counter and got served. I thought oh great yet again the invisible farang, but looked behind me and there was also a Thai guy waiting who shrugged his shoulders. It wasn't the guy was racist just an arrogant selfish A hole that thought he was more important than other people.

The woman who rents space of my wifes family for her restaurant thing here, I ordered when no on else was in the place then people came just after me I sat there holding my then 2 or 3 month old son waiting for half an hour for my ghia pad king while watching Thai person after Thai person who came after me getting served. This had happened a few times before so I just got up and walked away and ignored her as she shouted something I didn't understand behind me. I said to the wife how can that woman rent space off us if she has a problem with farangs. Again the person in question asked my wife later what was wrong and she told her. The woman said this has happened with other people( I'm the only farang barring friends that has ever eaten there) and that other people get up and walk away or complain and walk away. The woman said it's the way she cooks things and my wife told her that she should cook for people in the order they come and that's why people are walking out. My wife pointed out that maybe that's why she doesn't get anything like the same amount of customers she got when she opened, so now she has changed and people stay. Again you could look like racism if it happens to a farang, but it's just she didn't think about how she was doing things.

What do the postions of the people you are talking about have to do with anything ? I wouldn't be surprised if they live in expat communities and barely know any Thais or any non westernised Thais baring their maids. The type of communities that produce the repulsive loud mouthed kids in Emporium that treat the workers there like dirt which I imagine is how they treat their maids.

If you want to send your time fretting about it forming groups and upsetting people, good luck to you, you may need it like the guy on the BTS might do now, but I'm sure others will just shrug it off and get on with enjoying their lives.

Edited March 29, 2012 by arthurwait

[David48]

Now i'm empathy free dog food.

I wasn't expecting that.

Life is full of unexpected twists and turns ...

It would be a boring old path if we knew what was around the next corner.

[theblether]

By the way, and right on topic, I have an acute sense of empathy, I have an even more acute sense of who deserves empathy.

The OP apparently thinks that soi dogs are more worthy of help than humans.

We are all in the main animal lovers, but we can tell the difference between animal and pest.

Misplaced empathy makes problems worse.

The OP should consider as suggested earlier, spending more on humans than on pests.

The truly humane know when it!s right to put a dog down.

Edited March 29, 2012 by theblether

[arthurwait]

An interesting thread has turned into a 'bash fest'.

Of course most Thais are racist - as are most people in other nations!

Read the anti-immigration comments in UK newspapers... And, before anyone says this is 'cos the UK is being 'swamped' (which to a certain extent I agree with - they are certainly pushing wages down), those racist sentiments were there a couple of decades ago - if not longer.

The racists in the UK do not make up the majority. The Daily hate and racist portion of Sun readers don't make up the majority of the population and Uk wages ( along with most the wests ) and land prices need to go down if the UK ever wants to compete with where the jobs are going.

Edit: but that's another thread.

Edited March 29, 2012 by arthurwait