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[aneliane]

I realise that this only answer half of the OPs original complaint, but is covering an area of "Farang" abuse that my wife has experienced (she is blonde haired and blue eyed (not Thai-Chinese then!!)). She went for an interview at a kindergarten that couldn't afford to employ her (that only came out in the interview), they took a photo and now she is on the side of their school bus.....

She should be looking at legal compensation for that. That is completely unacceptable

Apparently personality rights are judge made laws in THL, so there is not much to do

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personality_rights

[wana]

In the steak shop ,the Chef is proud to have a Farang eating steak (its like a sign saying ,i can make steak so good ,even farang likes to eat it )

i suppose it is good for business because thais and new farangs passing by sometimes come into the shop and it looks good to have some

farangs eating steak or telling people i like to eat this or that type

but yes ,i should talk to some lawyers and possibly a judge.............they are taking advantage of my good nature and im not going to tolerate it any more

hopefully i can win my case and put an end to this gross injustice

[harrry]

Think yourself lucky it wasn't the local massage parlour you went into. You may have heard all your personal likes and dislikes discussed all over the place.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Of course you do own your privacy! Private details about your life are not to be used for commercial purpose without your consent

On Facebook you are a willing product, you agreed, you signed to have all the pics and details that you post being the sole copy right of Facebook. It's very different

Even in the most developed country, the OP's example would not be considered a violation of anything in a legal sense, especially informally in a mom and pop shop.

There are specific laws that govern privacy over specific types of organizations in specific contexts - Europe has much more stringent laws about computerized data held by corporations than the US in this area. However just about everything else in real life is wide open and fair game.

Your name and image, that's a civil matter probably even here at least in theory, but actually trying to enforce this here in Thailand would very different from other parts of the world that have some concept of privacy and rule of law.

A shopkeeper chatting about your purchasing habits? Nothing wrong with that at all IMO, if you don't like it shop somewhere else.

[aneliane]

Of course you do own your privacy! Private details about your life are not to be used for commercial purpose without your consent

On Facebook you are a willing product, you agreed, you signed to have all the pics and details that you post being the sole copy right of Facebook. It's very different

Even in the most developed country, the OP's example would not be considered a violation of anything in a legal sense, especially informally in a mom and pop shop.

There are specific laws that govern privacy over specific types of organizations in specific contexts - Europe has much more stringent laws about computerized data held by corporations than the US in this area. However just about everything else in real life is wide open and fair game.

Your name and image, that's a civil matter probably even here at least in theory, but actually trying to enforce this here in Thailand would very different from other parts of the world that have some concept of privacy and rule of law.

A shopkeeper chatting about your purchasing habits? Nothing wrong with that at all IMO, if you don't like it shop somewhere else.

Well I think we all know your opinion by now.

So I guess you would have no problem that the all shop was debating the size of your penis, and favorite sex positions...

Different strokes I guess ...

[wana]

Of course you do own your privacy! Private details about your life are not to be used for commercial purpose without your consent

On Facebook you are a willing product, you agreed, you signed to have all the pics and details that you post being the sole copy right of Facebook. It's very different

Even in the most developed country, the OP's example would not be considered a violation of anything in a legal sense, especially informally in a mom and pop shop.

There are specific laws that govern privacy over specific types of organizations in specific contexts - Europe has much more stringent laws about computerized data held by corporations than the US in this area. However just about everything else in real life is wide open and fair game.

Your name and image, that's a civil matter probably even here at least in theory, but actually trying to enforce this here in Thailand would very different from other parts of the world that have some concept of privacy and rule of law.

A shopkeeper chatting about your purchasing habits? Nothing wrong with that at all IMO, if you don't like it shop somewhere else.

Well I think we all know your opinion by now.

So I guess you would have no problem that the all shop was debating the size of your penis, and favorite sex positions...

Different strokes I guess ...

<deleted> has the mans penis got to do with any of this ?

trying to get people to take you seriously? and then you make a comparsion to the size of someones penis to your shopping habits?

Edited May 22, 2012 by wana

[BigJohnnyBKK]

<deleted> has the mans penis got to do with any of this ?

trying to get people to take you seriously? and then you make a comparsion to the size of someones penis to your shopping habits?

