Does Abs Completely Cut Out Skidding?

[sonic_11uk]

I was driving my girlfriend's 2 year old Honda City SV.

It was the top spec model at the time of purchase, has ABS and is in excellent condition.

Going round a gentle, but slightly sloped bend yesterday in very light drizzle, the back of the car started sliding out to the left as the car turned right.

I hit the brakes and the car went a bit crazy and suddenly pivoted in an anti-clockwise direction and eventually stopped in a 90 degree position in the middle of the road.

Luckily nobody was hurt.

It had only just started to rain very lightly and the speed was very low - I drive the same route every single work day, most of the times a hell of a lot faster.

As I moved the car to a safe spot a little further down the road to regain my senses, I saw a pickup truck also do a 180 degree spin going round that corner which leads me to believe that there may possibly have been a spillage or something to make that spot a bit slick.

My question is that with the car pointed in the right direction, shouldn't the ABS have prevented the slide?

Or is the Honda City a crap car?

[culicine]

I'm not sure but I reckon there was something on the road, as we get a lot of build-up of sludge during the dry season. When water hits it it becomes "soapy" and slippery.

Normally the abs pulsating helps you manoeuvre around objects and stops sliding. into them.I think the very soapy road conditions stops abs working the way it should - the pulsating abs needs some kind of traction to work properly. That;s my take on it but I'm sure someone else knows better than me:)

[indothai]

ABS helps greatly during a straight run and needing to quickly avoid something on the road. It doesn't really help much when you are already in a sliding turn.

You may have some oil slick or similar substance to cause such an oversteer affect, if so then very little of any technology can help....except airbags.

[transam]

ABS will not stop a sideways slide. The sensors detect ''a'' wheel lockup under braking and releases the brake on that given wheel. It will release a brake on the slide if it senses lock up.

[sezze]

ABS is a braking aid and doesn't prevent anything else . ABS in most times does nothing and when it does work you'll notice it as your brake pedal starts shaking .

What exactly does it do ? When you are driving ABS will never do anything at all . When you are braking , normally it will not do anything at all also . So , when does it work ? When braking hard , your wheels stop turning and you can steer but the car will not respond to this action . A right respons is to let the brake go a tiny bit just to let the wheels roll again , and then your steering action will have effect . ABS does this action for you and will notice that your wheels stop turning while the car is still moving . It takes over part of your braking action and starts pumping on your brake so that you can steer and you only have to keep putting the brake down as hard as you can . It is a emergency aid , and not for normal driving . It can prevent you slam in a object in front of you because you have to brake too hard and your steering action isn't working anymore .

Try a straight piece of road on a rainy day and brake hard , you will feel the action of ABS when you'll feel a heavy vibrating force in your pedal .

[sonic_11uk]

Thanks for the replies guys!!!

Would it help to avoid these kind of situations to have wider wheels/tyres to have more traction?

[transam]

Thanks for the replies guys!!!

Would it help to avoid these kind of situations to have wider wheels/tyres to have more traction?

Sometimes a wider tyre on a ''slippery'' road can make things worse. Every tyre design (tread) has a purpose which will be revealed on the tyre manufacturers Web site. The tyre pressure is the most important factor for traction and pushing water out the way, look inside the drivers door jam and it will show the correct pressure to keep your ride as safe as possible. If your tyres are over inflated you WILL lose traction in certain circumstances. .

[sezze]

Yes, over- or underinflated tyres is bad . On dry or wet roads a wider tyre in general is better . On flooded roads a wider tyre is worse , too much water has to be pushed away , wider tyres in such case are not good . Mud on the road , again , the smaller the better as more weight is put on the surface . It is difficult to say that or a or b is better . Standard i'd say that the tyre itself is the solution or problem. A better profile / rubber mixture will provide more grip . Also , when tyres are older , they will get harder and will have less grip .

[culicine]

To add to that, wider tyres, when they wear down can be even more dangerous in the wet. My dad had 265 rear tyres on a v8 fairlane and they were horrendous in the wet; traction under acceleration was no existent.

