tlansford Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 OK, several replies and not one person can say how it was abuse of power or corruption. point noted... You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. "You mean apart from breaking the law" Exactly the point. Read the information in the other post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlansford Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 OK, several replies and not one person can say how it was abuse of power or corruption. point noted... You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. You misunderstand this government's position. They wish to have all charges and verdicts quashed, then to be re-investigated and retried. Of course, due to missing evidence and a very liberal and friendly view of offence, no charges will be laid, and no defence necessary. Look at the Yingluk perjury case. The totally independent DSI has decided that lying in court is not perjury as long as you are not the defendant - beyond common logic, and quite different to the opinion of a judge IMO, BUT WE WILL NEVER KNOW, because a case won't be brought before a judge. Thaksin's charges will face a similar fate. " won't be brought before a judge." similar to the likely fate of Abhisit and Suthep. I personally find killing scores of protesters more serious than a charge of perjury ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzMick Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 OK, several replies and not one person can say how it was abuse of power or corruption. point noted... Why should anyone stoop to justify a long-existing Thai law? It was there, he or his advisers should have known of it (ignorance of the law is NOT an excuse), but he and his wife broke that law because they thought that they could avoid the consequences. tough TIT. "anyone" should perhaps do their homework to justify why they call Thaksin a criminal and tout the fact that he is a fugitive from "justice" for "abuse of power" due to this particular conviction which all you guys have. "ignorance" of the law is not being pushed here by anyone except you. It looks like Thaksin and his wife did their homework and determined that what looked legal was legal. The FIDF committee itself had to approve each potential bidder before the auction. In addition, prior to signing, it was confirmed that the office of the Prime Minister is neither the office in charge of, nor has the authority to direct or supervise the FIDF. I mentioned this earlier, perhaps you missed it. So no, ignorance of the law was not the case as you implied. It was checked before the signature. Everything was - at the time - done according to the law. The 5/4 conviction ruling 5 years later is the only ruling that says what he did was illegal. And signing his name as spousal consent as required by Thai law for ones wife to pay the highest bidding price in an open, public auction really, really really doesn't sound like abuse of power to me. Especially since it was verified beforehand. But no one has stepped forward to say why this is abuse of power... OK, point well taken. And each and every member of the FIDF committee has signed a statement that he/she was quite prepared to tell the Shinawatras to take a hike, and that such a statement would have no repercussions on their future advancement or career. So it comes down to the decision of 5/4 judges, or however many public servants under a Thaksin administration. Guess who wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewlyMintedThai Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 OK, several replies and not one person can say how it was abuse of power or corruption. point noted... You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. You misunderstand this government's position. They wish to have all charges and verdicts quashed, then to be re-investigated and retried. Of course, due to missing evidence and a very liberal and friendly view of offence, no charges will be laid, and no defence necessary. Look at the Yingluk perjury case. The totally independent DSI has decided that lying in court is not perjury as long as you are not the defendant - beyond common logic, and quite different to the opinion of a judge IMO, BUT WE WILL NEVER KNOW, because a case won't be brought before a judge. Thaksin's charges will face a similar fate. " won't be brought before a judge." similar to the likely fate of Abhisit and Suthep. I personally find killing scores of protesters more serious than a charge of perjury ... Agreed! But all you have against them is allegations. No charges, no convictions. When you do, I'll be the first one cheering when they get sent to jail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzMick Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 OK, several replies and not one person can say how it was abuse of power or corruption. point noted... You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. You misunderstand this government's position. They wish to have all charges and verdicts quashed, then to be re-investigated and retried. Of course, due to missing evidence and a very liberal and friendly view of offence, no charges will be laid, and no defence necessary. Look at the Yingluk perjury case. The totally independent DSI has decided that lying in court is not perjury as long as you are not the defendant - beyond common logic, and quite different to the opinion of a judge IMO, BUT WE WILL NEVER KNOW, because a case won't be brought before a judge. Thaksin's charges will face a similar fate. " won't be brought before a judge." similar to the likely fate of Abhisit and Suthep. I personally find killing scores of protesters more serious than a charge of perjury ... Abhisit and Suthep don't seek amnesty - in fact have rejected it. You still selectively reject killing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbamboo Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 OK, several replies and not one person can say how it was abuse of power or corruption. point noted... You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. "You mean apart from breaking the law" Exactly the point. Read the information in the other post. If a politician uses his position to break the law to enrich his family how is that not corruption? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubl Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) OK, several replies and not one person can say how it was abuse of power or corruption. point noted... You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. Your opening sentence. Which law was that then ??? Care to cite it it ? I close my eyes, I know nothing about it, therefore it didn't happen Or just yahoo / Google a bit to find the 5-page sentence read by the judges at that time Edited April 17, 2012 by rubl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlansford Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 - deleted quote -- You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. You misunderstand this government's position. They wish to have all charges and verdicts quashed, then to be re-investigated and retried. Of course, due to missing evidence and a very liberal and friendly view of offence, no charges will be laid, and no defence necessary. Look at the Yingluk perjury case. The totally independent DSI has decided that lying in court is not perjury as long as you are not the defendant - beyond common logic, and quite different to the opinion of a judge IMO, BUT WE WILL NEVER KNOW, because a case won't be brought before a judge. Thaksin's charges will face a similar fate. " won't be brought before a judge." similar to the likely fate of Abhisit and Suthep. I personally find killing scores of protesters more serious than a charge of perjury ... Agreed! But all you have against them is allegations. No charges, no convictions. When you do, I'll be the first one cheering when they get sent to jail. re: abhisit / suthep, no charges and no convictions is the result of no investigation... it's been 2 years already, let's get on with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whybother Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 re: abhisit / suthep, no charges and no convictions is the result of no investigation... it's been 2 years already, let's get on with it. Yes ... Why aren't the current government pushing for an investigation? Are they scared of what will come out? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewlyMintedThai Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 re: abhisit / suthep, no charges and no convictions is the result of no investigation... it's been 2 years already, let's get on with it. Yes ... Why aren't the current government pushing for an investigation? Are they scared of what will come out? They know that they themselves are guilty of the same thing x 100, that's why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlansford Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 re: abhisit / suthep, no charges and no convictions is the result of no investigation... it's been 2 years already, let's get on with it. Yes ... Why aren't the current government pushing for an investigation? Are they scared of what will come out? You are a joker, whybother... you and I both know that the abhisit gov't had red shirts investigated and on trial without a single investigated case against the government even completed before they lost the election. Now you want to say that it is this government that is dragging its feet - that is absurd beyond belief. But par for the course for those whose nervous twitch is to blame Thaksin/red-shirts/PTP for every ill in this world. Not to mention that your statement is also made with ZERO evidence. On the other hand, I recall Abhisit finally being called in to discuss 2010 ... when was that ? about 2 months ago perhaps? As Animatic would say about now, ... no sale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubl Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 (edited) re: abhisit / suthep, no charges and no convictions is the result of no investigation... it's been 2 years already, let's get on with it. Yes ... Why aren't the current government pushing for an investigation? Are they scared of what will come out? You are a joker, whybother... you and I both know that the abhisit gov't had red shirts investigated and on trial without a single investigated case against the government even completed before they lost the election. Now you want to say that it is this government that is dragging its feet - that is absurd beyond belief. But par for the course for those whose nervous twitch is to blame Thaksin/red-shirts/PTP for every ill in this world. Not to mention that your statement is also made with ZERO evidence. On the other hand, I recall Abhisit finally being called in to discuss 2010 ... when was that ? about 2 months ago perhaps? As Animatic would say about now, ... no sale So the current government is really into finding all details and amnesty for all including k. Thaksin. Except k. Abhisit and k. Suthep of course as Dept. PM Pol. Captain Chalerm once said. I must admit knowing the truth about March - May 2010 is way down the list of things to do compared with 'get Thaksin back' Edited April 17, 2012 by rubl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mosha Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 OK, several replies and not one person can say how it was abuse of power or corruption. point noted... You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. You misunderstand this government's position. They wish to have all charges and verdicts quashed, then to be re-investigated and retried. Of course, due to missing evidence and a very liberal and friendly view of offence, no charges will be laid, and no defence necessary. Look at the Yingluk perjury case. The totally independent DSI has decided that lying in court is not perjury as long as you are not the defendant - beyond common logic, and quite different to the opinion of a judge IMO, BUT WE WILL NEVER KNOW, because a case won't be brought before a judge. Thaksin's charges will face a similar fate. " won't be brought before a judge." similar to the likely fate of Abhisit and Suthep. I personally find killing scores of protesters more serious than a charge of perjury ... Along with Tak Bai and the war on drugs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draftvader Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Right on draftvader, Don't be drawn into the lies and false accusations of the democrat party. Good comment. Putting "spin" on my statement? Good politics, not my point though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlansford Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 -- deleted due to quote limit -- You mean apart from breaking the law that expressly forbade government officials of their families from being involved personally in business transactions involving the government? Well as much as I'd like to see a resolution of the Thaksin problem so the country can get back to normal our hero hasn't exactly helped the situation has he? By lying about his assets, his blatant tax avoidance, his Shin deal with Burmese military junta paid for by the Thai people, attempting to bribe judges, going on the run, a list just goes on it means even if he went back to court he is virtually undefendable. You misunderstand this government's position. They wish to have all charges and verdicts quashed, then to be re-investigated and retried. Of course, due to missing evidence and a very liberal and friendly view of offence, no charges will be laid, and no defence necessary. Look at the Yingluk perjury case. The totally independent DSI has decided that lying in court is not perjury as long as you are not the defendant - beyond common logic, and quite different to the opinion of a judge IMO, BUT WE WILL NEVER KNOW, because a case won't be brought before a judge. Thaksin's charges will face a similar fate. " won't be brought before a judge." similar to the likely fate of Abhisit and Suthep. I personally find killing scores of protesters more serious than a charge of perjury ... Along with Tak Bai and the war on drugs? yes. Along with those, too. I think the war on drugs in Thailand was as much a disaster as it has been when done in other parts of the world. So let's see a real investigation into 2010... As for his "crime" ... The more I look at the details of the Thaksin conviction, the more obvious it is to me that is was either just political or dumb luck for his opponents that he was found guilty of abuse of power in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 As for his "crime" ... The more I look at the details of the Thaksin conviction, the more obvious it is to me that is was either just political or dumb luck for his opponents that he was found guilty of abuse of power in this case. I think he may also be concerned about getting the same luck with the other charges he is accused of, hence it has to be a blanket amnesty for all past, present and future crimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdimension Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 I think he may also be concerned about getting the same luck with the other charges he is accused of, hence it has to be a blanket amnesty for all past, present and future crimes. There's no doubt that he'd love to have a blanket amnesty for future crimes. If he could get such a clause put into the new constitution without too much objection, he would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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