My pointing out the cultural difference of Thais having little conception of privacy in personal relations included a story about the elder women of the village publicly interrogating my (now ex) TGF about such matters during the ceremony negotiating our sin sot.

And yes it bothered me, but amused and baffled more so, and I certainly wouldn't have thought any laws were broken.

[draftvader]

I realise that this only answer half of the OPs original complaint, but is covering an area of "Farang" abuse that my wife has experienced (she is blonde haired and blue eyed (not Thai-Chinese then!!)). She went for an interview at a kindergarten that couldn't afford to employ her (that only came out in the interview), they took a photo and now she is on the side of their school bus.....

She should be looking at legal compensation for that. That is completely unacceptable

Apparently personality rights are judge made laws in THL, so there is not much to do

http://en.wikipedia....sonality_rights

Precisely why we live and learn. I think we would suffer more publicity and embarrassment for a settlement that, if it went our way (unlikely), would not be much anyway. I don't know why people waste their lives on such endeavours.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Apparently personality rights are judge made laws in THL, so there is not much to do

http://en.wikipedia....sonality_rights

From that article,

> name, image, likeness, or other unequivocal aspects of one's identity

would not include your shopping preferences, nor one-on-one conversation.

If they put your face on a bus, then sure, fair enough, but I don't think anyone here thinks you're right to be upset about that specific scenario, and it's certainly not a legal issue.

Edited May 22, 2012 by BigJohnnyBKK

[arthurwait]

People discuss my penis all the time too. It's bloody obvious it's big, there's nothing I can do about it.

I just have to get on with my life.

[wana]

<deleted> has the mans penis got to do with any of this ?

trying to get people to take you seriously? and then you make a comparsion to the size of someones penis to your shopping habits?

My pointing out the cultural difference of Thais having little conception of privacy in personal relations included a story about the elder women of the village publicly interrogating my (now ex) TGF about such matters during the ceremony negotiating our sin sot.

And yes it bothered me, but amused and baffled more so, and I certainly wouldn't have thought any laws were broken.

its hardly a valid or similar comparison ,someones shoping tastes and someones penis is in a entirely differnt league

even though ,i doubt talking about either of them would be illegal in any country ,especially thailand

anyway ,neither would bother me much ,

the same subject came up about my penis years ago in a guesthouse between the maids and kitchenstaff and i told them

if they wanted to know ,just ask and i would let them check

[F1fanatic]

I genuinely do not understand why you care.

Thais are v curious in a way that we would find offensive in the West but... it just amuses me the way everyone is looking in my shopping basket to see what I have bought.

The little mom and pop stores obviously remember if you go there often enough and I appreciate that. If you don't, shop from the big supermarkets where they have far too many customers to pay any attention to your purchases.

[carra]

ok, so the people saying they have no problem with this, let me give you a scenario:

You are in the pharmacy when another couple come in behind you, the guy whispers that he has piles, the pharmacist then tells them that you also have piles and use 'arseclear' pile remover, and while you are there you also buy your viagra there and KY Jelly.

is this ok?

We all have different levels of privacy and i understand if the OP does not want her shopping list distributed to all and sundry, or her condo discussed by what is essentially a stranger, personally I don't like the nosy feckers that look in my trolly when I am queuing at Tesco.

Edited May 22, 2012 by carra

[F1fanatic]

ok, so the people saying they have no problem with this, let me give you a scenario:

You are in the pharmacy when another couple come in behind you, the guy whispers that he has piles, the pharmacist then tells them that you also have piles and use 'arseclear' pile remover, and while you are there you also buy your viagra there and KY Jelly.

is this ok?

We all have different levels of privacy and i understand if the OP does not want her shopping list distributed to all and sundry, or her condo discussed by what is essentially a stranger, personally I don't like the nosy feckers that look in my trolly when I am queuing at Tesco.

But we're not talking about a pharmacy are we? We're talking about general shopping.