[aussiebebe]

Hi, I've got the base model City - the SV is a lot better equipped than mine but both have ABS and EBD. I've never had the experience of a car sliding out like that around a low-speed bend but always assumed that the EBD could sense whether the direction of the car matched the steering wheel input and adjust the power/brake to each wheel accordingly; working with the ABS system - I guess not. If the pickup slid out too, there must have been quite a slick on the road. I bet that was scary!

[sonic_11uk]

The tyres were inflated to the maximum limit as advised on the inside of the door - I did this myself.

Without a doubt, the situation freaked me out a bit as it potentially could have been a lot worse and maybe fatal if I was going faster of if there was more traffic.

I keep thinking if I did something wrong or whether I could have done something to get out of that situation better.

[culicine]

The tyres were inflated to the maximum limit as advised on the inside of the door - I did this myself.

Without a doubt, the situation freaked me out a bit as it potentially could have been a lot worse and maybe fatal if I was going faster of if there was more traffic.

I keep thinking if I did something wrong or whether I could have done something to get out of that situation better.

Apart from going slower there isn't much you could have done. Just take note after each dry season, the first rains make the roads very slippery. A few years back I saw no less than 6 accidents over a 2-3 km stretch on a main road in BKK. After a month of rains the roads are cleared of sludge and grime on the roads, making them not so slippery.

[TommyDee]

the roads here, as in, for example Germany, are ideal for aqua planing. where your vehicle actually rides on the water not the road surface, in such cases ABS cannot work. depending on your vehicle, there are either sensors on all four or just the front wheel, the sensors recognise slip compare to the other wheeles and the braking then pumps on and off very very fast reagrdless of your foot pressure.

many vehicle here have only 2 wheel sensors which wont help much

remember, YOu are the driver, dont trust a dam_n thing in a car to be better than your eyes and senses, if YOu feel slip, take your foot OFF the gas and try to brake slowly and effectively

[mr3cho]

ABS is to keep your tires from locking up and skidding when you brake hard and will shorten the distance needed to stop.

Stability control is a system (that sits on top of the abs system) to help prevent the car from skidding sideways. It detects a loss of traction at any of the four wheels and diverts power to keep traction and keep the car point in the direction you want to go.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stability_control

[BSJ]

Some people think...or have been lulled into thinking that ABS and ESC will make up for poor driving practices. Unfortunately it's a trend that will continue.

Being vigilant behind the wheel, is as always, paramount in ensuring a safe trip.

[DJH77]

The tyres were inflated to the maximum limit as advised on the inside of the door - I did this myself.

Without a doubt, the situation freaked me out a bit as it potentially could have been a lot worse and maybe fatal if I was going faster of if there was more traffic.

I keep thinking if I did something wrong or whether I could have done something to get out of that situation better.

It sounds to me that the first thing you did wrong was to hit the brakes, this is what spun the car. If you have the back step out you must turn into the slide and be gentle on the gas pedal to pull the car out of it and as the car was frontwheel drive you would usually feel the front slip prior to the back going. If you have a large concreted car park or something like that nearby i suggest that next time it's raining go and practice this, it does not come naturally to many drivers.

[2unique]

With a light rain whatever chemicals are under the surface or have bedded into the road bubble up but don't wash away as they would in a heavy downpour. With no local knowledge no vigilance in the world would have helped. Instinct and muscle memory count for a lot and older drivers from the days of Vauxhall Vivas and Ford Capris etc would know anti lock the wheel and whip that tail.... or cadence brake if you want to be less reckless :-P

It would be hard to recreate what happened in an underpowered City maybe some go-kart practice rather than empty car park might be a starting point. I actually found Grand Tourismo to be quite realistic for weight shifting and power sliding. Shhhh

Sent from Android please excuse errors in type or judgement

[VocalNeal]

It sounds to me that the first thing you did wrong was to hit the brakes, this is what spun the car. If you have the back step out you must turn into the slide and be gentle on the gas pedal to pull the car out of it and as the car was frontwheel drive you would usually feel the front slip prior to the back going.

Contrary to popular belief you should keep the front wheels pointed in the direction you wish to go. For front wheel drive use the throttle to pull the car out of the situation.

It could have been a spill or diesel or something but as someone has pointed out some roads get very slick during the initial stages of a rain shower.