Edit - must add that I was at my local pharmacy recently and talking to the pharmacist about the best antibiotic cream for a problem. A (tourist) Westerner overheard our conversation and made a suggestion that has proven invaluable. I'm v glad he was waiting and heard our conversation. Admittedly though, I would not have been so happy if we were discussing a personal problem . Fortunately my local pharmacist conducts 'embarrassing' conversations out of the way of everyone else - something I didn't enjoy back in the UK!

Incidentally - you don't like people looking in your shopping basket in Tescos?? Get used to it. It may be more obvious here, but it happens back home too....

Edited May 22, 2012 by F1fanatic

[Shot]

It happens all the time. Here, China, Panama, Japan, Korea, Mexico, etc Get over it, and grow up. Your full of yourself, and no one else is. Geez

[StreetCowboy]

It happens all the time. Here, China, Panama, Japan, Korea, Mexico, etc Get over it, and grow up. Your full of yourself, and no one else is. Geez

I beg to differ. I think you are full of yourself as well.

SC

[Shot]

It happens all the time. Here, China, Panama, Japan, Korea, Mexico, etc Get over it, and grow up. Your full of yourself, and no one else is. Geez

I beg to differ. I think you are full of yourself as well.

SC

Really? That's strange, my wife says I'm full of "it"

[aneliane]

It happens all the time. Here, China, Panama, Japan, Korea, Mexico, etc Get over it, and grow up. Your full of yourself, and no one else is. Geez

As previously said I am only wondering about the legal issue

The rest is rhetorical

[aneliane]

ok, so the people saying they have no problem with this, let me give you a scenario:

You are in the pharmacy when another couple come in behind you, the guy whispers that he has piles, the pharmacist then tells them that you also have piles and use 'arseclear' pile remover, and while you are there you also buy your viagra there and KY Jelly.

is this ok?

We all have different levels of privacy and i understand if the OP does not want her shopping list distributed to all and sundry, or her condo discussed by what is essentially a stranger, personally I don't like the nosy feckers that look in my trolly when I am queuing at Tesco.

But we're not talking about a pharmacy are we? We're talking about general shopping.

Edit - must add that I was at my local pharmacy recently and talking to the pharmacist about the best antibiotic cream for a problem. A (tourist) Westerner overheard our conversation and made a suggestion that has proven invaluable. I'm v glad he was waiting and heard our conversation. Admittedly though, I would not have been so happy if we were discussing a personal problem . Fortunately my local pharmacist conducts 'embarrassing' conversations out of the way of everyone else - something I didn't enjoy back in the UK!

Incidentally - you don't like people looking in your shopping basket in Tescos?? Get used to it. It may be more obvious here, but it happens back home too....

It was not looking it was looking,making comments, asking others what they think about it, and have an open conversation about my eating habit and private life as if I was not there

And no that does not happen back home

but that is not the issue here

Edited May 22, 2012 by aneliane

[aneliane]

I realise that this only answer half of the OPs original complaint, but is covering an area of "Farang" abuse that my wife has experienced (she is blonde haired and blue eyed (not Thai-Chinese then!!)). She went for an interview at a kindergarten that couldn't afford to employ her (that only came out in the interview), they took a photo and now she is on the side of their school bus.....

She should be looking at legal compensation for that. That is completely unacceptable

Apparently personality rights are judge made laws in THL, so there is not much to do

http://en.wikipedia....sonality_rights

Precisely why we live and learn. I think we would suffer more publicity and embarrassment for a settlement that, if it went our way (unlikely), would not be much anyway. I don't know why people waste their lives on such endeavours.

Bottom line, as BigjohnnyBKK said it be careful with any personal info or data in LOS

[aneliane]

Apparently personality rights are judge made laws in THL, so there is not much to do

http://en.wikipedia....sonality_rights

From that article,

> name, image, likeness, or other unequivocal aspects of one's identity

would not include your shopping preferences, nor one-on-one conversation.

If they put your face on a bus, then sure, fair enough, but I don't think anyone here thinks you're right to be upset about that specific scenario, and it's certainly not a legal issue.

Do you understand the meaning of these words?

Name : yes I was clearly identified, and named

Likeness : Yes what I liked what clearly debated in front of me

And Yes some other part of my identity were openly shared like where I lived.

But again it would be just a gossip matter which I could not care less about, if it was not used to promote the shop and make money on my back

I am not upset, I was mortified at the time, but I don't complain

I just wrote to wonder what was the deal legally (I had my own answer from wikipedia) on these issues of right to image in LOS

Edited May 23, 2012 by aneliane

[DP25]

I realise that this only answer half of the OPs original complaint, but is covering an area of "Farang" abuse that my wife has experienced (she is blonde haired and blue eyed (not Thai-Chinese then!!)). She went for an interview at a kindergarten that couldn't afford to employ her (that only came out in the interview), they took a photo and now she is on the side of their school bus.....

She should be looking at legal compensation for that. That is completely unacceptable

Apparently personality rights are judge made laws in THL, so there is not much to do

http://en.wikipedia....sonality_rights

Precisely why we live and learn. I think we would suffer more publicity and embarrassment for a settlement that, if it went our way (unlikely), would not be much anyway. I don't know why people waste their lives on such endeavours.

It would go your way. They can not plaster your face all over buses as advertising without permission or compensation. I can't find the link but I'm sure I've read a similar story from someone on this forum who's face was used on a billboard without being paid and they won

[BigJohnnyBKK]

It was not looking it was looking,making comments, asking others what they think about it, and have an open conversation about my eating habit and private life as if I was not there

And no that does not happen back home

but that is not the issue here

This is what the Thais do, there is no such thing as "private life" here unless you yourself make sure that no Thai you care about has any way of finding out what you want to keep private.

If you explain to those you know personally you don't like it, they'll stop doing it in front of you, but amongst each other all the information flows back and forth. They think this is perfectly fine and nothing wrong with it, just a cultural difference.

Farang think just because they live in a big city they're anonymous, they're not, the maids and security guards and street vendors moto drivers etc, all know and talk about with anyone and everyone from how many different partners you have in a month to the color of your skidmarks, from how much your salary is to whether you're a drunk or not.

And any Thai you socialize with will get all that information too. If you are a player but still want to have face in respectable Thai circles you need to keep those two parts of your life completely separate, live your life as if you're an undercover agent or something.

They'll look and act as if they respect you as long as they think it's worth their while, you'll never know how much they're actually just writing you off as being a typical farang monger according to all the stereotypes, and never take you seriously or expose you to good opportunities.

[Berkshire]

ok, so the people saying they have no problem with this, let me give you a scenario:

You are in the pharmacy when another couple come in behind you, the guy whispers that he has piles, the pharmacist then tells them that you also have piles and use 'arseclear' pile remover, and while you are there you also buy your viagra there and KY Jelly.

is this ok?

This is a really, REALLY, bad example, and is completely unrelated to what the OP is talking about.

[wana]

It was not looking it was looking,making comments, asking others what they think about it, and have an open conversation about my eating habit and private life as if I was not there

And no that does not happen back home

but that is not the issue here

This is what the Thais do, there is no such thing as "private life" here unless you yourself make sure that no Thai you care about has any way of finding out what you want to keep private.

If you explain to those you know personally you don't like it, they'll stop doing it in front of you, but amongst each other all the information flows back and forth. They think this is perfectly fine and nothing wrong with it, just a cultural difference.

Farang think just because they live in a big city they're anonymous, they're not, the maids and security guards and street vendors moto drivers etc, all know and talk about with anyone and everyone from how many different partners you have in a month to the color of your skidmarks, from how much your salary is to whether you're a drunk or not.

And any Thai you socialize with will get all that information too. If you are a player but still want to have face in respectable Thai circles you need to keep those two parts of your life completely separate, live your life as if you're an undercover agent or something.

They'll look and act as if they respect you as long as they think it's worth their while, you'll never know how much they're actually just writing you off as being a typical farang monger according to all the stereotypes, and never take you seriously or expose you to good opportunities.