The OP's tires are in good condition and behave well in normal driving he/she should put this all down to experience and carry on with life.

[2unique]

It sounds to me that the first thing you did wrong was to hit the brakes, this is what spun the car. If you have the back step out you must turn into the slide and be gentle on the gas pedal to pull the car out of it and as the car was frontwheel drive you would usually feel the front slip prior to the back going.

Contrary to popular belief you should keep the front wheels pointed in the direction you wish to go. For front wheel drive use the throttle to pull the car out of the situation.

It could have been a spill or diesel or something but as someone has pointed out some roads get very slick during the initial stages of a rain shower.

The OP's tires are in good condition and behave well in normal driving he/she should put this all down to experience and carry on with life.

That's assuming he has enough room to complete the maneuver - other vehicles, embankment, boards etc

Sent from Android please excuse errors in type or judgement

[Kwasaki]

The tyres were inflated to the maximum limit as advised on the inside of the door - I did this myself.

Without a doubt, the situation freaked me out a bit as it potentially could have been a lot worse and maybe fatal if I was going faster of if there was more traffic.

I keep thinking if I did something wrong or whether I could have done something to get out of that situation better.

Does ABS on BRAKES completely cut out skidding, no it detects it when there is no traction.

I don't think related to the type of situation you found yourself in but the pressure inside the door as mentioned in many threads are cold pressures from overnight parking say if you put the correct pressure before the car is driven OK but if you drive your car to put air in and check pressures at a garage, lessen it by 2-3 psi and check again in the morning.

You said you saw a pickup truck also do a 180 degree spin In the road so obviously the road surface bend you drove onto was in a slippery condition for all four wheels, apart from on the feel of the vehicle sliding and counter steering into the skid is about all you can do, as someone said hitting the brakes wasn't going to help neither would ESC until one of the tyres gain traction.

I don't believe you did anything wrong and apart from experiencing and taking part in some skid pan testing, there is probably not more you could have done, it was an incident not an accident so you got lucky.

[indothai]

Wider tires will not help, unless you absolutely know what caused the problem. Unless you are planning on going "faster", wider tires will only cost you more in the long run.

Owned 6 cars and participated in SCCA Autocross for 4 years. I know tires, never won an event. But learned a lot from the masters.

Best thing is keep an eye out for slicks on the road and be a careful driver, especially in LOS.

[2unique]

Good article here

http://www.ehow.com/how_5304153_correct-oversteer.html

Posted with Thaivisa App http://apps.thaivisa.com

[sonic_11uk]

I did a bit of research on the net and have found that hitting the brakes is indeed the wrong thing to do - I pushed as hard as I could as the rear started sliding out.

Apparently, if it's the front which is sliding, you're supposed to brake gently which will put more pressure on the front wheels (due to inertia) and therefore help them to grip.

If the back is sliding, you're supposed to gas to put the weight on the back wheels - this sounds a bit scary and would only work if the road in front in totally clear.

Additionally, when something like this happens out of the blue, I doubt I'd be able to figure out what's sliding and what to do fast enough......

[2unique]

Additionally, when something like this happens out of the blue, I doubt I'd be able to figure out what's sliding and what to do fast enough......

understeer vs oversteer

[EvilDrSomkid]

When I read stuff like this, it makes me sad that driver traning is completely insufficient in most countries, not just Thailand.

Norway (and maybe Sweden and Finland) is one of the few countries where trainig in very slippery conditions is required in order to get your license.

I took my license in the Netherlands, which also has strict rules for passing and they have no wet condition requirement.

You can take slipping courses. I did one. Wow! You learn so much from just one day.

I have seen so many accidents here caused by bad vehicle control, bad foresight (does it exist here?) and lack of ABS. OPs situation had nothing to do with ABS, obviously.

It is amazing that most pick ups here are not equipped with ABS as standard. It would avoid a lot of rear ending incidents. I have seen it happening in front of me and behind me. DId not have to brake hard at all.

[John 1]

When I read stuff like this, it makes me sad that driver traning is completely insufficient in most countries, not just Thailand.

Norway (and maybe Sweden and Finland) is one of the few countries where trainig in very slippery conditions is required in order to get your license.

I took my license in the Netherlands, which also has strict rules for passing and they have no wet condition requirement.