I have also noticed this ,Thais are fascinated with every aspect of Farang life ,especially Sex

If you have multiple partners /gf's /giks /femaile visitors every day/ month/ week etc everyone

in your building .soi and even area will probably get to hear about it

The more Thai you learn ,the more you pick up on it but im sure many people are oblivious to the fact

that everyone is probably talking about them and their so called "private " lives

The motortaxis that sit outside my gates for about 20 hours a day ,chatter about everyone that passes ,even thais ,

but of course ,more so about farangs and they chatter amongst the security team who chatter with the cleaners

who chatter with any thai people and neighbours who will give them them time of day

it just seems to be gossip ,gossip,gossip and i live in a very densely populated and busy part of bkk but on a near daily basis

i can hear someone talking or commenting about myself or someone else

if youre thick skinned like i am ,its water off a ducks back but i have noticed several examples of them trying to find out my income ,

occupation ,my relationship to thai persons in my company (sometimes staff,sometimes just friends /sometimes Gf's /lovers etc )

they will often try to make small talk with a Thai person they see me with so they can try to get more information to gossip about

my work or personal life etc so i usually dont have any qualms with bluntly changing the subject back onto them before they get a

chance to interrogate my visitors with 20 questions

[BigJohnnyBKK]

they will often try to make small talk with a Thai person they see me with so they can try to get more information to gossip about

my work or personal life etc so i usually dont have any qualms with bluntly changing the subject back onto them before they get a

chance to interrogate my visitors with 20 questions

"Mai giao arai gap kuhn" works too (None of your business) but of course only if you don't mind being perceived as rude since they honestly don't realize they're being offensive by our standards.

Think if Martians came down and lived amongst you and your neighbors back home, that's how the common Thai perceives foreigners, bizarre aliens, but mostly harmless.

And of course whatever they observe from each of us must be applicable to all, not that different from what many of do here about them 8-)

[arthurwait]

ok, so the people saying they have no problem with this, let me give you a scenario:

You are in the pharmacy when another couple come in behind you, the guy whispers that he has piles, the pharmacist then tells them that you also have piles and use 'arseclear' pile remover, and while you are there you also buy your viagra there and KY Jelly.

is this ok?

We all have different levels of privacy and i understand if the OP does not want her shopping list distributed to all and sundry, or her condo discussed by what is essentially a stranger, personally I don't like the nosy feckers that look in my trolly when I am queuing at Tesco.

But we're not talking about a pharmacy are we? We're talking about general shopping.

Edit - must add that I was at my local pharmacy recently and talking to the pharmacist about the best antibiotic cream for a problem. A (tourist) Westerner overheard our conversation and made a suggestion that has proven invaluable. I'm v glad he was waiting and heard our conversation. Admittedly though, I would not have been so happy if we were discussing a personal problem . Fortunately my local pharmacist conducts 'embarrassing' conversations out of the way of everyone else - something I didn't enjoy back in the UK!

Incidentally - you don't like people looking in your shopping basket in Tescos?? Get used to it. It may be more obvious here, but it happens back home too....

It was not looking it was looking,making comments, asking others what they think about it, and have an open conversation about my eating habit and private life as if I was not there

And no that does not happen back home

but that is not the issue here

Yes it did and does happen back home, but not to you because no one notices you there.

Try being someone of a differnet race in the west 30 years ago or even in some small towns or villages today. Everything they did back then was talked about, the only difference is it usually wasn't complimentary.

The only reason people take notice of you here is because you are differnet, a farang and particurlarly a farang woman. If it troubles you that much go back home where no one will even notice you.

My Mum just came for a holiday a couple of weeks back and everyone was talking about her and asking about her. Lots of people called her beautiful. She's 66. Some Thais will talk about every person of a differnet race and especially white women as there is not that many here. Your not special and it's not just about you, it happens to everyone.

It can be a lot worse than people just talking about you.

Edited May 23, 2012 by arthurwait

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Do you understand the meaning of these words?

Name : yes I was clearly identified, and named

Likeness : Yes what I liked what clearly debated in front of me

Actually likeness means a picture of you

And Yes some other part of my identity were openly shared like where I lived.