You can take slipping courses. I did one. Wow! You learn so much from just one day.

I have seen so many accidents here caused by bad vehicle control, bad foresight (does it exist here?) and lack of ABS. OPs situation had nothing to do with ABS, obviously.

It is amazing that most pick ups here are not equipped with ABS as standard. It would avoid a lot of rear ending incidents. I have seen it happening in front of me and behind me. DId not have to brake hard at all.

Can you name a pick up that doesn't have ABS as standard equipment

[funcat]

When I read stuff like this, it makes me sad that driver traning is completely insufficient in most countries, not just Thailand.

Norway (and maybe Sweden and Finland) is one of the few countries where trainig in very slippery conditions is required in order to get your license.

I took my license in the Netherlands, which also has strict rules for passing and they have no wet condition requirement.

You can take slipping courses. I did one. Wow! You learn so much from just one day.

I have seen so many accidents here caused by bad vehicle control, bad foresight (does it exist here?) and lack of ABS. OPs situation had nothing to do with ABS, obviously.

It is amazing that most pick ups here are not equipped with ABS as standard. It would avoid a lot of rear ending incidents. I have seen it happening in front of me and behind me. DId not have to brake hard at all.

Can you name a pick up that doesn't have ABS as standard equipment

My guess will be...all of them! You have to pay extra for this....

[transam]

When I read stuff like this, it makes me sad that driver traning is completely insufficient in most countries, not just Thailand.

Norway (and maybe Sweden and Finland) is one of the few countries where trainig in very slippery conditions is required in order to get your license.

I took my license in the Netherlands, which also has strict rules for passing and they have no wet condition requirement.

You can take slipping courses. I did one. Wow! You learn so much from just one day.

I have seen so many accidents here caused by bad vehicle control, bad foresight (does it exist here?) and lack of ABS. OPs situation had nothing to do with ABS, obviously.

It is amazing that most pick ups here are not equipped with ABS as standard. It would avoid a lot of rear ending incidents. I have seen it happening in front of me and behind me. DId not have to brake hard at all.

Can you name a pick up that doesn't have ABS as standard equipment

My guess will be...all of them! You have to pay extra for this....

They all have ABS but to different standards.

[funcat]

When I read stuff like this, it makes me sad that driver traning is completely insufficient in most countries, not just Thailand.

Norway (and maybe Sweden and Finland) is one of the few countries where trainig in very slippery conditions is required in order to get your license.

I took my license in the Netherlands, which also has strict rules for passing and they have no wet condition requirement.

You can take slipping courses. I did one. Wow! You learn so much from just one day.

I have seen so many accidents here caused by bad vehicle control, bad foresight (does it exist here?) and lack of ABS. OPs situation had nothing to do with ABS, obviously.

It is amazing that most pick ups here are not equipped with ABS as standard. It would avoid a lot of rear ending incidents. I have seen it happening in front of me and behind me. DId not have to brake hard at all.

Can you name a pick up that doesn't have ABS as standard equipment

My guess will be...all of them! You have to pay extra for this....

They all have ABS but to different standards.

In this case the problem is not in ABS,or lacking of it....here they just follow toooo(!) close...."standard equipment" normally does not include ABS brakes.

[EvilDrSomkid]

When I read stuff like this, it makes me sad that driver traning is completely insufficient in most countries, not just Thailand.

Norway (and maybe Sweden and Finland) is one of the few countries where trainig in very slippery conditions is required in order to get your license.

I took my license in the Netherlands, which also has strict rules for passing and they have no wet condition requirement.

You can take slipping courses. I did one. Wow! You learn so much from just one day.

I have seen so many accidents here caused by bad vehicle control, bad foresight (does it exist here?) and lack of ABS. OPs situation had nothing to do with ABS, obviously.

It is amazing that most pick ups here are not equipped with ABS as standard. It would avoid a lot of rear ending incidents. I have seen it happening in front of me and behind me. DId not have to brake hard at all.

Can you name a pick up that doesn't have ABS as standard equipment

Dmax? Vigo? Tata. Are you saying that all pick ups have ABS? Maybe the newest one's but there are PLENTY of pick ups on the road without ABS.