But again it would be just a gossip matter which I could not care less about, if it was not used to promote the shop and make money on my back

I am not upset, I was mortified at the time, but I don't complain

I just wrote to wonder what was the deal legally (I had my own answer from wikipedia) on these issues of right to image in LOS

And even in countries most protective of such matters, such principles would only be applied to published mass media, used these to imply you were endorsing the business, if you could prove that a corporation were using your identity in their training program for their in-person sales team and your name was being used routinely in their pitches to clients, then yes.

But definitely not face-to-face informal verbal conversation. Anywhere in the world. Even if you were a famous celebrity.

Even with the photo on the side of a bus example, you'd probably only be awarded damages equal to the fee you'd get for modeling as a generic farang, unless your association with the product actually damaged your reputation - say advertising the local blowjob bars. . .

Only celebrities who make big bucks from commercial endorsements would be awarded significant damages in any case. In any jurisdiction.

[carra]

ok, so the people saying they have no problem with this, let me give you a scenario:

You are in the pharmacy when another couple come in behind you, the guy whispers that he has piles, the pharmacist then tells them that you also have piles and use 'arseclear' pile remover, and while you are there you also buy your viagra there and KY Jelly.

is this ok?

We all have different levels of privacy and i understand if the OP does not want her shopping list distributed to all and sundry, or her condo discussed by what is essentially a stranger, personally I don't like the nosy feckers that look in my trolly when I am queuing at Tesco.

But we're not talking about a pharmacy are we? We're talking about general shopping.

Edit - must add that I was at my local pharmacy recently and talking to the pharmacist about the best antibiotic cream for a problem. A (tourist) Westerner overheard our conversation and made a suggestion that has proven invaluable. I'm v glad he was waiting and heard our conversation. Admittedly though, I would not have been so happy if we were discussing a personal problem . Fortunately my local pharmacist conducts 'embarrassing' conversations out of the way of everyone else - something I didn't enjoy back in the UK!

Incidentally - you don't like people looking in your shopping basket in Tescos?? Get used to it. It may be more obvious here, but it happens back home too....

But the problem is you are putting your personality and not the OPs personality when you say it is just general shopping, we all have different levels of self consciousness, and if the OP feels shy being discussed regarding her shopping habits then its her rights to feel this way. In all honesty she should not be discussed as though she is not standing there and her opinions on products should be hers unless she volunteers information on them.

been here 7 years, already 'used' to it, that does not mean I have to like it

[wana]

ok, so the people saying they have no problem with this, let me give you a scenario:

You are in the pharmacy when another couple come in behind you, the guy whispers that he has piles, the pharmacist then tells them that you also have piles and use 'arseclear' pile remover, and while you are there you also buy your viagra there and KY Jelly.

is this ok?

We all have different levels of privacy and i understand if the OP does not want her shopping list distributed to all and sundry, or her condo discussed by what is essentially a stranger, personally I don't like the nosy feckers that look in my trolly when I am queuing at Tesco.

But we're not talking about a pharmacy are we? We're talking about general shopping.

Edit - must add that I was at my local pharmacy recently and talking to the pharmacist about the best antibiotic cream for a problem. A (tourist) Westerner overheard our conversation and made a suggestion that has proven invaluable. I'm v glad he was waiting and heard our conversation. Admittedly though, I would not have been so happy if we were discussing a personal problem . Fortunately my local pharmacist conducts 'embarrassing' conversations out of the way of everyone else - something I didn't enjoy back in the UK!

Incidentally - you don't like people looking in your shopping basket in Tescos?? Get used to it. It may be more obvious here, but it happens back home too....

But the problem is you are putting your personality and not the OPs personality when you say it is just general shopping, we all have different levels of self consciousness, and if the OP feels shy being discussed regarding her shopping habits then its her rights to feel this way. In all honesty she should not be discussed as though she is not standing there and her opinions on products should be hers unless she volunteers information on them.

been here 7 years, already 'used' to it, that does not mean I have to like it

as someone mentiioned previously ,it doesnt matter here

you are an alien in a culture vastly differnt to your own

the facts are ,you will be under scrutiny no matter what you do

you will not blend in and have the same anonimity you would have in NYC for example

thailand ,even BKK is a close knit community ,not a massive city as it appears

i live right in the centre of bkk ,and the local layabouts know almost everyone who even comes through our soi